Robert Morein wrote:
"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com...

Schizoid Man wrote:
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not
required. The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD.
Can anyone recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

I've got a C-70 which is very functional IMO. I think this will serve
you well. I switched to a passive attenuator for my line level sources
and am hard pressed to tell a difference.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ran&1138482535

Don't let the Yamaha haters give you any crap. The C- series is well
designed and very reliable.

I use a couple. It's a great preamp if you know how to solder, but there are
two considerations:
1. The circuit boards are single sided epoxy paper. The solder connections
holding the relays on the board develop cracks from the vibration of the
relay action.

I've never seen a solder joint fail due to relay vibration. I suspect
thermal cycling is a far more likely cause. My unit has no
detectable heat output so I wonder if you may have a problem in your
power supply... a leaky cap perhaps.

I did have one of the main output connectors cracked a solder joint but
I attribute that to the use of monster interconnects which were grossly
too tight. I touched the joints with my iron and haven't had problem
since.

I will never understand why some people think soldering requires
skill... its just too easy.

The units can always be repaired by resolding them, but this
is a definite design weakness. On the plus side, these preamps actually have
a balanced output, supplying both normal and inverted phase. The output
impedance is the lowest I've ever seen, around 15 ohms.
2. The analog power supply is cooled via vents on the top of the cabinet.
This area of the preamp runs extremely hot. These vents must not be obscured
by stacking, or very expensive repairs will be required. Even so, the board
tends to brown in this area.

Great line drivers, great sound. Just those little problems.

As I said... for $150 with a decent phono stage I think he'd be hard
pressed to find a better deal.

ScottW

"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com
Robert Morein wrote:
"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com...

Schizoid Man wrote:
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono
section not required. The sources will be Aux1 (TV),
Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD. Can anyone recommend some
makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out
with the usual suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

I've got a C-70 which is very functional IMO. I think
this will serve you well. I switched to a passive
attenuator for my line level sources and am hard
pressed to tell a difference.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ran&1138482535

Don't let the Yamaha haters give you any crap. The C-
series is well designed and very reliable.

I use a couple. It's a great preamp if you know how to
solder, but there are two considerations:
1. The circuit boards are single sided epoxy paper. The
solder connections holding the relays on the board
develop cracks from the vibration of the relay action.

I've never seen a solder joint fail due to relay
vibration. I suspect thermal cycling is a far more
likely cause. My unit has no detectable heat output so
I wonder if you may have a problem in your power
supply... a leaky cap perhaps.

I did have one of the main output connectors cracked a
solder joint but I attribute that to the use of monster
interconnects which were grossly too tight. I touched
the joints with my iron and haven't had problem since.

I will never understand why some people think soldering
requires skill... its just too easy.

The units can always be repaired by resolding them, but
this
is a definite design weakness. On the plus side, these
preamps actually have a balanced output, supplying both
normal and inverted phase. The output impedance is the
lowest I've ever seen, around 15 ohms.
2. The analog power supply is cooled via vents on the
top of the cabinet. This area of the preamp runs
extremely hot. These vents must not be obscured by
stacking, or very expensive repairs will be required.
Even so, the board tends to brown in this area.

Great line drivers, great sound. Just those little
problems.

As I said... for $150 with a decent phono stage I think
he'd be hard pressed to find a better deal.

One word: eBay.

Arny Krueger wrote:

One word: eBay.

If you don't mind bidding

Item 5835668034 and its here in SD too.

ScottW

"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com...

Robert Morein wrote:
"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com...

Schizoid Man wrote:
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not
required. The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD.
Can anyone recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

I've got a C-70 which is very functional IMO. I think this will serve
you well. I switched to a passive attenuator for my line level sources
and am hard pressed to tell a difference.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ran&1138482535

Don't let the Yamaha haters give you any crap. The C- series is well
designed and very reliable.

I use a couple. It's a great preamp if you know how to solder, but there
are
two considerations:
1. The circuit boards are single sided epoxy paper. The solder
connections
holding the relays on the board develop cracks from the vibration of the
relay action.

I've never seen a solder joint fail due to relay vibration. I suspect
thermal cycling is a far more likely cause. My unit has no
detectable heat output so I wonder if you may have a problem in your
power supply... a leaky cap perhaps.

Scott, I have two C-70's in service right now. The ps sections of both run
hot as hell, and perfectly in every other regard. A leaky cap would have
blown already, or had some other symptom. I also have a C-80, which runs
much cooler. This unit has no relays, just cable control of remote switches.


I did have one of the main output connectors cracked a solder joint but
I attribute that to the use of monster interconnects which were grossly
too tight. I touched the joints with my iron and haven't had problem
since.

I will never understand why some people think soldering requires
skill... its just too easy.

We don't know if Schizoid Man is into that. There's no point in giving him a
problem down the line he can't handle.

The units can always be repaired by resolding them, but this
is a definite design weakness. On the plus side, these preamps actually
have
a balanced output, supplying both normal and inverted phase. The output
impedance is the lowest I've ever seen, around 15 ohms.
2. The analog power supply is cooled via vents on the top of the cabinet.
This area of the preamp runs extremely hot. These vents must not be
obscured
by stacking, or very expensive repairs will be required. Even so, the
board
tends to brown in this area.

Great line drivers, great sound. Just those little problems.

As I said... for $150 with a decent phono stage I think he'd be hard
pressed to find a better deal.

They're not for everybody, Scott.

"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com...

Robert Morein wrote:
"ScottW" wrote in message
ups.com...

Schizoid Man wrote:
Hi all,

I'm looking for a sub-$500 pre-owned pre-amp. Phono section not
required. The sources will be Aux1 (TV), Aux2 (DVD) and primarily CD.
Can anyone recommend some makes/models?

Given my budget, or lack thereof, I'm starting out with the usual
suspects - Adcom, Rotel, NAD.

I've got a C-70 which is very functional IMO. I think this will serve
you well. I switched to a passive attenuator for my line level sources
and am hard pressed to tell a difference.

http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....ran&1138482535

Don't let the Yamaha haters give you any crap. The C- series is well
designed and very reliable.

I use a couple. It's a great preamp if you know how to solder, but there
are
two considerations:
1. The circuit boards are single sided epoxy paper. The solder
connections
holding the relays on the board develop cracks from the vibration of the
relay action.

I've never seen a solder joint fail due to relay vibration. I suspect
thermal cycling is a far more likely cause. My unit has no
detectable heat output so I wonder if you may have a problem in your
power supply... a leaky cap perhaps.

I did have one of the main output connectors cracked a solder joint but
I attribute that to the use of monster interconnects which were grossly
too tight. I touched the joints with my iron and haven't had problem
since.

I will never understand why some people think soldering requires
skill... its just too easy.

Once learned, yes. A lot of people just don't want to wait long enough for
the solder to melt. I've seen lots of separation from the board from people
using the iron improperly.
Some son't want to take the time to tin the iron or keep it clean. I have a
freind who works in a machine shop where they do van conversions for he
handicapped and does a lot of soldering and does it beautifully. He
installs the electronics that control the doors and the lift, etc. and
therefore is soldering every day, yet his work, good as it is, is not nearly
as good as his wife's. Go figure.


The units can always be repaired by resolding them, but this
is a definite design weakness. On the plus side, these preamps actually
have
a balanced output, supplying both normal and inverted phase. The output
impedance is the lowest I've ever seen, around 15 ohms.
2. The analog power supply is cooled via vents on the top of the cabinet.
This area of the preamp runs extremely hot. These vents must not be
obscured
by stacking, or very expensive repairs will be required. Even so, the
board
tends to brown in this area.

Great line drivers, great sound. Just those little problems.

As I said... for $150 with a decent phono stage I think he'd be hard
pressed to find a better deal.

And the parts should they need replacing are always standard AFAICR.