Some recorded DAT, cassette and DA88 tapes were accidentally left on the
rear window sill of a car for a few days, in their cases, and inside an
opaque plastic storage box. Outdoor temps were in high 70s. Temperatures of
tapes when discovered, in middle of afternnoon, were not uncomfortable to
touch, but certainly exceeded normal storage levels. How much heat can tape
withstand before damage? Did a Google search but couldn't find specific
numbers. Thanks.

"Bill Lorentzen" wrote in message
...
Some recorded DAT, cassette and DA88 tapes were accidentally left on the
rear window sill of a car for a few days, in their cases, and inside an
opaque plastic storage box. Outdoor temps were in high 70s. Temperatures
of
tapes when discovered, in middle of afternnoon, were not uncomfortable to
touch, but certainly exceeded normal storage levels. How much heat can
tape
withstand before damage? Did a Google search but couldn't find specific
numbers. Thanks.

I think it comes under the category of, "Don't do that any more." You
probably didn't hurt them much.

dtk

Bill Lorentzen wrote:
Some recorded DAT, cassette and DA88 tapes were accidentally left on the
rear window sill of a car for a few days, in their cases, and inside an
opaque plastic storage box. Outdoor temps were in high 70s. Temperatures of
tapes when discovered, in middle of afternnoon, were not uncomfortable to
touch, but certainly exceeded normal storage levels. How much heat can tape
withstand before damage? Did a Google search but couldn't find specific
numbers. Thanks.

There is a NASA SP on tape recording technology which has a whole chapter
about this, for flight recording stuff.

Basically, there are three things that go wrong. The shells deform (which
is easy to fix by transplanting the tape into a new shell), and this happens
at fairly low temperatures like you might find in a car. Then, the tape base
itself deforms (which causes the tape to look rippled at first, and you
get poor tape to head contact... this is worst on helical scan systems),
which happens at higher temperatures (probably not in your car with modern
polyester tapes, but maybe). Then the tape gets up to the Curie point and
the particles lose their magnetic field (definitely not going to happen in
your car).
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Thanks, Scott, that is very reassuring. There has been no damage to the
shells, so no damage to the tapes either.


"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message
...
Bill Lorentzen wrote:
Some recorded DAT, cassette and DA88 tapes were accidentally left on the
rear window sill of a car for a few days, in their cases, and inside an
opaque plastic storage box. Outdoor temps were in high 70s. Temperatures
of
tapes when discovered, in middle of afternnoon, were not uncomfortable to
touch, but certainly exceeded normal storage levels. How much heat can
tape
withstand before damage? Did a Google search but couldn't find specific
numbers. Thanks.

There is a NASA SP on tape recording technology which has a whole chapter
about this, for flight recording stuff.

Basically, there are three things that go wrong. The shells deform (which
is easy to fix by transplanting the tape into a new shell), and this
happens
at fairly low temperatures like you might find in a car. Then, the tape
base
itself deforms (which causes the tape to look rippled at first, and you
get poor tape to head contact... this is worst on helical scan systems),
which happens at higher temperatures (probably not in your car with modern
polyester tapes, but maybe). Then the tape gets up to the Curie point and
the particles lose their magnetic field (definitely not going to happen in
your car).
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

In article writes:

Temperatures of
tapes when discovered, in middle of afternnoon, were not uncomfortable to
touch, but certainly exceeded normal storage levels. How much heat can tape
withstand before damage? Did a Google search but couldn't find specific
numbers.

What good will knowing a specific number do? You don't know how hot the
tape got anyway.

The standard "tape baking" temperature is about 130 degrees F, and it
rarely gets that hot in a car so you're probably safe. You might have
even helped, but don't make a habit of it.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

You might find a bit of "print-through" on your cassette tapes, where
recorded material on one layer of the tape 'ghosts' itself onto subsequent
layers below it (particularly noticeable where there are loud and soft
sections of music in close proximity). This apparently disappears ..or at
least reduces..during ffwd/rwd, but can be a permanent legacy of high
temp.exposure. Cassette tapes are damn durable items however, far exceeding
their predicted lifespan in hostile environments (ie car cabins) over
several years. However, don't do it again, just like the guys said...
Ray

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
news:znr1070561062k@trad...

In article
writes:

Temperatures of
tapes when discovered, in middle of afternnoon, were not uncomfortable
to
touch, but certainly exceeded normal storage levels. How much heat can
tape
withstand before damage? Did a Google search but couldn't find specific
numbers.

What good will knowing a specific number do? You don't know how hot the
tape got anyway.

The standard "tape baking" temperature is about 130 degrees F, and it
rarely gets that hot in a car so you're probably safe. You might have
even helped, but don't make a habit of it.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

"Bill Lorentzen" wrote in message
...
Thanks, Scott, that is very reassuring. There has been no damage to the
shells, so no damage to the tapes either.

I would still recommend you get the stuff off DAT and onto a hard disk
system... I've had more than a couple masters where the DAT became
unplayable after a few years... it's really not a very stable storage
format.

Best of luck with it.
--
Fletcher
Mercenary Audio
TEL: 508-543-0069
FAX: 508-543-9670
http://www.mercenary.com
"this is not a problem"

"Fletcher" wrote:

I would still recommend you get the stuff off DAT and onto a hard disk
system... I've had more than a couple masters where the DAT became
unplayable after a few years... it's really not a very stable storage
format.

.... and keeping the tape at a safe place. A hard disk is not a very
stable storage format for varoius reasons. The disk doesn't have a
read-only-switch. I lost a couple of disks due to different failures
in the last couple of years.

All my tapes with digital recording that date back to 1984 are still
fine. However, I have a disk that dates back to the 1989 might be no
longer readable just because it is not a IDE disk but has its own
controller which needs a ISA bus. That's no longer available today.

Can anybody imagine to go to an archive in 2023, pick up a computer
disk with recordings from today and start playing the music?

Nevertheless, backing up DAT and other digital recording to some other
medium makes sense.

Norbert

In article ,
Fletcher wrote:

I would still recommend you get the stuff off DAT and onto a hard disk
system... I've had more than a couple masters where the DAT became
unplayable after a few years... it's really not a very stable storage
format.

This is especially the case with recent DAT tape stock.

--
Bob Olhsson Audio Mastery, Nashville TN 615.385.8051
Mastering, Audio for Picture, Mix Evaluation and Quality Control
http://www.hyperback.com/olhsson.html
Over 40 years making people sound better than they ever imagined!

ck.com

In article ,
Fletcher wrote:

I would still recommend you get the stuff off DAT and onto a hard disk
system... I've had more than a couple masters where the DAT became
unplayable after a few years... it's really not a very stable storage
format.

This is especially the case with recent DAT tape stock.

--
Bob Olhsson Audio Mastery, Nashville TN 615.385.8051
Mastering, Audio for Picture, Mix Evaluation and Quality Control
http://www.hyperback.com/olhsson.html
Over 40 years making people sound better than they ever imagined!



Just Great. My DAT tapes from 1988 still play just fine. The only bad tape I
ever had was some stuff from DIC a few years ago.

Sony and HHB have been fine.

I suppose that now that tape isn't the big thing it once was that the quality
is going downhill.

Personally I like DAT as a format. I have lost way less stuff through the years
due to any failure on DAT than I have on hard disk or CD.

Luddite that I am, I will continue to use my DAT portable until the thing dies.
I have a couple of studio backups, and will eventually need to transfer the
library to another format.

Richard H. Kuschel
"I canna change the law of physics."-----Scotty

"Norbert Hahn" wrote:

"Fletcher" wrote:

I would still recommend you get the stuff off DAT and onto a hard disk
system... I've had more than a couple masters where the DAT became
unplayable after a few years... it's really not a very stable storage
format.

... and keeping the tape at a safe place. A hard disk is not a very
stable storage format for varoius reasons. The disk doesn't have a
read-only-switch. I lost a couple of disks due to different failures
in the last couple of years.

LOCKSS (lots of copies keeps stuff safe) - many archives use a combination
of hard disk and other media to ensure survival of the contents rather than
putting all their eggs into one basket. Larger HDs at lower prices mean
that this is becoming a very feasable method of storage. Furthermore, data
is easily migrated to newer disks and there are several integrity checks
that can be put into place to verify data integrity.

All my tapes with digital recording that date back to 1984 are still
fine. However, I have a disk that dates back to the 1989 might be no
longer readable just because it is not a IDE disk but has its own
controller which needs a ISA bus. That's no longer available today.

All you had to do was leave it in the PC...


Can anybody imagine to go to an archive in 2023, pick up a computer
disk with recordings from today and start playing the music?

Yes, but that is hardly the issue.

Nevertheless, backing up DAT and other digital recording to some other
medium makes sense.

Correct! Backing up to MORE THAN ONE other medium makes even more sense.

W