[Jan Holm]

How do I give 80 people a monitor signal when headphones
is not an option. It's a sport crowd singing along a tune and
making some shouts, in sync with tempo.

For the singing part I was thinking of placeing a speaker facing
the crowd feeding them the lead vocal and a deep kick drum.
On the shout part they'll just get the deep kick.

The kick will be removed with eq afterwards, and I have a
dummy lead they can sing to, so the the spill wont mess with
the real lead singer.

Would this work, or is there a better way to do this when headphones
is not an option

TIA

Regards
Jan Holm

[Federico]

You can relate to the crowd as if it is an orchestra...
Have one person be the director (with headphones if possible) to give the
right tempo to the others.
Make sure everyone can see him.
Maybe have a person in the crowd playing something like a classcal guitar,
that's for tuning. You will not hear the guitar in a 80 people crowd.

Will it be an indoor or outdoor recording?
F.

[Jan Holm]

"Federico" wrote in message
You can relate to the crowd as if it is an orchestra...

Hi Federico

Thank you great advice - I have the means to that kinda
thing. I can do both in and outdoor. The indoor option
is a 200 M2 well damped tv studio. But still if the weather
allow for it, I would probably prefer to do it outdoor.

Not that I have any experience in this field, but 80 people
would probably sound boxy in everything but a concert hall ?

Regards
Jan Holm

[Rafael Vanoni]

I've done something very similar to that with success.
20-30 people in the studio with one 'director' in front of everyone and
three to four headphones spread out in the crowd.
A few guitars around would set the tone.

[Roy W. Rising]

"Jan Holm" wrote:
How do I give 80 people a monitor signal when headphones
is not an option. It's a sport crowd singing along a tune and
making some shouts, in sync with tempo.

For the singing part I was thinking of placeing a speaker facing
the crowd feeding them the lead vocal and a deep kick drum.
On the shout part they'll just get the deep kick.

The kick will be removed with eq afterwards, and I have a
dummy lead they can sing to, so the the spill wont mess with
the real lead singer.

Would this work, or is there a better way to do this when headphones
is not an option

TIA

Regards
Jan Holm

The key to what you're doing is loudspeakers that are highly accurate ...
ones that sound as good to the audience mics and the signal that is being
fed to them.

In 1969, Pete Seger asked me to feed some mics that picked up audience
sing-along to loudspeakers the audience could hear. He felt it would help
them feel better about "singing out". I did as he asked, avoiding
feedback. Regretably, the monitors were not sufficiently accurate to
deliver what really was needed.

A decade later, after developing an understanding that a good monitor
should sound good to a good mic, I established the ABC-TV Hollywood
Loudspeaker Evaluation Protocol. I can give several anecdotal proofs that
I was on the right track. One was a case where I fed audience response
through accurate monitors into each area of a sitcom set. During a break,
I killed the audience feed to the line mix. When we resumed, the only
audience response to the line mix was the boom mics' pickup of those
speakers. It sounded surprisingly good. Good enough to continue without a
retake. Of course, I heard the subtle difference and re-opened the
audience master to the line mix.

--
~ Roy
"If you notice the sound, it's wrong!"

[[email protected]]

On 2006-10-08 said:
You can relate to the crowd as if it is an orchestra...
Have one person be the director (with headphones if possible) to
give the right tempo to the others.
Make sure everyone can see him.
Maybe have a person in the crowd playing something like a classcal
guitar, that's for tuning. You will not hear the guitar in a 80
people crowd.
DOne this for chants or tracks that needed to be relatively
on pitch. YOur director's the key.

Do the director with some low monitors in the null pattern
of your mics. IF pitch isn't important such as a chant just
a director can be all you need.



Richard webb,
Electric Spider Productions
Replace anything before the @ symbol with elspider for real
email address.

[Preben Friis]

"Jan Holm" wrote in message
k...
How do I give 80 people a monitor signal when headphones
is not an option. It's a sport crowd singing along a tune and
making some shouts, in sync with tempo.

For the singing part I was thinking of placeing a speaker facing
the crowd feeding them the lead vocal and a deep kick drum.

What about two speakers, one in opposite polarity of the other, and each in
the same distance from the microphone? The cancellation will probably not be
perfect, but it might be sufficient. If you want to record in stereo ... use
three or four speakers...

/Preben Friis

[Roy W. Rising]

"Preben Friis" wrote:
"Jan Holm" wrote in message
k...
How do I give 80 people a monitor signal when headphones
is not an option. It's a sport crowd singing along a tune and
making some shouts, in sync with tempo.

For the singing part I was thinking of placeing a speaker facing
the crowd feeding them the lead vocal and a deep kick drum.

What about two speakers, one in opposite polarity of the other, and each
in the same distance from the microphone? The cancellation will probably
not be perfect, but it might be sufficient. If you want to record in
stereo ... use three or four speakers...

/Preben Friis

You are correct up to the part about "three or four speakers". Two
identical speakers, out of phase, with a coincident pair of mics for stereo
likely will work. I've made good money fliping the phase of a speaker pair
on either side of a lectern. Remember, the more accurate the speakers, the
better the results. Accuracy here means, the part of the track picked up
by the mic(s) should sound almost exactly like the track itself.

--
~ Roy
"If you notice the sound, it's wrong!"

[Scott Dorsey]

Jan Holm wrote:
How do I give 80 people a monitor signal when headphones
is not an option. It's a sport crowd singing along a tune and
making some shouts, in sync with tempo.

Floor wedges, wired out of phase. Put a single microphone directly between the wedges.
You may need to move it around a little bit to find the null. The quality of the null at
low frequencies will depend a lot on the room, but outside you should have a pretty deep
one.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."