I am looking for speaker suggestions so I have some
idea what to go listen to. The choices are staggering.

My target price (subject to change based on input of course)
is to spend under $1500 for the pair.

The equipment I will drive them with is
Cambridge Audio A500 65W Integrated amp (and phono pre-amp) 65 watts
RMS (8 Ohms) / 85 watts RMS (6 Ohms)
Cambridge Audio D500se CD Player
Dual CS-500 Turntable with Surve V15-MR cartridge

The room is a 20'D X 40'W X 7'H with accoustic tile ceiling

I am not looking for something "too bright" as I can find
bright speakers a little overpowering after a while. However,
I am interested in good imaging and a detailed sound stage.

For low end extension I have room (in the room and in the budget)
for a subwoofer if needed, so I am considering small speakers on
stands as well as floor standers. Small speakers on stands tend
to be a little cheaper since the cabinets are cheaper. I already
have a set of nice sand filled stands to use.

My typical listening levels are not very loud. I don't need
to shake the house, but sometimes I do like to hear an orchestra
sound powerfull. My musical tastes are all over the map. I would
say I mostly listen to classic rock, experimental rock, and blues,
and female vocals in general but almost anything is fair game.

(Is it reasonable to run magnepans off this amp, or am I under powered?)

One speaker that cought my eye is the CDM1 NT from B&W

I have heard a lot of good things about Paradigm, but I can't seem
to find much info online.

For the subwoofer I am condering building the 10" Titanic Vance
subwoofer kit from Parts Express.

I was also consider the Odin MK III Kit (Madisound or Zalytron) for
speakers.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

AndyB

AndyB wrote:

My target price (subject to change based on input of course)
is to spend under $1500 for the pair.

The equipment I will drive them with is
Cambridge Audio A500 65W Integrated amp (and phono pre-amp) 65 watts
RMS (8 Ohms) / 85 watts RMS (6 Ohms)
Cambridge Audio D500se CD Player
Dual CS-500 Turntable with Surve V15-MR cartridge

Fine basic setup. I have a simmilar Dual turntable and cartridge,
though not as nice - lol. Acceptable for everyday listening
on a budget.

The room is a 20'D X 40'W X 7'H with accoustic tile ceiling

Not a fan of acoustic tiles myself. 20*40 is a big room, btw.

I am not looking for something "too bright" as I can find
bright speakers a little overpowering after a while. However,
I am interested in good imaging and a detailed sound stage.

Good - that helps some.

KEF and Tannoy are top choices for a more mellow top-end,
as are Magnepans and the Ellis Audio 1801b(plus a few others)

The Magnepans have a very bright top-end, but it is so dispersed
and clean that it doesn't hit you in the face like a typical
tweeter. The fact that the Magnepans have almost no fatigue
fom listening helps some, too.

I always EQ out most everything above 16khz anyways on
brighter speakers. The Tannoys and KEFs were the first speakers
in a long time that I didn't have to do this to.

For low end extension I have room (in the room and in the budget)
for a subwoofer if needed, so I am considering small speakers on
stands as well as floor standers. Small speakers on stands tend
to be a little cheaper since the cabinets are cheaper. I already
have a set of nice sand filled stands to use.

Good. Most speakers, like a pair of Tannoy Saturn 6/8 towers
will do fine without a subwoofer. You may have to get the bass
up a bit, though, if your room is a bit "dead" - or use an equalizer
to boost the bass some. My home - very live sound. My father's
carpeted filled with plush furniture living room - needs about
2-4db bass boost.

My typical listening levels are not very loud. I don't need
to shake the house, but sometimes I do like to hear an orchestra
sound powerfull. My musical tastes are all over the map. I would
say I mostly listen to classic rock, experimental rock, and blues,
and female vocals in general but almost anything is fair game.

(Is it reasonable to run magnepans off this amp, or am I under powered?)

It needs to be able to drive 4 ohms. That's pretty much all it
needs - most any power level will do as long as it is reasonable.
(20wpc tube amps are kind of iffy)

One speaker that cought my eye is the CDM1 NT from B&W

I listened to this. It is not as good as the big Mirage FRX and
Tannoy R series towers, let alone the Saturns. The Mirage FRx-nine
is a sweet speaker, btw - subwoofer built into each speaker and
very clean top-end for the price.

The Tannoy lacks the bass impact, but is smooooooth. MOst realistic
sounding voices that I've heard out of a commercial speaker at
this price.

Another choice, which would be perfect is a used mint condition
pair of KEF 104/2 speakers. These were THE reference speaker
for almost a decade and still are amazing speakers for the
price. A pair plus re-foaming should cost about $1300 or so.

I have heard a lot of good things about Paradigm, but I can't seem
to find much info online.

Paradigm and MIrage are pretty simmilar sounding - both solid
performers for the price.

For the subwoofer I am condering building the 10" Titanic Vance
subwoofer kit from Parts Express.

I good tower will make a subwoofer for music moot.

One last q:

- What is your maximum price if you were to factor in the
price of the subwoofer into a single pair of full-range
speakers?

Option #1 (my choice):

Maggie 1.6's used on Audiogon $1100-$1200. Assuming your integrated amp has
outputs which allow you use bigger amps, 2-Outlaw mono amp's (forgot the
model number, but they just starting selling them recently and they put out
a solid 300wpc rms into a 4 Ohm load, which the Maggie's are) $300 ea., or a
good used two channel amp in the price range from Audiogon. This set-up
will come in a bit over your price range, but you will have incredible
sound, and I know of nothing in this price range that will match this
set-up. No, your amp is not big enough for the Maggie's, they will need at
least 200wpc into 4 Ohms. Also, the Maggie 1.6's will surprise you with
their bass abilities, but you may find you still want a sub for hard rock or
HT (their -3dB point is 40Hz, but they fall off pretty sharply after that).
The bass that is there is to dye for, especially with acoustic instruments.
I truly believe the Maggie's will be a speaker you will have for a long
time. I've been into audio seriously for about 25 years or so and couldn't
start to list all the speakers I've owned, but bought my first set of
Maggie's (the 1.6's) a few months ago and still cannot believe how good they
are. However, you must understand these speakers need allot of room to
work, I'm talking a minimum of 2' from any surrounding surface, and more for
optimum results. If you don't have the room forget about Maggie's and go to
plan B.

Option #2: You mentioned the B&W CDM-1NT's, and I too like these very much.
However, when it comes to the B&W's I would hold out for a pair of the
Nautilus'. Their bookshelf 805's or the floor standing 804's (my
preference). Once again you can buy used and get a deal in your price range
(at least for the 805's, the 804's are going to run a bit over your budget)
You can use these for awhile with your current set-up as the B&W's are an
easy load for just about any amp, but they will sound better with more
power. But, you said you don't listen that loud. I like these because
their very detailed, have an extended high end without having that nasty
edge to them, and just have such a smooth and seamless sound. And, they
sound good with everything you throw at them. Allot of people think these
are over rated and too expensive, but my ears do not agree. Both of these
speakers have a nice tight bass, with the 804's having the more extended
bass and what I perceive to be a little more detailed mid-range. Great
speakers, and they are beautiful furniture pieces too. BTW, I chose the B&W
Nautilus HTM-2 as my center speaker over the Maggie MGCC-3. Some people
would think this crazy, but I actually thought it was a better match. This
says something about the speed of the Nautilus line.

Option #3: Go to http://www.audioshop.on.ca and take a look at the new
Dahlquist line. I bought a pair of QX-9's for my son for Christmas for less
than $600 shipped (one of the bennies of having a strong dollar when buying
from Canada), and am amazed at how incredibly good they are for the money.
You could get a pair of QX-10's (no need for a sub with these guys, all the
bass you would want) and update your electronics within your budget. I
dealt with a fellow named Marc and he is just a very decent and helpful
person to deal with. These speakers are a little more forgiving than the
other two, but this is not to say they are not as good, just that their a
very warm and forgiving speaker. I can't start to describe what a bargain
these are and at the prices they go for your can't go wrong. To be honest,
these are probably the most logical match for the current equipment you
have. If you find you don't want to update your electronics and are happy
with what you have, then you have saved a bundle. I know it's tough to buy
a speaker without hearing it, but if you go to the Home Theater forum and do
a search you will find numerous articles about these speakers. One of the
best kept secrets in the speaker industry today IMO.

Notes: I, like you, listen to a variety of music. I grew up on hard rock,
but have mellowed with age. I still listen to rock quite often, but most of
the time I find myself listening to Allison Krauss, Miles Davis, Norah
Jones, etc. You know, the mellow stuff.

Other good speakers in your price range:

NHT (I've even seen the highly touted 3.3's on Audiogon that are in your
price range), PSB Stratus series, Paradigm Studio series, etc., etc.

Final word: Maggie's, Maggie's, Maggie's, and in case you didn't hear that,
Maggie's. :-)

"AndyB" wrote in message
et...
I am looking for speaker suggestions so I have some
idea what to go listen to. The choices are staggering.

My target price (subject to change based on input of course)
is to spend under $1500 for the pair.

The equipment I will drive them with is
Cambridge Audio A500 65W Integrated amp (and phono pre-amp) 65 watts
RMS (8 Ohms) / 85 watts RMS (6 Ohms)
Cambridge Audio D500se CD Player
Dual CS-500 Turntable with Surve V15-MR cartridge

The room is a 20'D X 40'W X 7'H with accoustic tile ceiling

I am not looking for something "too bright" as I can find
bright speakers a little overpowering after a while. However,
I am interested in good imaging and a detailed sound stage.

For low end extension I have room (in the room and in the budget)
for a subwoofer if needed, so I am considering small speakers on
stands as well as floor standers. Small speakers on stands tend
to be a little cheaper since the cabinets are cheaper. I already
have a set of nice sand filled stands to use.

My typical listening levels are not very loud. I don't need
to shake the house, but sometimes I do like to hear an orchestra
sound powerfull. My musical tastes are all over the map. I would
say I mostly listen to classic rock, experimental rock, and blues,
and female vocals in general but almost anything is fair game.

(Is it reasonable to run magnepans off this amp, or am I under powered?)

One speaker that cought my eye is the CDM1 NT from B&W

I have heard a lot of good things about Paradigm, but I can't seem
to find much info online.

For the subwoofer I am condering building the 10" Titanic Vance
subwoofer kit from Parts Express.

I was also consider the Odin MK III Kit (Madisound or Zalytron) for
speakers.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

AndyB

"Jack Dotson" wrote in message
news:zKXPa.45687$H17.13841@sccrnsc02...
Final word: Maggie's, Maggie's, Maggie's, and in case you didn't hear
that,
Maggie's. :-)

Hehe, one can get rather enthusiastic about them. On one day I auditioned
the Nautilus 804 (with $6000 Musical Fidelity amp and cd player) and the 1.6
Maggies (on T+A amp and CD player, both amp and cd player $3000). Rough
estimations, cos the prices were in Euros and prices in other countries may
vary. I liked the 804 ever since I saw them. I think they are beautiful, but
when I heard the Maggies it was a revelation. They sound much better to me
and the price of the Maggies with T+A amp and cd player is a lot lower. What
I liked, is that the Maggies are less exhausting and have a lot of detail
too.

Wenslauw

When properly set-up and with the right amplification I don't think there is
a better deal in the speaker world than the Maggie's.

"Wenslauw" wrote in message
et...
"Jack Dotson" wrote in message
news:zKXPa.45687$H17.13841@sccrnsc02...
Final word: Maggie's, Maggie's, Maggie's, and in case you didn't hear
that,
Maggie's. :-)

Hehe, one can get rather enthusiastic about them. On one day I auditioned
the Nautilus 804 (with $6000 Musical Fidelity amp and cd player) and the
1.6
Maggies (on T+A amp and CD player, both amp and cd player $3000). Rough
estimations, cos the prices were in Euros and prices in other countries
may
vary. I liked the 804 ever since I saw them. I think they are beautiful,
but
when I heard the Maggies it was a revelation. They sound much better to me
and the price of the Maggies with T+A amp and cd player is a lot lower.
What
I liked, is that the Maggies are less exhausting and have a lot of detail
too.

Wenslauw

Jack Dotson wrote:
When properly set-up and with the right amplification I don't think there is
a better deal in the speaker world than the Maggie's.

I concur. The MMGs for instance, at $550 a pair, are shockingly good
for that amount of money.

People rag on them and say they aren't full range and so on - but
name me ONE $550 speaker that does what it does. For what it is,
it is a superb deal. Incredible, in fact - and a sign of just how
overpriced and shoddy conventional speakers in that price range
really are.

hmm, I would say that the Vandersteen model 1 or model 2 would be worth a
listen. I have also heard some Acoustic Research models that do very well with
smaller amps and larger rooms. The Vandersteens will want more power, not very
eff.

good luck
Jon
http://www.jonlayephotography.com

On 14 Jul 2003 04:47:47 GMT, Joseph Oberlander
wrote:

Jack Dotson wrote:
When properly set-up and with the right amplification I don't think there is
a better deal in the speaker world than the Maggie's.

I concur. The MMGs for instance, at $550 a pair, are shockingly good
for that amount of money.

People rag on them and say they aren't full range and so on - but
name me ONE $550 speaker that does what it does. For what it is,
it is a superb deal. Incredible, in fact - and a sign of just how
overpriced and shoddy conventional speakers in that price range
really are.

I bought my first set of Maggies (MMG) about 8 months ago. I was a
confirmed Vandersteen fan, having graduated from the 1b's to the 2Ce.
I built myself a set of stands for about $25 at Home Deopt, see the
URL below for the instructions I used:

http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue4/magnapan1.htm

This puts the MMG's up in the air about 8 inches and vertical. On the
stock stands the soundstage sounded somewhat like it was coming up out
of the floor. The MMG's paired with a HSU VTF-2 sub is pure heaven.
For the first time in over 30 years I am listening to the music
instead of the speakers. These things are so incredibly open and
balanced it is unbelievable. It took me about a week to integrate the
sub (crossover and volume) and about 95% of the time you don't even
know it is there. I sold my Vandy 2Ce's after only two days with the
MMG's!

For $1050 for the MMG's and the HSU VTF-2, that leaves you $450 to
buy a bigger amp (audiogon, ebay, etc) and use your Cambridge as a
preamp. The MMG's have a 60 day home trial and the VTF-2 has a 30 day
trial. The only way to accurately evaluate a speaker system in your
listening room.

I truly love this setup, I would encourage you to investigate this
angle. I have included a couple of links below.

http://www.goodsound.com/equipment/magnepan_mmg.htm

http://www.goodsound.com/equipment/hsu_vtf2.htm

http://www.magnepan.com
Check out "The offer we hope you can't resist" link

http://www.audioreview.com/PRD_119590_2741crx.aspx
VTF-2 user reviews

http://www.audioreview.com/Main+Spea...4_1594crx.aspx

Kurt wrote:
On 14 Jul 2003 04:47:47 GMT, Joseph Oberlander
wrote:


Jack Dotson wrote:

When properly set-up and with the right amplification I don't think there is
a better deal in the speaker world than the Maggie's.

I concur. The MMGs for instance, at $550 a pair, are shockingly good
for that amount of money.

People rag on them and say they aren't full range and so on - but
name me ONE $550 speaker that does what it does. For what it is,
it is a superb deal. Incredible, in fact - and a sign of just how
overpriced and shoddy conventional speakers in that price range
really are.


I bought my first set of Maggies (MMG) about 8 months ago. I was a
confirmed Vandersteen fan, having graduated from the 1b's to the 2Ce.
I built myself a set of stands for about $25 at Home Deopt, see the
URL below for the instructions I used:

One thing, though. Outlaw Audio makes their ICBM module. This
is an external crossover made specifically to mate Magnepans and
Subwoofers(or other silmmilar speakers like electrostatics). It
really makes it sound a lot better.

http://www.outlawaudio.com//products/icbm.html

What it does is pre-filter the audio signal so that the speakers
are only sent music to a certain point. Ie - you can set the
cutoff on the MMGs at 60hz and no matter how loud you drive the
setup, you aren't trying to send 30-40hz information to the speakers
anymore.

Joseph Oberlander wrote in message ...
Jack Dotson wrote:
When properly set-up and with the right amplification I don't think there is
a better deal in the speaker world than the Maggie's.

I concur. The MMGs for instance, at $550 a pair, are shockingly good
for that amount of money.

People rag on them and say they aren't full range and so on - but
name me ONE $550 speaker that does what it does. For what it is,
it is a superb deal. Incredible, in fact - and a sign of just how
overpriced and shoddy conventional speakers in that price range
really are.

I was reading enjoythemusic.com and found this article about a system
featuring the MMGs.

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazin.../donibbles.htm

See the Issue 143 of THE ABSOLUTE SOUND (Aug-Sept 2003) for "34
Recommended Speakers. The Best under $2500."

Twenty of them are $1500 and under (Paradigm, PSB, Spendor, Red Rose,
more).

AndyB wrote in message . net...
I am looking for speaker suggestions so I have some
idea what to go listen to. The choices are staggering.

My target price (subject to change based on input of course)
is to spend under $1500 for the pair.

The equipment I will drive them with is
Cambridge Audio A500 65W Integrated amp (and phono pre-amp) 65 watts
RMS (8 Ohms) / 85 watts RMS (6 Ohms)
Cambridge Audio D500se CD Player
Dual CS-500 Turntable with Surve V15-MR cartridge

The room is a 20'D X 40'W X 7'H with accoustic tile ceiling

I am not looking for something "too bright" as I can find
bright speakers a little overpowering after a while. However,
I am interested in good imaging and a detailed sound stage.

For low end extension I have room (in the room and in the budget)
for a subwoofer if needed, so I am considering small speakers on
stands as well as floor standers. Small speakers on stands tend
to be a little cheaper since the cabinets are cheaper. I already
have a set of nice sand filled stands to use.

My typical listening levels are not very loud. I don't need
to shake the house, but sometimes I do like to hear an orchestra
sound powerfull. My musical tastes are all over the map. I would
say I mostly listen to classic rock, experimental rock, and blues,
and female vocals in general but almost anything is fair game.

(Is it reasonable to run magnepans off this amp, or am I under powered?)

One speaker that cought my eye is the CDM1 NT from B&W

I have heard a lot of good things about Paradigm, but I can't seem
to find much info online.

For the subwoofer I am condering building the 10" Titanic Vance
subwoofer kit from Parts Express.

I was also consider the Odin MK III Kit (Madisound or Zalytron) for
speakers.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

AndyB

"Jack Dotson" wrote in message news:zKXPa.45687$H17.13841@sccrnsc02...
Option #1 (my choice):

Maggie 1.6's used on Audiogon $1100-$1200. Assuming your integrated amp has
outputs which allow you use bigger amps, 2-Outlaw mono amp's (forgot the
model number, but they just starting selling them recently and they put out
a solid 300wpc rms into a 4 Ohm load, which the Maggie's are) $300 ea., or a
good used two channel amp in the price range from Audiogon.

I think you mean the Outlaw Audio M-200 monoblocks.

ctakim

Go check out Eminent Technology LFT8a's. It is a planner/hybred with
bass to 35 hz maybe abit lower. They use a magnetic planner /mylar mid
and highs. The design has been around for a while with the "a" being
the latest design. They are super resonable at a list of 1800. and can
be had for 1400. shipped to you from Hollywood Sound in Florida. They
have been widly reviewed here, Audio Asylum and Audioreview.com. They
should be driven with at least 80 watts rms.
Sound is fluid, clean, very listenable .