All of us who have ever used a particular mic on a particular singer should
read the current issue of The New Yorker, Talk Of The Town section for the
piece on Al Green and Willie Mitchell. Willie's carried it to an extreme seldom
seen.
Phil Brown

For those who are interested it's available at:
http://www.newyorker.com/talk/conten...a_talk_mnookin

"Phil Brown" wrote in message
...
All of us who have ever used a particular mic on a particular singer
should
read the current issue of The New Yorker, Talk Of The Town section for the
piece on Al Green and Willie Mitchell. Willie's carried it to an extreme
seldom
seen.
Phil Brown

It isn't hard to believe that the ribbon of a particular 77DX would, through
time and use, arrive at just the right tension to favor a particular voice.
Will a used ribbon maintain that tension for ten years if unused in the
interim?

....Paul

--
************************************************** ********
"In the analog realm, it ain't "OVER" 'til it's over."


"Phil Brown" wrote in message
...
All of us who have ever used a particular mic on a particular singer
should
read the current issue of The New Yorker, Talk Of The Town section for the
piece on Al Green and Willie Mitchell. Willie's carried it to an extreme
seldom
seen.
Phil Brown

with unquestioned accuracy of thought, Paul Bawol replied:

It isn't hard to believe that the ribbon of a particular 77DX would, through
time and use, arrive at just the right tension to favor a particular voice.
Will a used ribbon maintain that tension for ten years if unused in the
interim?

...Paul

--
************************************************** ********
"In the analog realm, it ain't "OVER" 'til it's over."


"Phil Brown" wrote in message
...
All of us who have ever used a particular mic on a particular singer
should
read the current issue of The New Yorker, Talk Of The Town section for the
piece on Al Green and Willie Mitchell. Willie's carried it to an extreme
seldom
seen.
Phil Brown


I guess you gotta stay open to the possibilty that the Vodka had something
to do with it all. Didn't say what kind of vodka. That was a great
article. Ha! Patric

It wouldn't be the first time; back when Dolly Parton was recording for RCA
Victor, they kept a particular Electro-Voice RE-15 in a vault, for her
exclusive use.

Peace,
Paul

Then there's the famous George Massenburg story about the mic (C12?) that
Linda Ronstad asked him to leave her in his will- George agreed.


"P Stamler" wrote in message
...
It wouldn't be the first time; back when Dolly Parton was recording for
RCA
Victor, they kept a particular Electro-Voice RE-15 in a vault, for her
exclusive use.

Peace,
Paul

In article writes:

It isn't hard to believe that the ribbon of a particular 77DX would, through
time and use, arrive at just the right tension to favor a particular voice.
Will a used ribbon maintain that tension for ten years if unused in the
interim?

It will probably change. If it's a long, very low tension ribbon like
in an RCA 44, storing it with the ribbon horizontal increases its
potential for sagging. The proper way to store that mic is vertically,
or just leave it on the stand in its normal position, with a bag over
it to keep the dust out.

A 77 has a shorter ribbon and can probably tolerate more stress, but
eventually gravity wins.



--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

In Article znr1070711012k@trad, (Mike Rivers) wrote:

In article writes:

It isn't hard to believe that the ribbon of a particular 77DX would, through
time and use, arrive at just the right tension to favor a particular voice.
Will a used ribbon maintain that tension for ten years if unused in the
interim?

It will probably change. If it's a long, very low tension ribbon like
in an RCA 44, storing it with the ribbon horizontal increases its
potential for sagging. The proper way to store that mic is vertically,
or just leave it on the stand in its normal position, with a bag over
it to keep the dust out.

A 77 has a shorter ribbon and can probably tolerate more stress, but
eventually gravity wins.


This, so I've been told, is the reason for teh red dot on the beyer m160. If
you store the M160 with the red dot up, the ribbon is less likely to sag.


My 77DX seemed magical. One night I transported it to a session by lying it
down carefully wrapped in my car. When I got to the studio and plugged it
in, it sounded like crap. I think the jiggling of the journey allowed the
small pieces of junk that had made their way into a complimentary position
to one that wasn't as complimentary.

Regards,

Ty Ford

**Until the worm goes away, I have put "not" in front of my email address.
Please remove it if you want to email me directly.
For Ty Ford V/O demos, audio services and equipment reviews,
click on http://www.jagunet.com/~tford

It wouldn't be the first time; back when Dolly Parton was recording for
RCA
Victor, they kept a particular Electro-Voice RE-15 in a vault, for her
exclusive use.

But Dolly was actually recording there. Willie kept the mic on the possibility
that Al would return.
Just as an aside, I remastered most of Al Green (and Ann Peebles, why she
wasn't a great hit artist baffles me to this day) stuff from the Hi catalog.
Phil Brown

Phil Brown wrote:

I remastered most of Al Green (and Ann Peebles, why she
wasn't a great hit artist baffles me to this day) stuff from the Hi catalog.

Any specific recommendations from her catalog?


--thanks

In article writes:

This, so I've been told, is the reason for teh red dot on the beyer m160. If
you store the M160 with the red dot up, the ribbon is less likely to sag.

So now he tells me (after having stored mine in random positions for at
least ten years). I thought that was just sealant so you would have
difficulty getting the screws out. I just looked at mine and the screw
on the opposite side has some red sealant on it, too, just not so much
that it fills the hole.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

Any specific recommendations from her catalog?

The album "Part Time Love." It's a killer and as close to the original as I
could make it and since I brought mine from home for a reference, it's close.
Phil Brown

Phil Brown wrote:

Any specific recommendations from her catalog?


The album "Part Time Love." It's a killer and as close to the original as I
could make it and since I brought mine from home for a reference, it's close.

OK, no luck at Amazon but two of their affilliates have it. Did Capitol
pull it from the catalog, or is it just not very popular?

Any other sources?

There seems to be a 2003 'complete' release on Hi Records UK. Any idea
if they're using your masters or is it another rework?
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg.../-/B000006L87/

"paul tumolo" wrote:

Then there's the famous George Massenburg story about the mic (C12?) that
Linda Ronstad asked him to leave her in his will- George agreed.

It's a U67, with the Stephan Paul 0.6 or 0.7 micron diaphragm.

Harvey Gerst
Indian Trail Recording Studio
http://www.ITRstudio.com/

In article , Harvey Gerst
writes:

It's a U67, with the Stephan Paul 0.6 or 0.7 micron diaphragm.

Harvey Gerst

How is Stephen doing? I havent heard much about him of late. Has he already
released his line of proprietary mics?

Garth~


"I think the fact that music can come up a wire is a miracle."
Ed Cherney

Mike Rivers wrote:

writes:

This, so I've been told, is the reason for teh red dot on the beyer m160. If
you store the M160 with the red dot up, the ribbon is less likely to sag.

So now he tells me (after having stored mine in random positions for at
least ten years). I thought that was just sealant so you would have
difficulty getting the screws out. I just looked at mine and the screw
on the opposite side has some red sealant on it, too, just not so much
that it fills the hole.

The red dots signify the axis of the double ribbon(s) for orientation
purposes.

--
ha

In article writes:

The red dots signify the axis of the double ribbon(s) for orientation
purposes. [M260]

How so? Are you supposed to use it (at least nominally) with the dots
vertical? Honestly, I've never experimented with rotating the mic
around its long axis. Maybe it really makes a difference.

Do these things come with manuals?

--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

There seems to be a 2003 'complete' release on Hi Records UK. Any idea

if they're using your masters or is it another rework?
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg.../-/B000006L87/

Some are mine, some are Capitol.
Phil Brown

In Article znr1070802206k@trad, (Mike Rivers) wrote:

In article
writes:

The red dots signify the axis of the double ribbon(s) for orientation
purposes. [M260]

How so? Are you supposed to use it (at least nominally) with the dots
vertical? Honestly, I've never experimented with rotating the mic
around its long axis. Maybe it really makes a difference.

Do these things come with manuals?

Mine came with a one page cut sheet that never mentioned axial orientation.
I don't recall it mentioning the sag factor. I got that from someone lese
years later.

I DO remember testing the beyer M260.80 and finding that the response did
vary axially as I twisted the mic. I also remember thinking it was probably
a simple on-axis (down the throat) versus off-axis (down the side of the
throat) thing, but found the frequency response peaks had nothing to do with
the obvious way the ribbon was mounted in the throat of the magnet.


Regards,

Ty Ford

**Until the worm goes away, I have put "not" in front of my email address.
Please remove it if you want to email me directly.
For Ty Ford V/O demos, audio services and equipment reviews,
click on http://www.jagunet.com/~tford

OK, no luck at Amazon but two of their affilliates have it. Did Capitol

pull it from the catalog, or is it just not very popular?

Couldn't tell you. I just make 'em, I don't sell 'em.
Phil Brown

Any specific recommendations from her catalog?

Not from Ann alone but I reccommend "A Memphis Soul Night Live In Europe" Waylo
269530 2 with Ann Peebles and Otis Clay. It's Dutch.

I thought the M260 was a single ribbon and the M160 was the double
ribbon with the 2 dots? Neither of my M260s (old style and new style)
have red dots.


On 7 Dec 2003 09:01:52 -0500, (Mike Rivers) wrote:


In article writes:

The red dots signify the axis of the double ribbon(s) for orientation
purposes. [M260]

How so? Are you supposed to use it (at least nominally) with the dots
vertical? Honestly, I've never experimented with rotating the mic
around its long axis. Maybe it really makes a difference.

Do these things come with manuals?

(Garthrr) wrote:

Harvey Gerst wrote:
It's a U67, with the Stephan Paul 0.6 or 0.7 micron diaphragm.

How is Stephen doing? I havent heard much about him of late. Has he already
released his line of proprietary mics?

Garth,

Stephan's serious health problems aren't going away anytime soon, but I believe
the mic is close to being ready. From the last conversation I had with Stephan,
there are so many new and innovative ideas in this mic, it should really be a
ground breaking microphone. I think you'll see many of the things that Stephan
came up with (for this mic) making appearances on many mics in the future.

Harvey Gerst
Indian Trail Recording Studio
http://www.ITRstudio.com/

In Article , wrote:
I thought the M260 was a single ribbon and the M160 was the double
ribbon with the 2 dots? Neither of my M260s (old style and new style)
have red dots.

My m160 only has one red dot.

Perhaps it was made in India.

Regards,

Ty Ford

**Until the worm goes away, I have put "not" in front of my email address.
Please remove it if you want to email me directly.
For Ty Ford V/O demos, audio services and equipment reviews,
click on http://www.jagunet.com/~tford

In article ,
says...

My m160 only has one red dot.

Perhaps it was made in India.

Regards,

Ty Ford

LOL. that made my day ;D


--
/ Peter Kaersaa

Nothing that can't be cured with a bit of penicillin.

On Mon, 8 Dec 2003 16:54:37 +0100, Peter Kaersaa N_AT_kaersaa.dk
wrote:

In article ,
says...

My m160 only has one red dot.

Perhaps it was made in India.

Regards,

Ty Ford

LOL. that made my day ;D

Damn guys, if you haven't realized, please welcome the renound Phil Brown to
the group. If you look him up as Phill Brown on allmusic.com I think you'll
see we have some real greatness here.

From Nilsson to Little Feat to Bob Marley to Robert Palmer, I greet Phil and
welcome him.

Might I suggest that no one **** him off for at least a month or two? g

--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio
RAP FAQ and Purchase your copy of the Fifth of RAP CD set at
www.recaudiopro.net.
See how far $20 really goes.





"Phil Brown" wrote in message
...
It wouldn't be the first time; back when Dolly Parton was recording for
RCA
Victor, they kept a particular Electro-Voice RE-15 in a vault, for her
exclusive use.

But Dolly was actually recording there. Willie kept the mic on the
possibility
that Al would return.
Just as an aside, I remastered most of Al Green (and Ann Peebles, why she
wasn't a great hit artist baffles me to this day) stuff from the Hi
catalog.
Phil Brown

U87 and it wasn't quite up to George's snuff, so he ended up giving it to
her, not leaving it to her in his will. Not that George was giving away a
piece of ****, just that Linda liked it so much that George was nice enough
to let her have it. You gotta be real good friends, I can tell ya! g

--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio
RAP FAQ and Purchase your copy of the Fifth of RAP CD set at
www.recaudiopro.net.
See how far $20 really goes.





"paul tumolo" wrote in message
...
Then there's the famous George Massenburg story about the mic (C12?) that
Linda Ronstad asked him to leave her in his will- George agreed.


"P Stamler" wrote in message
...
It wouldn't be the first time; back when Dolly Parton was recording for
RCA
Victor, they kept a particular Electro-Voice RE-15 in a vault, for her
exclusive use.

Peace,
Paul

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
How so? Are you supposed to use it (at least nominally) with the dots
vertical? Honestly, I've never experimented with rotating the mic
around its long axis. Maybe it really makes a difference.

Mike, how come I've heard about this and I don't own the mics and you
haven't? Proper orientation in STORAGE is the key to a long life with
ribbons. I mean, if it's stored longitudinally for a couple weeks that's
not as bad as a couple of years, but still, gravity wins almost all battles.
And even if it was tweakable in terms of tension, at some point it would
still end up sagging beyond tweekability. At least that makes sense to me.
How one uses it in a recording setup isn't really the question. How one
stores it was the statement.

--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio
RAP FAQ and Purchase your copy of the Fifth of RAP CD set at
www.recaudiopro.net.
See how far $20 really goes.

In article writes:

How so? Are you supposed to use it (at least nominally) with the dots
vertical?

Mike, how come I've heard about this and I don't own the mics and you
haven't?

Maybe because you read about it, and I just use the mics now and then.
I guess it makes sense when you don't have a symmetrical diaphragm
that orientation would make a difference, but then I don't fool with
mics too much. I set them up so they look right, give a listen, and
unless it sounds wrong, I go with what I have. I don't try to make it
better if it's already OK. Well, maybe sometimes, but honestly I've
never messed with the M160s.

Proper orientation in STORAGE is the key to a long life with
ribbons. I mean, if it's stored longitudinally for a couple weeks that's
not as bad as a couple of years, but still, gravity wins almost all battles.

The elements in these Beyer mics are usually referred to (by people
who speak in these terms) as "high tension" ribbons. This is why
they're not as delicate as the classic RCA mics that most people think
of when they hear the term "ribbon microphone." If this is really
true, I suspect that it really doesn't matter very much.

I've never looked at the ribbons in an M160, but the standard M260
ribbon isn't accordion-pleated over its length like an RCA ribbon is.
It has kind of a long oval pressed into it which acts as a stiffener
along the lenght, and just a little pleat at each end where it's
supported, so the whole thing tends to move as a flat diaphragm. I
wouldn't think this is subject to too much sagging if stored in the
wrong orientation. Probably the worst thing would be to store it with
the body vertical.

Hopefully Stephen Sank will see his name mentioned and can shed some
light on this since he's taken apart several Beyer mics.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

"Roger W. Norman"

From Nilsson to Little Feat to Bob Marley to Robert Palmer, I greet Phil and
welcome him.

I think this is the "other" Phil Brown, Roger, I already asked him if he
was the "Nilsson Schmilsson" Phil Brown... He's been around and done a bit of
TV too.


Will Miho
NY Music & TV Audio Guy
Off the Morning Show! & sleepin' In... / Fox News
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits

I think this is the "other" Phil Brown, Roger, I already asked him
if he
was the "Nilsson Schmilsson" Phil Brown... He's been around and done a
bit of
TV too.

Yes, there are two Phil Browns, one English who worked for Island at Basing
Street and me who worked for CBS and Warner Bros among others. I almost worked
for Blackwell as well and wouldn't that have been confusing. As it was there's
a Robert Palmer with both of us credited.
Phil Brown

Ah, well, welcome anyway. Those you spoke of and your involvement
apparently gave me a nice little precipice from which to fling myself!

--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio
RAP FAQ and Purchase your copy of the Fifth of RAP CD set at
www.recaudiopro.net.
See how far $20 really goes.





"Phil Brown" wrote in message
...

I think this is the "other" Phil Brown, Roger, I already asked him
if he
was the "Nilsson Schmilsson" Phil Brown... He's been around and done a
bit of
TV too.

Yes, there are two Phil Browns, one English who worked for Island at
Basing
Street and me who worked for CBS and Warner Bros among others. I almost
worked
for Blackwell as well and wouldn't that have been confusing. As it was
there's
a Robert Palmer with both of us credited.
Phil Brown