[Rick[_4_]]

Hi, I'm looking to add a blu-ray player to my system. Can someone give me
some insight to the audio cd player quality vs. a stand alone cd player.

[Audio Empire]

On Sun, 17 Jul 2011 19:44:13 -0700, Rick wrote
(in article ):

Hi, I'm looking to add a blu-ray player to my system. Can someone give me
some insight to the audio cd player quality vs. a stand alone cd player.


They are. for all intents and purposes, the same.

[Arny Krueger[_4_]]

"Rick" wrote in message
...
Hi, I'm looking to add a blu-ray player to my system. Can someone give me
some insight to the audio cd player quality vs. a stand alone cd player.


Sound is fine. The two things to watch out for is disc loading time and
usuabiilty if you don't attach a video display.

[Rich Teer]

On Sun, 18 Jul 2011, Rick wrote:

Hi, I'm looking to add a blu-ray player to my system. Can someone give me
some insight to the audio cd player quality vs. a stand alone cd player.

If you're planning to hook it up via analogue interconnects, make sure
the Blu-ray player has a decent analogue section (some are better than
others). Analogue section upgrades were one of the main reasons for
the Special Editions of the recent Oppo player (BD-83?).

--
Rich Teer, Publisher
Vinylphile Magazine

www.vinylphilemag.com

[Audio Empire]

On Mon, 18 Jul 2011 08:22:04 -0700, Rich Teer wrote
(in article ):

On Sun, 18 Jul 2011, Rick wrote:

Hi, I'm looking to add a blu-ray player to my system. Can someone give me
some insight to the audio cd player quality vs. a stand alone cd player.

If you're planning to hook it up via analogue interconnects, make sure
the Blu-ray player has a decent analogue section (some are better than
others). Analogue section upgrades were one of the main reasons for
the Special Editions of the recent Oppo player (BD-83?).



But the analog sections of Blu-Ray players don't vary from unit to unit any
more than do the analog sections of regular CD players. That they do vary is
beyond the scope of Rick's question. The fact that Blu-Ray players will play
most any thing makes them a better buy than a stand-alone CD player. For
instance, the latest Sony Blu-Ray players will even play SACD discs and DSD
downloaded files transferred to DVD.

But Arny Kruger is correct. The most import considerations are disc startup
times (which can be maddeningly slow) and the ability to operate the player
without the need of a video display turned on (especially if you are using
the player as audio-only).

[Arny Krueger[_4_]]

"Rich Teer" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 18 Jul 2011, Rick wrote:

Hi, I'm looking to add a blu-ray player to my system. Can someone give me
some insight to the audio cd player quality vs. a stand alone cd player.

If you're planning to hook it up via analogue interconnects, make sure
the Blu-ray player has a decent analogue section (some are better than
others). Analogue section upgrades were one of the main reasons for
the Special Editions of the recent Oppo player (BD-83?).

In fact its hard to imagine that the analog section of a blu ray player
would have audible colorations. I've done measurements on $39 DVD players
and their performance was such that there was no question about the adequacy
of their analog sections. The analog section of a digital player is pretty
simple - usually an analog switch for muting and a op amp that is running at
close to unity gain.

OTOH, many of us get a laugh over high end optical players that are just
relabeled or reboxed mid fi equipment, perhaps with a vastly overbuilt
analog output stage and corresponding laughably overbuilt power supply. It
is all for show.

[Arny Krueger[_4_]]

"Audio Empire" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 18 Jul 2011 08:22:04 -0700, Rich Teer wrote
(in article ):

On Sun, 18 Jul 2011, Rick wrote:

Hi, I'm looking to add a blu-ray player to my system. Can someone give
me
some insight to the audio cd player quality vs. a stand alone cd player.

If you're planning to hook it up via analogue interconnects, make sure
the Blu-ray player has a decent analogue section (some are better than
others). Analogue section upgrades were one of the main reasons for
the Special Editions of the recent Oppo player (BD-83?).



But the analog sections of Blu-Ray players don't vary from unit to unit
any
more than do the analog sections of regular CD players. That they do vary
is
beyond the scope of Rick's question. The fact that Blu-Ray players will
play
most any thing makes them a better buy than a stand-alone CD player. For
instance, the latest Sony Blu-Ray players will even play SACD discs and
DSD
downloaded files transferred to DVD.

But Arny Kruger is correct. The most import considerations are disc
startup
times (which can be maddeningly slow) and the ability to operate the
player
without the need of a video display turned on (especially if you are using
the player as audio-only).

I've seen players that address both problems. Every sample I've checked of
recent (introduced last fall or later) of mid-fi Blu Ray player has had
under 10 second load times for all kinds of discs. The human engineering
problem is less frequently solved, but the key features I've see on
occastion include more elaborate displays and a separate set of pushbuttons
laid out like they belong on a CD player. On balance small LCDs TVs are
becoming cheap and common, and do the job very nicely. Some Blu Ray players
have very artistically designed menus for playing CDs and music files off of
flash memory.

One other blu ray player feature to look for is called DLNA which allows the
player to access computers on your home network as music and video servers.

[Audio Empire]

On Tue, 19 Jul 2011 03:55:00 -0700, Arny Krueger wrote
(in article ):

"Rich Teer" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 18 Jul 2011, Rick wrote:

Hi, I'm looking to add a blu-ray player to my system. Can someone give me
some insight to the audio cd player quality vs. a stand alone cd player.

If you're planning to hook it up via analogue interconnects, make sure
the Blu-ray player has a decent analogue section (some are better than
others). Analogue section upgrades were one of the main reasons for
the Special Editions of the recent Oppo player (BD-83?).

In fact its hard to imagine that the analog section of a blu ray player
would have audible colorations. I've done measurements on $39 DVD players
and their performance was such that there was no question about the adequacy
of their analog sections. The analog section of a digital player is pretty
simple - usually an analog switch for muting and a op amp that is running at
close to unity gain.

OTOH, many of us get a laugh over high end optical players that are just
relabeled or reboxed mid fi equipment, perhaps with a vastly overbuilt
analog output stage and corresponding laughably overbuilt power supply. It
is all for show.



Like the MSB "Universal Media Player"? Merely a re-packaged Oppo BSD-93 with
a fancy power supply in a separate chassis, and "proprietary" audio stuff
which MSB sells for $4000! Of course one still will need an external DAC and
MSB will gladly sell your a DACIV for $14000 or more....

[Gary Eickmeier]

Audio Empire wrote:
On Tue, 19 Jul 2011 03:55:00 -0700, Arny Krueger wrote
(in article ):

"Rich Teer" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 18 Jul 2011, Rick wrote:

Hi, I'm looking to add a blu-ray player to my system. Can someone
give me some insight to the audio cd player quality vs. a stand
alone cd player.

If you're planning to hook it up via analogue interconnects, make
sure the Blu-ray player has a decent analogue section (some are
better than others). Analogue section upgrades were one of the
main reasons for the Special Editions of the recent Oppo player
(BD-83?).

In fact its hard to imagine that the analog section of a blu ray
player would have audible colorations. I've done measurements on $39
DVD players and their performance was such that there was no
question about the adequacy of their analog sections. The analog
section of a digital player is pretty simple - usually an analog
switch for muting and a op amp that is running at close to unity
gain.

OTOH, many of us get a laugh over high end optical players that are
just relabeled or reboxed mid fi equipment, perhaps with a vastly
overbuilt analog output stage and corresponding laughably overbuilt
power supply. It is all for show.



Like the MSB "Universal Media Player"? Merely a re-packaged Oppo
BSD-93 with a fancy power supply in a separate chassis, and
"proprietary" audio stuff which MSB sells for $4000! Of course one
still will need an external DAC and MSB will gladly sell your a DACIV
for $14000 or more....

I just bought a Sony BDP-SX1000 portable Blu Ray player. It has a 10 inch
screen that has a 1080 x 600 resolution and it can output to your large
screen with HDMI. This little thing can play anything, from CD to Blu Ray,
and also regular DVDs with hi def MPEG files, MPEG-4, Windows Media Video,
MP3 music files, WAV files, JPEG photos, and most any video files from a
portable hard drive that you can attach via the USB port. It was this player
that I used as a video screen to view my receiver from another room, via the
composite video in jack.

In addition to being a fantastic test bench for any kind of disc I want to
see after authoring, it can access the Blu Ray with breakneck speed, much
better than my component Panasonic. Has a LAN for BD Live too.

Gary Eickmeier

[Rick[_4_]]

"Gary Eickmeier" wrote in message
...
Audio Empire wrote:
On Tue, 19 Jul 2011 03:55:00 -0700, Arny Krueger wrote
(in article ):

"Rich Teer" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 18 Jul 2011, Rick wrote:

Hi, I'm looking to add a blu-ray player to my system. Can someone
give me some insight to the audio cd player quality vs. a stand
alone cd player.

If you're planning to hook it up via analogue interconnects, make
sure the Blu-ray player has a decent analogue section (some are
better than others). Analogue section upgrades were one of the
main reasons for the Special Editions of the recent Oppo player
(BD-83?).

In fact its hard to imagine that the analog section of a blu ray
player would have audible colorations. I've done measurements on $39
DVD players and their performance was such that there was no
question about the adequacy of their analog sections. The analog
section of a digital player is pretty simple - usually an analog
switch for muting and a op amp that is running at close to unity
gain.

OTOH, many of us get a laugh over high end optical players that are
just relabeled or reboxed mid fi equipment, perhaps with a vastly
overbuilt analog output stage and corresponding laughably overbuilt
power supply. It is all for show.



Like the MSB "Universal Media Player"? Merely a re-packaged Oppo
BSD-93 with a fancy power supply in a separate chassis, and
"proprietary" audio stuff which MSB sells for $4000! Of course one
still will need an external DAC and MSB will gladly sell your a DACIV
for $14000 or more....

I just bought a Sony BDP-SX1000 portable Blu Ray player. It has a 10 inch
screen that has a 1080 x 600 resolution and it can output to your large
screen with HDMI. This little thing can play anything, from CD to Blu Ray,
and also regular DVDs with hi def MPEG files, MPEG-4, Windows Media Video,
MP3 music files, WAV files, JPEG photos, and most any video files from a
portable hard drive that you can attach via the USB port. It was this
player
that I used as a video screen to view my receiver from another room, via
the
composite video in jack.

In addition to being a fantastic test bench for any kind of disc I want to
see after authoring, it can access the Blu Ray with breakneck speed, much
better than my component Panasonic. Has a LAN for BD Live too.

Gary Eickmeier



Thanks for all your input. I found my solution in the back of a closet. I
had an old Pioneer dv 578a tucked away. No blu-ray, but it plays every thing
else. Most of my videos are dvds anyway.

[Audio Empire]

On Sun, 24 Jul 2011 18:19:41 -0700, Rick wrote
(in article ):

"Gary Eickmeier" wrote in message
...
Audio Empire wrote:
On Tue, 19 Jul 2011 03:55:00 -0700, Arny Krueger wrote
(in article ):

"Rich Teer" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 18 Jul 2011, Rick wrote:

Hi, I'm looking to add a blu-ray player to my system. Can someone
give me some insight to the audio cd player quality vs. a stand
alone cd player.

If you're planning to hook it up via analogue interconnects, make
sure the Blu-ray player has a decent analogue section (some are
better than others). Analogue section upgrades were one of the
main reasons for the Special Editions of the recent Oppo player
(BD-83?).

In fact its hard to imagine that the analog section of a blu ray
player would have audible colorations. I've done measurements on $39
DVD players and their performance was such that there was no
question about the adequacy of their analog sections. The analog
section of a digital player is pretty simple - usually an analog
switch for muting and a op amp that is running at close to unity
gain.

OTOH, many of us get a laugh over high end optical players that are
just relabeled or reboxed mid fi equipment, perhaps with a vastly
overbuilt analog output stage and corresponding laughably overbuilt
power supply. It is all for show.



Like the MSB "Universal Media Player"? Merely a re-packaged Oppo
BSD-93 with a fancy power supply in a separate chassis, and
"proprietary" audio stuff which MSB sells for $4000! Of course one
still will need an external DAC and MSB will gladly sell your a DACIV
for $14000 or more....

I just bought a Sony BDP-SX1000 portable Blu Ray player. It has a 10 inch
screen that has a 1080 x 600 resolution and it can output to your large
screen with HDMI. This little thing can play anything, from CD to Blu Ray,
and also regular DVDs with hi def MPEG files, MPEG-4, Windows Media Video,
MP3 music files, WAV files, JPEG photos, and most any video files from a
portable hard drive that you can attach via the USB port. It was this
player
that I used as a video screen to view my receiver from another room, via
the
composite video in jack.

In addition to being a fantastic test bench for any kind of disc I want to
see after authoring, it can access the Blu Ray with breakneck speed, much
better than my component Panasonic. Has a LAN for BD Live too.

Gary Eickmeier



Thanks for all your input. I found my solution in the back of a closet. I
had an old Pioneer dv 578a tucked away. No blu-ray, but it plays every thing
else. Most of my videos are dvds anyway.



I've also yet to buy a Blu-Ray player. I enjoy the HD programming on my HDTV
from my AppleTV and my DirecTV satellite system, but I don't see enough value
in HD via Blu-Ray to justify paying $40 for a Blu-Ray copy of a film that I
can get in regular DVD for $20.

[vlad]

On Jul 25, 4:45=A0am, Audio Empire wrote:
. . .

I've also yet to buy a Blu-Ray player. I enjoy the HD programming on my H=
DTV
from my AppleTV and my DirecTV satellite system, but I don't see enough v=
alue
in HD via Blu-Ray to justify paying $40 for a Blu-Ray copy of a film that=
I
can get in regular DVD for $20.

The quality of the picture on well made Blu-Ray disk is stunning.
When I bought my first BD player, I rented the "Die Hard" movie on DVD
and Blu-Ray. Then I put BD in my new player and DVD in my old DVD
player and I watched about half an hour of the movie in my RPTV 720p
screen switching the sources. Try the same experiment then you will
know what you are missing on DVD. Since then some of the movies in my
DVD collection are simply unwatchable when you know how it would look
on BD.

I also can assure you that I had a very good quality DVD player in
my system, so arguments about low quality of my DVD player simply are
not applicable.

vlad

[vlad]

On Jul 25, 4:45=A0am, Audio Empire wrote:

I've also yet to buy a Blu-Ray player. I enjoy the HD programming on my H=
DTV
from my AppleTV and my DirecTV satellite system, but I don't see enough v=
alue
in HD via Blu-Ray to justify paying $40 for a Blu-Ray copy of a film that=
I
can get in regular DVD for $20.

I do not have TV feed at home, but from time to time I watch tv in
my friends houses. I must tell you that HD channels on Comcast (major
cable provider in Northern California) often show DVD quality stuff up-
sampled for HD. So whatever you think HD is is not necessarily
so :-) . Even real HD on their channels cannot even approach Blu-Ray.

Streaming on Netflix has two options - Standard (below 1Mbit/sec)
and HD (about 2.3 Mbit/sec). Well made DVD usually delivers 4-6 Mbit/
sec. All this resolution labels are just gimmicks.

So until you did not experience good quality Blu-Ray disk (about
35Mbit/sec) you don't know what real HD is.

On a lesser not - you can rent Blu-Ray disks from Netflix and not
to pay $40 a pop.

My $.02 worth.

vlad

[David E. Bath]

In article ,
Audio Empire writes:

I've also yet to buy a Blu-Ray player. I enjoy the HD programming on my HDTV
from my AppleTV and my DirecTV satellite system, but I don't see enough value
in HD via Blu-Ray to justify paying $40 for a Blu-Ray copy of a film that I
can get in regular DVD for $20.

I felt the same way about Blu-ray until I saw one at a friends home.
The picture is noticably sharper and the colors more real than any
other HD source I've seen on my 55" HD TV.

But more appropriate for this forum is the sound quality. Dolby
Digital and DTS on Blu-ray has 3-4 time the bitrate of DVDs abd it is
also noticably clearer. Since purchasing my Blu-rau player I have
watched several titles that I have on DVD and the sound quality jumps
out at you. The first example was Blade Runner, a movie I have had on
VHS, Laserdisc, DVD, and now Blu-ray and it never sounded or looked as
good. Also, I've bought several titles that include a DVD copy and
again, easily noticable differences. Also, several titles I've bought
include a 5.1 PCM 24bit/96KHz audio track that I ahve not been able to
check out since my hardware does not support it.

On the price question, many stores sell new Blu-ray releases at $20-22
during the first week, and I've seen quite a few titles that have been
out for a year or more available at prices ranging $5.99-$14.99.

--
David Bath - RAHE Co-moderator

[Kele]

On Jul 17, 4:44=A0pm, "Rick" wrote:
Hi, I'm looking to add a blu-ray player to my system. Can someone give me
some insight to the audio cd player quality vs. a stand alone cd player.

Based on responders, sounds like you mean universal player vs cd-only
player. My best player is both the Pioneer Laserdisc/DVD/CD player's
digital out to my preamp's D/A converter. It's better than my
dedicated CD player (an Integra) as a transport using the same D/A
converter in the preamp. In my system, none of my silver disc players
with their own DAC or using the DAC built into the preamp sounds as
good as the Laserdisc/CD player and preamp D/A converter combination.
The better combination sounds to have more dynamic range, is snapier
and less muddy. The sound difference isn't huge, but it's
consistant. However, the worst sounding player (using its own DAC or
the one in the preamp) has the best picture... It's a cheapo Philips
rebranded as a Sony DVD/CD player. The disc players are two entities,
a transport and DAC. In my case, I don't have a player that is the
best at both.

Obviously I'm talking about mass-market level stuff. The preamp is a
little above... a "C" rating in Stereophile. It makes sense the DAC
in the late-model preamp helps. Comparing just the Onkyo CD player
with a Pioneer DVD/CD player (not the laserdisc), using their own
DACs, the Onkyo wins. It sounds clean but not harsh, and not bloated
like the Pioneer. As a transport only, these two players sound about
the same... but for CD playback, the old dedicated CD player has
better functionality for doing that - direct track access on the front
face, etc.

At the mass-market, I think some brands have a priority or know-how,
sound or video. Basically, the brands that have a long history
producing audio equipment seem to provide components with decent
sound. While those brands that have a history with video have better
video. That might be why I don't have a player that excels at both.
I havn't had a high end digital source component so this general
observation may not apply to better gear.

[Arny Krueger[_4_]]

"Audio Empire" wrote in message
...

I've also yet to buy a Blu-Ray player. I enjoy the HD programming on my
HDTV
from my AppleTV and my DirecTV satellite system, but I don't see enough
value
in HD via Blu-Ray to justify paying $40 for a Blu-Ray copy of a film that
I
can get in regular DVD for $20.

Since my physical media watching is primarily via Netflix, the tariff per
disc is only about $2 each.

IME, Blu Ray is a mixed bag. Some are as gorgeous as the other posters say,
and some might even be a little substandard if they were DVDs.

Again IME my ca. $100 Blu Ray player does an outstanding job of upscaling
DVDs.

One hidden agenda in the HD jungle is the business of scaling. While really
good scaler chips are now pretty cheap, the difference between a good one
and an excellent one is clearly visible.

For example, the scaler in my low end Mitsubishi TV is said to be pretty,
well simplistic. It also does not handle a lot of different formats.

But, the scalers in my ca. $100 Panasonic Blu Ray and my Motorola cable box
definately do their job.

It is said that I would not be such a happy camper if I was using some
competitive cable boxes that only do 720 lines, and relied on the scaler in
my TV to get things up to 1080.

If I relied on a garden variety DVD player to play my DVDs, I would probably
have a poorer impression of what the best of them look like.

[Audio Empire]

On Tue, 26 Jul 2011 07:18:59 -0700, Arny Krueger wrote
(in article ):

"Audio Empire" wrote in message
...

I've also yet to buy a Blu-Ray player. I enjoy the HD programming on my
HDTV
from my AppleTV and my DirecTV satellite system, but I don't see enough
value
in HD via Blu-Ray to justify paying $40 for a Blu-Ray copy of a film that
I
can get in regular DVD for $20.

Since my physical media watching is primarily via Netflix, the tariff per
disc is only about $2 each.

IME, Blu Ray is a mixed bag. Some are as gorgeous as the other posters say,
and some might even be a little substandard if they were DVDs.

Again IME my ca. $100 Blu Ray player does an outstanding job of upscaling
DVDs.

Not and issue for me for two reasons: 1) I already have an up-scaling DVD
player that also plays (and up-scales) PAL. Since I buy a lot of motorsport
DVDs from England, I need that feature. 2) My Pioneer Elite 58" HDTV is more
than 10 years old (I bought it '99). It doesn't have an HDMI interface and
has only component inputs. All modern up-sampling players require HDMI to
up-sample