"Daniel" wrote in message .ca...
Hi,

I was just wondering if there are any "transformers" that can "transform" my
600 ohm headphones to a lower ohm setting so that I don't have to use an
amplifier ?

Thanks,

Daniel

I'm gonna guess that you want to use the headphone jack on a piece of
equipment like a CD burner, but have found that the feed just doesn't
have enough power for your 600 ohm phones? So you would like to
somehow lower the impedance of the headphones instead of using a
separate headphone amp to supply the power necessary to drive your
existing cans? Well, I don't have an answer for you, but I'm sure
some of the more techinially capable folks will. But I do want to
comment on this issue, because I'm starting to run into this situation
and it ****es me off.

I can't imagine that manufacturers save more than a dollar or so by
installing a wimpy headphone amp in a piece of pro audio gear (instead
of a proper headphone amplifier that can easily drive a 600 ohm load.)
I don't care how many millions of cheap low impedance headphones are
sold every day, the fact remains that there are still countless
studios using 600 ohm headphones from Beyer, AKG and other brands.
Why would the manufacturer of a piece of supposedly "pro" audio gear
decide to save 50 cents by using a cheap headphone amp design that
can't power these headphones? It would almost make sense if the cheap
outboard gear included the useless "headphone amps" and real pro gear
always included decent amps. But it seems totally random; a cheap
mass market CD burner has enough power to drive a 600 ohm phones to
ear-bleed levels while a $5,000 piece of highly desirable "boutique"
gear has one of the useless amps that needs to be turned up to 11 to
get any sound out of it!!! Message to all equipment manufacturers:
this is a stupid way to save a few cents, if you are gonna stick a
hole on the front of your gear, please include a decent headphone amp.

rant over

steve

In article ,
(hollywood_steve) wrote:

rant over

Nice rant. I couldn't agree more about spoiling a ship for a ha'pence of
tar.

Only one point though: it is the 8 ohm headphones that are more difficult
to drive, not the 600 ohms ones.

"Daniel" wrote in message
. ca...

I was just wondering if there are any "transformers" that can "transform"
my
600 ohm headphones to a lower ohm setting so that I don't have to use an
amplifier ?

You probably want to restate your problem to be a request for a transformer
that would transform 300-600 ohm headphones to 32 ohms, given that these are
more typical real world numbers for practical applications.

You need 2 transformers (1 per channel) with an approximate 3:1 turns ratio.

The closest high quality transformer I could find is this one:

http://www.lundahl.se/pdfs/datash/1517.pdf

with the following wiring:

Input to transformer - pins 7 + 12 connected together (+) and pins 8 and 11
connected together (-).

Output from transformer - pin 6 (+) and pin 2 (-) with pin 3 connected to
pin 6.

http://hometown.aol.com/kevinc927/my...business1.html is the US
distributor, based on their pricing for existing models figure on $120+ for
a pair of 1517 transformers...

If it works, this will give you less than a 10 dB volume increase which is
less than the perception of "twice as loud". IOW, an expensive solution with
limited benefits.

Daniel wrote:

I was just wondering if there are any "transformers" that can "transform" my
600 ohm headphones to a lower ohm setting so that I don't have to use an
amplifier ?

Sure, but doing it right will cost you more than an amplifier. I think Edcor
makes some autotransformers for 70V PA system use that will take 600 ohm
inputs down to 50.

Cheaper and easier to use an amp that can drive them properly, or a pair
of headphones designed for what you're running.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

The problem is not that the amps are too crappy to drive 600 ohms -- as someone
pointed out, it's easier to drive higher impedances. The problem is that recent
headphone amps are designed with less voltage gain, to avoid blowing out
customers' headphones or customers' ears when they use the majority of
contemporary phones, which are low-impedance, high voltage sensitivity. It's no
more expensive to make a higher-gain amp -- just a matter of changing a
resistor or two -- but the manufacturers are, I think, playing the percentages,
and more people have the low-Z high-sensitivity cans.

Peace,
Paul

hollywood_steve wrote:
"Daniel" wrote in message
.ca...
Hi,

I was just wondering if there are any "transformers" that can
"transform" my 600 ohm headphones to a lower ohm setting so that I
don't have to use an amplifier ?

Thanks,

Daniel

I'm gonna guess that you want to use the headphone jack on a piece of
equipment like a CD burner, but have found that the feed just doesn't
have enough power for your 600 ohm phones? So you would like to
somehow lower the impedance of the headphones instead of using a
separate headphone amp to supply the power necessary to drive your
existing cans? Well, I don't have an answer for you, but I'm sure
some of the more techinially capable folks will. But I do want to
comment on this issue, because I'm starting to run into this situation
and it ****es me off.

I can't imagine that manufacturers save more than a dollar or so by
installing a wimpy headphone amp in a piece of pro audio gear (instead
of a proper headphone amplifier that can easily drive a 600 ohm load.)
I don't care how many millions of cheap low impedance headphones are
sold every day, the fact remains that there are still countless
studios using 600 ohm headphones from Beyer, AKG and other brands.
Why would the manufacturer of a piece of supposedly "pro" audio gear
decide to save 50 cents by using a cheap headphone amp design that
can't power these headphones? It would almost make sense if the cheap
outboard gear included the useless "headphone amps" and real pro gear
always included decent amps. But it seems totally random; a cheap
mass market CD burner has enough power to drive a 600 ohm phones to
ear-bleed levels while a $5,000 piece of highly desirable "boutique"
gear has one of the useless amps that needs to be turned up to 11 to
get any sound out of it!!! Message to all equipment manufacturers:
this is a stupid way to save a few cents, if you are gonna stick a
hole on the front of your gear, please include a decent headphone amp.

Yeah, that pretty much sums it up, Steve. It's a shame my AKG's 240M 600ohm
cans, which are great headphones, can't be "driven" properly by most
electronics' amplifiers today.

Daniel


rant over

steve

Arny Krueger wrote:
"Daniel" wrote in message
. ca...

I was just wondering if there are any "transformers" that can
"transform" my 600 ohm headphones to a lower ohm setting so that I
don't have to use an amplifier ?

You probably want to restate your problem to be a request for a
transformer that would transform 300-600 ohm headphones to 32 ohms,
given that these are more typical real world numbers for practical
applications.

You need 2 transformers (1 per channel) with an approximate 3:1 turns
ratio.

The closest high quality transformer I could find is this one:

http://www.lundahl.se/pdfs/datash/1517.pdf

with the following wiring:

Input to transformer - pins 7 + 12 connected together (+) and pins 8
and 11 connected together (-).

Output from transformer - pin 6 (+) and pin 2 (-) with pin 3
connected to pin 6.

http://hometown.aol.com/kevinc927/my...business1.html is the US
distributor, based on their pricing for existing models figure on
$120+ for a pair of 1517 transformers...

If it works, this will give you less than a 10 dB volume increase
which is less than the perception of "twice as loud". IOW, an
expensive solution with limited benefits.

Right, and I guess I won't go that route I'll have to settle for a
seperate amplifier which will come out cheaper, especially if I buy used.

Thanks,

Daniel

Scott Dorsey wrote:
Daniel wrote:

I was just wondering if there are any "transformers" that can
"transform" my 600 ohm headphones to a lower ohm setting so that I
don't have to use an amplifier ?

Sure, but doing it right will cost you more than an amplifier. I
think Edcor makes some autotransformers for 70V PA system use that
will take 600 ohm inputs down to 50.

Cheaper and easier to use an amp that can drive them properly, or a
pair of headphones designed for what you're running.
--scott

I agree. Thanks )

Daniel

P Stamler wrote:
The problem is not that the amps are too crappy to drive 600 ohms --
as someone pointed out, it's easier to drive higher impedances. The
problem is that recent headphone amps are designed with less voltage
gain, to avoid blowing out customers' headphones or customers' ears
when they use the majority of contemporary phones, which are
low-impedance, high voltage sensitivity. It's no more expensive to
make a higher-gain amp -- just a matter of changing a resistor or two
-- but the manufacturers are, I think, playing the percentages, and
more people have the low-Z high-sensitivity cans.

Peace,
Paul

Thanks

Daniel

Daniel wrote:

Well, if you mean that 8ohm headphones distort faster than 600ohm ones, then
yes, I agree BUT fact is that it is much harder to power 600ohm cans than it
is 8ohm ones.

Not from a tube output stage, which can easily supply wide voltage swings
but not much current.

And that is why 600 ohm headphones were the standard for so many years.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."