The current issue of Medical Electronics
Manufacturing has an article about the prospects
and issues concerning the use of Compact Flash and
similar solid-state storage technology in
medical applications. Gives a little insight on
the future of what some perceive as a "critical"
application.

Also, an article on EMI issues in medical
electronics. Many similarities to audio
applications. Interesting if for no other reason
than to show how parallel disciplines are affected
by similar problems, and how cross-disciplinary
solutions might be considered.

I'm sure nearly all the readers of this newsgroup
already read this magazine, but for those who may
have missed it:

http://www.devicelink.com/mem

Read a little about the technology impinging on
the future.

Let the past argue with itself...



TM

T Maki wrote:

The current issue of Medical Electronics
Manufacturing has an article about the prospects
and issues concerning the use of Compact Flash and
similar solid-state storage technology in
medical applications. Gives a little insight on
the future of what some perceive as a "critical"
application.

Also, an article on EMI issues in medical
electronics. Many similarities to audio
applications. Interesting if for no other reason
than to show how parallel disciplines are affected
by similar problems, and how cross-disciplinary
solutions might be considered.

I'm sure nearly all the readers of this newsgroup
already read this magazine, but for those who may
have missed it:

http://www.devicelink.com/mem

Read a little about the technology impinging on
the future.

Let the past argue with itself...

Dig it:

http://www.sandisk.com/pressrelease/20040823.htm

--
ha

T Maki wrote:
The current issue of Medical Electronics
Manufacturing has an article about the prospects
and issues concerning the use of Compact Flash and
similar solid-state storage technology in
medical applications. Gives a little insight on
the future of what some perceive as a "critical"
application.

Is this my opening to say: "Aha! I told you so!"? g

I realize that recording isn't quite a life-and-death level of
criticality as medical practice (with the possible exception of the
life or death of the recordist), but I do have my concerns, not just
about whether there will be anything on the memory card when I finish
the reocrding, but until I have a chance to back it up.

I see that at the NAB Post conference (NYC November 15) there's a
digital photography track with a couple of sessions on "Negative"
management.

http://www.nabpostplus.com/sessiondetail.asp?id=1203436

Mike Rivers wrote:
T Maki wrote:

The current issue of Medical Electronics
Manufacturing has an article about the prospects
and issues concerning the use of Compact Flash and
similar solid-state storage technology in
medical applications.

Is this my opening to say: "Aha! I told you so!"? g

I realize that recording isn't quite a life-and-death level of
criticality as medical practice (with the possible exception of the
life or death of the recordist), but I do have my concerns,

Although I'm getting more comfortable with CF,
etc., I still get moist palms using it.
Interestingly enough, I've not had any
apprehension using solid state storage devices in
my digital cameras. And I had enough faith in it
to use it for the "only one chance to get it"
recordings I did in China last year. Although I
did back up to DVT.

I've just had to replace the HD in one of my
Fostex D1624s, and while doing so I thought about
the idea of getting another drive caddy and
changing out the HD to CF. The adapters are
readily available and very cheap (the Fostex uses
standard IDE interface). Since I've got a 1GB CF,
it's worth the effort to experiment. If it works,
I'll have a nearly silent machine.

I've just started doing a little research on CF
specs (http://www.compactflash.org), and present
specs allow up to 137GB. I haven't found anything
above 12GB on the market right now (anybody know
otherwise?) 20-, 30-, or 40GB would be good for now.

I've got a surround recording to do next week
(Mozart "Solemn Vespers" and Durufle "Requiem",
100-voice chorus, orchestra), and if I can get
this working, it'll be a good opportunity to try
it out. Somewhat an act of faith, but I'll take
both machines.

I certainly understand and appreciate your
concerns. I had the same kind of concerns going to
HD recording. Actually, I'm MORE concerned about
longevity with HD. The Fostex drive I just
replaced crashed on startup with information on it
that I wanted to re-mix. Oh well.

Robustness and data integrity/longevity are
legitimate concerns. They are being (or have been)
addressed, and the info I'm finding indicates
100-year life, 1 million erase cycles, 2000Gs
shock tolerance. I haven't done the lab tests, but
that's pretty impressive. I'm still not switching
over completely, but running parallel technologies
for a while seems like a good idea (at this time).

Of course, every silly thing we've ever done
seemed like a good idea at the time...



TM

hank alrich wrote:

T Maki wrote:


The current issue of Medical Electronics
Manufacturing has an article about the prospects
and issues concerning the use of Compact Flash


Dig it:

http://www.sandisk.com/pressrelease/20040823.htm


Yeah, I saw that same bit from Sandisk in either
PLSN or BE recently. Quite a story. Another block
in the foundation of confidence in the technology.


TM

"T Maki" wrote in message
ink.net
hank alrich wrote:

T Maki wrote:


The current issue of Medical Electronics
Manufacturing has an article about the prospects
and issues concerning the use of Compact Flash


Dig it:

http://www.sandisk.com/pressrelease/20040823.htm


Yeah, I saw that same bit from Sandisk in either
PLSN or BE recently. Quite a story. Another block
in the foundation of confidence in the technology.


Whether the explosion was a tougher or easier test to pass
than the following, I really don't know.

I took my 256 meg Lexar JumpDrive (which is always on my
keychain and therefore is externally quite worn) swimming
for over an hour in a highly ozinated city swimming pool
this summer. I dried it out and it never lost a bit.

Chel van Gennip wrote:

The EMI article does not mention the circuit design itself. Circuit desing
has a big influence on the detection characteristics. For e.g. cell phones
to become a problem the GHz signal should be detected. Some circuit
designs are acting as a rectifyer/detector for HF signals, some don't.

Indeed. As we (in the audio industry) begin to
recognize and accept the reality that digital is
here to stay - whether in the acquisition, storage
or distribuiton aspects - details of proper
circuit design applied to frequency ranges well
outside the audible is becoming very important. I
found the discussion on power supply design and
parasitic emission interesting. I've been studying
power quality issues for several years, and more
and more I'm seeing references to the problems
caused by triplen harmonics created by switching
power supplies. The current issue of EC&M has
another article about it with a sidebar explaining
how triplen harmonics can cause in a worst-case
situation current overloads in the neutral
conductor of up to 1.73 times the supply current.
The proliferation of devices with switching power
supplies is beyond comprehension.

The issues discussed about the propagation of HF/EMI signals in boxes is nice.

I believe there was a discussion in this NG a
new device that referred to its plastic case as
being perhaps a factor in its performance.

There are a lot of cross-disciplinary problems like signal levels and
frequency bands etc. Special for medical instruments are extreme
requirements for leakage currents and strict specifications. Nobody there
says things like "Forget about specifications, just try it".

Yeah, nothing worse than waking up on the
operating table just at the instant your heart
surgeon utters, "Oops!" :-)



TM

T Maki wrote:

I certainly understand and appreciate your
concerns. I had the same kind of concerns going to
HD recording. Actually, I'm MORE concerned about
longevity with HD. The Fostex drive I just
replaced crashed on startup with information on it
that I wanted to re-mix. Oh well.

Long term or archival storage is a separate issue. By having a 20GB or
larger hard drive (or fixed internal memory would serve the same
purpose), I don't have to IMMEDIATELY take care of copying the
recording so I could re-use the media. When the cost of that much solid
state memory comes down to where a weekend's worth of "temporary tape"
doesn't cost more than the recorder, then I'll be really ready to give
it a try.

Of course, every silly thing we've ever done
seemed like a good idea at the time...

I recorded at a music camp this weekend and used (secondary to the
Jukebox 3) my computer with an external hard drive. Then I went to burn
some quickie CDs from the stereo mix on the hard drive and after making
a coaster, realized that with the USB 1.1 interface to the drive
(that's all the computer has) I'd have to make the CDs in real time or
at best 2X. It was quicker to transfer the files to the computer from
the Jukebox via Firewire (the Jukebox works through the Firewire PCMCIA
adapter, but the hard drive doesn't) and burn the CD from the
computer's internal drive.

At every turn, it seems there's something to bite me in the ass.

Chel van Gennip wrote:

Special for medical instruments are extreme
requirements for leakage currents and strict specifications. Nobody there
says things like "Forget about specifications, just try it".

And that's sensible. In one case, somebody dies, and in another, you
risk discovering that your interpretation of specs is invalidated by
personal experience.

--
ha

On Wed, 19 Oct 2005 13:50:17 GMT, T Maki wrote:

Although I'm getting more comfortable with CF,
etc., I still get moist palms using it.
Interestingly enough, I've not had any
apprehension using solid state storage devices in
my digital cameras. And I had enough faith in it
to use it for the "only one chance to get it"
recordings I did in China last year. Although I
did back up to DVT.

Just as a data point, my lady friend, as excellent
photographer often limited by her point-n-shoot,
came back from an Alaska cruise to find that one
of two CF memories was unreadable.

Best an idiot like me could determine was that the
camera's firmware caused a modulo/rollover damage
to the card's FAT. Made a safety bit image and sent the
card to a service that recovered the vast majority
of the images.

Only interesting because it highlights that even
digital media is vulnerable to flakey hardware. Some
things don't change.

Thanks, as always,

Chris Hornbeck
Gen. Miller, Gen. Sanchez, Donald Rumsfeld, President Bush.