I have recently seen references to loudness compensation which started me
thinking about its potential benefits, and I am seeking feedback from any
members of the high end newsgroup who have experience on whether it is
worthwhile. I haven't had a preamp with loudness compensation for years,
but if you believe the Fletcher-Munsen study results it should be necessary
for correct tonal balance at lower listening levels.

It really depends on your system configuration and preferences. Many modern
amplifiers are so transparent and overdamped that they really suck the life
out of the bass area. In this situation it can help to boost the bass level
a bit.

KE

"Wylie Williams" wrote in message
...
I have recently seen references to loudness compensation which started me
thinking about its potential benefits, and I am seeking feedback from any
members of the high end newsgroup who have experience on whether it is
worthwhile. I haven't had a preamp with loudness compensation for years,
but if you believe the Fletcher-Munsen study results it should be
necessary
for correct tonal balance at lower listening levels.

In article ,
Wylie Williams wrote:
I have recently seen references to loudness compensation which started me
thinking about its potential benefits, and I am seeking feedback from any
members of the high end newsgroup who have experience on whether it is
worthwhile. I haven't had a preamp with loudness compensation for years,
but if you believe the Fletcher-Munsen study results it should be necessary
for correct tonal balance at lower listening levels.

Lexicon preamp/processors know the output level (0dBFS = 105dB SPL on all
properly calibrated THX processors set to 0dB of attenuation, and the volume
controls are calibrated in dB) and use this to implement a level dependant
loudness control using the Fletcher-Munson curves.

It doesn't sound bad like simpler loudness controls, although with it is
unnatural hearing things that "should" be below your threshold of hearing.
Definately OK if you want to hear the standup/electric bass or movie effects
while people are sleeping, but not really appropriate for more serious
listening.

--
a href="http://www.poohsticks.org/drew/"Home Page/a
The Congress shall assemble at least once in every Year, and such Meeting
shall be on the first Monday in December, unless they shall by Law appoint a
different Day.

All Ears wrote:
It really depends on your system configuration and preferences. Many modern
amplifiers are so transparent and overdamped that they really suck the life
out of the bass area. In this situation it can help to boost the bass level
a bit.

This is as odd a use of the word 'transparency' as I've seen in awhile.

--
-S.

(Drew Eckhardt) writes:

In article ,
Wylie Williams wrote:
I have recently seen references to loudness compensation which started me
thinking about its potential benefits, and I am seeking feedback from any
members of the high end newsgroup who have experience on whether it is
worthwhile. I haven't had a preamp with loudness compensation for years,
but if you believe the Fletcher-Munsen study results it should be necessary
for correct tonal balance at lower listening levels.

Lexicon preamp/processors know the output level (0dBFS = 105dB SPL on all
properly calibrated THX processors set to 0dB of attenuation, and the volume
controls are calibrated in dB) and use this to implement a level dependant
loudness control using the Fletcher-Munson curves.

How does the amplifier know how efficient your speakers are? You can't
match the Fletcher-Munsen curves without knowing that.
--
Chris Malcolm +44 (0)131 650 3085 DoD #205
School of Informatics, Edinburgh University, 5 Forrest Hill,
Edinburgh, EH1 2QL, UK. [http://www.dai.ed.ac.uk/homes/cam/ ]

On 24 Jul 2003 16:38:08 GMT, (Chris Malcolm)
wrote:

Depends what you mean by "correct balance".

Definitely.

If you argue that the
correct low level listening balance is the one you would hear
naturally at low levels, then the correct compensation is none.

Yes.

If you
want to factor in the usual natural accompaniments of low level
listening, such as greater loss of HF due to greater distance, then
you ought ot turn down the treble a bit, which is the opposite of what
"loudness compensation" usually does.

Yes except that the standard premise is that you are listening to
music of normal loudness from a normally proximate perspective BUT,
due to domestic listening constraints, you must use a lower loudness.
The purpose of these compensations is to restore the frequency balance
of the normal situation despite the lower listening level.

Kal

"Chris Malcolm" wrote in message
news:n1UTa.135557$N7.19482@sccrnsc03...
How does the amplifier know how efficient your speakers are? You can't
match the Fletcher-Munsen curves without knowing that.

Perhaps by using the technique used in the late 50's / early 60's (heyday of
Fletcher-Munsen compenasation) where the better amps included both level and
loudness controls, as well as volume controls. So the Fletcher-Munsen
levels could be set independent of the volume control.

Mike, thanks for the feedback. I would experiment by increasing the bass
but I have no tone controls, hence my post. There have been so few responses
from people who have used compensation that I am beginning to think that
this feature is not common enough to get a response.
I know that the vintage preamps often had variable loudness compensation.
Does anyone know of newsgroups or the like that are frequented by owners on
vintage components? There seems to be lots of activity in vintage Marantz,
McIntosh, etc whose owners could recount their listening experience.
Wylie Williams

"Mike Prager" wrote:

Decades ago I used a Yamaha receiver that had that feature.
Because I lived in an apartment with poor soundproofing, I
wanted to listen more quietly without losing the bass. I
thought it was a great feature.

Now I listen at nearly lifelike volumes, which provides the
bass in a more realistic context (if reproducing an orchestra
-- or even a string quartet -- in a relatively small listening
room could be ever be considered realistic). Although I have
much more elaborate gear, it's more obvious than ever that
home audio always involves compromises.

So back when, I thought the variable loudness compensation was
a pretty good one. Today, I still sometimes insert a slight
bass boost when listening at low levels.

Mike Prager
North Carolina, USA

On Fri, 25 Jul 2003 14:58:46 GMT, "Wylie Williams"
wrote:

Mike, thanks for the feedback. I would experiment by increasing the bass
but I have no tone controls, hence my post. There have been so few responses
from people who have used compensation that I am beginning to think that
this feature is not common enough to get a response.
I know that the vintage preamps often had variable loudness compensation.
Does anyone know of newsgroups or the like that are frequented by owners on
vintage components? There seems to be lots of activity in vintage Marantz,
McIntosh, etc whose owners could recount their listening experience.

Audio Asylum has a 'Vintage' forum.

Kal