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On Mar 25, 4:22 am, (paul packer) wrote:
On Sun, 25 Mar 2007 20:23:38 +1000, "Trevor Wilson"





wrote:

"paul packer" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 25 Mar 2007 15:42:09 +1000, "Trevor Wilson"
wrote:

"paul packer" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 24 Mar 2007 12:31:23 +1100, "Trevor Wilson"
wrote:

wrote in message
legroups.com...
hi

i have a YAMAHA RX-300U natural Sound AMPLIFIER
i would like to replace some of the component with better pats.
any sugestion? this amp is only 2 X 37 chanel

any idea ?

**Replace it with a Rotel.

Not necessarily an improvement, Trevor. I have a Yamaha RX-485

**BZZZZT! How long has the RX-485 been identical to a Rotel?
How relevant is it to compare a Rotel to a Yamaha, when using headphones
if
the vast majority of people listen via speakers?

receiver and it sounds brilliant--better than the several budget
Rotels I've had.

I'd ask the OP why he feels the need for better compontents. What does
he feel the sound is lacking?

**He probably uses speakers. Rotels are designed to operate with speakers.
Yamahas work better with dummy loads.

Says you and how many others?

**Everyone who has measured them.

I cite the following on the RX-485:

"One company that does make high-current receivers for those on a
tight budget is Yamaha. Rated at 65w/ch continuously into 8 ohms, that
power goes up to 70w/ch for 6 ohm loads like the Mini-Reference.

**Big whoop. From 65 Watts to 70 Watts. A theorectically perfect amp will
run to around 85 Watts. The Yammay falls well short of ideal.

And
the dynamic power output figures really show greater
capabilities--into 8/6/4/2 ohms respectively, IHF rated dynamic power
is 96/115/135/150 watts/ch (and all these are full 20hz-20Khz
bandwidth ratings, unlike the cheating I've seen some companies do by
only measuring their amplifiers driving a 40hz+ signal).

**Except that dynamic power ratings are worse than bull****.

This sort of
output, with power going up into lower loads, is a characteristic of a
good design with a good power supply.

**No, it is not. It is just that dynamic power figures make good copy for
people who have no idea about what they're talking about. Like the author.

Receivers without dynamic
headroom, and those that have their power drop dramatically below 8
ohms, are not recommended for driving real speakers no matter how high
their wattage figures may be."

**Utter, banal bull****. The author needs to contact the following companies
and tell them how bad their amps a

Krell
Mark Levinson
Rowland
ME
Et al.

All the above amplifiers enjoy vanishingly small dynamic headroom figures.
The 'ideal' amplifier has a dynamic headroom figure of 0dB. As amplifiers
become worse (IE: Cheaper power supplies are used) then the dynamic headroom
figure rises as well.

from this link:

http://www.soundstage.com/entry01.htm

**Keep reading that nonsense Paul and you'll never learn anything. The
author clearly has no idea.

I don't read it to learn anything, Trevor, merely to cite a contrary
opinion. I know enough about the measurements cited to be as
unimpressed by the figures as you were (one does learn something
reading all those hi-fi mags over the years); I just didn't like your
smug tone in disparaging (or rather damning) Yamahas. You tend to talk
in absolutes, and brook no contradiction. A bad habit.

My comments about your use of headphones remain.
The use of headphones invalidates your claim to knowing how an amplifier
sounds, for the vast majority of uses that the amplifier will be put to.

If that's true then there is no way of knowing what an amplifier
sounds like, since it will sound different with every speaker
depending on load---there is no constant. In a way headphones give a
true sound since they are not causing the amp any difficulty. And you
know, Trevor, this will come as a shock but....some people actually
prefer headphones to speakers. In fact there's a thriving community of
headphones users out there. So when you say (again rather smugly) that
I can't know the true sound of an amp listening through headphones,
maybe to me the sound through headphones IS the true sound.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

============================
I'll make a nonsubstantial, non-technically knowledgeable
noncontribution.
Whenever I tried listening to eg. an orchestra on headphones I got a
feeling of claustrophobia. It sounded to me not remotely like the true
thing.
Ludovic Mirabel

[MiNe 109]

In article . com,
" wrote:

============================
I'll make a nonsubstantial, non-technically knowledgeable
noncontribution.
Whenever I tried listening to eg. an orchestra on headphones I got a
feeling of claustrophobia. It sounded to me not remotely like the true
thing.

There are several binaural recordings of the Pasadena Symphony available
(on Newport Classics) that may be as close as one can get outside of the
former Bell Labs and Microsoft.

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=sr_nr_i_...e=UTF8&keyword
s=pasadena%20symphony&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Apasadena%20 symphony%2Ci%3Apopular

Sadly, the binaural effect seems lost on me! at least for the
Rachmaninoff disc I bought used.

Stephen

[Arny Krueger]

wrote in message
ups.com

I'll make a nonsubstantial, non-technically knowledgeable
noncontribution.

You're good at that, Ludo. ;-)

Whenever I tried listening to eg. an orchestra on
headphones I got a feeling of claustrophobia. It sounded
to me not remotely like the true thing.

Depends a lot on the recording and the headphones. I just spent about a week
of working days over a period of two weeks, sitting in the middle of row 1,
recording choirs and bands in a number of different venues.

My recording chain was composed of a Rode NT-4 microphone, a Symmetrix SX202
mic preamp, and a Tascam CD-RW4U CD recorder. My mic placement technique was
to move the mic around, perched on the top of a tall stand (max 12 feet),
until what I heard in my Audio Technica ATH A700 headphones, sounded
substantially like the live sound, both in terms of imaging and tonal
balance.

[Jenn]

In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:

wrote in message
ups.com

I'll make a nonsubstantial, non-technically knowledgeable
noncontribution.

You're good at that, Ludo. ;-)

Whenever I tried listening to eg. an orchestra on
headphones I got a feeling of claustrophobia. It sounded
to me not remotely like the true thing.

Depends a lot on the recording and the headphones. I just spent about a week
of working days over a period of two weeks, sitting in the middle of row 1,
recording choirs and bands in a number of different venues.

My recording chain was composed of a Rode NT-4 microphone, a Symmetrix SX202
mic preamp, and a Tascam CD-RW4U CD recorder. My mic placement technique was
to move the mic around, perched on the top of a tall stand (max 12 feet),
until what I heard in my Audio Technica ATH A700 headphones, sounded
substantially like the live sound, both in terms of imaging and tonal
balance.

Any interesting composers or works come to mind?

[George M. Middius]

Jenn said:


My
My
I

Any interesting composers or works come to mind?

Jnen are you claiming, Jen that you know more about "interesting" music
than, Arnii knows Jennn?





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