Wouldn't the R-121, being a figure 8 mic, have potential phase problems that
could cause problems? I know tons of people love the mic (I bought one
because of its rep), so I figure there has to be an explanation. For
instance, if I have it close to a guitar cab, the end facing the cab is
picking up the sound coming out of the cab, but then isn't the other end
picking up what's behind it? If this is the case, then that perhaps explains
why I hear the room sound even when close-micing my guitar cab. I just want
to understand why this is not problematic for most people. Since the mic
picks up sound from both ends seems that that phase problems would be
inevitable. But like I said, I must just not be understanding something
here. Or maybe I am not positioning the mic properly. I just place it like I
would my SM57.

thanks,

brian

A bidirectional mic like the R121 will not cause phase problems just because of
the nature of its design. If you were to mic something and on the other side of
the mic was a reflective surface such as a wall then you might have some phase
cancellation. In pratice I dont notice a problem with the mic picking up too
much room sound. I do put it fairly close to the speaker though--usually about
a foot away.

In your post you refer to the "end" of the mic. I assume you realize that this
a side address mic. Ahh, I just re-read the last sentence in your post and that
makes me think you are mistaken about the mics orientation. You do not point
it's end at the source like you would an SM 57. I'll assume you can figure out
what I'm talking about here.

Garth~


In article , "Brian Huether"
writes:

Wouldn't the R-121, being a figure 8 mic, have potential phase problems that
could cause problems? I know tons of people love the mic (I bought one
because of its rep), so I figure there has to be an explanation. For
instance, if I have it close to a guitar cab, the end facing the cab is
picking up the sound coming out of the cab, but then isn't the other end
picking up what's behind it? If this is the case, then that perhaps explains
why I hear the room sound even when close-micing my guitar cab. I just want
to understand why this is not problematic for most people. Since the mic
picks up sound from both ends seems that that phase problems would be
inevitable. But like I said, I must just not be understanding something
here. Or maybe I am not positioning the mic properly. I just place it like I
would my SM57.

thanks,

brian






"I think the fact that music can come up a wire is a miracle."
Ed Cherney

In Article , "Brian Huether"
wrote:
Wouldn't the R-121, being a figure 8 mic, have potential phase problems that
could cause problems? I know tons of people love the mic (I bought one
because of its rep), so I figure there has to be an explanation. For
instance, if I have it close to a guitar cab, the end facing the cab is
picking up the sound coming out of the cab, but then isn't the other end
picking up what's behind it?

Yes.


If this is the case, then that perhaps explains
why I hear the room sound even when close-micing my guitar cab. I just want
to understand why this is not problematic for most people. Since the mic
picks up sound from both ends seems that that phase problems would be
inevitable. But like I said, I must just not be understanding something
here. Or maybe I am not positioning the mic properly. I just place it like I
would my SM57.

thanks,

brian

Hi Brian,

Sounds like you're about 90 degrees off-axis.

Unlike an SM57, which is an end address mic, the 121 is a side address mic.
The most direct angle is 90 degrees (perpendicular) to the shaft of the mic.

The reason the mic works well on guitar cabs is that cabs are usually
cranked. The indirect sound is MUCH lower in level, unless you have a very
small and very reflective room.

Regards,

Ty Ford

**Until the worm goes away, I have put "not" in front of my email address.
Please remove it if you want to email me directly.
For Ty Ford V/O demos, audio services and equipment reviews,
click on http://www.jagunet.com/~tford

Wow. Thanks for the replies. This explains so much!! This whole time I have
been wondering why I have to crank my mic pres to get good levels from the
r-121. I can't wait to try out the mic in the manner it was designed!!

thanks tons,

brian
"Brian Huether" wrote in message
...
Wouldn't the R-121, being a figure 8 mic, have potential phase problems
that
could cause problems? I know tons of people love the mic (I bought one
because of its rep), so I figure there has to be an explanation. For
instance, if I have it close to a guitar cab, the end facing the cab is
picking up the sound coming out of the cab, but then isn't the other end
picking up what's behind it? If this is the case, then that perhaps
explains
why I hear the room sound even when close-micing my guitar cab. I just
want
to understand why this is not problematic for most people. Since the mic
picks up sound from both ends seems that that phase problems would be
inevitable. But like I said, I must just not be understanding something
here. Or maybe I am not positioning the mic properly. I just place it like
I
would my SM57.

thanks,

brian

Brian Huether wrote:
Wouldn't the R-121, being a figure 8 mic, have potential phase problems that
could cause problems? I know tons of people love the mic (I bought one
because of its rep), so I figure there has to be an explanation. For
instance, if I have it close to a guitar cab, the end facing the cab is
picking up the sound coming out of the cab, but then isn't the other end
picking up what's behind it? If this is the case, then that perhaps explains
why I hear the room sound even when close-micing my guitar cab.

With ANY mike you will hear room sound even when close miking a cabinet.
There is no mike that provides complete isolation.

I just want
to understand why this is not problematic for most people.

If the room sounds good, then picking up room sound is a good thing.

Since the mic
picks up sound from both ends seems that that phase problems would be
inevitable. But like I said, I must just not be understanding something
here. Or maybe I am not positioning the mic properly. I just place it like I
would my SM57.

If you don't like the pickup from the rear lobe, mike the cabinet from the
rear and put a baffle behind the mike. But the rear lobe pickup is where
most of the interesting sound comes from.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

In article writes:

Wow. Thanks for the replies. This explains so much!! This whole time I have
been wondering why I have to crank my mic pres to get good levels from the
r-121. I can't wait to try out the mic in the manner it was designed!!

Don't these things come with instructions?

If you were pointing the end of the microphone at the cabinet, you
were aiming the null at the thing you were wanting to record, and were
actually recording the reflections from the floor and ceiling, or two
opposite walls, or a combination of all four. In that case, there
would almost certainly be some cancellation - the extent of the
cancellation and the frequencies depndent on the difference in
distance of the reflecting surfaces from the business sides of the
mic, and their efficiency as a reflector.



--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo