Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not
required. The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD.
Can anyone recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

Thanks,
Schiz

"Schizoid Man" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not required.
The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD. Can anyone
recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

Thanks,
Schiz

The Hafler ones, without remote control, are really nice.
The DH-110 and 915 are both all discrete, with plenty of headroom.
The 110 is bipolar, and bright, but pleasantly so, depending upon the
overall balance of the system.
The 915 is smooth, with a tremendous bottom.

Robert Morein wrote:
"Schizoid Man" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not required.
The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD. Can anyone
recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

I would borrow a "passive preamp" first to see if you might not find
that wholly satisfactory. If not there are several out there, but a
homebuilt Marantz 7C clone will beat most modern ones solidly. Many
extremely expensive high end ones available today are poor. The use of
RCA connectors and excessively long interconnects, because people who
refuse to learn to solder buy them ready-made instead, renders any
effort at excellence moot in most installations even when good ones are
used.

"21st century Schizoid Man" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not required.
The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD. Can anyone
recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

Thanks,
Schiz


Don't know. My hifi is junk.
I spend all my money on freebase and porn.
I live in a cheap bedsit.
I dream of younger men.

"Schizoid Man" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not required.
The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD. Can anyone
recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

If you don't need a phono section then you could follow Ludwig's advice and
use a passive one, even though most of the rest of his diatribe is without
substance.

All you need is something to regulate the volume and connections for as many
devices as you have.

I think you could probably check out some audio stores and see if they will
let you switch between couple of them and see if you can hear any
difference. I get them to allow me to do comparisons like that as long as
they promise not to speak. They let me do the switching or they do it but
if they talk and try to sell me something before I finish with the
comparisons, I let them know they'll blow any chance at a sale.

I don't think preamps are that big a deal so long as the volume knob is dead
quiet and the connections and switches are well made, then that's about all
you need. You might even check to see if you can find an old receiver or
integrated amp that has preamp only capability like my old HK 730 did.

Stewart Pinkerton has a passive preamp that he built, so perhaps you can go
to RAHE and find one of his posts and discuss the pros and cons of such a
device.

Failing that, do what you like.

Schizoid Man wrote:
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not
required. The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD.
Can anyone recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

I've got a C-70 which is very functional IMO. I think this will serve
you well. I switched to a passive attenuator for my line level sources
and am hard pressed to tell a difference.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ran&1138482535

Don't let the Yamaha haters give you any crap. The C- series is well
designed and very reliable.

If you really want just line stage and remote control... this looks
interesting. Not sure but it appears passive.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ran&1138349164

When I was looking around for a passive someone was touting these
Parasounds but I don't have any experience with them.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ran&1138203756

ScottW

On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 14:50:05 -0800, Schizoid Man wrote:

Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not
required. The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD.
Can anyone recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

Parasound P/HP-850 is a good budget preamp only recently discontinued.
Unfortunately it's not remote controllable...

"Schizoid Man" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not required.
The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD. Can anyone
recommend some makes/models?

What does this preamp have to do? Does it have to amplify? How many
channels do you need?

Norm Strong

"Schizoid Man" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not required.
The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD. Can anyone
recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

Thanks,
Schiz


For a lot less than $500, the Nakamichi CA-5 is overall very hard to beat
provided it has been professionally checked and brought back to spec. I also
love the sound of Melos SHA-Gold in the right system but many people think
that it sounds "bigger than life" or "bombastic". I still love its ability
to bring music alive despite the PITA controls (I have the version with the
"balance meter"). And you have a choice between active and passive modes of
operation. And one of the very best headphone amps around. I have no idea of
the going price of the Melos though but I bought my second unit for $450
from a dealer. BTW, in active mode the Melos can drive Avantgarde Trios
without a power amp... :-)


Cheers,

Margaret

wrote in message
...

"Schizoid Man" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not required.
The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD. Can anyone
recommend some makes/models?

What does this preamp have to do?

Bake brownies. You blithering idiot!

"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com...

Schizoid Man wrote:
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not
required. The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD.
Can anyone recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

I've got a C-70 which is very functional IMO. I think this will serve
you well. I switched to a passive attenuator for my line level sources
and am hard pressed to tell a difference.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ran&1138482535

Don't let the Yamaha haters give you any crap. The C- series is well
designed and very reliable.

I use a couple. It's a great preamp if you know how to solder, but there are
two considerations:
1. The circuit boards are single sided epoxy paper. The solder connections
holding the relays on the board develop cracks from the vibration of the
relay action. The units can always be repaired by resolding them, but this
is a definite design weakness. On the plus side, these preamps actually have
a balanced output, supplying both normal and inverted phase. The output
impedance is the lowest I've ever seen, around 15 ohms.
2. The analog power supply is cooled via vents on the top of the cabinet.
This area of the preamp runs extremely hot. These vents must not be obscured
by stacking, or very expensive repairs will be required. Even so, the board
tends to brown in this area.

Great line drivers, great sound. Just those little problems.

wrote in message

"Schizoid Man" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono
section not required. The sources will be Aux1 (TV),
Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD. Can anyone recommend some
makes/models?

What does this preamp have to do?

Impress visiting firemen, and other paying customers.

Does it have to amplify?

Yes, it needs to amplify Maggies' intelligence to the point
where she finds her first clue.

How many channels do you need?

As many channles as it takes to satisfy her bloated ego.

On Wed, 30 Nov 2005 07:09:46 -0500, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

Does it have to amplify?

Yes, it needs to amplify Maggies' intelligence to the point
where she finds her first clue.

There you go with the intellligence thing again, Arny. You obviously
believe you're more intelligent than anyone else on this NG. Thus I
have to ask: what proof do you have of this? Not your posts,
certainly.

How many channels do you need?

As many channles as it takes to satisfy her bloated ego.

Did you know that good spelling is a sign of intehlligoence...er..
intelligence?

"paul packer" wrote in message


On Wed, 30 Nov 2005 07:09:46 -0500, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

Does it have to amplify?

Yes, it needs to amplify Maggies' intelligence to the
point where she finds her first clue.

There you go with the intellligence thing again, Arny.

Only people who feel they are lacking need object.


You obviously believe you're more intelligent than anyone
else on this NG.

I really have no idea about that. However, in terms of
relevant knowlege and experience, the situation seems to be
pretty obvious.

Thus I have to ask: what proof do you
have of this? Not your posts, certainly.

What proof do you expect to find in my posts, Paul?
Remember, I have to "dumb down" just about everything I
write to you, for fear of shooting way over your pointy
little head.


How many channels do you need?

As many channels as it takes to satisfy her bloated ego.

Did you know that good spelling is a sign of
intehlligoence...er.. intelligence?

Yet another example of your lack of intelligence, Paul.
Correct spelling has a lot to do with how much effort one
puts into the writing. There is very little on RAO that
deserves much effort, due to the high prevalence of
stupidity and childishness.

"Robert Morein" said:

Don't let the Yamaha haters give you any crap. The C- series is well
designed and very reliable.

I use a couple. It's a great preamp if you know how to solder, but there are
two considerations:
1. The circuit boards are single sided epoxy paper. The solder connections
holding the relays on the board develop cracks from the vibration of the
relay action. The units can always be repaired by resolding them, but this
is a definite design weakness. On the plus side, these preamps actually have
a balanced output, supplying both normal and inverted phase. The output
impedance is the lowest I've ever seen, around 15 ohms.


I've serviced many Yamaha (pre)amps, and other brands as well, but the
relay problems you describe here don't sound familiar to me.

Maybe it has something to do with my silly habit of resoldering PCBs
entirely, regardless of the problem they came in with :-)


2. The analog power supply is cooled via vents on the top of the cabinet.
This area of the preamp runs extremely hot. These vents must not be obscured
by stacking, or very expensive repairs will be required. Even so, the board
tends to brown in this area.


Resoldering of the drivers, resistors, and power supply regulator
transistors is a prerequisite, not just with Yamaha.

In general, I found it to be nice and reliable gear.

--

"Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes."
- Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005

paul packer wrote :


Did you know that good spelling is a sign of intehlligoence...er..
intelligence?


Oh I see...
So in fact you are using my poor spelling as a kind of springboard to propel
yourself in RAO world.
LOL ! I'm really glad to be able to help you.



--
"Nobody seemes to have actaully read what i wrote.
But what's new around here?"

Dave Weil, Sun, 05 Oct 2003 00:57:15

"Sander deWaal" wrote in message
news
"Robert Morein" said:

Don't let the Yamaha haters give you any crap. The C- series is well
designed and very reliable.

I use a couple. It's a great preamp if you know how to solder, but there
are
two considerations:
1. The circuit boards are single sided epoxy paper. The solder connections
holding the relays on the board develop cracks from the vibration of the
relay action. The units can always be repaired by resolding them, but this
is a definite design weakness. On the plus side, these preamps actually
have
a balanced output, supplying both normal and inverted phase. The output
impedance is the lowest I've ever seen, around 15 ohms.


I've serviced many Yamaha (pre)amps, and other brands as well, but the
relay problems you describe here don't sound familiar to me.

Maybe it has something to do with my silly habit of resoldering PCBs
entirely, regardless of the problem they came in with :-)

Well sure. That is an unusual habit. But single sided boards, without plated
through eyelets, tend to develop problems. With Sony stuff, it's the RCA
jacks. With Yamaha, it is the relays. Sander, surely you've noticed the
tactile "clunk" when a Yamaha relay latches? Tin lead fatigues very easily
from vibration.


2. The analog power supply is cooled via vents on the top of the cabinet.
This area of the preamp runs extremely hot. These vents must not be
obscured
by stacking, or very expensive repairs will be required. Even so, the
board
tends to brown in this area.


Resoldering of the drivers, resistors, and power supply regulator
transistors is a prerequisite, not just with Yamaha.

In general, I found it to be nice and reliable gear.

That has been my experience also. I have found the full, though 2-band,
parametric equalizer very useful. The inverted outputs can be used to bridge
amplifiers that do not contain internal bridging circuits. The sound is
second to none, in my solid state world .

Robert Morein wrote:
"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com...

Schizoid Man wrote:
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not
required. The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD.
Can anyone recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

I've got a C-70 which is very functional IMO. I think this will serve
you well. I switched to a passive attenuator for my line level sources
and am hard pressed to tell a difference.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ran&1138482535

Don't let the Yamaha haters give you any crap. The C- series is well
designed and very reliable.

I use a couple. It's a great preamp if you know how to solder, but there are
two considerations:
1. The circuit boards are single sided epoxy paper. The solder connections
holding the relays on the board develop cracks from the vibration of the
relay action.

I've never seen a solder joint fail due to relay vibration. I suspect
thermal cycling is a far more likely cause. My unit has no
detectable heat output so I wonder if you may have a problem in your
power supply... a leaky cap perhaps.

I did have one of the main output connectors cracked a solder joint but
I attribute that to the use of monster interconnects which were grossly
too tight. I touched the joints with my iron and haven't had problem
since.

I will never understand why some people think soldering requires
skill... its just too easy.

The units can always be repaired by resolding them, but this
is a definite design weakness. On the plus side, these preamps actually have
a balanced output, supplying both normal and inverted phase. The output
impedance is the lowest I've ever seen, around 15 ohms.
2. The analog power supply is cooled via vents on the top of the cabinet.
This area of the preamp runs extremely hot. These vents must not be obscured
by stacking, or very expensive repairs will be required. Even so, the board
tends to brown in this area.

Great line drivers, great sound. Just those little problems.

As I said... for $150 with a decent phono stage I think he'd be hard
pressed to find a better deal.

ScottW

"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com
Robert Morein wrote:
"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com...

Schizoid Man wrote:
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono
section not required. The sources will be Aux1 (TV),
Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD. Can anyone recommend some
makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out
with the usual suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

I've got a C-70 which is very functional IMO. I think
this will serve you well. I switched to a passive
attenuator for my line level sources and am hard
pressed to tell a difference.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ran&1138482535

Don't let the Yamaha haters give you any crap. The C-
series is well designed and very reliable.

I use a couple. It's a great preamp if you know how to
solder, but there are two considerations:
1. The circuit boards are single sided epoxy paper. The
solder connections holding the relays on the board
develop cracks from the vibration of the relay action.

I've never seen a solder joint fail due to relay
vibration. I suspect thermal cycling is a far more
likely cause. My unit has no detectable heat output so
I wonder if you may have a problem in your power
supply... a leaky cap perhaps.

I did have one of the main output connectors cracked a
solder joint but I attribute that to the use of monster
interconnects which were grossly too tight. I touched
the joints with my iron and haven't had problem since.

I will never understand why some people think soldering
requires skill... its just too easy.

The units can always be repaired by resolding them, but
this
is a definite design weakness. On the plus side, these
preamps actually have a balanced output, supplying both
normal and inverted phase. The output impedance is the
lowest I've ever seen, around 15 ohms.
2. The analog power supply is cooled via vents on the
top of the cabinet. This area of the preamp runs
extremely hot. These vents must not be obscured by
stacking, or very expensive repairs will be required.
Even so, the board tends to brown in this area.

Great line drivers, great sound. Just those little
problems.

As I said... for $150 with a decent phono stage I think
he'd be hard pressed to find a better deal.

One word: eBay.

"Robert Morein" said:

Maybe it has something to do with my silly habit of resoldering PCBs
entirely, regardless of the problem they came in with :-)

Well sure. That is an unusual habit. But single sided boards, without plated
through eyelets, tend to develop problems. With Sony stuff, it's the RCA
jacks. With Yamaha, it is the relays. Sander, surely you've noticed the
tactile "clunk" when a Yamaha relay latches? Tin lead fatigues very easily
from vibration.


I've seen it with components that suffer from mechanical stress, like
in- and output connectors, switches, potmeters etc.
But until now, I've never noticed it with small-signal relays.

I'll have a better look next time a Yamaha passes my bench, and also
before I start wriggling the iron inside.


Stress from thermal cycles, yes. But that was already covered in my
former post.

--

"Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes."
- Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005

Arny Krueger wrote:

One word: eBay.

If you don't mind bidding

Item 5835668034 and its here in SD too.

ScottW

"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com...

Robert Morein wrote:
"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com...

Schizoid Man wrote:
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not
required. The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD.
Can anyone recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

I've got a C-70 which is very functional IMO. I think this will serve
you well. I switched to a passive attenuator for my line level sources
and am hard pressed to tell a difference.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ran&1138482535

Don't let the Yamaha haters give you any crap. The C- series is well
designed and very reliable.

I use a couple. It's a great preamp if you know how to solder, but there
are
two considerations:
1. The circuit boards are single sided epoxy paper. The solder
connections
holding the relays on the board develop cracks from the vibration of the
relay action.

I've never seen a solder joint fail due to relay vibration. I suspect
thermal cycling is a far more likely cause. My unit has no
detectable heat output so I wonder if you may have a problem in your
power supply... a leaky cap perhaps.

Scott, I have two C-70's in service right now. The ps sections of both run
hot as hell, and perfectly in every other regard. A leaky cap would have
blown already, or had some other symptom. I also have a C-80, which runs
much cooler. This unit has no relays, just cable control of remote switches.


I did have one of the main output connectors cracked a solder joint but
I attribute that to the use of monster interconnects which were grossly
too tight. I touched the joints with my iron and haven't had problem
since.

I will never understand why some people think soldering requires
skill... its just too easy.

We don't know if Schizoid Man is into that. There's no point in giving him a
problem down the line he can't handle.

The units can always be repaired by resolding them, but this
is a definite design weakness. On the plus side, these preamps actually
have
a balanced output, supplying both normal and inverted phase. The output
impedance is the lowest I've ever seen, around 15 ohms.
2. The analog power supply is cooled via vents on the top of the cabinet.
This area of the preamp runs extremely hot. These vents must not be
obscured
by stacking, or very expensive repairs will be required. Even so, the
board
tends to brown in this area.

Great line drivers, great sound. Just those little problems.

As I said... for $150 with a decent phono stage I think he'd be hard
pressed to find a better deal.

They're not for everybody, Scott.

"Sander deWaal" wrote in message
...
"Robert Morein" said:

Maybe it has something to do with my silly habit of resoldering PCBs
entirely, regardless of the problem they came in with :-)

Well sure. That is an unusual habit. But single sided boards, without
plated
through eyelets, tend to develop problems. With Sony stuff, it's the RCA
jacks. With Yamaha, it is the relays. Sander, surely you've noticed the
tactile "clunk" when a Yamaha relay latches? Tin lead fatigues very easily
from vibration.


I've seen it with components that suffer from mechanical stress, like
in- and output connectors, switches, potmeters etc.
But until now, I've never noticed it with small-signal relays.

Reeds have insignificant clunk.
The Yamaha relays are armature driven latchers, not reeds. They take a big
coil pulse and have considerable mechanical inertia. That's why they sound
like little hammers. Reeds have so little mass, they are barely audible.

"Bret Ludwig" wrote in message
ups.com...

Robert Morein wrote:
"Schizoid Man" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not
required.
The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD. Can anyone
recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

I would borrow a "passive preamp" first to see if you might not find
that wholly satisfactory.

A passive preamp is not a good choice for a typical CD player with op-amp
outputs.
If Schizoid Man has something better, with discrete outputs, or premium
op-amps, then it can work.

"paul packer" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 30 Nov 2005 07:09:46 -0500, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

Does it have to amplify?

Yes, it needs to amplify Maggies' intelligence to the point
where she finds her first clue.

There you go with the intellligence thing again, Arny. You obviously
believe you're more intelligent than anyone else on this NG. Thus I
have to ask: what proof do you have of this? Not your posts,
certainly.

Yes, he really does. He has explicitly said so.
Arny, let's get one thing straight.
You're pretty smart. Perhaps you have an IQ of 140. That's not bad at all.
But you are not a luminary. You are not one of the intellects of our epoch.

Arny, for you, it will be dust to dust, just like the rest of us; just like
Steve Zipser. You will not be remembered.

Paul, have you ever visited Hyde Park, and seen the soap box speakers?

How many channels do you need?

As many channles as it takes to satisfy her bloated ego.

Did you know that good spelling is a sign of intehlligoence...er..
intelligence?

Usenet is the home of many diseased personalities.

"Robert Morein" wrote in message

"Sander deWaal" wrote in message
...
"Robert Morein" said:

Maybe it has something to do with my silly habit of
resoldering PCBs entirely, regardless of the problem
they came in with :-)

Well sure. That is an unusual habit. But single sided
boards, without plated
through eyelets, tend to develop problems. With Sony
stuff, it's the RCA jacks. With Yamaha, it is the
relays. Sander, surely you've noticed the tactile
"clunk" when a Yamaha relay latches? Tin lead fatigues
very easily from vibration.


I've seen it with components that suffer from mechanical
stress, like in- and output connectors, switches,
potmeters etc. But until now, I've never noticed it with
small-signal
relays.
Reeds have insignificant clunk.
The Yamaha relays are armature driven latchers, not
reeds. They take a big coil pulse and have considerable
mechanical inertia. That's why they sound like little
hammers. Reeds have so little mass, they are barely
audible.

Sounds like a very backwards design. All that is needed is
normally-closed contacts, and those are available as reed
relays.

"Robert Morein" wrote in message


You're pretty smart. Perhaps you have an IQ of 140.

Prove it by means of an independent reference. Obviously
Morein, your usual it's true because I say so approach is
completely invalid.

(a very interesting proposition, since its wrong!)

If you can't prove your claim Morein, that makes you exactly
as delusional as many of the rest of your posts show you to
be.

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Robert Morein" wrote in message


You're pretty smart. Perhaps you have an IQ of 140.

Prove it by means of an independent reference. Obviously Morein, your
usual it's true because I say so approach is completely invalid.

I don't need to, as you have already tried to estimate Paul Packer's IQ.
What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
Regardless, you are not an earthshaking intelligence. You could be a good
engineer, or a competent professional. There's no shame in that; it already
puts you in the 1% uppercrust of humanity.

But you do no good here at all, either for yourself, or your "cause." You
behaved like a normal person at the Debate, but here you show the side of
your personality that is most ugly.

If you had never posted on this newsgroup, you would have done your "cause"
a great favor. For all your intelligence, you can't see how other people
view you. Your view is strictly from the inside. All of us suffer from this
kind of self-centric view when growing up, but most people eventually go
beyond it. For some reason, you chose not to. From your performance at the
Debate, you know how to. If you wish to be an effective person, you should
always comport yourself exactly as you did during the Show.

If Google is efficient in the preservation of the archive of this newsgroup,
hundreds of years from now, your posts here may be the way people image Arny
Krueger. Do you really want that? All of the accomplished people of the
world inevitably have their petty sides, but it is pointless to deliberately
immortalize one's self in this manner.

Robert Morein said:

There you go with the intellligence thing again, Arny. You obviously
believe you're more intelligent than anyone else on this NG. Thus I
have to ask: what proof do you have of this? Not your posts,
certainly.

Yes, he really does. He has explicitly said so.
Arny, let's get one thing straight.
You're pretty smart. Perhaps you have an IQ of 140. That's not bad at all.
But you are not a luminary. You are not one of the intellects of our epoch.

I'm of the opinion that smartness by itself matters little. A person's
accomplishments are much more revealing of his or her worth. Put another
way, the smarter you are on paper, the more you should be able to
accomplish in life.

I believe we all know what Arnii Krooger's accomplishments are. ;-)



BTW, I changed the thread title because I don't believe Mr. **** is a
megalomaniac. Quite the opposite -- he has no power and he doesn't take
any steps to amass it. The other day, I heard a term that applied quite
well to Turdborg. It's slipped my mind but it nicely encompassed Krooger's
persistent delusions of grandiosity and grotesquely inflated estimate of
his own importance.

"Margaret von B." wrote in message
...
:
: "Schizoid Man" wrote in message
: ...
: Hi all,
:
: I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not required.
: The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD. Can anyone
: recommend some makes/models?
:
: Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
: suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.
:
: Thanks,
: Schiz
:
:
: For a lot less than $500, the Nakamichi CA-5 is overall very hard to beat
: provided it has been professionally checked and brought back to spec. I also
: love the sound of Melos SHA-Gold in the right system but many people think
: that it sounds "bigger than life" or "bombastic". I still love its ability
: to bring music alive despite the PITA controls (I have the version with the
: "balance meter"). And you have a choice between active and passive modes of
: operation. And one of the very best headphone amps around. I have no idea of
: the going price of the Melos though but I bought my second unit for $450
: from a dealer. BTW, in active mode the Melos can drive Avantgarde Trios
: without a power amp... :-)
:
:
: Cheers,
:
: Margaret
:
you must have an awfull lotta rooms
or wall to wall equipment in some home venue :-)
Rudy

"George M. Middius" cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast [dot] net wrote
in message ...


Robert Morein said:

There you go with the intellligence thing again, Arny. You obviously
believe you're more intelligent than anyone else on this NG. Thus I
have to ask: what proof do you have of this? Not your posts,
certainly.

Yes, he really does. He has explicitly said so.
Arny, let's get one thing straight.
You're pretty smart. Perhaps you have an IQ of 140. That's not bad at
all.
But you are not a luminary. You are not one of the intellects of our
epoch.

I'm of the opinion that smartness by itself matters little. A person's
accomplishments are much more revealing of his or her worth. Put another
way, the smarter you are on paper, the more you should be able to
accomplish in life.

I believe we all know what Arnii Krooger's accomplishments are. ;-)



BTW, I changed the thread title because I don't believe Mr. **** is a
megalomaniac. Quite the opposite -- he has no power and he doesn't take
any steps to amass it. The other day, I heard a term that applied quite
well to Turdborg. It's slipped my mind but it nicely encompassed Krooger's
persistent delusions of grandiosity and grotesquely inflated estimate of
his own importance.

An incompetent megalomaniac?
I suspect that most megalomaniacs are incompetent. It is only the rare few,
combining manipulative cunning with mindless ambition for power, who go down
in History. Arny has all the cunning of a claw hammer.

"Ruud Broens" wrote in message
...

"Margaret von B." wrote in message
...
:
: "Schizoid Man" wrote in message
: ...
: Hi all,
:
: I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not
required.
: The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD. Can anyone
: recommend some makes/models?
:
: Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
: suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.
:
: Thanks,
: Schiz
:
:
: For a lot less than $500, the Nakamichi CA-5 is overall very hard to
beat
: provided it has been professionally checked and brought back to spec. I
also
: love the sound of Melos SHA-Gold in the right system but many people
think
: that it sounds "bigger than life" or "bombastic". I still love its
ability
: to bring music alive despite the PITA controls (I have the version with
the
: "balance meter"). And you have a choice between active and passive modes
of
: operation. And one of the very best headphone amps around. I have no
idea of
: the going price of the Melos though but I bought my second unit for $450
: from a dealer. BTW, in active mode the Melos can drive Avantgarde Trios
: without a power amp... :-)
:
:
: Cheers,
:
: Margaret
:
you must have an awfull lotta rooms

Quite a few, actually.

or wall to wall equipment in some home venue :-)

I do have a dedicated storage room where I keep most of my equipment. Even
my home studio is relatively uncluttered, thanks to digital...

Cheers,

Margaret

Margaret von B. said:

I do have a dedicated storage room where I keep most of my equipment. Even
my home studio is relatively uncluttered, thanks to digital...

Sounds spiffy. Give a shout next time you're having a tea party, would
you?

"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com...

Robert Morein wrote:
"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com...

Schizoid Man wrote:
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not
required. The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD.
Can anyone recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

I've got a C-70 which is very functional IMO. I think this will serve
you well. I switched to a passive attenuator for my line level sources
and am hard pressed to tell a difference.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ran&1138482535

Don't let the Yamaha haters give you any crap. The C- series is well
designed and very reliable.

I use a couple. It's a great preamp if you know how to solder, but there
are
two considerations:
1. The circuit boards are single sided epoxy paper. The solder
connections
holding the relays on the board develop cracks from the vibration of the
relay action.

I've never seen a solder joint fail due to relay vibration. I suspect
thermal cycling is a far more likely cause. My unit has no
detectable heat output so I wonder if you may have a problem in your
power supply... a leaky cap perhaps.

I did have one of the main output connectors cracked a solder joint but
I attribute that to the use of monster interconnects which were grossly
too tight. I touched the joints with my iron and haven't had problem
since.

I will never understand why some people think soldering requires
skill... its just too easy.

Once learned, yes. A lot of people just don't want to wait long enough for
the solder to melt. I've seen lots of separation from the board from people
using the iron improperly.
Some son't want to take the time to tin the iron or keep it clean. I have a
freind who works in a machine shop where they do van conversions for he
handicapped and does a lot of soldering and does it beautifully. He
installs the electronics that control the doors and the lift, etc. and
therefore is soldering every day, yet his work, good as it is, is not nearly
as good as his wife's. Go figure.


The units can always be repaired by resolding them, but this
is a definite design weakness. On the plus side, these preamps actually
have
a balanced output, supplying both normal and inverted phase. The output
impedance is the lowest I've ever seen, around 15 ohms.
2. The analog power supply is cooled via vents on the top of the cabinet.
This area of the preamp runs extremely hot. These vents must not be
obscured
by stacking, or very expensive repairs will be required. Even so, the
board
tends to brown in this area.

Great line drivers, great sound. Just those little problems.

As I said... for $150 with a decent phono stage I think he'd be hard
pressed to find a better deal.

And the parts should they need replacing are always standard AFAICR.

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Robert Morein" wrote in message


You're pretty smart. Perhaps you have an IQ of 140.

Prove it by means of an independent reference. Obviously Morein, your
usual it's true because I say so approach is completely invalid.

(a very interesting proposition, since its wrong!)

If you can't prove your claim Morein, that makes you exactly as delusional
as many of the rest of your posts show you to be.
I don't know about delusional, but certainly childish.
I killfiled him weeks ago and apparently he still responds to my posts with
the usual nonsense.

"George M. Middius" cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast [dot] net wrote
in message ...


Robert Morein said:

There you go with the intellligence thing again, Arny. You obviously
believe you're more intelligent than anyone else on this NG. Thus I
have to ask: what proof do you have of this? Not your posts,
certainly.

Yes, he really does. He has explicitly said so.
Arny, let's get one thing straight.
You're pretty smart. Perhaps you have an IQ of 140. That's not bad at
all.
But you are not a luminary. You are not one of the intellects of our
epoch.

I'm of the opinion that smartness by itself matters little. A person's
accomplishments are much more revealing of his or her worth. Put another
way, the smarter you are on paper, the more you should be able to
accomplish in life.

I believe we all know what Arnii Krooger's accomplishments are. ;-)

And as far as we know your biggest accomplishment is being a pain in the ass
on usenet.
Your folks must be so proud.

BTW, I changed the thread title because I don't believe Mr. **** is a
megalomaniac.

That seems to fit you like a glove.

Quite the opposite -- he has no power and he doesn't take
any steps to amass it.

While you seem to think you have power that doesn't exist.

The other day, I heard a term that applied quite
well to Turdborg.

What a funny name. Is that one of your siblings?

It's slipped my mind

Probably not that difficult.

but it nicely encompassed Krooger's
persistent delusions of grandiosity and grotesquely inflated estimate of
his own importance.


Speaking of delusions, why is it you appear to believe your own bull****.
I've seen no evidence that Arny (note proper spelling) does anything more
than try to correct factual inaccuracies spewed forth by some of the dimmer
people who haunt this board. Except for the times he strikes back at the
vitriol he gets for those efforts.

I have this notin that you have no mirrors in your house, so as to keep you
from looking yourself in the eye.

wrote in message
news

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Robert Morein" wrote in message


You're pretty smart. Perhaps you have an IQ of 140.

Prove it by means of an independent reference. Obviously Morein, your
usual it's true because I say so approach is completely invalid.

(a very interesting proposition, since its wrong!)

If you can't prove your claim Morein, that makes you exactly as
delusional as many of the rest of your posts show you to be.
I don't know about delusional, but certainly childish.
I killfiled him weeks ago and apparently he still responds to my posts
with the usual nonsense.

I respond to all of Mikey's posts, for the benefit of those who do not
realize that he is R.A.O.'s Village Idiot.
Mikey, too bad you're missing all I say about you.

George, please quote?

wrote in message
news

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Robert Morein" wrote in message


You're pretty smart. Perhaps you have an IQ of 140.

Prove it by means of an independent reference. Obviously Morein, your
usual it's true because I say so approach is completely invalid.

(a very interesting proposition, since its wrong!)

If you can't prove your claim Morein, that makes you exactly as
delusional as many of the rest of your posts show you to be.
I don't know about delusional, but certainly childish.
I killfiled him weeks ago and apparently he still responds to my posts
with the usual nonsense.

That is correct, Mikey.
I am hard at work representing your subhuman IQ and stoogy slavery to Arny
Krueger.
I annotate everything you write.
You know, Mikey, you really don't belong here. You have a weak mind, a low
IQ, poor hearing, and a desire to be a human slave.
These annotations will continue.

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
wrote in message

"Schizoid Man" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono
section not required. The sources will be Aux1 (TV),
Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD. Can anyone recommend some
makes/models?

What does this preamp have to do?

Impress visiting firemen, and other paying customers.


So that is how you are making a living these days! IIRC Jesus had a thing
with a prostitute so your church-related ramblings are starting to make
sense... :-)

Cheers,

Margaret

wrote in message
ink.net...

"George M. Middius" cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast [dot] net
wrote in message ...


Robert Morein said:

There you go with the intellligence thing again, Arny. You obviously
believe you're more intelligent than anyone else on this NG. Thus I
have to ask: what proof do you have of this? Not your posts,
certainly.

Yes, he really does. He has explicitly said so.
Arny, let's get one thing straight.
You're pretty smart. Perhaps you have an IQ of 140. That's not bad at
all.
But you are not a luminary. You are not one of the intellects of our
epoch.

I'm of the opinion that smartness by itself matters little. A person's
accomplishments are much more revealing of his or her worth. Put another
way, the smarter you are on paper, the more you should be able to
accomplish in life.

I believe we all know what Arnii Krooger's accomplishments are. ;-)

And as far as we know your biggest accomplishment is being a pain in the
ass on usenet.
Your folks must be so proud.

BTW, I changed the thread title because I don't believe Mr. **** is a
megalomaniac.

That seems to fit you like a glove.

Quite the opposite -- he has no power and he doesn't take
any steps to amass it.

While you seem to think you have power that doesn't exist.

The other day, I heard a term that applied quite
well to Turdborg.

What a funny name. Is that one of your siblings?

It's slipped my mind

Probably not that difficult.

but it nicely encompassed Krooger's
persistent delusions of grandiosity and grotesquely inflated estimate of
his own importance.


Speaking of delusions, why is it you appear to believe your own bull****.
I've seen no evidence that Arny (note proper spelling) does anything more
than try to correct factual inaccuracies spewed forth by some of the
dimmer people who haunt this board. Except for the times he strikes back
at the vitriol he gets for those efforts.

I have this notin that you have no mirrors in your house, so as to keep
you from looking yourself in the eye.
This is the response of Mikey McKelviphibian, r.a.o.'s village idiot. Mikey
does hold a distinction -- that of a weak mind, poor hearing, and slavish
devotion to Arny Krueger. He is a subhuman slave.