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#1
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Another Resorce for Quantegy Tape Rumors
Fred Layn just posted on the Studer List some interesting news.
- --He just talked to Steve Smith who had retired from Quantegy October 1 - --Smith continued as a consultant until December - --There were cash flow problems due to the decline of videotape sales and insufficient funds to pay for raw materials. - --DuPont had stopped making 1.5 mil basefilm - --Flanges had quadrupled in price in the last six years - --Oxide manufacturers weren't real interested in supplying small quantities of audio oxides - --Apparently Ampex sold 250,000 reels of two-inch in 1992. Quantegy sold 2,500 in 2004. - --Investors apparently bought two coating lines from Emtec and are planning to manufacture in the Netherlands. - --"Quantegy will not rise again." Of course where there's "news," there's more information to add to the pool. One tape distributor said that he himself had sold more than 2,000 reels of two-inch Quantegy tape in 2004, so Qunategy likely sold more than 2,500 total (though certainly not close to the 1992 figure). The Emtec coating equipment was apparently for cassettes. The prediction of Quantegy not rising again is premature. Depends on how the search for an investor goes. Curious about the factoid that DuPont had stopped making the 1.5 mil film. Stuff does go out of product - it happens with ICs all the time. But large industrial supplliers don't usually pull a product, particularly one with a limited but important customer base, suddenly. Typically they contact the major customers (and probably post an announcement on the Internet that nobody else notices) and inform them that it's time for a "last lifetime buy." If the manufacturer of their film base indeed discontinued production, it's unlikely that Quantegy didn't know this and stock up. Maybe they did and that "lifetime" supply became exhausted, or maybe they didn't have the money to place a lifetime order. One who wasn't there never knows, though. -- I'm really Mike Rivers ) However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over, lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo |
#2
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Mike Rivers wrote:
- --Investors apparently bought two coating lines from Emtec and are planning to manufacture in the Netherlands. Heeehah! Go Holland! Hans -- This is a non-profit organization; we didn't plan it that way, but it is ===================================== (remove uppercase trap, and double the number to reply) |
#3
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Can somebody answer this? This thread, like so many others, appears for the
first time with a Another Resource... Where is the original post, which I believe Mike Rivers started? I see so many posts , appearing for the very first time , begining with Where is the original posts? |
#4
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"Archiving" media is non-permanant, magnetic tapes wear out,floppy
disks wear out, operating systems become obsolete or defunct, digital files get bit rot... and to top it all off we have proprietary DRM,"digital restrictions management", being sold to people as a great fix all to copying. What happens if your master tape, or master digital recording wears out and the tape literally crumbles into dust and the digital recording becomes corrupt with bit rot? What do you have to fall back on, a CD or digital file that is copy-proof? In the end DRM ends up hurting the creators, locking them out of thier own legacy recordings. Companies and technologies come and go, at one time we ended up with about 8 amigas that eventually were thrown away,a box of 3/4 tapes that had lots of drop out,5' floppy disks,3' floppy disks,obsolete equipment, how are your recordings going to survive the changes over time? Andrea http://www.andrearogers.com |
#5
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In article writes: Where is the original post, which I believe Mike Rivers started? I see so many posts , appearing for the very first time , begining with It was posted to the Studer list. Subscribe at http://www.recordist.com/studer (I think). But that won't get you back to the original message until it gets archived in a few months. -- I'm really Mike Rivers ) However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over, lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo |
#6
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In article ,
BLCKOUT420 wrote: Can somebody answer this? This thread, like so many others, appears for the first time with a Another Resource... Where is the original post, which I believe Mike Rivers started? I see so many posts , appearing for the very first time , begining with Where is the original posts? It's on my server. Does AOL give you a threaded interface so you can jump back to referred messages? --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
#7
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#8
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wrote in message oups.com... "Archiving" media is non-permanant, magnetic tapes wear out,floppy disks wear out, operating systems become obsolete or defunct, digital files get bit rot... and to top it all off we have proprietary DRM,"digital restrictions management", being sold to people as a great fix all to copying. What happens if your master tape, or master digital recording wears out and the tape literally crumbles into dust and the digital recording becomes corrupt with bit rot? What happens when your analogue tape does the same ? What do you have to fall back on, a CD or digital file that is copy-proof? Strictly-speaking, 'Archived' the same info stored on different types of media. Just depends how much you value teh material, whatever media. geoff |
#9
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In article , Geoff Wood wrote:
wrote in message roups.com... "Archiving" media is non-permanant, magnetic tapes wear out,floppy disks wear out, operating systems become obsolete or defunct, digital files get bit rot... and to top it all off we have proprietary DRM,"digital restrictions management", being sold to people as a great fix all to copying. What happens if your master tape, or master digital recording wears out and the tape literally crumbles into dust and the digital recording becomes corrupt with bit rot? What happens when your analogue tape does the same ? It is still playable. Analogue formats degrade slowly. Digital formats have no audible effects with increasing error rates, until it hits a certain point at which all hell breaks loose. It's sort of like AM vs. FM radio, with the capture phenomenon magnified a hundredfold. What do you have to fall back on, a CD or digital file that is copy-proof? Strictly-speaking, 'Archived' the same info stored on different types of media. Just depends how much you value teh material, whatever media. The LoC standards want everything on a red-oxide tape with a polyester base and a particular binder type. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
#10
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Mike Rivers wrote: Fred Layn just posted on the Studer List some interesting news. - --He just talked to Steve Smith who had retired from Quantegy October 1 - --Smith continued as a consultant until December - --There were cash flow problems due to the decline of videotape sales and insufficient funds to pay for raw materials. - --DuPont had stopped making 1.5 mil basefilm - --Flanges had quadrupled in price in the last six years - --Oxide manufacturers weren't real interested in supplying small quantities of audio oxides - --Apparently Ampex sold 250,000 reels of two-inch in 1992. Quantegy sold 2,500 in 2004. - --Investors apparently bought two coating lines from Emtec and are planning to manufacture in the Netherlands. It was the cutters and the SM900 formulation. They're hoping to be up and running within 3 months. |
#11
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#12
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Mike Caffrey wrote:
Mike Rivers wrote: - --Investors apparently bought two coating lines from Emtec and are planning to manufacture in the Netherlands. It was the cutters and the SM900 formulation. They're hoping to be up and running within 3 months. I predict that in about a year from now there will be 3 or 4 manufacturers of professional audio tape, possibly a restructured Quantegy among them. -- -- John Noll Retromedia Sound Studios Red Bank, NJ http://www.retromedia.net |
#13
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"Mike Rivers" wrote in message news:znr1105704531k@trad... In article writes: Strictly-speaking, 'Archived' the same info stored on different types of media. Just depends how much you value the material, whatever media. I should have added "different geographic locations" as well.... geoff |
#14
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On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 18:14:16 GMT, John Noll
wrote: It was the cutters and the SM900 formulation. They're hoping to be up and running within 3 months. I predict that in about a year from now there will be 3 or 4 manufacturers of professional audio tape, possibly a restructured Quantegy among them. snip Look for the resurrected Emtec SM900 to be prohibitively expensive in the US, due to the impending collapse of the dollar, which is already sinking at record levels, thanks to Bush's failed economic policies. Quantegy, assuming it gets the $11 million, could keep them at bay on pricing point versus performance alone for quite some time. But, to be realistic, there's not nearly enough demand for analog tape anywhere to attract the kind of "cowboy capitalists" who are ruining the US economy now. To put it in a baseball analogy, these guys only invest in a home run, and refuse to waste their time on a base hit or ground rule double. It's called "short sightedness." Another worry: I hear that Flux, makers of those fine custom heads, is just about out of business, and the Quantegy fiasco might push them over the edge. Anyone have any factual word on their situation? dB |
#15
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DeserTBoB wrote:
Look for the resurrected Emtec SM900 to be prohibitively expensive in the US, due to the impending collapse of the dollar, which is already sinking at record levels, thanks to Bush's failed economic policies. That's okay. It won't be any more expensive than anything else. Quantegy, assuming it gets the $11 million, could keep them at bay on pricing point versus performance alone for quite some time. But, to be realistic, there's not nearly enough demand for analog tape anywhere to attract the kind of "cowboy capitalists" who are ruining the US economy now. If the dollar does drop, Quantegy will have a good market abroad for tape and will actually find themselves at a point where making cassette media may even be profitable for them again. This may actually help them a lot. Remember that Quantegy's main business these days is videotape and everything else is fairly small. A decade ago there was a huge market for cheap red oxide tapes in the broadcast industry. All of that market is gone now, which is a lot of the reason why the tape manufacturers are dying out. That was a much more profitable market than the high end 2" market. To put it in a baseball analogy, these guys only invest in a home run, and refuse to waste their time on a base hit or ground rule double. It's called "short sightedness." Yes, this is the current story of American business, and this is why I think the shutdown of Quantegy was mostly an attempt to wave their hands and point out to potential investors that they have a viable and vocal market. Another worry: I hear that Flux, makers of those fine custom heads, is just about out of business, and the Quantegy fiasco might push them over the edge. Anyone have any factual word on their situation? No, but a decade ago I was keeping a list of about sixty head manufacturers. Today I think five or six companies on that list still exist. Saki was the last of the big ones to go. I think Flux is in a good position, though, because they are a small company mostly dependant on craftsmanship and making an expensive high-end product. I think that as the dollar falls that this is going to be the most successful sort of organization in the US. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
#16
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Ohh noo, the sky is falling, ..
Relax guys. Supply and demand. The demand is still there. The price will adjust. Somebody will make it, and probably at even better quality. It really hasn't gone up much in a lot of years, even *before* adjusting for inflation. Sure, some will just finally go digital. But there will remain those that believe analog multitrack is still worth the extra money and hassle (or lack of, depending on your point of view). |
#17
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On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 22:28:22 -0600, Joe Sensor
wrote: Relax guys. Supply and demand. The demand is still there. The price will adjust. Somebody will make it, and probably at even better quality. It really hasn't gone up much in a lot of years, even *before* adjusting for inflation. Sure, some will just finally go digital. But there will remain those that believe analog multitrack is still worth the extra money and hassle (or lack of, depending on your point of view). So, which of these two models applies to audio tape manufacturing? 1: Kodak B: Vinyl record pressing The two models both look (from the outside, to me) mutually exclusive, but equally (im/ )plausible. It might depend on material availablities upstream and/or on large cash/credit flows. Some wild-eyed dreamer (damned hippies!) recently posted his prediction of homebrew semiconductors at the IC level. Never would have occured to me, and so opened up my sphere of possibilities. The flipside of the conservative argument is that tape was made, good enough to use just-fine-thank-you, before I was born. Before "I have a tip for you, just one word, plastics", etc. So, are cottage industries possible? Chris Hornbeck |
#18
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Chris Hornbeck wrote:
Some wild-eyed dreamer (damned hippies!) recently posted his prediction of homebrew semiconductors at the IC level. Never would have occured to me, and so opened up my sphere of possibilities. I don't think that will happen. But what will happen is that FPGAs (and the analogue equivalent) will get so cheap and easy to program that people will just use them in place of existing chips. Lose some weird unavailable DTL part? Blow an array to replace it. This is the case of using an existing general-purpose technology to replace unavailable components. Now, the question is whether this can be done with magnetic tape, and I'm having some trouble seeing how, but I'm really hoping somebody comes up with something. The flipside of the conservative argument is that tape was made, good enough to use just-fine-thank-you, before I was born. Before "I have a tip for you, just one word, plastics", etc. Right, but the original material from which it is made (the plastic sheeting) is becoming unavailable. How do we get around this? So, are cottage industries possible? They certainly have become in the vinyl world. Brooklyn Phono is out there making money and selling records with only two operating presses. You could not have afforded to run an operation like that in the early eighties because you couldn't compete on price with the large-scale mass-production shops that were stamping for a buck or so each. Those guys no longer exist. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
#19
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#20
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Chris Hornbeck wrote:
On 17 Jan 2005 09:36:02 -0500, (Scott Dorsey) wrote: Right, but the original material from which it is made (the plastic sheeting) is becoming unavailable. How do we get around this? I wonder how similar or dissimilar the plastic used for videotapes might be and if it's made in suitable sizes? It'll likely be around for a while worldwide. It is much, much thinner. Typical audio tape is 1.5 mil. You can get 1 mil tape, but it's a pain in the neck to edit. Videotape is 0.5 mil or thinner. Sometimes 0.25 mil even. This is where the supply problems come in. Everybody wants to buy and sell thin stuff. Nobody wants to do thick stuff anymore. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
#21
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