Tstungo wrote:

OK, this has probably been asked a thousand times before..I'm sorry!

I have Fruity Loops and can build up nice loops then bring them in to Cool
Edit, either as a wav or in individual blocks. I can fiddle about here and
there to do a few clever things, but to get the complexity of beats I'm
after I haven't a clue what's the quickest way.

There must a way to piece it all together, as drum n bass appeared years
ago (ie with older technology) - and the programming's incredible.

I'm into more dowtempo beats but I'd still like to move up a notch with
the programming of drums.

Any suggestions?

Many thanks,

Tom, High Wycombe, UK.

After you've cut up the beats and made some new ones in cool edit, bounce it
to a a new track and keep on editing the new one.. Bounce that to a new
track and reverse it. Make another copy to a new track and time stretch it
200%. Same again but 50%. Same again, but reversed, pitchshifted down an
octave. Same again, but through a really feedbacky in-time delay.. etc etc..

Now you should have a stack of tracks, all with interesting stuff going on.
Mute all the parts, and start unmuting small sections of each one.

When you are happy with it, bounce the lot to a new track.

The trick is to make a 'tune' out of all the seperate cut up beats. It has
to make musical sense, so the listner follows the pattern of the beats like
a melody. As there is often not much else going on, the drums are kind of
like a vocal line, up front and interesting, rather than supplying a basic
rhythm.

Don't work on just a single bar long loop, work over 32 bars or so,
otherwise it will sound static and repetative, with no flow.

There are as many short cuts to doing it well as there are to writing a
really good melody.

The classic d'n'b setup is probably an Atari ST+AKAI S950+a midi keyboard.
Being able to play in the chopped up beats live from the keys and edit the
midi afterwards is more instantly rewarding than mousing about for hours...
It's also easier to do 64th or 128th notes for those buzzy fills with midi
than editing audio, and you can program pitch bend+mod in ways that are a
pain to replicate in an audio editor.

You might want to have a look at apps like Ableton live as well, which gets
rid of a lot of the leg work involved in beat matching etc..

"brand.smith" wrote in message
news:CD5Qa.48278$ye4.36056@sccrnsc01...
Not to bragg but i get lots of compliments on my drum programming. one
thing that helps to get a more realistic sound (if that's what you're
going
for) is to know the mechanics of how drums are played... for instance,
don't
program a snare hit, hi-hat, and 2 cymbals on the same beat because it's
not
physically possible.
also when drummers play they vary the strength of their hits... if you
have
a beat that has 16th notes on the ride, then make the hits which fall on
the
downbeats(or upbeats, whichever it calls for) louder, but in an
unpredictable way , such as 7,5,7,6,7,5,8,6,7,4,7,6,7,5,6,5.
another trick i use is to manually vary the tempo via the drum machine
tempo
knob/slider as it records to tape... not wild changes, but very subtle
changes both above and below the desired tempo.

by combining all of these techniques (plus a few I could tell you about,
but
would then have to kill you) i've actually gotten compliments on my
"drumming" from other drummers... I, of course, tell them it's not me.

listen to the "fruit of my drum programming labor" he
http://artists.mp3s.com/artist_song/2575/2575860.html


Thats not a fricken live drummer? You're kidding! What the hell did you
program that in and whered you get your samples?

Paul




"Musikboy" wrote in message
.. .
In article ,
philicorda wrote:

Tstungo wrote:

OK, this has probably been asked a thousand times before..I'm sorry!

I have Fruity Loops and can build up nice loops then bring them in
to
Cool
Edit, either as a wav or in individual blocks. I can fiddle about
here
and
there to do a few clever things, but to get the complexity of beats
I'm
after I haven't a clue what's the quickest way.

There must a way to piece it all together, as drum n bass appeared
years
ago (ie with older technology) - and the programming's incredible.

I'm into more dowtempo beats but I'd still like to move up a notch
with
the programming of drums.

Any suggestions?

Many thanks,

Tom, High Wycombe, UK.

..
MPC 2000XL or some sort of an mpc. use the repeat button and just hold
down the drum you want that superfast fill played by. i think there's a
repeat button on the roand stuff as well (they had some electronic
beatboxes out a few years ago)

nope, just an alesis sr-16B drum machine.
another tip:
my drum machine has 18 pads on it so I set up two pads for each drum and
have the two pads slightly detuned from each other... if you'll notice when
a drummer hits a drum the pitch can vary depending on how hard the drum is
struck.


"Paul Beauchamp" wrote in message
...

"brand.smith" wrote in message
news:CD5Qa.48278$ye4.36056@sccrnsc01...
Not to bragg but i get lots of compliments on my drum programming. one
thing that helps to get a more realistic sound (if that's what you're
going
for) is to know the mechanics of how drums are played... for instance,
don't
program a snare hit, hi-hat, and 2 cymbals on the same beat because it's
not
physically possible.
also when drummers play they vary the strength of their hits... if you
have
a beat that has 16th notes on the ride, then make the hits which fall on
the
downbeats(or upbeats, whichever it calls for) louder, but in an
unpredictable way , such as 7,5,7,6,7,5,8,6,7,4,7,6,7,5,6,5.
another trick i use is to manually vary the tempo via the drum machine
tempo
knob/slider as it records to tape... not wild changes, but very subtle
changes both above and below the desired tempo.

by combining all of these techniques (plus a few I could tell you about,
but
would then have to kill you) i've actually gotten compliments on my
"drumming" from other drummers... I, of course, tell them it's not me.

listen to the "fruit of my drum programming labor" he
http://artists.mp3s.com/artist_song/2575/2575860.html


Thats not a fricken live drummer? You're kidding! What the hell did you
program that in and whered you get your samples?

Paul




"Musikboy" wrote in message
.. .
In article ,
philicorda wrote:

Tstungo wrote:

OK, this has probably been asked a thousand times before..I'm
sorry!

I have Fruity Loops and can build up nice loops then bring them in
to
Cool
Edit, either as a wav or in individual blocks. I can fiddle about
here
and
there to do a few clever things, but to get the complexity of
beats
I'm
after I haven't a clue what's the quickest way.

There must a way to piece it all together, as drum n bass appeared
years
ago (ie with older technology) - and the programming's incredible.

I'm into more dowtempo beats but I'd still like to move up a notch
with
the programming of drums.

Any suggestions?

Many thanks,

Tom, High Wycombe, UK.

..
MPC 2000XL or some sort of an mpc. use the repeat button and just hold
down the drum you want that superfast fill played by. i think there's
a
repeat button on the roand stuff as well (they had some electronic
beatboxes out a few years ago)

another trick i use can be heard on this song:
http://artists.mp3s.com/artist_song/3321/3321708.html
the middle of the song has a part where the cymbals are rode for a long
time. the cymbals are definately the weak point of my drum machines sound,
so i sent only the cymbals out the drum machines AUX out to record them on a
separate track from the rest of the drums... then, on the part in question,
i added some subtle flange to the cymbal track to make it sound less
constant.

p.s.- we are looking for a REAL drummer, if anyone is near Indy and
interested, please contact me.


"Paul Beauchamp" wrote in message
...

"brand.smith" wrote in message
news:CD5Qa.48278$ye4.36056@sccrnsc01...
Not to bragg but i get lots of compliments on my drum programming. one
thing that helps to get a more realistic sound (if that's what you're
going
for) is to know the mechanics of how drums are played... for instance,
don't
program a snare hit, hi-hat, and 2 cymbals on the same beat because it's
not
physically possible.
also when drummers play they vary the strength of their hits... if you
have
a beat that has 16th notes on the ride, then make the hits which fall on
the
downbeats(or upbeats, whichever it calls for) louder, but in an
unpredictable way , such as 7,5,7,6,7,5,8,6,7,4,7,6,7,5,6,5.
another trick i use is to manually vary the tempo via the drum machine
tempo
knob/slider as it records to tape... not wild changes, but very subtle
changes both above and below the desired tempo.

by combining all of these techniques (plus a few I could tell you about,
but
would then have to kill you) i've actually gotten compliments on my
"drumming" from other drummers... I, of course, tell them it's not me.

listen to the "fruit of my drum programming labor" he
http://artists.mp3s.com/artist_song/2575/2575860.html


Thats not a fricken live drummer? You're kidding! What the hell did you
program that in and whered you get your samples?

Paul




"Musikboy" wrote in message
.. .
In article ,
philicorda wrote:

Tstungo wrote:

OK, this has probably been asked a thousand times before..I'm
sorry!

I have Fruity Loops and can build up nice loops then bring them in
to
Cool
Edit, either as a wav or in individual blocks. I can fiddle about
here
and
there to do a few clever things, but to get the complexity of
beats
I'm
after I haven't a clue what's the quickest way.

There must a way to piece it all together, as drum n bass appeared
years
ago (ie with older technology) - and the programming's incredible.

I'm into more dowtempo beats but I'd still like to move up a notch
with
the programming of drums.

Any suggestions?

Many thanks,

Tom, High Wycombe, UK.

..
MPC 2000XL or some sort of an mpc. use the repeat button and just hold
down the drum you want that superfast fill played by. i think there's
a
repeat button on the roand stuff as well (they had some electronic
beatboxes out a few years ago)

Abyssmal, philicorda, Musikboy, brand.smith - all you guys - thank you for
taking the time to deal out such detailed replies. More than enough for me to
go on there, and I look forward to trying some of this stuff out.

Thanks people -

Tom