wrote in message
oups.com...

Fella ranted:

wrote:
Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason! wrote:


I'm just curious. I just did a search of r.a.o. going back at least
eight years. Thousands and thousands of 'objectivist' posts by Mr.
Krueger, nob, and others.

Have these thousands of posts, representing hundreds and thousands of
man hours, been to any effect?

Has anyone ever actually changed their mind on how they think about
audio based on what they've read here?

Just curious...


I did. I used to read Arny back way back in the day, when I was just a
wee little lurker. I was a hard-boiled extremist objectivist. Even more
than Arny is. ABX was my religion, and I practiced it every day. You
couldn't convince me that ANYTHING sounded ANY different from ANYTHING
else in audio. Even loudspeakers all sounded the same, where I was
concerned. But after taking in a gutfull of Arny Krueger, he sickened
me so much, that I renounced the religion of objectivism, and smashed
my ABX comparator box with a mallet.

I even tore down my picture of sexy Dave Carlstrom, and today, as most
people know me, I'm an alternative audio guru. I always maintain an
even number of cd's in my collection, I cross out the bar codes in my
cd cases with a "specially treated" $150 red marker, and I park my car
in the same place and the same direction every day. All to ensure good
sound from my home audio. And I'm happy to report, the sound I'm
getting off my hifi kit has NEVER been better in all my days. So thank
you, Arny Krueger!


Troll BE GONE!

This post is almost proof that this is some borg posing as an extreme
audio subjectivist crackpot. The message to be derived from the text
above: If you abandon the objectivist abxism religion you become a
pitiful silly subjectivist crackpot troll with a $200 green marker stuck
up your butt.

Nice kook rant. So... are you going to ever back up any of your
********, or simply remain the ignorant twit that you so clearly are?

I vote for the second one.

Mr. McMickey, I'm calling you to account for your libelous accuasations
against legitimate professionals in the audio business.

We've had some Real Audio Guys on RAO from time to time who
do have genuine, hands-on knowledge and experience with them.
Two of them are Glenn Zelniker and John Atkinson. Others may be
Paul Bamborough and Paul Frindle, although I can't remember with
certainty. We Normals have great respect for all of those guys, but
you and the Krooborg hate and fear them.

Of course you do, they are all dishonest and many of them completely looney
and/or vulgar.


Please tell us exactly how each of them is "dishonest".

Glenn Zelniker:

John Atkinson:

Paul Bamborough:

Paul Frindle:

Remember, you said "they are all dishonest". Provide your evidence or
admit you committed libel.

After that, you can give specific reasons for saying at least 3 of them
are "completely looney".

We're waiting, McStupid.

"Signal" wrote in message
...
" emitted :

Given the abuse the ones who admit to endorsing it take, why would
anyone want to come out from lurking to abused by the likes of RAO's
usual suspects?

Why do ABX endorsees lack the courage of their convictions, Mick?


In what way? If you are referring to some not having actually taken an ABX
test, that's a straw man. All that's required is understanding that it is a
valid way to check for difference.

I understood the reason for doing ABX testing when I first heard of it and
way before I knew who Tom or Arny were, and before I even owned a computer.
It simply made sense to remove bias, particularly since I had been an audio
salesperson and used suggestion to help make sales, at least at first.
Eventually I came to realize that when the levels were close enough and the
switching quick enough, most people were not hearing any differences. This
was still before I had heard of ABX or Arny and Nousaine. It always made
sense to me to base audio decisions on one of 2 primary reasons, either a
difference in sound, or a matter of functions required for a given purpose.

I decided that if a customer heard no difference, they should simply pick
whatever met their function needs as well as their financial needs.

This caused me to become well trusted and got me a lot of repeat business,
since my customers realized that I wasn't trying to oversell them.

There were of course times when differences were very apparent, such as with
turntables and cartridges, or speakers, therefore I know it's not honest to
claim there are never any differences, since I have demonstrated them and
heard them myself.

I have no fear of participating in an ABX test, and would gladly do so if
the opportunity presented it self. Of course then someone would be
complaining that the outcome was due to my expectation bias, assuming I
heard no difference, so it's a no win situation, what would be gained?

Those that say the test is not valid, in spite of the fact that it used by
many audio researchers, won't take the test and those that do think it is
valid are accused of expectation bias. That only leaves people who have no
idea about the validity of the test, and I assume they are the ones sought
after by the researchers.

Or were you referring to some other lack of conviction?

"Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason!" wrote in message
oups.com...
From:
Date: Mon, Mar 13 2006 12:24 am
Email: "

Given the abuse the ones who admit to endorsing it take, why would
anyone want to come out from lurking to abused by the likes of RAO's
usual suspects?

Convenient excuse. If it was me, I want to shove it to those rabid
subjectivists and say, 'Here I am, assholes!'

Well we've already established that you play by your own set of rules.


Do you actually think that most people would be afraid of being called
'Krooborg' or 'nob' on a discussion group?

I don't think any are now.

People like that should not
be on the Usenet. Their delicate sensibilities might get upset. You act
like there's physical violence here. LOL!

If given the opportunity, I simply prefer more reasoned discourse.

They can post one message that just says, "I've been converted by posts
here from enter name to a different view" (if any people like that
actually exist) and then go back to lurking.

Why bother? There's only the possibility of derision and no possible gain
to be had by doing so. Any benefit comes from knowing that you spend your
money for real and audible improvements, not from admitting that you do so.

You'd think that after eight plus years and tens of thousands of posts
there'd be some people coming forward. I am beginning to suspect that
Signal is correct: lots of loud insistent demands, lots of preference
bashing, no real effect.

The only preference bashing I've seen is from the subjectivist side. They
are the ones who claim there must be something wrong if you can't hear how
much better some tweako piece of equipment is, or if you don't prefer the
sound of tubes, or how much better a certain kind of expensive amplifier is.
Observe "Fella," who took an ABX test between 2 amps he owns and even though
he could not reliably hear a difference, still insists that the reason for
that is the test and not the fact that the amps actually might just sound
enough alike that there was no difference to be perceived. Of coursed he
refuses to try and improve his listening skills and try again to see if he
can do better, and refuses to accept that there are knowns about what is
audible and what is not.

I think that most people, have read and understand what an ABX test is about
and can see that it makes sense to use only ears and not eyes to determine
difference. I also think that they get the fact that if 2 pieces of gear
have audible differences and then one is EQ'd to match the other, that it
will make it impossible to hear those differences afterwards. From that
they can understand that frequency response that is close enough and not
having anything driven to clipping will result in the inability to detect
any difference. They use this to help them save money by not buying
anything more than what they really need in terms of electronics and
concentrate on where the real differences are, in speakers and how they
interact with the room they are in.

At least that's what I hope people are learning, since that clearly, to me
at least is the wisest of choices. It doesn't mean that it is wrong to make
other choices, it just means there is very little, audible reason to do
other wise.

"ScottW" wrote in message
news:dg2Rf.136372$0G.31877@dukeread10...

"Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason!" wrote in message
oups.com...
I'm just curious. I just did a search of r.a.o. going back at least
eight years. Thousands and thousands of 'objectivist' posts by Mr.
Krueger, nob, and others.

Have these thousands of posts, representing hundreds and thousands of
man hours, been to any effect?

Has anyone ever actually changed their mind on how they think about
audio based on what they've read here?

Sometimes Arny would step into it with guys like JJ and Zelniker
and there would be some things to learn about audio bantered
back and forth.
Some of those discussions were highly technical and
difficult to always follow... but it was interesting and
sometimes revealing.

Those days are long gone.


And Middius is one of the main reasons.

Stupid is as stupid does.

Why do ABX endorsees lack the courage of their convictions, Mick?

In what way? If you are referring to some not having actually taken an ABX
test, that's a straw man. All that's required is understanding that it is a
valid way to check for difference.

Several valid points have been made about the flaws of aBxism. You are
either too stupid to understand them or too far gone in your religion to
accept anything that undermines your blind faith.

It's not just me who calls you duh-Mikey, you know. Why don't you get a job
already and stop bleeding all over Usenet seven days a week?

"Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason!" wrote in message
ups.com...
From: Arny Krueger
Date: Mon, Mar 13 2006 6:29 am
Email: "Arny Krueger"

What I said was I
looked at posts going back over eight years and saw
hundreds and thousands of posts from you, nob, and
others.

False claim - google's highest estimate of how many posts I've made on RAO
is under 100,000.

Please note the difference between 'hundreds and thousands' and
'hundreds of thousands.' They do not mean the same thing. It may help
you to see that I have made no 'false claim.'

The ones that I looked from you and nob at were
just like the ones I see today, Mr. Krueger: generally
angry, all promoting the 'objectivist' viewpoint, and
many that seemed to bash preference.

Inability to tell the difference between being angry and trying to hold a
bunch of abusers accountable for thieir childish behavior noted.

IMO, there's a definite 'tone' to the majority of 'objectivist' posts
here. While yours may not be as angry as nob's, they have a distinct
edge, especially if someone disagrees with you.

I didn't notice in the FAQ that there was anyone officially responsible
here for 'holding' people 'accountable.'

Just now I ran three searches. One with 'Arny Krueger'
one with 'Arnold Krueger' and another with just 'Arny' as
authors on r.a.o only. The former came up with 44,300
posts; the latter 74,100.

IOW, far less than the 100,000's you claimed above. Thanks for
contradicting
yourself, again.

No, 44,300 is indeed 'hundreds and thousands' of posts. Inability to
understand plain English noted.

I also looked up 'George Middius' as the author on r.a.o.
That search showed 52,600 posts. I could see no other
variations that looked like the posts were his.

George used other nicknames including "Glanbrok". I can't remember them
all
but in the early days they changed pretty frequently.

I'd have no way of knowing that. From what I see today, I'd put you and
nob among the highest-volume posters here.

Even assuming that you've made only 45,000 posts to
r.a.o., the difference in volume between you and Mr.
Middius is hardly 'overrunning' rec.audio.opinion,
especially in relationship to your posting quantity. I'd
guess you and he were running probably closer to 1-1, or
even more likely that you post more than he does.

Let's put it this way - even his defenders can only remember a handful of
posts on RAO by Middius that could be called audio-related. Those 45,000
or
more posts by Middius were virtually all personal attacks. The vast
majority of those posts attacked me.

OTOH, my posts are predomiantely audio-related.

I don't doubt that. My question was not meant as a qualitative study on
posting content. My only question was if the massive volume of
audio-related posts from you, nob, and the other 'usual suspects' had
changed anyone's mind.

Just comnparing with both of your posts, it would be
equally truthful to say that you've overrun r.a.o. It
would probably be more truthful to say that neither of
you has.

It's true that I've overrun RAO with audio-related posts, which were
objectively true and based on orthodox audio technology. It's equally true
that Middius has overrun RAO with personal attacks.

Have either of you changed anybody's mind?

Just curious.

Not on RAO that I know of, but in real life, yes.

"George M. Middius" cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast
[dot] net wrote in message


Please tell us exactly how each of them is "dishonest".

Glenn Zelniker:

Distorted some truth and refused to tell or defend other truth.

John Atkinson:

Read his ragazine. Do you seriously think that is all the truth?

Paul Bamborough:

Guilty because of his many agenda-driven distortions of the truth - his
indictment of Adobe Audition (named Cool Edit Pro in the day) as being a
destructive editor is good example.

Paul Frindle:

Irrelevant on the grounds of lack of sufficient postings to reach any
conclusions.

Remember, you said "they are all dishonest". Provide your
evidence or admit you committed libel.

After that, you can give specific reasons for saying at
least 3 of them are "completely looney".

In my experience:

Glenn Zelniker: - Looney over-the top profane posting.

John Atkinson: - Looney if he isn't lying. Can any well-informed person read
any issue of his ragazine without thinking that anybody who approves all
that weirdness has to be at least a little nuts?

Paul Bamborough - Looney twisting of the truth. Threw numerous fits of rage.

In Paul's case there was point in time after which there was a serious
degradation of the quality of his posts. It was almost like someone else
with a lot less brains and experience was forging Bamborough's name. A
stroke? Depression? It was very strange.

"George M. Middius" cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast [dot] net wrote
in message ...



Shhhh! said to ImmoralityBorg:

Have either of you changed anybody's mind?

I never intended to change anybody's mind. I just make fun of the
self-appointed "scientists" who have no real knowledge of DBTs but are
blessed with a surfeit of class envy.


Astounding! Once again the swine gets it all wrong. I don't claim to be a
scientist, I just claim to be able to understand that removing bias works
and that ears are all you need to evaluate audio equipment. The class envy
crapola is just that, I don't give a **** if somebody wants to spend
ridiculousamounts of money on their audio system, I just hope they
concentrate on what is most effective, speakers.

Theere does seem to be a fair amount of snobbery from some on the
subjectivist side who seem to always be claiming that someone doesn't have a
"revealing enough" system to hear the wonderous benfits of their 600 dollar
volume knob, or their 300 dollar per foot cable.

wrote in message
nk.net...


Calling yourself "normal" is ridiculous in the extreme, since "normal"
people aren't stalkers, liars and swine.

Oh yeah, they are also not sockpuppets.


'Normal' people don't argue with sockpuppets.



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wrote in message
nk.net...

"Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason!" wrote in message
ups.com...


Have either of you changed anybody's mind?

Just curious.

Not on RAO that I know of, but in real life, yes.


Real life doesn't count!!!



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"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"George M. Middius" cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast
[dot] net wrote in message


Please tell us exactly how each of them is "dishonest".

Glenn Zelniker:

Distorted some truth and refused to tell or defend other truth.

John Atkinson:

Read his ragazine. Do you seriously think that is all the truth?

Paul Bamborough:

Guilty because of his many agenda-driven distortions of the truth - his
indictment of Adobe Audition (named Cool Edit Pro in the day) as being a
destructive editor is good example.

Paul Frindle:

Irrelevant on the grounds of lack of sufficient postings to reach any
conclusions.

Remember, you said "they are all dishonest". Provide your
evidence or admit you committed libel.

After that, you can give specific reasons for saying at
least 3 of them are "completely looney".

In my experience:

Glenn Zelniker: - Looney over-the top profane posting.

John Atkinson: - Looney if he isn't lying. Can any well-informed person
read any issue of his ragazine without thinking that anybody who approves
all that weirdness has to be at least a little nuts?

Paul Bamborough - Looney twisting of the truth. Threw numerous fits of
rage.

In Paul's case there was point in time after which there was a serious
degradation of the quality of his posts. It was almost like someone else
with a lot less brains and experience was forging Bamborough's name. A
stroke? Depression? It was very strange.



if irony consulted a psychiatrist.



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George M. Middius wrote:
Stupid is as stupid does.

Why do ABX endorsees lack the courage of their convictions, Mick?

In what way? If you are referring to some not having actually taken an ABX
test, that's a straw man. All that's required is understanding that it is a
valid way to check for difference.

Several valid points have been made about the flaws of aBxism.

No they have not. There have been several distortions and outright
lies about it and attempts to try and mke it sound like something it
isn'.

You are
either too stupid to understand them or too far gone in your religion to
accept anything that undermines your blind faith.


It is precisely the opposite of blnd faith, it is recognition of the
fact that ears are the only appropriate tool for evaluating the sound
of auido equipment.

It's not just me who calls you duh-Mikey, you know. Why don't you get a job
already and stop bleeding all over Usenet seven days a week?

If irony killed.

George M. Middius wrote:
Some plain talk from the Bug Eater.

self-appointed "scientists" who have no real knowledge of DBTs

I don't claim to be a scientist

Oh, that's a relief. It's not like anybody actually thought you were a real
scientist who does real research in the real world, but still, it's big of
you to clear that point up.

What confused about what I said, McMoron? Do you know what self-appointed
means? Do you know what a Normal person means when he puts a word in
quotation marks?


Self appointed , as in the person calling himself George Middius, is
the self appointed monitor of what is appriopriate for discovering the
truth about audio?


I know you're very stupid, but even an idiot can occasionally realize he
messed up. Now's your chance to do just that.

I must have missed an opportunity to call you a swine, stalker and all
round pain in the ass, sack o ****.

Clyde Slick wrote:
wrote in message
nk.net...


Calling yourself "normal" is ridiculous in the extreme, since "normal"
people aren't stalkers, liars and swine.

Oh yeah, they are also not sockpuppets.


'Normal' people don't argue with sockpuppets.



What do you call Ssss****I'mlisteningtomyself****onRAO, or
soundhasatweakforyou?

"George M. Middius" cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast
[dot] net wrote in message

Stupid is as stupid does.

Why do ABX endorsees lack the courage of their
convictions, Mick?

In what way? If you are referring to some not having
actually taken an ABX test, that's a straw man. All
that's required is understanding that it is a valid way
to check for difference.

Several valid points have been made about the flaws of
aBxism.

So much for ABXism, which is in fact a creation of one George Middius.

Why
don't you get a job already and stop bleeding all over
Usenet seven days a week?

About that non-existent employment history of yours, Mr. Middius...

Clyde Slick said:

'Normal' people don't argue with sockpuppets.

Mickey is the only "person" I know of who eats the lice after he picks them
out of his roots.

"George M. Middius" cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast [dot] net wrote
in message ...


Clyde Slick said:

'Normal' people don't argue with sockpuppets.

Mickey is the only "person" I know of who eats the lice after he picks
them
out of his roots.


You come by this knowledge the same way youcome by all the rest of the
prouncements you make here, you make them up.

Once a swine, always a swine.

How about you tell us something about your audio knowledge? Uh-oh
Kryptonite.

wrote in message
oups.com...

Clyde Slick wrote:
wrote in message
nk.net...


Calling yourself "normal" is ridiculous in the extreme, since "normal"
people aren't stalkers, liars and swine.

Oh yeah, they are also not sockpuppets.


'Normal' people don't argue with sockpuppets.



What do you call Ssss****I'mlisteningtomyself****onRAO, or
soundhasatweakforyou?


Anonymous rats.
but not sockpuppets.
There is a difference.
A few (including Arny) say they have evidence that sound.....
is a sockpuppet of a known RAO guy, but I haven't seen any
such evidence, "at least" not yet. Arny could be right, but who knows.


Anyway, here are the sockpuppets, as I see them

Michael Conzo, is a Brian McCarty sockpuppet
Warm Blue Glow, is a Sound.....sockpuppet, but not well hidden,
I think its pretty obvious and WBG means it to be obvious,
so maybe it is more of an alias than a sockpuppet.
Yet, Sound... has the potential of turnng out to be a sockpuppet.
for now, he is anonymous.

Now, for aliases.
Clyde Slick is an alias of Art Sackman
NYOB is an alias of Mik McKelvy.



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"Clyde Slick" wrote in message


Now, for aliases.
Clyde Slick is an alias of Art Sackman

If there ever was an Art Sackman who posted to RAO...

Out of lice already, Mickey?

How about you tell us something about your audio knowledge?

I enjoy my systems. That's all I need to know.


(For all I know, I might enjoy hearing your system too, but I doubt
you'll pack it up and ship it to me, so that question will have to
remain academic.)

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
"Clyde Slick" wrote in message


Now, for aliases.
Clyde Slick is an alias of Art Sackman

If there ever was an Art Sackman who posted to RAO...


here we go again!
No, Arny, I am not sending you my
credit card and bank account numbers.



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"George M. Middius" cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast
[dot] net postured in message


Prerequisite subjectivist childish name-calling:

Out of lice already, Mickey?


How about you tell us something about your audio
knowledge?

I enjoy my systems. That's all I need to know.

That might be true Middius, if you didn't try to sit in judgement over
people who need to know more.

From:
Date: Tues, Mar 14 2006 2:29 pm
Email: "

What do you call Ssss****I'mlisteningtomyself****onRAO, or
soundhasatweakforyou?

I call myself an 'anonymous poster.'

Given the rage you clearly display, would you really expect me to give
you my name and address?

And exactly how have I '**** on r.a.o.'? By questioning attacks on
people's preferences? By pointing out your bigoted and destructive
politics?

One man's anonymous poster is another man's 'sockpuppet' I suppose.

From: Clyde Slick
Date: Tues, Mar 14 2006 3:29 pm
Email: "Clyde Slick"

Anyway, here are the sockpuppets, as I see them

...Warm Blue Glow, is a Sound.....sockpuppet, but not well hidden, I think its pretty obvious
and WBG means it to be obvious,

Actually not. Warm Blue Glow is me. I had set up two nicknames when I
set up my Google account, one for r.a.o. and one for r.a.t. and
forgotten about it. If I reply to a post in r.a.t. WBG shows up. Some
of the posts are cross-posted to both, so WBG shows up on r.a.o. if I
reply to a post in r.a.t. and it is cross-posted to r.a.o.

So this was not intended as a 'sockpuppet' but simply as a different
nickname for a different newsgroup.

Sorry for the confusion. (BTW, you'll see that the email address for
both nicknames is the same.)

"Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason!" wrote in message
oups.com...
From: Clyde Slick
Date: Tues, Mar 14 2006 3:29 pm
Email: "Clyde Slick"

Anyway, here are the sockpuppets, as I see them

...Warm Blue Glow, is a Sound.....sockpuppet, but not well hidden, I think
its pretty obvious
and WBG means it to be obvious,

Actually not. Warm Blue Glow is me. I had set up two nicknames when I
set up my Google account, one for r.a.o. and one for r.a.t. and
forgotten about it. If I reply to a post in r.a.t. WBG shows up. Some
of the posts are cross-posted to both, so WBG shows up on r.a.o. if I
reply to a post in r.a.t. and it is cross-posted to r.a.o.

So this was not intended as a 'sockpuppet' but simply as a different
nickname for a different newsgroup.

Sorry for the confusion. (BTW, you'll see that the email address for
both nicknames is the same.)



okay, I'll classify WBG as an alias of an anonymous poster.




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"George M. Middius" cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast [dot] net wrote
in message ...


Shhhh! said to the Bug Eater:

And exactly how have I '**** on r.a.o.'? By questioning attacks on
people's preferences? By pointing out your bigoted and destructive
politics?

Those naughty behaviors surely annoy Mickey, but your one big sin that
dwarfs all the others was daring to confront the Krooborg. Mr. **** is
to duh-Mikey as Marshall Applewhite, the leader of Heaven's Gate, was to
his followers. No sacrifice too great, etc.



"At least" Applewhite departed with his flock, as
did Jim Jones. Will Arny have the same courage
when irony finally kills the Borgs?



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"George M. Middius" cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast [dot] net wrote
in message ...


Out of lice already, Mickey?

How about you tell us something about your audio knowledge?

I enjoy my systems. That's all I need to know.

And don't try and teach you anything else.

And don't try and teach anybody else either.

I think that pretty much covers your input, so now you can go, you're done.

Mickey displays his slavish devotion to Kroopologism.

Out of lice already, Mickey?

No answer from the Bug Eater, so I'll assume the answer is Yes.

How about you tell us something about your audio knowledge?

I enjoy my systems. That's all I need to know.

And don't try and teach you anything else.

OK, I won't.

And don't try and teach anybody else either.

OK, I won't do that either.

I think that pretty much covers your input, so now you can go, you're done.

Why haven't you answered my question about your libels of the Real Audio
Guys? I've asked you twice now. Are you afraid to admit you have no
evidence to back up your lies?

From: Clyde Slick
Date: Tues, Mar 14 2006 7:25 pm
Email: "Clyde Slick"

okay, I'll classify WBG as an alias of an anonymous poster.

We'll still have to address the fact that you think that I sound like
Soundhaspriority...

I disagree.:-)

"Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason!" wrote in message
oups.com...
From:
Date: Tues, Mar 14 2006 1:07 pm
Email:

Some of those discussions were highly technical and
difficult to always follow... but it was interesting and
sometimes revealing.

Those days are long gone.

And Middius is one of the main reasons.

There's one *powerful* person.

He controls everybody.

More like he annoys everybody. and for no apparent reason.

He seems to pervade your thoughts every waking
moment.

You are a wizard at overstatement. Once I leave his board, Inever think of
him.

He's also driven off what sounds to me like the most
intelligent group of people here.

That much is true.

Um, so why are you still here, nob?;-)

Why are you?

I left for a long while, but I decided that there was still stuff to be
learned even with the noise from the peanut gallery.

"Clyde Slick" wrote in message
.. .

wrote in message
oups.com...

Clyde Slick wrote:
wrote in message
nk.net...


Calling yourself "normal" is ridiculous in the extreme, since "normal"
people aren't stalkers, liars and swine.

Oh yeah, they are also not sockpuppets.

Sure they are, that's why they hide.


'Normal' people don't argue with sockpuppets.

Normal people don't hang out here.

What do you call Ssss****I'mlisteningtomyself****onRAO, or
soundhasatweakforyou?


Anonymous rats.
but not sockpuppets.

You say tomato.

There is a difference.
A few (including Arny) say they have evidence that sound.....
is a sockpuppet of a known RAO guy, but I haven't seen any
such evidence, "at least" not yet. Arny could be right, but who knows.

I guess we'll find out eventually.


Anyway, here are the sockpuppets, as I see them

Michael Conzo, is a Brian McCarty sockpuppet

Could be, but I'm not entirely sure.

Warm Blue Glow, is a Sound.....sockpuppet, but not well hidden,
I think its pretty obvious and WBG means it to be obvious,
so maybe it is more of an alias than a sockpuppet.

Yet, Sound... has the potential of turnng out to be a sockpuppet.
for now, he is anonymous.

Now, for aliases.
Clyde Slick is an alias of Art Sackman
NYOB is an alias of Mik McKelvy.


And Middius is a swine, no matter what else he may be.

"George M. Middius" cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast [dot] net wrote
in message ...



Mr. McMickey, I'm calling you to account for your libelous accuasations
against legitimate professionals in the audio business.

We've had some Real Audio Guys on RAO from time to time who
do have genuine, hands-on knowledge and experience with them.
Two of them are Glenn Zelniker and John Atkinson. Others may be
Paul Bamborough and Paul Frindle, although I can't remember with
certainty. We Normals have great respect for all of those guys, but
you and the Krooborg hate and fear them.

Of course you do, they are all dishonest and many of them completely
looney
and/or vulgar.


Please tell us exactly how each of them is "dishonest".

Glenn Zelniker:

John Atkinson:

Paul Bamborough:

Paul Frindle:

Remember, you said "they are all dishonest". Provide your evidence or
admit you committed libel.

After that, you can give specific reasons for saying at least 3 of them
are "completely looney".

We're waiting, McStupid.


Go ahead hold your breath.

There actions speak for themselves, just like yours.

"Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason!" wrote in message
oups.com...
From:
Date: Tues, Mar 14 2006 2:29 pm
Email: "

What do you call Ssss****I'mlisteningtomyself****onRAO, or
soundhasatweakforyou?

I call myself an 'anonymous poster.'

Given the rage you clearly display, would you really expect me to give
you my name and address?

There's that overstatement again. I'm not in any kind of rage, it's more
disgust.

And exactly how have I '**** on r.a.o.'?

You distort, you cheat,and you lie.

By questioning attacks on
people's preferences?

From whom? I don't do that, so that's one of those lies I was just
mentioning.

By pointing out your bigoted and destructive
politics?

I'm neither bigoted or destructive. I'm the least bigoted person I know.
What's destructive about thinking people ought not to be the victims of
force by the government?
What's destructive about wanting everyone to be free?

One man's anonymous poster is another man's 'sockpuppet' I suppose.

Yawn.

"George M. Middius" cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast [dot] net wrote
in message ...



Mickey displays his slavish devotion to Kroopologism.

Out of lice already, Mickey?

No answer from the Bug Eater, so I'll assume the answer is Yes.

How about you tell us something about your audio knowledge?

I enjoy my systems. That's all I need to know.

And don't try and teach you anything else.

OK, I won't.

And don't try and teach anybody else either.

OK, I won't do that either.

I think that pretty much covers your input, so now you can go, you're
done.

Why haven't you answered my question about your libels of the Real Audio
Guys? I've asked you twice now. Are you afraid to admit you have no
evidence to back up your lies?


I answered as well as I feel like it, I'm not surprised that you don't
recognize a lie when you se one.
But then you are a liar as well as a swine.

"Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason!" wrote in message
ups.com...
From: Clyde Slick
Date: Tues, Mar 14 2006 7:25 pm
Email: "Clyde Slick"

okay, I'll classify WBG as an alias of an anonymous poster.

We'll still have to address the fact that you think that I sound like
Soundhaspriority...

I disagree.:-)




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"Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason!" wrote in message
ups.com...
From: Clyde Slick
Date: Tues, Mar 14 2006 7:25 pm
Email: "Clyde Slick"

okay, I'll classify WBG as an alias of an anonymous poster.

We'll still have to address the fact that you think that I sound like
Soundhaspriority...

I disagree.:-)


no, I just mixed up your names, not your voices.



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"Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason!" wrote in message
oups.com...
From:
Date: Tues, Mar 14 2006 1:07 pm
Email:

Some of those discussions were highly technical and
difficult to always follow... but it was interesting and
sometimes revealing.

Those days are long gone.

And Middius is one of the main reasons.

There's one *powerful* person.

He controls everybody. He seems to pervade your thoughts every waking
moment. He's also driven off what sounds to me like the most
intelligent group of people here.

Um, so why are you still here, nob?;-)


and Arny!!



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From:
Date: Tues, Mar 14 2006 11:30 pm
Email:

Some of those discussions were highly technical and
difficult to always follow... but it was interesting and
sometimes revealing.

Those days are long gone.

And Middius is one of the main reasons.

There's one *powerful* person.

He controls everybody.

More like he annoys everybody. and for no apparent reason.

Aw, it looks to me as though he simply enjoys tweaking your noses. He's
pretty good at it. The funny thing to me is that you let him.

He seems to pervade your thoughts every waking moment.

You are a wizard at overstatement. Once I leave his board, Inever think of
him.

So he only pervades your thoughts obssessively when you're posting.

He's also driven off what sounds to me like
the most intelligent group of people here.

That much is true.

Um, so why are you still here, nob?;-)

(Sometimes I crack myself up...)

Why are you?

What? An 'IKYABWAI'? Nah, I don't think nob got the slam.

I'm having fun. Aren't you?

I left for a long while, but I decided that there was still stuff to be
learned even with the noise from the peanut gallery.

This is an incredibly inefficient way of learning anything. Why not
consider:

a) Identifying your shortcomings (i.e. 'what you need to learn') and
then,

b) research it?

That's what all the best colleges teach these days.

wrote:

wrote in message
oups.com...

Fella ranted:


wrote:

Shhhh! I'm Listening to Reason! wrote:



I'm just curious. I just did a search of r.a.o. going back at least
eight years. Thousands and thousands of 'objectivist' posts by Mr.
Krueger, nob, and others.

Have these thousands of posts, representing hundreds and thousands of
man hours, been to any effect?

Has anyone ever actually changed their mind on how they think about
audio based on what they've read here?

Just curious...


I did. I used to read Arny back way back in the day, when I was just a
wee little lurker. I was a hard-boiled extremist objectivist. Even more
than Arny is. ABX was my religion, and I practiced it every day. You
couldn't convince me that ANYTHING sounded ANY different from ANYTHING
else in audio. Even loudspeakers all sounded the same, where I was
concerned. But after taking in a gutfull of Arny Krueger, he sickened
me so much, that I renounced the religion of objectivism, and smashed
my ABX comparator box with a mallet.

I even tore down my picture of sexy Dave Carlstrom, and today, as most
people know me, I'm an alternative audio guru. I always maintain an
even number of cd's in my collection, I cross out the bar codes in my
cd cases with a "specially treated" $150 red marker, and I park my car
in the same place and the same direction every day. All to ensure good
sound from my home audio. And I'm happy to report, the sound I'm
getting off my hifi kit has NEVER been better in all my days. So thank
you, Arny Krueger!


Troll BE GONE!

This post is almost proof that this is some borg posing as an extreme
audio subjectivist crackpot. The message to be derived from the text
above: If you abandon the objectivist abxism religion you become a
pitiful silly subjectivist crackpot troll with a $200 green marker stuck
up your butt.

Nice kook rant. So... are you going to ever back up any of your
********, or simply remain the ignorant twit that you so clearly are?


I vote for the second one.



Yet another piece of proof that shp is a piece of twisted borg;
duh!mikey aligns himself with him against me.