[Phildo]

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Mr.T" MrT@home wrote in message
u
"Eeyore" wrote
in message ...
All you need to do is examine Phildo's favourite

manufacturer, Behringer, to
find LOTS of mixers with no PFL.

Can you name one Behringer FOH mixer that does not have
PFL?

In order to do that in a reasaonble way, you need to show us a list of
officially-designated "FOH Mixers". The imprimateur of some well-known
professional organization will suffice.

It is a lot of fun to watch you squirm Arnold. Why not just admit you were
wrong and move on?

Of course if you include things like the 802, yes they
don't have PFL with a single mic channel. Amazing isn't
it? :-)

An 802 can definately be used as a FOH mixer, following the
generally-accepted meaning of FOH.

How you can say that when you don't even know where FOH is I don't know.

In case people need a little reminder I'll repost probably the funniest post
ever made to aapls at the end of this one.

Phildo


"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
"Phildo" wrote in message

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

You seem to have forgotten the most important considearation - what
do his mixes sound like to you?

Try reading his post again Arny. He covered that part already:

quote I mean, the quality of the mix is okay, but its not great.end
quote

Oh, it was such a weak statement that it shot right under my feet.

It sounds to me like he's obsessing over something that someone else might
be doing well enough. It also seems like he doesn't know how to do the
thing
that he's judging. If he thinks that he could do a better FOH mix himself
by
other means, then he should know it and say it.

People are saying strange dogmatic things about FOH mixes. For example:

"Not a good way to Mix - I always Tell people that the headphones are for
troubleshooting only. Mixing through headphones as you realise means that
you are not mixing what people are hearing."

Obviously, this writer is not considering the possibility that the FOH mix
is being listened to over IEMs. There's a pretty good chance in a 21st
century church that the music director IS onstage performing, directing
and
listening to the FOH mix over a headset. So, now its always bad to mix
with
phones when the mix is going to be listened to, particularly by the boss
man, with phones?

The next possibility that is not being considered is the possibility that
the FOH mix is being done by someone who isn't in the same sound field as
the performers. In fact, this is pretty likely unless the FOH mixer is one
of the performers.

Let's be real, the FOH sound is not usually all that consistent over the
whole stage. It's not like there's just one mix that is going to make
everybody happy. If there's just one FOH mix, it's a pretty thoroughly
compromised thing, anyhow. For example, how is it that I have two stage
mixes? Well the piano is at stage right about 5' from the performers on
the
right of the stage.The performers at stage right feel they are getting
blasted by piano if there is piano in their mix, so they get a mix w/o
piano. Then, the clav is at stage left about 5' from the performers over
there, and so on.

If there's a dedicated FOH mixer, then he's not likely to be at the BOH,
but
why are people saying such categorical things when in general, there's a
pretty good chance that the FOH mixer is a one guy doing it all, and in
the
BOH (more usual) or mid-hall (on a good day).

I'm a bit amused by such a simplistic situation that there is just one FOH
mix. I have to manage 4 FOH mixes - left stage, right stage, choir loft
and
pianist. The only one that is in any sense optional is the choir loft.
Now,
exactly how I do a reasonble job of monitoring 4 separate FOH mixes from
the
BOH without headphones?

Another thing to consider is the fact that the FOH mix should be a
relatively static thing. It's purpose is to give the performers feedback,
and if someone is changing gain all the time, the performer's don't have
consistent feedback.

Finally, why are people presuming that nobody can translate what they hear
over phones into a good FOH mix? I guess they think that since they can't
do
it, nobody can.



Or for good measure there is this one as well:


"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
"Ian Gregory" wrote in message

Arny Krueger wrote:
Another thing to consider is the fact that the FOH mix should be a
relatively static thing. It's purpose is to give the performers
feedback, and if someone is changing gain all the time, the
performer's don't have consistent feedback.

Err, no. The FOH mix is what the audience hear. The monitor mix(es)
are what the performers hear.

The FOH is the stage, the platform.