need SACD or DVD-A player advice

[Randy and Michelle]

I am looking to spend up to $700 for a SACD or a DVD-A player. Any
recommendations or advice as to which kind to get would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Randy

[Arny Krueger]

Randy and Michelle wrote:
> I am looking to spend up to $700 for a SACD or a DVD-A player. Any
> recommendations or advice as to which kind to get would be
> appreciated.


Why not cover all the bases? Check out the Pioneer universal
DVD-A/SACD/DVD/CD player Model: DV-563AS.

[Joseph Oberlander]

Arny Krueger wrote:

> Randy and Michelle wrote:
>
>>I am looking to spend up to $700 for a SACD or a DVD-A player. Any
>>recommendations or advice as to which kind to get would be
>>appreciated.
>
>
>
> Why not cover all the bases? Check out the Pioneer universal
> DVD-A/SACD/DVD/CD player Model: DV-563AS.

Exactly. Well, I'd pay a bit more for the 6.1 vs 5.1 out
on the Elite series, but the idea's the same. Pioneer
makes nice players.

[Joseph Oberlander]

JBorg wrote:

>>Arny Krueger wrote:
>>
>>>Randy and Michelle wrote:

> Let's look at that thinly primp-up, slim and flimsy piece of gem
> daintily wrap in silver-colored mantle of your lustful desires.
>
>
> http://tinyurl.com/2tjwc
>
>
> And yes, for $149.00 US dollars, this phenomenal humdinger is simply
> not gonna get any better.

Since it is a purely digital format, it's all about the chips
and components inside the box.

You should check out the prices for the various components at
wholesale value. Marantz and Denon and the rest all put the
same chips and capacitors and so on in their boxes. Maybe $100
in actual parts - the rest is markup.

Also, considering HD-DVD is around the corner, why blow the
whole wad on an ever-changing format?

[Arny Krueger]

JBorg wrote:


> Have you actually heard it?

Yes.

Do tell us about your auditions of Pioneer universal DVD-A/SACD/DVD/CD
player Model: DV-563AS.

[Arny Krueger]

JBorg wrote:
>> Arny Krueger wrote:
>>> JBorg wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Have you actually heard it?

>> Yes.

> Oh yeah?

Yeah, it sounds just like any number of other fine optical players. I mean
Borg you can wander through the earth looking for audio nirvana with optical
disc players, but anybody with brain knows that the real action is someplace
else.

I think It's totally obscene that poor schmucks are being defrauded out of
the better of part of a $grand for an optical disc player that sounds no
different from something they can get a Best Buy for change from $150.

>> Do tell us about your auditions of Pioneer universal
>> DVD-A/SACD/DVD/CD player Model: DV-563AS.

> Sure.

> Nearing the end of the time I spent carefully auditioning the $149
> Pioneer universal combo player model DV-563AS, I concluded that:

> It is a piece of ****.

I'll take that as a biographical comment, Borg.

[dave weil]

On Fri, 26 Mar 2004 19:17:39 -0500, "Arny Krueger" >
wrote:

>JBorg wrote:
>
>
>> Have you actually heard it?
>
>Yes.
>
>Do tell us about your auditions of Pioneer universal DVD-A/SACD/DVD/CD
>player Model: DV-563AS.

Do tell us about *your* double-blind tests of the above unit. Please
tell us the models that you compared this usit to and what the
statistical results of your trials were and please be as specific as
possible in terms of *how* you did your tests.

Are you saying that this argument that you offered a little over a
year and half ago can reasonably be discarded:

"Remember that these *cheap* SACD players don't perform nearly as well
as the expensive ones".

http://tinyurl.com/yw42n

That would certainly be good news to those of us on budgets.

[Joseph Oberlander]

JBorg wrote:

>>Since it is a purely digital format, it's all about the chips
>>and components inside the box.
>
>
> Are designs inside the box do not effect the end result then?

Not really. It's like a Walkman or TV set - very little is
left to understand about a CD or DVD player these ways. Everyone
uses the same designs and techniques and most of these sub components
are from overseas.

It's not even like amplifiers or speakers, where quality can
be found for a little more money - it's all cheap nowadays
in DVD and CD players.

> . Identical Discrete Multi-Channel Audio Circuit

Kind of meaningless outside of an amplifier. It's just
a fancy preamp, anyways, which if you have 6.1 out, you
can always use the decoder in the amplifier instead.

> . CS4397 DAC by Cirrus Logic Inc.

DAC is a DAC these days and most use this or something simmilar.

> . Ample Grade EI-type Power Transformer
> . "Zero-Impedance" Copper Ground Plate for Analog Output Terminals

OOO! Fancy *analog* connectors. Um... since everyone smart
uses a digital link to their receiver...

> . Double-Layered Chassis Construction

I'll give you this. Inexpensive means a cheap case, but
honestly - how many times do you even move the DVD player?

[Joseph Oberlander]

JBorg wrote:

> Are you now saying that Randy and Michelle are poor schmucks for really, really,
> really allowing themselves be defrauded for a better part of a $grand for
> wishing to spend $700 ? Or, do you think that they are simply, simply, simply
> fine folks with no brains?
>
> Which is it?

Option #3:
They have been duped by the media and salespeople into believing that
$50-100 in parts is worth $700 because of a fancy faceplate.

[Bruce J. Richman]

George M. Middius wrote:


>JBorg said to Turdborg:
>
>> DIDN'T YOU SAY HERE ON MANY OCCASION THAT YOU ARE A DEVOUT CHRISTIAN,
>MOTHER****ER.
>
>Curiously, there are more than 200 words for excrement in the English
>language.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

I think maybe Mr. Borg misquoted Krueger by inserting a comma between the last
2 words.



Bruce J. Richman

[Arny Krueger]

JBorg wrote:
>> Arny Krueger wrote:
>>> JBorg wrote:
>>>> Arny Krueger wrote:
>>>>> JBorg wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Have you actually heard it?
>>
>>>> Yes.
>>
>>> Oh yeah?
>>
>>
>> Yeah, it sounds just like any number of other fine optical players.
>> I mean Borg you can wander through the earth looking for audio
>> nirvana with optical disc players, but anybody with brain knows that
>> the real action is someplace else.

> Are you saying that Randy and Michelle has no brains for looking to
> spend up to $700 for a SACD or a DVD-A player yet, didn't know that
> the real action is someplace else ?

I was speaking of you, Borg.

>> I think It's totally obscene that poor schmucks are being defrauded
>> out of the better of part of a $grand for an optical disc player
>> that sounds no different from something they can get a Best Buy for
>> change from $150.
>
> Are you now saying that Randy and Michelle are poor schmucks for
> really, really, really allowing themselves be defrauded for a better
> part of a $grand for wishing to spend $700 ? Or, do you think that
> they are simply, simply, simply fine folks with no brains?

I was speaking of you, Borg.


> DIDN'T YOU SAY HERE ON MANY OCCASION THAT YOU ARE A DEVOUT CHRISTIAN,
> MOTHER****ER.

Thus comment seems totally relevant to a discussion of SACD players, doesn't
it, Borg?

Why don't you admit it Borg? You're having another meltdown!

> ----

> I think that Dave Weil's commentary below has effectively decimated
> your early droppings thus far on this thread. Therefore, I see no
> need to further expound on your craziness.

<note that nothing follows this comment - there is nothing *below*>

[Arny Krueger]

George M. Middius wrote:
> Joseph Borglander said:
>
>> They have been duped by the media and salespeople into believing that
>> $50-100 in parts is worth $700 because of a fancy faceplate.
>
> Or, much more likely, they buy what they want for their own reasons.

Seems very unlikely given that they were so unsure of their own reasons,
that the decided to consult with RAO.

[dave weil]

On Sat, 27 Mar 2004 05:45:01 -0500, "Arny Krueger" >
wrote:

>JBorg wrote:
>>> Arny Krueger wrote:
>>>> JBorg wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Have you actually heard it?
>
>>> Yes.
>
>> Oh yeah?
>
>Yeah, it sounds just like any number of other fine optical players.

Could you post your dbt level-matched time-synchronized data, Arnold?

[Arny Krueger]

JBorg wrote:

> Well how did you arrived at a conclusion that Marantz SA8260 and
> Pioneer DV-563AS sounds the same then?

Actually, the Pioneer sounds better. Makes the sound of a high end stereo
shop shyster laughing all the way to the bank, sorta go away.

[dave weil]

On Mon, 29 Mar 2004 06:24:56 -0500, "Arny Krueger" >
wrote:

>JBorg wrote:
>
>> Well how did you arrived at a conclusion that Marantz SA8260 and
>> Pioneer DV-563AS sounds the same then?
>
>Actually, the Pioneer sounds better. Makes the sound of a high end stereo
>shop shyster laughing all the way to the bank, sorta go away.

Still waiting for the dbt resuts.

I'm also curious what you think makes this usit sound better than the
Marantz (from a technical standpoint).

[dave weil]

On Mon, 29 Mar 2004 08:37:08 -0600, dave weil >
wrote:

>On Mon, 29 Mar 2004 06:24:56 -0500, "Arny Krueger" >
>wrote:
>
>>JBorg wrote:
>>
>>> Well how did you arrived at a conclusion that Marantz SA8260 and
>>> Pioneer DV-563AS sounds the same then?
>>
>>Actually, the Pioneer sounds better. Makes the sound of a high end stereo
>>shop shyster laughing all the way to the bank, sorta go away.
>
>Still waiting for the dbt resuts.
>
>I'm also curious what you think makes this usit sound better than the
>Marantz (from a technical standpoint).

That's "unit", of course, not usit.

[Arny Krueger]

dave weil wrote:
> On Mon, 29 Mar 2004 06:24:56 -0500, "Arny Krueger" >
> wrote:
>
>> JBorg wrote:
>>
>>> Well how did you arrived at a conclusion that Marantz SA8260 and
>>> Pioneer DV-563AS sounds the same then?
>>
>> Actually, the Pioneer sounds better. Makes the sound of a high end
>> stereo shop shyster laughing all the way to the bank, sorta go away.
>
> Still waiting for the dbt resuts.

There will never be any dbt resuts.

[dave weil]

On Mon, 29 Mar 2004 09:54:44 -0500, "Arny Krueger" >
wrote:

>dave weil wrote:
>> On Mon, 29 Mar 2004 06:24:56 -0500, "Arny Krueger" >
>> wrote:
>>
>>> JBorg wrote:
>>>
>>>> Well how did you arrived at a conclusion that Marantz SA8260 and
>>>> Pioneer DV-563AS sounds the same then?
>>>
>>> Actually, the Pioneer sounds better. Makes the sound of a high end
>>> stereo shop shyster laughing all the way to the bank, sorta go away.
>>
>> Still waiting for the dbt resuts.
>
>There will never be any dbt resuts.
>
Fair enough. How about results?

[Marc Phillips]

Arny said:

>Makes the sound of a high end stereo
>shop shyster laughing all the way to the bank, sorta go away.
>
>

You just can't get that whole comma thing, can you.

Boon