I'm considering upgrading my MMF-5 'table with a new cartridge. Both
the Shure V15 and the Sumiko BPS are on sale at AudioAdvisor. I've
been leaning toward the BPS for quite a while, wanting to try out an
MC cart for a change. But I've read great things about the V15 as
well.

Anyone with experience with one or both cartridges? Any significant
differences in sound, or installation ease?

I'd appreciate any comments. Thanks.

---
Jim

J Bunnell wrote in message ...
I'm considering upgrading my MMF-5 'table with a new cartridge. Both
the Shure V15 and the Sumiko BPS are on sale at AudioAdvisor. I've
been leaning toward the BPS for quite a while, wanting to try out an
MC cart for a change. But I've read great things about the V15 as
well.

Anyone with experience with one or both cartridges? Any significant
differences in sound, or installation ease?

I'd appreciate any comments. Thanks.

---
Jim


I've had extensive experience with both. Owned v15III, v15IV, V15vmr
then got BPS (had 3 of them). Quicker than the Shures maybe not as
smooth but far more alive sounding. I prefered the BPS handsdown. The
downside appears if you plan to install the BPS yourself. Its
unprotected stylus can bring you to grief in short order if you are
the least bit clumsy in handling it. Be extremely careful when
installing or get a pro to do it.

"J Bunnell" wrote in message
...
I'm considering upgrading my MMF-5 'table with a new cartridge. Both
the Shure V15 and the Sumiko BPS are on sale at AudioAdvisor. I've
been leaning toward the BPS for quite a while, wanting to try out an
MC cart for a change. But I've read great things about the V15 as
well.

Anyone with experience with one or both cartridges? Any significant
differences in sound, or installation ease?

I'd appreciate any comments. Thanks.

---
Jim


Have owned both. The Shure is very neutral and objectively very hard to
fault. It tracks at light forces in a low-to-medium mass arm. It just
never sounds ultimately "you are there, they are here".

The Blue Point Special is very much a moving coil..dynamic, vivid, a high
frequency sheen that can turn to brightness. Tracks at about 2 grams to the
Shure's 1, has a bit more finicky stylus to get to sound just right (in
other words is VTA sensitive), and requires an arm with absolutely no
resonance's or they will be excited. However, in the right arm in can
provide a large dose of MC magic at an affordable price.

Both cartridges operate just fine into standard 47k input resistance.

Safe choice is the Shure; I'd go for the Blue Point Special.

This mirrors my experience as well. I actually used the Platinum on a
Rega P3 with no problem and got fabulous sound. There was an extremely
small level of hum at the very end of the Lp sides that was covered
over completely by the music and by comparison surface noise can be
much greater, so that has always been more of a rumor than a truth.
There is a very good compatibility with the MMF tables as well as I
have most recently mounted and sold a Grado on an MMF-7. The Grados
are superior in sound to either of the other options. I now use a Rega
Super Elys which is also excellent, so there is yet another choice.
for years before I had used the better models of the Denon MC
cartridges which are now impossible to find. The new Grados and Regas
really give them a run for the money and do not require sinfully
expensive preamplification to get the most from them either. As with
any cartridge, proper set-up and alignment is very important so be
sure to get that right or you will not benefit from these cartridges
tracking abilities and can also damage your records.
- Bill
www.uptownaudio.com
Roanoke VA
(540) 343-1250

"Bruce J. Richman" wrote in message
...
J. Bunnell wrote:

I'm considering upgrading my MMF-5 'table with a new cartridge.
Both
the Shure V15 and the Sumiko BPS are on sale at AudioAdvisor. I've
been leaning toward the BPS for quite a while, wanting to try out
an
MC cart for a change. But I've read great things about the V15 as
well.

Anyone with experience with one or both cartridges? Any
significant
differences in sound, or installation ease?

I'd appreciate any comments. Thanks.

---
Jim









I've owned both cartridges in the past. My experiences were as
follows. The
Shure cartridge is an extremely competent tracker, compared to the
BPS. Also,
I would characterize its sound as definitely more neutral and
"relaxed" than
the BPS. When I first got the BPS, I thought its sound was more
"detailed" and
"exciting":, but longer term use and comparison finally convinced me
that it
was just more fatiguing and "hi-fi-ish". Now if you prefer a
relatively
analytical sound, you may prefer this, but I did not.

My first choice in the price bracket you are considering would be
the Grado
Reference Platinum, selling on the AA web site for $ 270.00. I used
this
cartridge for several years and found it significantly superior to
either the
Shure or BPS. It is much more musical IMHO than either of the
others. It
seems to impart a fullness of body to many vocals and instrumentals
that is
missing from the other cartridges you are considering. The only
caveat I would
attach to it is that some Rega owners have reported hum problems
with the Grado
cartridges. With other brands, this does not appear to be a
problem, perhaps
because of different motor locations. I've used VPI turntables with
my
cartridges with no such problems.

Ideally, of course, you should try and audition any cartridge you
are
considering prior to purchase.

Bruce J. Richman

(Bruce J. Richman) wrote in message ...

Ideally, of course, you should try and audition any cartridge you are
considering prior to purchase.

Is there really dealer who will let you audition a cartridge?

I've not compared the two but I happen to love my BPS. It is mounted on a Linn
Basik arm and VPI TT and sounds just great. No hardness, just very detailed.
I'll probably buy another when done with grad school and can buy something
again.
Dave
"Club Soda Not Seals"

Fill X wrote:
i'd say the sure is fairly neutral and a good tracker as well as good value at
the price. The BPS is over-hyped sounding to me and i'd rather have a LOT of
other things before I'd buy one.

There are better cartridges than the Shure, but Shure makes great,
solid performers for the budget-minded person.

"Uptown Audio" wrote in message
...
This mirrors my experience as well. I actually used the Platinum on a
Rega P3 with no problem and got fabulous sound. There was an extremely
small level of hum at the very end of the Lp sides that was covered
over completely by the music and by comparison surface noise can be
much greater, so that has always been more of a rumor than a truth.

The combo of a TT and cartridge which picks up hum bugs the hell out of me.
There are so many matches, all of which yield which can give great results
and sound, why choose one that does? I'd prefer to go out of my way to find
an arrangement which will not produce any hum whatsoever. In addition, in my
set-up (Tympanis) with two large woofer panels the hum is not so
inconsiderable. Even if you don't notice the hum, reproducing this
distortion or "noise" it is simply a wasting of your amp's power output.
When you lift up the arm at the end of the LP you will hear that it is truth
*and not* rumor.

Subject: Shure V15 vs. Blue Point Special?
From: J Bunnell
Date: 7/11/2003 10:26 AM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id:

I'm considering upgrading my MMF-5 'table with a new cartridge. Both
the Shure V15 and the Sumiko BPS are on sale at AudioAdvisor. I've
been leaning toward the BPS for quite a while, wanting to try out an
MC cart for a change. But I've read great things about the V15 as
well.

Anyone with experience with one or both cartridges? Any significant
differences in sound, or installation ease?

I'd appreciate any comments. Thanks.

---
Jim


I have owned both a standard original Blue Point and a Shure V15vmr and
have also heard a Blue Point Special. IMHO, the Blue Points are better than the
Shure. They have a better (more involving) midrange,better imaging, are more
dynamic (especially in the bass) and airier on top. The Shure sounds somewhat
dry and boring by comparison and lacking in "life" . My first MC was a Blue
Point (after I broke my Shure) and I haven't owned a moving magnet cartridge
since. Moving coils, to me, are better sounding as a rule.

Duane

Fair enough although I usually listen with the needle IN the groove...
- Bill
www.uptownaudio.com
Roanoke VA
(540) 343-1250

"Norman M. Schwartz" wrote in message
...
"Uptown Audio" wrote in message
...
This mirrors my experience as well. I actually used the Platinum
on a
Rega P3 with no problem and got fabulous sound. There was an
extremely
small level of hum at the very end of the Lp sides that was
covered
over completely by the music and by comparison surface noise can
be
much greater, so that has always been more of a rumor than a
truth.

The combo of a TT and cartridge which picks up hum bugs the hell out
of me.
There are so many matches, all of which yield which can give great
results
and sound, why choose one that does? I'd prefer to go out of my way
to find
an arrangement which will not produce any hum whatsoever. In
addition, in my
set-up (Tympanis) with two large woofer panels the hum is not so
inconsiderable. Even if you don't notice the hum, reproducing this
distortion or "noise" it is simply a wasting of your amp's power
output.
When you lift up the arm at the end of the LP you will hear that it
is truth
*and not* rumor.

"Uptown Audio" wrote in message
...

Fair enough although I usually listen with the needle IN the groove...

Many thanks for this information. All along I've been under the false
impression that I was the only one who listened to music that way.
Nevertheless at the end of a LP's side, should the sound fade to zero or
become "pianissimo" the hum becomes "fortissimo".

The combo of a TT and cartridge which picks up hum bugs the hell out
of me.
There are so many matches, all of which yield which can give great
results
and sound, why choose one that does? I'd prefer to go out of my way
to find
an arrangement which will not produce any hum whatsoever. In
addition, in my
set-up (Tympanis) with two large woofer panels the hum is not so
inconsiderable. Even if you don't notice the hum, reproducing this
distortion or "noise" it is simply a wasting of your amp's power
output.
When you lift up the arm at the end of the LP you will hear that it
is truth
*and not* rumor.

There are better cartridges than the Shure, but Shure makes great,
solid performers for the budget-minded person.


I agree, but they track really well. I use a lyra helikon sl myself, but have
enjoyed the shure for what it does well just like I love a grado for it's
particular "sound" which a lot of people hate. I happen to hate the BPS sound,
because it sounds like a cheap vocal microphone to me; kind artificially hyped
and spitty in the highs.

What I think makes the shure a great buy for your average person is it's great
tracking and easy matching to a preamp.

P h i l i p

______________________________

"I'm too ****ing busy and vice-versa"

- Dorothy Parker

At a $300 price level, there are inevitable tradeoffs, and each person
judges these differently, and the same person (moi) judges them differently
at different points in time.

Yes, but you must also bear in mind the matching of the tonearm to the
cartridge and the cartridge to the phono amp etc. When you have a cartridge
known for a "sound" like the grado or the BPS, inevitably you're going to have
love/hate reactions. A grado which is more focused to the midrange and "laid
back" a bit in the high end can be just the thing for some systems and some
people. Same story with the BPS. However, I wouldn't equate a brighter
cartridge with having more "detail" just like I don't feel one with less has
"more bass". It's a very subjective thing for all of us.

P h i l i p

______________________________

"I'm too ****ing busy and vice-versa"

- Dorothy Parker