[Mike Rivers]

I've been trying for at least three years to use RightMark. The only
audio interface I've found that works predictably and correctly with
it is the built-in audio hardware in my laptop computers. The Mackie
Onyx Fireiwre interface doesn't work, Mackie Satellite doesn't work,
Mackie 1200F doesn't work. Focusrite Saffire Pro doesn't work.

Today I picked up one of those $30 Behringer USB interfaces (UCA-202)
figuring that a dirt simple USB interface that uses the Windows native
driver would work for sure, and it doesn't. I checked it out with real
analog test equipment and it's actually pretty decent.

Has anyone found a portable (USB or Firewire) interface that works
with Rightmark? This is getting silly.

[Steve L.]

Mike Rivers wrote in news:3d6ad3f4-cda1-48d8-8f3b-
:

The only
audio interface I've found that works predictably and correctly with
it is the built-in audio hardware in my laptop computers

Have you tried diabling your onboard sound in the BIOS ?
Sometimnes that cures anomolies.

[[email protected]]

On Mar 24, 5:49*pm, Mike Rivers wrote:
I've been trying for at least three years to use RightMark. The only
audio interface I've found that works predictably and correctly with
it is the built-in audio hardware in my laptop computers. The Mackie
Onyx Fireiwre interface doesn't work, Mackie Satellite doesn't work,
Mackie 1200F doesn't work. Focusrite Saffire Pro doesn't work.

Today I picked up one of those $30 Behringer USB interfaces (UCA-202)
figuring that a dirt simple USB interface that uses the Windows native
driver would work for sure, and it doesn't. I checked it out with real
analog test equipment and it's actually pretty decent.

Has anyone found a portable (USB or Firewire) interface that works
with Rightmark? This is getting silly.

Hi Mike

I've found Rightmark to work with everything I've ever thrown at it
including some rather exotic setups. But I haven't kept up with
upgrade fever. I'm using version 5.3 and NOT using ASIO drivers with
RMAA.

bobs

BS Studios / SoundSmith Labs
we organize chaos

[Eeyore]

Mike Rivers wrote:

I've been trying for at least three years to use RightMark. The only
audio interface I've found that works predictably and correctly with
it is the built-in audio hardware in my laptop computers. The Mackie
Onyx Fireiwre interface doesn't work, Mackie Satellite doesn't work,
Mackie 1200F doesn't work. Focusrite Saffire Pro doesn't work.

Today I picked up one of those $30 Behringer USB interfaces (UCA-202)
figuring that a dirt simple USB interface that uses the Windows native
driver would work for sure, and it doesn't. I checked it out with real
analog test equipment and it's actually pretty decent.

Has anyone found a portable (USB or Firewire) interface that works
with Rightmark? This is getting silly.

Are you sure you don't have a dodgy device driver loaded somewhere ?

I'd check it with a fresh plain vanilla install of XP. Can you do that ?

Graham

[Eeyore]

"Steve L." wrote:

Mike Rivers wrote

The only
audio interface I've found that works predictably and correctly with
it is the built-in audio hardware in my laptop computers

Have you tried diabling your onboard sound in the BIOS ?
Sometimnes that cures anomolies.

Very good point. Possibly also in Device Manager.

Graham

[Arny Krueger]

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message

I've been trying for at least three years to use
RightMark. The only audio interface I've found that works
predictably and correctly with it is the built-in audio
hardware in my laptop computers. The Mackie Onyx Fireiwre
interface doesn't work, Mackie Satellite doesn't work,
Mackie 1200F doesn't work. Focusrite Saffire Pro doesn't
work.

Today I picked up one of those $30 Behringer USB
interfaces (UCA-202) figuring that a dirt simple USB
interface that uses the Windows native driver would work
for sure, and it doesn't. I checked it out with real
analog test equipment and it's actually pretty decent.

Very strange, Mike. I obtained a UCA 202 with a small Behringer console I
bought for small gigs at church, and I did a Rightmark analysis of it,
forthwith.

Has anyone found a portable (USB or Firewire) interface
that works with Rightmark?

IME, the Behringer UCA 202 works fine with the current Rightmark program.

[Arny Krueger]

"Steve L." wrote in message
. 71
Mike Rivers wrote in
news:3d6ad3f4-cda1-48d8-8f3b-
:

The only
audio interface I've found that works predictably and
correctly with it is the built-in audio hardware in my
laptop computers

Have you tried diabling your onboard sound in the BIOS ?

Not necessary. As I wrote Mike, I Rightmarked a UCA 202 with this computer
I'm typing on. There's a menu for selecting which audio interface to test,
if there are several in the computer. I've run Rightmark on computers with
5 audio interfaces (4 PCI interfaces of 3 different kinds from the M-Audio
Delta series, and the on-board).

Sometimes that cures anomolies.

I've never seen an onboard interface that couldn't be shoved out of the way
with either the application or the control panel.

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 25, 12:05 am, wrote:

I've found Rightmark to work with everything I've ever thrown at it
including some rather exotic setups. But I haven't kept up with
upgrade fever. I'm using version 5.3 and NOT using ASIO drivers with
RMAA.

I get better results with Version 5 than Version 6, but still get
flaky results and sometimes it just crashes. As far as I know, only
the 'paid' version can use ASIO drivers.

Is there any reason, perhaps the way RMAA performs its frequency
response analysis, that should make it look like the high end rolls
off substantially when it's quite flat when testing with a sine wave?

[Arny Krueger]

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message


Is there any reason, perhaps the way RMAA performs its
frequency response analysis, that should make it look
like the high end rolls off substantially when it's quite
flat when testing with a sine wave?

I've double-checked the rightmark with other tests, and its FR results are
right on. It does portray frequency response with an expanded vertical scale
that can make things look dire, when they are actually pretty good.

Also, the frequency response of a modern audio interface is generally better
than most analog test equipment.

What are you using in the way of test equipment?

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 25, 5:43 am, Eeyore
wrote:

Are you sure you don't have a dodgy device driver loaded somewhere ?

The one thing that I have in common with all the computers (all
laptops) that I've tried RightMark on is that they all have the
Digigram VX Pocket driver installed. I've been tempted to try
uninstalling that on the "shop" computer since I almost never use the
Digigram card in that one other than to use RightMark, which doesn't
work worth a damn with that card either. I've been reluctant to
uninstall that because it seems that whenever I re-install it, it
takes me a week of fooling around to find all the right settings
again.

I probably should, though, since I've been having trouble getting a
CEntrance MicPort to work correctly as well. Maybe I'll do that this
morning rather than make money writing the article I'm supposed to
have in by the end of the month.

I haven't yet tried uninstalling or disabling the internal sound
hardware. That's the only thing that does work with RightMark.



I'd check it with a fresh plain vanilla install of XP. Can you do that ?

Graham

[Steve L.]

"Arny Krueger" wrote in news:9aadnfvmj6t-
:

Not necessary

What's it gonna hurt to try

[Arny Krueger]

"Steve L." wrote in message
. 71
"Arny Krueger" wrote in
news:9aadnfvmj6t- :

Not necessary

What's it gonna hurt to try

Time spent not iterating towards the proper solution.

[Steve L.]

"Arny Krueger" wrote in
:

Time spent

even if it doesn't resovle the problem .. 5 minutes is
about how long it takes to get back where he was.

I can't say i know a lot about the inner workings of drivers and thier
conflicts but i can say i've resovled issues with other soundcards residing
on the same computer.

[Richard Crowley]

"Mike Rivers" wrote ...
Eeyore wrote:
Are you sure you don't have a dodgy device driver loaded somewhere ?

The one thing that I have in common with all the computers (all
laptops) that I've tried RightMark on is that they all have the
Digigram VX Pocket driver installed. I've been tempted to try
uninstalling that on the "shop" computer since I almost never use the
Digigram card in that one other than to use RightMark, which doesn't
work worth a damn with that card either. I've been reluctant to
uninstall that because it seems that whenever I re-install it, it
takes me a week of fooling around to find all the right settings
again.

"Digigram" is my definition of "dodgy". I've given up on them.

I'd check it with a fresh plain vanilla install of XP. Can you do
that ?

Some people wipe the boot drive and start fresh once a
year. It is like the computer version of "spring cleaning".
It's not difficult to install a fresh copy of XP. What is
difficult is preserving whatever data, settings, apps when
you do it.

When I got a new laptop at the office I refused to use their
"backup-restore" process because I wasnted to start fresh
without a load of legacy trash. I copied the boot drive to
my own external disc and I'm only retrieving misc files from
it as I need them. The scheme works well for me.

[Laurence Payne[_2_]]

On Tue, 25 Mar 2008 06:27:25 -0700, "Richard Crowley"
wrote:

Some people wipe the boot drive and start fresh once a
year. It is like the computer version of "spring cleaning".
It's not difficult to install a fresh copy of XP. What is
difficult is preserving whatever data, settings, apps when
you do it.

Ghost is your friend. You should have a Ghost image saved of a clean
XP setup. Plus a rolling backup of your current setup. If you have
to restore to the basic installation, all your data files are
available from the latest image. You may also want to back up
important data at another location.

Now that huge external hard drives are cheap, there's no excuse :-)

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 25, 8:09 am, "Arny Krueger" wrote:

Not necessary. As I wrote Mike, I Rightmarked a UCA 202 with this computer
I'm typing on.

Well, it runs, sort of, but like I said, the frequency response curve
is way off what the actual frequency response is. What I've always
found is that setting the level is very critical in RMAA. It complains
if it's too low, it complains if it's too high, and I can't seem to
satisfy it. The only control for setting level when looped back is the
playback volume on the Windows mixer. I don't get any sliders when
selecting Recording properties. When the level is high enough so that
the test will run, the interchannel crosstalk light on the RightMark
level setting screen keeps going on and off.

I get essentially the same behavior on two different computers.

I wasted about two hours on it this morning. Uninstalled the Digigram
driver and that didn't help RightMark, and as usual, it took me way to
long to get the VX Pocket card working correctly again. It's
functional now, but still not working correctly. I think some days you
just need a brand new computer, and some days the old ones work just
fine.

I get so weary of fooling with computers, and that's all it it ever is
is "fooling." I rarely seem to learn anything that I can apply again.

I don't really need this Behringer interface if it's not going to let
me use the computer with RightMark as a test instrument, so an RMA for
the UCA is probably going to be on its way.

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 25, 9:10 am, "Steve L." wrote:

even if it doesn't resovle the problem .. 5 minutes is
about how long it takes to get back where he was.

Maybe for you and the gear you have. I fooled around with the Digigram
re-install for a couple of hours.

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 25, 9:27 am, "Richard Crowley" wrote:

"Digigram" is my definition of "dodgy". I've given up on them.

I don't think that there's been a computer device made that someone
won't say that about if a user reports trouble. I've found nothing
"dodgy" about my Digigram VX Pocket . . well not until today.

Some people wipe the boot drive and start fresh once a
year. It is like the computer version of "spring cleaning".
It's not difficult to install a fresh copy of XP. What is
difficult is preserving whatever data, settings, apps when
you do it.

This is why I don't do that. The only thing that I have to install
from is the "restoration CD" that came with the computer, so the first
step after doing that installation would be to clean off all the junk
(a six year old version of AOL, for instance), then do all the Windows
updates, and install all the applications. No thanks. If the computer
ever gets that far out of kilter, it'll be time to forget about ever
putting it back like it was.

[Steve L.]

Mike Rivers wrote in news:f7f5c8a2-0c03-4d3d-a800-
:

On Mar 25, 9:10 am, "Steve L." wrote:

even if it doesn't resovle the problem .. 5 minutes is
about how long it takes to get back where he was.

Maybe for you and the gear you have. I fooled around with the Digigram
re-install for a couple of hours.



ah .. i had figured you had a sound card configured already ..
It only takes about as long to reboot your computer to turn off
the onboard sound in the BIOS .
as you were

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 25, 12:44 pm, "Steve L." wrote:

ah .. i had figured you had a sound card configured already ..
It only takes about as long to reboot your computer to turn off
the onboard sound in the BIOS .

Laptops don't have very much that you can disable in the BIOS. I could
disable it in the Windows Device Mangler, but that's too easy. Already
tried that.

[Paul Stamler]

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
...

The one thing that I have in common with all the computers (all
laptops) that I've tried RightMark on is that they all have the
Digigram VX Pocket driver installed. I've been tempted to try
uninstalling that on the "shop" computer since I almost never use the
Digigram card in that one other than to use RightMark, which doesn't
work worth a damn with that card either. I've been reluctant to
uninstall that because it seems that whenever I re-install it, it
takes me a week of fooling around to find all the right settings
again.

Write them down.

Peace,
Paul

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 25, 1:05 pm, "Paul Stamler" wrote:

Write them down.

That doesn't help until you get past the point where the mixer stops
saying "No Digigram device or driver installed" even though I can
record and play back with it.
Maybe that's what Steve considers "dodgy."

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 25, 12:32 pm, Mike Rivers (that's me!)
wrote:

When the level is high enough so that
the test will run, the interchannel crosstalk light on the RightMark
level setting screen keeps going on and off.

I should add that in a crosstalk measurement made by recording with a
signal on one channel and a shorting plug in the other channel's input
connector, the crosstalk on playback was rather high, with the
"unrecorded" channel measuring about 45 dB lower than the recorded
channel, at 200 Hz and 10 kHz. Spec is -77 dB or so at 1 kHz. So maybe
this one is broken, but that wouldn't explain the poor frequency
response that RMAA shows.

[Arny Krueger]

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message

On Mar 25, 12:32 pm, Mike Rivers
(that's me!) wrote:

When the level is high enough so that
the test will run, the interchannel crosstalk light on
the RightMark level setting screen keeps going on and
off.

I should add that in a crosstalk measurement made by
recording with a signal on one channel and a shorting
plug in the other channel's input connector, the
crosstalk on playback was rather high, with the
"unrecorded" channel measuring about 45 dB lower than the
recorded channel, at 200 Hz and 10 kHz. Spec is -77 dB or
so at 1 kHz. So maybe this one is broken, but that
wouldn't explain the poor frequency response that RMAA
shows.

Umm, is there a possibility that this laptop only has a mono input? I know
a lot of laptops do.

[Richard Crowley]

"Mike Rivers" wrote...
"Richard Crowley" wrote:
"Digigram" is my definition of "dodgy". I've given up on them.

I don't think that there's been a computer device made that someone
won't say that about if a user reports trouble. I've found nothing
"dodgy" about my Digigram VX Pocket . . well not until today.

Maybe I should go back and try it again. They must have
made some improvement in the drivers since I last tried it.
OTOH, that fragile connector on the PCMCIA card and
the break-out cable were always problematic. Want a
spare?

Some people wipe the boot drive and start fresh once a
year. It is like the computer version of "spring cleaning".
It's not difficult to install a fresh copy of XP. What is
difficult is preserving whatever data, settings, apps when
you do it.

This is why I don't do that. The only thing that I have to install
from is the "restoration CD" that came with the computer, so the first
step after doing that installation would be to clean off all the junk
(a six year old version of AOL, for instance), then do all the Windows
updates, and install all the applications. No thanks. If the computer
ever gets that far out of kilter, it'll be time to forget about ever
putting it back like it was.

As Mr. Payne observed, large external drives are so cheap
there is no pracical excuse for not backing up all that stuff
anyway (just as a hedge against hard drive failure, etc.)

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 25, 2:38 pm, "Arny Krueger" wrote:

Umm, is there a possibility that this laptop only has a mono input? I know
a lot of laptops do.

The laptop does indeed have a mono input for its built-in audio
hardware, but that wasn't what tested poorly. It tests pretty good,
actually. The UCA-202 as you know, has stereo in and out and that's
what behaves oddly with RightMark..

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 25, 3:43 pm, "Richard Crowley" wrote:

OTOH, that fragile connector on the PCMCIA card and
the break-out cable were always problematic. Want a
spare?

I haven't broken mine yet but it doesn't fit as snugly as it useter.
I'd love a spare. The fact that most of the time the laptop is on a
shelf and the cable is secured to the shelf with those DB-25ish screws
that come with it, so it doesn't get a lot of hard use. I commented to
Digigram that I thought that would be the first thing to go, and they
said, yes, they've sold a good number of replacements. But many PCMCIA
cards are like that, at least until they figured out that people would
put up with a lump on the end.

As Mr. Payne observed, large external drives are so cheap
there is no pracical excuse for not backing up all that stuff
anyway (just as a hedge against hard drive failure, etc.)

I do that occasionally - not daily, but at least monthly, and things
that I know I'll need are usually copied to another computer, plus I
keep a box of CDs of all the software that I've downloaded. Backup
isn't a problem. But finding a really clean point that you can go back
to sometimes is.

Still, this isn't about backup, it's about why RightMark won't work
with any of my interfaces on any of my computers.

Another issue is why Windows Service Pack 2 won't completely install
(and therefore, I believe undoes everything it managed to cram down
the computer's throat) on the older of these two laptops. Maybe
there's something in (or missing from) the Dell version of Windows
that's keeping the update from running to completion. Or maybe it's
simply that I waited too long before trying to update to SP2 (I wanted
all of that Firewire mess to go away since Firewire audio was working
fine) and it's missing a piece that it needs to update to SP2.

[Laurence Payne[_2_]]

On Tue, 25 Mar 2008 13:15:17 -0700 (PDT), Mike Rivers
wrote:


Another issue is why Windows Service Pack 2 won't completely install
(and therefore, I believe undoes everything it managed to cram down
the computer's throat) on the older of these two laptops. Maybe
there's something in (or missing from) the Dell version of Windows
that's keeping the update from running to completion. Or maybe it's
simply that I waited too long before trying to update to SP2 (I wanted
all of that Firewire mess to go away since Firewire audio was working
fine) and it's missing a piece that it needs to update to SP2.

Yeah. Sometimes routine maintance cuts it. But sometimes you just
have to strip it all down, clean everything and put it together again.
Rather like hardware :-)

[Arny Krueger]

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message

On Mar 25, 2:38 pm, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

Umm, is there a possibility that this laptop only has a
mono input? I know a lot of laptops do.

The laptop does indeed have a mono input for its built-in
audio hardware, but that wasn't what tested poorly. It
tests pretty good, actually. The UCA-202 as you know, has
stereo in and out and that's what behaves oddly with
RightMark..

How do your results compare with this?

http://www.birotechnology.com/soundc..._line-line.htm

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 25, 5:19 pm, "Arny Krueger" wrote:

How do your results compare with this?

OK, I'll take that challenge:

http://tinyurl.com/368zqz
http://tinyurl.com/32v5x6

Understand that this is bogus and doesn't represent the actual
performance of the interface. The actual frequency response is within
a couple of tenths of a dB over the range. I measured crosstalk to be
a bit worse than RMMA, and slightly higher THD at selected frequencies
between 100 Hz and 10 kHz. It doesn't even sound half bad when used to
record music (!).

I'm not complaining about the performance of the UCA202, I'm
complaining about how RMMA measures it.

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 25, 4:28 pm, Laurence Payne wrote:

Yeah. Sometimes routine maintance cuts it. But sometimes you just
have to strip it all down, clean everything and put it together again.
Rather like hardware :-)

Yeah, but if this was a car, I could replace the spark plugs and make
it run better, then replace the brake pads and make it stop better.
But I don't have to take the whole car completely apart in one shot.

[Arny Krueger]

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message

On Mar 25, 5:19 pm, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

How do your results compare with this?

OK, I'll take that challenge:

http://tinyurl.com/368zqz
http://tinyurl.com/32v5x6


ouch!

Understand that this is bogus and doesn't represent the
actual performance of the interface.

No doubt, its bogus.

http://www.birotechnology.com/soundc..._line-line.htm

is pretty much the same as what I get.

The actual frequency
response is within a couple of tenths of a dB over the
range.

As the report I'm citing shows.

I measured crosstalk to be a bit worse than RMMA,
and slightly higher THD at selected frequencies between
100 Hz and 10 kHz. It doesn't even sound half bad when
used to record music (!).

There's something very funny going on with that computer.

I'm not complaining about the performance of the UCA202,

The FR of the UCA202 is pretty much beyond reproach with a caveat. If you
test it as an ADC with a wideband source, it has response up to a few KHz
*above* the Nyquist frequency. IOW, its anti-aliasing has been compromised
to obtain in-band smoothness.

I'm complaining about how RMMA measures it.

Agreed.

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 25, 8:06 am, "Arny Krueger" wrote:

IME, the Behringer UCA 202 works fine with the current Rightmark program.

Maybe it's just the air in here, given that nothing I have seems to
work correctly with the program.

[Mike Rivers]

Could I just be stoopid and doing something fundamentally wrong? I'm
connecting the left output of the box to the left input, and the right
output to the right input. There doesn't seem to be a lot more than
that to the instructions.

I always have a very difficult time setting the level. It's like
there's a feedback loop there (well, there is, isnt there?) where I
get to a certain point where it's still telling me that the level is
too low, about -4 or -5 dB (and not the same on both channels - they
jump around a bit) and then the slightest nudge of the level control
on the Windows mixer, either record or playback, shoots it up so that
Rightmark's meters are hitting the pin and it's telling me to reduce
the level. It's like this with any interface that I connect.

I don't see any settings that I could use to change anything.

[Paul Stamler]

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message
...
On Mar 25, 4:28 pm, Laurence Payne wrote:

Yeah. Sometimes routine maintance cuts it. But sometimes you just
have to strip it all down, clean everything and put it together again.
Rather like hardware :-)

Yeah, but if this was a car, I could replace the spark plugs and make
it run better, then replace the brake pads and make it stop better.
But I don't have to take the whole car completely apart in one shot.

You never owned a Ford Escort, did you?

Peace,
Paul

[Arny Krueger]

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message


Could I just be stoopid and doing something fundamentally
wrong? I'm connecting the left output of the box to the
left input, and the right output to the right input.
There doesn't seem to be a lot more than that to the
instructions.

Worked for me!

I always have a very difficult time setting the level.
It's like there's a feedback loop there (well, there is,
isnt there?) where I get to a certain point where it's
still telling me that the level is too low, about -4 or
-5 dB (and not the same on both channels - they jump
around a bit) and then the slightest nudge of the level
control on the Windows mixer, either record or playback,
shoots it up so that Rightmark's meters are hitting the
pin and it's telling me to reduce the level. It's like
this with any interface that I connect.

That does look like feedback, and feedback can do a number on the FR of an
audio interface.

There could be some piece of software in there that is looping around the
audio interface's driver. Total Recorder?

I don't see any settings that I could use to change anything.

Make sure that only the minimum inputs and outputs are enabled and/or turned
up in the Windows mixer.

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 26, 7:48 am, "Arny Krueger" wrote:

There could be some piece of software in there that is looping around the
audio interface's driver. Total Recorder?

Well, I do have Total Recorder installed. That's one of the selectable
devices in RightMark's pulldown menu. I thought this might have been a
good clue, but it hasn't helped.

I don't fully understand the meaning of the "Use only default devices"
check box in the Windows Sounds/Audio window, but when I opened it up,
it had Total Recorder set as the default record and playback device,
and that "use only" box was checked. I tried every combination of
checking the box and unchecking it, and setting the UCA202 (USB Audio
CODEC) or something else as the Windows default device, and still get
the same results with RightMark.

Once again, I confirmed that using the built-in SigmaTel Audio device,
I get reasonably good results with RightMark. I'm sure that the UCA202
isn't broken, it must be a Windows setup problem or operator error.

Isn't there anyone in the DC area who uses RightMark who can show me
that it really works?

[Arny Krueger]

"Mike Rivers" wrote in message

On Mar 26, 7:48 am, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

There could be some piece of software in there that is
looping around the audio interface's driver. Total
Recorder?

Well, I do have Total Recorder installed. That's one of
the selectable devices in RightMark's pulldown menu. I
thought this might have been a good clue, but it hasn't
helped.

I don't fully understand the meaning of the "Use only
default devices" check box in the Windows Sounds/Audio
window, but when I opened it up, it had Total Recorder
set as the default record and playback device, and that
"use only" box was checked. I tried every combination of
checking the box and unchecking it, and setting the
UCA202 (USB Audio CODEC) or something else as the Windows
default device, and still get the same results with
RightMark.

Checking and unchecking that box in the control panel shouldn't affect the
Rightmark program, because the Rightmark program bypasses the preferred
sound device with its device selection menu.

Whatever is screwing you up, is more profound than that.

Once again, I confirmed that using the built-in SigmaTel
Audio device, I get reasonably good results with
RightMark.

Somehow the onboard sound device is immune to whatever is causing the
feedback. It is possible that its device driver or some related component is
somehow part of the problem. Since disabling the onboard device does not
affect the problem, the problem is proabably not directly related to the
device driver, but perhaps some control program that is installed with the
device driver.

I'm sure that the UCA202 isn't broken, it must
be a Windows setup problem or operator error.

The UCA 202 is one of those devices that is almost too dumb to be broken in
as sophistcated way as we see happening here. It's device driver is the one
for USB devices that comes with Windows, right?

BTW, is this a SP2 XP system?

Isn't there anyone in the DC area who uses RightMark who
can show me that it really works?

At this time my best guess is that there is some piece of software or device
driver installed on your computer, that is mucking up the works. I am very
surprised that whatever this software is, it is capable of subverting the
device selection feature of the Rightmark program.

My next approach would be to uninstall everything that is related to sound
devices in the add/remove programs in the control panel. I would then obtain
the latest-greatest driver for your onboard sound device, and update it.

When installing the new device driver, I would uninstall the old one, reboot
the machine, and then be careful to install just the device driver, and if
possible avoid installing any other utilities that may have come with it.

The actual audio interface device drivers are usually in a folder called
"WDM" or some such. Getting a WDM folder installed may require first
installing the device driver with a SETUP program, and then uninstalling the
driver package with the control panel, and then reinstalling it by rebooting
the machine and pointing the windows device driver installer at the WDM
folder that the Setup program created.

[Richard Crowley]

"Mike Rivers" wrote ...
Well, I do have Total Recorder installed. That's one of the selectable
devices in RightMark's pulldown menu. I thought this might have been a
good clue, but it hasn't helped.

I've never seen any problem with Total Recorder, but it
is easy enough to remove to eliminate it as the cause of
your symptoms.

[Mike Rivers]

On Mar 26, 10:11 am, "Arny Krueger" wrote:
The UCA 202 is one of those devices that is almost too dumb to be broken in
as sophistcated way as we see happening here.

That's what I was hoping, and why I decided to give it a try.

It's device driver is the one
for USB devices that comes with Windows, right?

Yes, there's no separate driver installation. Plugging it in for the
first time comes up with the "Found New Hardware" popup, and Windows
does its thing.

BTW, is this a SP2 XP system?

One of the two laptops is. The one I've been doing most of the testing
on is the one that's running SP1 and refuses to complete the
installation of SP2 both on-line and when I download the installer
file and run it locally. I've forgotten what the excuse it gives is, I
recall something like 'missing components'. However, I have the same
results with another laptop computer that's up to date with SP2 and
whatever other updates Windows thinks it needs. There are some
differences between what the two computers have installed, but most of
their audio setups are identical.

At this time my best guess is that there is some piece of software or device
driver installed on your computer, that is mucking up the works. I am very
surprised that whatever this software is, it is capable of subverting the
device selection feature of the Rightmark program.

Well, that's the problem - how to find it. I just don't know any way
to find such a problem, only to hopefully eliminate it by removing
everything and rebuilding from scratch, testing RMMA along the way to
find out what makes it stop working. Chances are pretty good that I'll
find nothing.

My next approach would be to uninstall everything that is related to sound
devices in the add/remove programs in the control panel. I would then obtain
the latest-greatest driver for your onboard sound device, and update it.

This is an old Dell, and they aren't very good about latest greatest
drivers. I probably have it, but I'll see if there's anything
available on the web site. But do you think that it's the SigmaTel
driver that's screwing up RightMark when running with any other audio
device?

Well, I think I just found the problem.

The itty bitty Monitor switch was on, and that was apparently what was
causing the feedback. Turning it off gave me pretty much the expected
results, in fact, better than what I had measured with real test
equipment. But by sticking a mixer channel in line, I'm able to see
changes in the frequency response when I diddle the equalizer
controls, and that indicates to me that it's not lying.

It's still very fussy about level setting and the crosstalk indicator
flashes a lot when setting the level, but it's usable. I don't have a
handle on using it with the Digigram card yet though. It has its own
driver (yup, I have the latest though that doesn't seem to affect
anything) and its own mixer control panel. When I mute the Monitor
slider on that one, the RightMark signal goes away entirely even
though the Digigram meters (on its mixer) still show input and output.
And with the monitor switched on, RightMark behaves like the
Behringer, appearing to be in a feedback state that approaches unity
gain when close to the level at which the program likes to work.

So I guess I have at least partial success, and as I suspected, the
problem wasn't with the computer or the interface, but with the human
attached to the buttons.

Thanks for hanging in and not leaving me with an excuse to give up too
soon.

I still don't have a handle on getting it to work