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#1
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In Case you Missed It
Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio.
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf |
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#3
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"Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. |
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#4
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"Robert Morein" wrote in message ... "Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. IOW it's right in line with all other ABX research and 100% correct. |
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#5
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" wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... "Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. Expelling rank air from its bladder, the mckelviphibian vocalized: IOW gruuuntt it's right urrrghh in line with greeeek all other gruuunt ABX research urrrgh and greeeek 100% gruuunnt correct. According to creationists, the mckelviphibian and the housefly were put on earth for a reason. However, mimicry of higher life forms is merely incidental to the purpose of the mckelviphibian as a coprophage. |
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#6
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Bill Riel wrote: In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill The "in case you missed it" is a 1987 Brad Meyer's account about a few loopholes that he said should deceive listeners to falsely differentiate audio components from each other when in fact no differences were present. It is now 2005. Where are the published reports of identification of components when ABXing? Falsely or correctly. NYOB is obviously searching the old issues of "Stereo Review". He will not find any there. Neither correct nor false by Brad Meyer's criteria, ABX makes it all sound the same. Even Brad Meyer's laboriously researched false clues can not withstand the brain-deafening "test". When will simple minds grasp that reproduction of complex musical signals is beyond the reach of their primitive "testing" tools? Ludovic Mirabel _______________________________________________ |
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#7
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Robert Morein wrote:
"Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. You have no idea who E. Brad Meyer is, do you? -- -S |
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#8
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"Steven Sullivan" wrote in message ... Robert Morein wrote: "Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. You have no idea who E. Brad Meyer is, do you? Incorrect. |
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#9
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wrote in message oups.com... Bill Riel wrote: In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill The "in case you missed it" is a 1987 Brad Meyer's account about a few loopholes that he said should deceive listeners to falsely differentiate audio components from each other when in fact no differences were present. It is now 2005. Where are the published reports of identification of components when ABXing? Falsely or correctly. NYOB is obviously searching the old issues of "Stereo Review". He will not find any there. Neither correct nor false by Brad Meyer's criteria, ABX makes it all sound the same. Even Brad Meyer's laboriously researched false clues can not withstand the brain-deafening "test". When will simple minds grasp that reproduction of complex musical signals is beyond the reach of their primitive "testing" tools? Ludovic Mirabel _______________________________________________ Ludovic, I don't know. These idiots have obviously never had an Acoustat TNT-200 a Hafler XL-600, a Parasound HCA-2200, and an Odyessey in their hands. With different circuit topologies, they sound markedly different, yet none of these amplifiers have ever been labeled as "improperly operating", or "defective", by anybody. These people, and amphibians, love to play pretend, with their pretentious put-ons of pseudoscience and authority. The idiocy was apparently started by one Arny Krueger, who, righteously indignant at the fakery that infects the high end, overreacted by slaughtering the truth in the manner of the French Terror. These people spew pure poison, and to anyone who is reading, I say: The choices of hifi componentry are not simple. A complex interplay of amplifier, speakers, and signal source determine the pleasure of end result. Trust your ears and your gut. Be not deceived by appearance, price, or false prophets of either simplicity or complexity. And if you see a mckelviphibian, hit it with your shoe, pick it up with a paper towel, and flush it down the toilet. |
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#10
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Robert Morein wrote: snip Ludovic, I don't know. These idiots have obviously never had an Acoustat TNT-200 a Hafler XL-600, a Parasound HCA-2200, and an Odyessey in their hands. With different circuit topologies, they sound markedly different, yet none of these amplifiers have ever been labeled as "improperly operating", or "defective", by anybody. The differences between stock Haflers and ones properly modified with reinforced power supplies, internal shielding and bypassing, and other relatively inexpensive mods are noticeable to all but the most casual, or deaf, listeners, and the modified ones "sound better" in the opinion and judgment of _every_ listener, as far as I know, experiencing the comparison. Based on this example of unanimity, in the perceptions of listeners, despite the relatively small change in measured performance, I think one may reasonably conclude amplifiers do sound somewhat different, and some sound better than others, at least in the perception of an overwhelming majority. |
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#11
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"Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... "Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. Expelling rank air from its bladder, the mckelviphibian vocalized: IOW gruuuntt it's right urrrghh in line with greeeek all other gruuunt ABX research urrrgh and greeeek 100% gruuunnt correct. According to creationists, the mckelviphibian and the housefly were put on earth for a reason. However, mimicry of higher life forms is merely incidental to the purpose of the mckelviphibian as a coprophage. I notice you generate this drek every time you get caught with the truth. The comparisons in the article are right in line with present day ABX comparisons. Note the comments on applying EQ to an anp that is less than flat and how it then becomes indistinguishable from the amp that has flat FR. Your ridiculous posturing and overall nastiness, doesn't change the fact that your crap about relays is more denial. |
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#12
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wrote in message oups.com... Bill Riel wrote: In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill The "in case you missed it" is a 1987 Brad Meyer's account about a few loopholes that he said should deceive listeners to falsely differentiate audio components from each other when in fact no differences were present. It is now 2005. Where are the published reports of identification of components when ABXing? Falsely or correctly. NYOB is obviously searching the old issues of "Stereo Review". Not at all, it was posted on RAHE, where I can only assume you've been banned, due to you having your head handed to you so many times and you not taking it all that well. He will not find any there. Neither correct nor false by Brad Meyer's criteria, ABX makes it all sound the same. Even Brad Meyer's laboriously researched false clues can not withstand the brain-deafening "test". When will simple minds grasp that reproduction of complex musical signals is beyond the reach of their primitive "testing" tools? Ludovic Mirabel When will simple minds realize that sighted listening for subtle differences is worthless? When will simple minds understand that once the responses of 2 devices is close enough, they sound identical? When will simple minds understand that despite their protestations, ABX and other double blind protocols are the standard way serious researchers look for differences? |
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#13
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"Robert Morein" wrote in message ... wrote in message oups.com... Bill Riel wrote: In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill The "in case you missed it" is a 1987 Brad Meyer's account about a few loopholes that he said should deceive listeners to falsely differentiate audio components from each other when in fact no differences were present. It is now 2005. Where are the published reports of identification of components when ABXing? Falsely or correctly. NYOB is obviously searching the old issues of "Stereo Review". He will not find any there. Neither correct nor false by Brad Meyer's criteria, ABX makes it all sound the same. Even Brad Meyer's laboriously researched false clues can not withstand the brain-deafening "test". When will simple minds grasp that reproduction of complex musical signals is beyond the reach of their primitive "testing" tools? Ludovic Mirabel _______________________________________________ Ludovic, I don't know. These idiots have obviously never had an Acoustat TNT-200 a Hafler XL-600, a Parasound HCA-2200, and an Odyessey in their hands. You'd be wrong, but that's typical. With different circuit topologies, they sound markedly different, yet none of these amplifiers have ever been labeled as "improperly operating", or "defective", by anybody. Sound differnt? IN what DBT did you determine this? These people, and amphibians, love to play pretend, with their pretentious put-ons of pseudoscience and authority. That's so cute, you can't really write words like "scientific fact," so you pretend nothing is known about the way people hear or the fact that amps that measure close enough to each other sound identical. The idiocy was apparently started by one Arny Krueger, who, righteously indignant at the fakery that infects the high end, overreacted by slaughtering the truth in the manner of the French Terror. These people spew pure poison, and to anyone who is reading, I say: Complete bull**** Robert, and you know it. The ABX methodology, that Arny developed for audio comparisons was to help find the differences, that he as a then true beleiver in such things expected to find. The choices of hifi componentry are not simple. A complex interplay of amplifier, speakers, and signal source determine the pleasure of end result. What horse****. You get an amp that drive your speakers and a good CD player, fi you value accuracy, and a turntable if you don't, and a pair of speakers that you like. There's never been any evidence of system synergy and you know that as well. Trust your ears and your gut. Be not deceived by appearance, price, or false prophets of either simplicity or complexity. And if you see a mckelviphibian, hit it with your shoe, pick it up with a paper towel, and flush it down the toilet. Snore. |
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#14
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"Bret Ludwig" wrote in message oups.com... Robert Morein wrote: snip Ludovic, I don't know. These idiots have obviously never had an Acoustat TNT-200 a Hafler XL-600, a Parasound HCA-2200, and an Odyessey in their hands. With different circuit topologies, they sound markedly different, yet none of these amplifiers have ever been labeled as "improperly operating", or "defective", by anybody. The differences between stock Haflers and ones properly modified with reinforced power supplies, internal shielding and bypassing, and other relatively inexpensive mods are noticeable to all but the most casual, or deaf, listeners, and the modified ones "sound better" in the opinion and judgment of _every_ listener, as far as I know, experiencing the comparison. Based on this example of unanimity, in the perceptions of listeners, despite the relatively small change in measured performance, I think one may reasonably conclude amplifiers do sound somewhat different, and some sound better than others, at least in the perception of an overwhelming majority. If the comparisons weren't done blind then you know they are worthless. |
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#15
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" wrote in message ink.net... wrote in message oups.com... The "in case you missed it" is a 1987 Brad Meyer's account about a few loopholes that he said should deceive listeners to falsely differentiate audio components from each other when in fact no differences were present. It is now 2005. Where are the published reports of identification of components when ABXing? Falsely or correctly. NYOB is obviously searching the old issues of "Stereo Review". Not at all, it was posted on RAHE, where I can only assume you've been banned, due to you having your head handed to you so many times and you not taking it all that well. Why are you referring to Arny? What does he have to do with this? |
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#16
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" wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... "Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. Expelling rank air from its bladder, the mckelviphibian vocalized: IOW gruuuntt it's right urrrghh in line with greeeek all other gruuunt ABX research urrrgh and greeeek 100% gruuunnt correct. According to creationists, the mckelviphibian and the housefly were put on earth for a reason. However, mimicry of higher life forms is merely incidental to the purpose of the mckelviphibian as a coprophage. I notice you gruuunt generate this urrrghhh drek every greeeek time you get caught with the truth. The mckelviphibian's powers of mimicry frequently attract the attention of mammals. With their far greater intelligence, the mckelviphibian is easy prey. When cornered in sandy soil, the mckelviphibian assumes a posture referred to by amphibiologists as "ass up head down". With the head buried in soft sand, the predator is supposed to be intimidated by the size of the ass. This gave rise to a popular expression that is incorrectly attributed to ostriches. |
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#17
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" wrote in message nk.net... "Bret Ludwig" wrote in message oups.com... Robert Morein wrote: snip Ludovic, I don't know. These idiots have obviously never had an Acoustat TNT-200 a Hafler XL-600, a Parasound HCA-2200, and an Odyessey in their hands. With different circuit topologies, they sound markedly different, yet none of these amplifiers have ever been labeled as "improperly operating", or "defective", by anybody. The differences between stock Haflers and ones properly modified with reinforced power supplies, internal shielding and bypassing, and other relatively inexpensive mods are noticeable to all but the most casual, or deaf, listeners, and the modified ones "sound better" in the opinion and judgment of _every_ listener, as far as I know, experiencing the comparison. Based on this example of unanimity, in the perceptions of listeners, despite the relatively small change in measured performance, I think one may reasonably conclude amplifiers do sound somewhat different, and some sound better than others, at least in the perception of an overwhelming majority. If the comparisons weren't done by an ass then you know they are worthless. If you eat with your other end, you might taste something. |
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#18
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" wrote in message ink.net... [snip] people spew pure poison, and to anyone who is reading, I Complete truth Robert, and you know it. The ABX methodology, that Arny developed for audio comparisons was to help find the differences, that he as a then true beleiver Incorrect spelling: "beleiver". Rest of post: garbage. Grade: F. |
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#19
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In fact, in some caves, there exist whole communities of creatures that have
no sight. Blind mckelviphibians, devoid of all pigmentation, choke down fistfuls of bugs while crooning mornfully, echoing off endless caverns of limestone. As part of our acclaimed PBS documentary, "McKelviphibian; Creature from the Black Lagoon", we took sensitive sound recording equipment into one of these caves. Listen now, for a voice that sounds almost human: When will mckelviphibians understand that despite their protestations, ABX and other double blind protocols are the standard way serious amphibians look for differences in mating calls? |
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#20
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"Robert Morein" said:
If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. Dunno about Arny's soldering skills, but the relays in my preamp (gold-plated gasfilled OMRON types) sure as hell don't add or subtract anything in the signal. Now, if one's to ABX gear with a 4066, that's another matter :-) -- "Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes." - Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005 |
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#21
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"Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... "Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. Expelling rank air from its bladder, the mckelviphibian vocalized: IOW gruuuntt it's right urrrghh in line with greeeek all other gruuunt ABX research urrrgh and greeeek 100% gruuunnt correct. According to creationists, the mckelviphibian and the housefly were put on earth for a reason. However, mimicry of higher life forms is merely incidental to the purpose of the mckelviphibian as a coprophage. I notice you gruuunt generate this urrrghhh drek every greeeek time you get caught with the truth. The mckelviphibian's powers of mimicry frequently attract the attention of mammals. With their far greater intelligence, the mckelviphibian is easy prey. When cornered in sandy soil, the mckelviphibian assumes a posture referred to by amphibiologists as "ass up head down". With the head buried in soft sand, the predator is supposed to be intimidated by the size of the ass. This gave rise to a popular expression that is incorrectly attributed to ostriches. Thank you for admitting that you were wrong, again. |
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#22
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"Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message nk.net... "Bret Ludwig" wrote in message oups.com... Robert Morein wrote: snip Ludovic, I don't know. These idiots have obviously never had an Acoustat TNT-200 a Hafler XL-600, a Parasound HCA-2200, and an Odyessey in their hands. With different circuit topologies, they sound markedly different, yet none of these amplifiers have ever been labeled as "improperly operating", or "defective", by anybody. The differences between stock Haflers and ones properly modified with reinforced power supplies, internal shielding and bypassing, and other relatively inexpensive mods are noticeable to all but the most casual, or deaf, listeners, and the modified ones "sound better" in the opinion and judgment of _every_ listener, as far as I know, experiencing the comparison. Based on this example of unanimity, in the perceptions of listeners, despite the relatively small change in measured performance, I think one may reasonably conclude amplifiers do sound somewhat different, and some sound better than others, at least in the perception of an overwhelming majority. If the comparisons weren't done by an ass then you know they are worthless. If you eat with your other end, you might taste something. Thank you for admitting that you must commit forgery when cornered by the truth. The truth being you are a clueless dickhead. |
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#23
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"Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message ink.net... [snip] people spew pure poison, and to anyone who is reading, I Complete truth Robert, and you know it. The ABX methodology, that Arny developed for audio comparisons was to help find the differences, that he as a then true beleiver Incorrect spelling: "beleiver". Rest of post: garbage. Grade: F. IOW, I got it right again, and you don't know what the **** you're talking about, again. |
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#24
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Robert Morein wrote:
"Steven Sullivan" wrote in message ... Robert Morein wrote: "Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. You have no idea who E. Brad Meyer is, do you? Incorrect. I don't believe you. -- -S |
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#26
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" wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... "Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. Expelling rank air from its bladder, the mckelviphibian vocalized: IOW gruuuntt it's right urrrghh in line with greeeek all other gruuunt ABX research urrrgh and greeeek 100% gruuunnt correct. According to creationists, the mckelviphibian and the housefly were put on earth for a reason. However, mimicry of higher life forms is merely incidental to the purpose of the mckelviphibian as a coprophage. I notice you gruuunt generate this urrrghhh drek every greeeek time you get caught with the truth. The mckelviphibian's powers of mimicry frequently attract the attention of mammals. With their far greater intelligence, the mckelviphibian is easy prey. When cornered in sandy soil, the mckelviphibian assumes a posture referred to by amphibiologists as "ass up head down". With the head buried in soft sand, the predator is supposed to be intimidated by the size of the ass. This gave rise to a popular expression that is incorrectly attributed to ostriches. Thank you for gruunnt admitting that urrrrgh you were greeeeek wrong, again. This is one example of the mckelviphibian's talent for mimicry of the krugersaurus. Many naturalists have debated whether a behavior represents intelligence innate to the species, or mere mimicry. Since the mckelviphibian's brain has negligible corticial matter, mimicry provides it with an ability to exhibit behavior more sophisticated than could be independently created by its primitive ganglion. In fact, the total volume of corticial matter in the mckelviphibian is dwarfed by the "mushroom bodies" of the cockroach, those particular extensions of the insectoid cephaliod ganglion that are intimately connected with the antennae. |
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#27
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"Steven Sullivan" wrote in message ... Robert Morein wrote: "Steven Sullivan" wrote in message ... Robert Morein wrote: "Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. You have no idea who E. Brad Meyer is, do you? Incorrect. I don't believe you. Answer too long? |
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#28
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"Sander deWaal" wrote in message ... "Robert Morein" said: If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. Dunno about Arny's soldering skills, but the relays in my preamp (gold-plated gasfilled OMRON types) sure as hell don't add or subtract anything in the signal. Now, if one's to ABX gear with a 4066, that's another matter :-) The inadequate size of the relays was noted in a Stereophile article that predated the current acrimony. I built a remote control AB box using garden variety P&B relays with plated palladium/oxide contacts. Even with brand new relays, there was clearly a degrading effect. All those days of wasted fabrication! From the change in the sound, I think there was something nonlinear going on, ala rectification. I'm sure Arny used better relays, but the Stereophile comment remains, specifically challenging the power handling capacity. |
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#29
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"Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message nk.net... [snip] If the comparisons weren't done by an ass then you know they are worthless. What an amazing criteria! All science must be done by asses!!!!! Hahahahahahahahaha!!!! |
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#30
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"Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... "Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. Expelling rank air from its bladder, the mckelviphibian vocalized: IOW gruuuntt it's right urrrghh in line with greeeek all other gruuunt ABX research urrrgh and greeeek 100% gruuunnt correct. According to creationists, the mckelviphibian and the housefly were put on earth for a reason. However, mimicry of higher life forms is merely incidental to the purpose of the mckelviphibian as a coprophage. I notice you gruuunt generate this urrrghhh drek every greeeek time you get caught with the truth. The mckelviphibian's powers of mimicry frequently attract the attention of mammals. With their far greater intelligence, the mckelviphibian is easy prey. When cornered in sandy soil, the mckelviphibian assumes a posture referred to by amphibiologists as "ass up head down". With the head buried in soft sand, the predator is supposed to be intimidated by the size of the ass. This gave rise to a popular expression that is incorrectly attributed to ostriches. Thank you for gruunnt admitting that urrrrgh you were greeeeek wrong, again. This is one example of the mckelviphibian's talent for mimicry of the krugersaurus. Many naturalists have debated whether a behavior represents intelligence innate to the species, or mere mimicry. Since the mckelviphibian's brain has negligible corticial matter, mimicry provides it with an ability to exhibit behavior more sophisticated than could be independently created by its primitive ganglion. In fact, the total volume of corticial matter in the mckelviphibian is dwarfed by the "mushroom bodies" of the cockroach, those particular extensions of the insectoid cephaliod ganglion that are intimately connected with the antennae. Observe how when confronted with facts that contradict Moron's fantasy world, he resorts to infantile attacks. Way to go Bob. |
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#31
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Robert Morein wrote:
"Steven Sullivan" wrote in message ... Robert Morein wrote: "Steven Sullivan" wrote in message ... Robert Morein wrote: "Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. You have no idea who E. Brad Meyer is, do you? Incorrect. I don't believe you. Answer too long? No, simply insufficiently convincing. -- -S |
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#32
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"Steven Sullivan" wrote in message ... Robert Morein wrote: "Steven Sullivan" wrote in message ... Robert Morein wrote: "Steven Sullivan" wrote in message ... Robert Morein wrote: "Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. You have no idea who E. Brad Meyer is, do you? Incorrect. I don't believe you. Answer too long? No, simply insufficiently convincing. Oh. |
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#33
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" wrote in message k.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... " wrote in message ink.net... "Robert Morein" wrote in message ... "Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. Expelling rank air from its bladder, the mckelviphibian vocalized: IOW gruuuntt it's right urrrghh in line with greeeek all other gruuunt ABX research urrrgh and greeeek 100% gruuunnt correct. According to creationists, the mckelviphibian and the housefly were put on earth for a reason. However, mimicry of higher life forms is merely incidental to the purpose of the mckelviphibian as a coprophage. I notice you gruuunt generate this urrrghhh drek every greeeek time you get caught with the truth. The mckelviphibian's powers of mimicry frequently attract the attention of mammals. With their far greater intelligence, the mckelviphibian is easy prey. When cornered in sandy soil, the mckelviphibian assumes a posture referred to by amphibiologists as "ass up head down". With the head buried in soft sand, the predator is supposed to be intimidated by the size of the ass. This gave rise to a popular expression that is incorrectly attributed to ostriches. Thank you for gruunnt admitting that urrrrgh you were greeeeek wrong, again. This is one example of the mckelviphibian's talent for mimicry of the krugersaurus. Many naturalists have debated whether a behavior represents intelligence innate to the species, or mere mimicry. Since the mckelviphibian's brain has negligible corticial matter, mimicry provides it with an ability to exhibit behavior more sophisticated than could be independently created by its primitive ganglion. In fact, the total volume of corticial matter in the mckelviphibian is dwarfed by the "mushroom bodies" of the cockroach, those particular extensions of the insectoid cephaliod ganglion that are intimately connected with the antennae. Observe how gruunntt when confronted urrrghhh with facts greeeek that contradict gruuuntt Moron's urrrghhh fantasy world, he greeeek resorts to gruuuntt infantile urrrrgh attacks greeeeek. Way to grunnnt urrrrgh grreeekk Bob. This is what amphibiologists call a "reflex response". |
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#34
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Robert Morein wrote:
"Steven Sullivan" wrote in message ... Robert Morein wrote: "Steven Sullivan" wrote in message ... Robert Morein wrote: "Steven Sullivan" wrote in message ... Robert Morein wrote: "Bill Riel" wrote in message . .. In article et, says... Worthwhile reading, if you care anything about audio. http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/ass...rInterface.pdf Hey, good link - thanks for that, I hadn't seen it before. -- Bill If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. The conclusions, as is typically is the case, are presented by a person with a flair for writing, but without the analytic ability of a true scientist. IOW, it's bull****. You have no idea who E. Brad Meyer is, do you? Incorrect. I don't believe you. Answer too long? No, simply insufficiently convincing. Oh. Next time, you might want to actually provide evidence, like Mr. Meyer did. Just a thought. Or not. I'm about done with the newsgroup again for awhile. RAHE's back up. -- -S |
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#35
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Sillybot prepares to have his firmware refreshed. I'm about done with the newsgroup again for awhile. You're not allowed to preach about aBxism on RAHE, Silly. You'll be banned like Krooger was. |
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#36
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Robert Morein wrote: "Sander deWaal" wrote in message ... "Robert Morein" said: If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. Dunno about Arny's soldering skills, but the relays in my preamp (gold-plated gasfilled OMRON types) sure as hell don't add or subtract anything in the signal. Now, if one's to ABX gear with a 4066, that's another matter :-) The inadequate size of the relays was noted in a Stereophile article that predated the current acrimony. I built a remote control AB box using garden variety P&B relays with plated palladium/oxide contacts. Palladium doesn't oxidize, thats why its used.. however it's conductivity is poor so it isn't used in high current (5 A) apps. http://relays.tycoelectronics.com/app_pdfs/13c3236.pdf Even with brand new relays, there was clearly a degrading effect. All those days of wasted fabrication! From the change in the sound, I think there was something nonlinear going on, ala rectification. I'm sure Arny used better relays, but the Stereophile comment remains, specifically challenging the power handling capacity. You mean current handling. If the relay is dissipating power, you f'd up. Relays dont care if you're delivering 10V and 1A but they sure might care if your delivering 1V and 10A. ScottW |
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#37
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"ScottW" wrote in message oups.com... Robert Morein wrote: "Sander deWaal" wrote in message ... "Robert Morein" said: If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. Dunno about Arny's soldering skills, but the relays in my preamp (gold-plated gasfilled OMRON types) sure as hell don't add or subtract anything in the signal. Now, if one's to ABX gear with a 4066, that's another matter :-) The inadequate size of the relays was noted in a Stereophile article that predated the current acrimony. I built a remote control AB box using garden variety P&B relays with plated palladium/oxide contacts. Palladium doesn't oxidize, thats why its used.. however it's conductivity is poor so it isn't used in high current (5 A) apps. http://relays.tycoelectronics.com/app_pdfs/13c3236.pdf Even with brand new relays, there was clearly a degrading effect. All those days of wasted fabrication! From the change in the sound, I think there was something nonlinear going on, ala rectification. I'm sure Arny used better relays, but the Stereophile comment remains, specifically challenging the power handling capacity. You mean current handling. If the relay is dissipating power, you f'd up. Relays dont care if you're delivering 10V and 1A but they sure might care if your delivering 1V and 10A. ScottW No, I don't mean current handling. Palladium does have that problem, but the timbre change could not be explained by a modest increase in the resistance of the speaker feed. Junction rectification effects occur whenever there is the slightest dissimilarity in contact material. These are voltage dependent. Another possibility would be this: Because the actual contact area of slightly convex contacts is very small, the geometry may change as a function of point heating. Regardless of whether these, or a third, unknown mechanism turns out to be the culprit, the result is easily audible, as an unpleasant artifact. All I can tell you is: my self-constructed AB box is worthless. I have every self-serving reason to hide this fact, because I put a lot of time in it. But I won't, because that would be bad science. |
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#38
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Robert Morein wrote: "ScottW" wrote in message oups.com... Robert Morein wrote: "Sander deWaal" wrote in message ... "Robert Morein" said: If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. Dunno about Arny's soldering skills, but the relays in my preamp (gold-plated gasfilled OMRON types) sure as hell don't add or subtract anything in the signal. Now, if one's to ABX gear with a 4066, that's another matter :-) The inadequate size of the relays was noted in a Stereophile article that predated the current acrimony. I built a remote control AB box using garden variety P&B relays with plated palladium/oxide contacts. Palladium doesn't oxidize, thats why its used.. however it's conductivity is poor so it isn't used in high current (5 A) apps. http://relays.tycoelectronics.com/app_pdfs/13c3236.pdf Even with brand new relays, there was clearly a degrading effect. All those days of wasted fabrication! From the change in the sound, I think there was something nonlinear going on, ala rectification. I'm sure Arny used better relays, but the Stereophile comment remains, specifically challenging the power handling capacity. You mean current handling. If the relay is dissipating power, you f'd up. Relays dont care if you're delivering 10V and 1A but they sure might care if your delivering 1V and 10A. ScottW No, I don't mean current handling. Palladium does have that problem, but the timbre change could not be explained by a modest increase in the resistance of the speaker feed. Junction rectification effects occur whenever there is the slightest dissimilarity in contact material. These are voltage dependent. Another possibility would be this: Because the actual contact area of slightly convex contacts is very small, the geometry may change as a function of point heating. Regardless of whether these, or a third, unknown mechanism turns out to be the culprit, the result is easily audible, as an unpleasant artifact. All I can tell you is: my self-constructed AB box is worthless. I have every self-serving reason to hide this fact, because I put a lot of time in it. But I won't, because that would be bad science. Swapping out the relays for something with suitable contact material shouldn't be a big deal. ScottW |
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#39
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Robert Morein wrote: "ScottW" wrote in message oups.com... Robert Morein wrote: "Sander deWaal" wrote in message ... "Robert Morein" said: If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. Dunno about Arny's soldering skills, but the relays in my preamp (gold-plated gasfilled OMRON types) sure as hell don't add or subtract anything in the signal. Now, if one's to ABX gear with a 4066, that's another matter :-) The inadequate size of the relays was noted in a Stereophile article that predated the current acrimony. I built a remote control AB box using garden variety P&B relays with plated palladium/oxide contacts. Palladium doesn't oxidize, thats why its used.. however it's conductivity is poor so it isn't used in high current (5 A) apps. http://relays.tycoelectronics.com/app_pdfs/13c3236.pdf Even with brand new relays, there was clearly a degrading effect. All those days of wasted fabrication! From the change in the sound, I think there was something nonlinear going on, ala rectification. I'm sure Arny used better relays, but the Stereophile comment remains, specifically challenging the power handling capacity. You mean current handling. If the relay is dissipating power, you f'd up. Relays dont care if you're delivering 10V and 1A but they sure might care if your delivering 1V and 10A. ScottW No, I don't mean current handling. Then Stereophile meant current handling and you repeated their error. ScottW |
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#40
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"ScottW" wrote in message oups.com... Robert Morein wrote: "ScottW" wrote in message oups.com... Robert Morein wrote: "Sander deWaal" wrote in message ... "Robert Morein" said: If it's Arny Krueger's ABX box, it was constructed with inadequate relays. IME, this can easily mask subtle differences between amplifiers. Even if it was not constructed by Krueger, that does not make it immune from criticism. Dunno about Arny's soldering skills, but the relays in my preamp (gold-plated gasfilled OMRON types) sure as hell don't add or subtract anything in the signal. Now, if one's to ABX gear with a 4066, that's another matter :-) The inadequate size of the relays was noted in a Stereophile article that predated the current acrimony. I built a remote control AB box using garden variety P&B relays with plated palladium/oxide contacts. Palladium doesn't oxidize, thats why its used.. however it's conductivity is poor so it isn't used in high current (5 A) apps. http://relays.tycoelectronics.com/app_pdfs/13c3236.pdf Even with brand new relays, there was clearly a degrading effect. All those days of wasted fabrication! From the change in the sound, I think there was something nonlinear going on, ala rectification. I'm sure Arny used better relays, but the Stereophile comment remains, specifically challenging the power handling capacity. You mean current handling. If the relay is dissipating power, you f'd up. Relays dont care if you're delivering 10V and 1A but they sure might care if your delivering 1V and 10A. ScottW No, I don't mean current handling. Then Stereophile meant current handling and you repeated their error. ScottW Probably. Ever since the cat's whisker detector, it has been known that mechanical junctions have effects. When the purpose of a mechanical junction is to supply power, or a digital signal, methods of contact design, such as bifurcation, have been practically successful. But "dry" contacts, that must pass a delicate analog signal that dips to millivolts near the crossover, are, like audio, an electronic backwater. Is gold-on-gold with sufficiently low resistance sufficient? Silver oxide is quoted as having excellent conductivity, but what about junction effects that would not be noticed in power applications? And what about changes in the mechanical interface, caused by local heating, that occur on the time scale of the signal? This means that for me, cannot be accepted without examination for comparator construction. |
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