[Romeo Rondeau[_4_]]

hank alrich wrote:
Laurence Payne wrote:

On Sat, 7 Jun 2008 08:09:02 -0700 (PDT), Biasrocks
wrote:

Cons

Primarily; no delay compensation for plug-ins.
Really? Hasn't PT caught up with that yet?

They're talking PT LE.

Even on LE, plugin delay isn't as much of a problem as people make it
out to be. Most RTAS plugins don't have any processing delay at all,
even for the ones that do there is an easy way of dealing with it.

[Biasrocks]

On Jun 7, 1:17 pm, Romeo Rondeau wrote:
Laurence Payne wrote:
On Sat, 7 Jun 2008 08:09:02 -0700 (PDT), Biasrocks
wrote:

Cons

Primarily; no delay compensation for plug-ins.

Really? Hasn't PT caught up with that yet?

Second; The hardware is only usable with Protools

I think you'll find it's the other way round.

If ProTools doesn't have delay compensation, I'd better call back some
records I mixed :-) As for the hardware, the hardware works fine with
other programs. I use an Mbox when I mix in Nuendo here at the house.

There is no delay compensation in Protools LE; HD otoh has implemented
it.

I was talking about LE w/Digi hardware; specifically, the 002 and 003
boxes. M-boxes, I can't comment on.

If you want to call back records you mixed, I won't stop you.

Mark
SHARKTANK PRODUCTIONS
Windsor, ON

[Biasrocks]

On Jun 7, 1:27 pm, Romeo Rondeau wrote:
hank alrich wrote:
Laurence Payne wrote:

On Sat, 7 Jun 2008 08:09:02 -0700 (PDT), Biasrocks
wrote:

Cons

Primarily; no delay compensation for plug-ins.
Really? Hasn't PT caught up with that yet?

They're talking PT LE.

Even on LE, plugin delay isn't as much of a problem as people make it
out to be. Most RTAS plugins don't have any processing delay at all,
even for the ones that do there is an easy way of dealing with it.

I use a lot of VST plugin's in my work and prefer to not even have to
think about delay compensation when I'm working.

There are very few native DAW host's that DON'T HAVE delay
compensation included, aside from Protools LE.

The main benefit to having Protools running in native mode is that you
can say "I Have PROTOOLS".

Mark
SHARKTANK PRODUCTIONS
Windsor, ON

[Ty Ford]

On Sat, 7 Jun 2008 09:22:05 -0400, Adrian Tuddenham wrote
(in article . invalid):

My guess it was caused by some automatic way of preventing overload when
multiple tracks might all peak at once, but there was nothing to warn me that

it was happening.

I don't know of anything in PTLE that does that. Pitch in, any other PT
users.

The mono-stereo thing would do something but it would likely be more than
just 1 dB.

Regards,

Ty Ford


--Audio Equipment Reviews Audio Production Services
Acting and Voiceover Demos http://www.tyford.com
Guitar player?:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RZJ9MptZmU

[Scott Dorsey]

Biasrocks wrote:

If you want to call back records you mixed, I won't stop you.

I've got a bunch of them I'd like to call back, but none of them were
made with Pro Tools....
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Scott Dorsey]

Biasrocks wrote:

The main benefit to having Protools running in native mode is that you
can say "I Have PROTOOLS".

I run ads in the local musicians' rags saying "We don't have Pro Tools
and we never will-- Call old farts with tape machines." They seem to be
doing fairly well.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[[email protected]]

On 2008-06-08 (ScottDorsey) said:
Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
I run ads in the local musicians' rags saying "We don't have Pro
Tools and we never will-- Call old farts with tape machines." They
seem to be doing fairly well.
rotflmao!!!

WIsh I could do that with the remote truck. Once we've got
enough going on we have a regular studio building again i
want to get back into that.
I've got hard disk recorder in the truck.

tape cost is just too prohibitive if we want to work at all.
tHis rig used to have two h-24's.

NOte a friend of mine in Iowa who jumped on the pt
bandwagon's going analog again. I think he bought a NEotech
console recently and iirc got another sTudor to replace the
one he sold g.



Richard webb,
replace anything before at with elspider

[Geoff]

wrote:


NOte a friend of mine in Iowa who jumped on the pt
bandwagon's going analog again. I think he bought a NEotech
console recently and iirc got another sTudor to replace the
one he sold g.


Just a thought - can you buy new B+W TVs these days ?

geoff

[Scott Dorsey]

wrote:
WIsh I could do that with the remote truck. Once we've got
enough going on we have a regular studio building again i
want to get back into that.
I've got hard disk recorder in the truck.

tape cost is just too prohibitive if we want to work at all.
tHis rig used to have two h-24's.

Nahh, throw in a 4-track 1/2" machine or an 8-track 1" machine. They
sound good, they have enough channels that you can easily record stems
to them, and they won't cost much to keep them full of tape. Much more
cost-effective than a 2" machine.

NOte a friend of mine in Iowa who jumped on the pt
bandwagon's going analog again. I think he bought a NEotech
console recently and iirc got another sTudor to replace the
one he sold g.

The thing is, the stuff sounds good, and it's paid for. Why should I
put more money into a machine with a five-year lifespan?
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Romeo Rondeau[_4_]]

The thing is, the stuff sounds good, and it's paid for. Why should I
put more money into a machine with a five-year lifespan?
--scott

You don't have to as long as your clients don't need you to do anything
that requires a workstation.

[Scott Dorsey]

geoff wrote:
wrote:

NOte a friend of mine in Iowa who jumped on the pt
bandwagon's going analog again. I think he bought a NEotech
console recently and iirc got another sTudor to replace the
one he sold g.

Just a thought - can you buy new B+W TVs these days ?

No, but there are still new B+W TV shows being made anyway!
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Scott Dorsey]

Romeo Rondeau wrote:

The thing is, the stuff sounds good, and it's paid for. Why should I
put more money into a machine with a five-year lifespan?

You don't have to as long as your clients don't need you to do anything
that requires a workstation.

If they do, I subcontract it. Everybody in the world has a workstation, so
it's no problem to find folks to do that stuff.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[[email protected]]

On 2008-06-08 (ScottDorsey) said:
WIsh I could do that with the remote truck. Once we've got
enough going on we have a regular studio building again i
want to get back into that.
I've got hard disk recorder in the truck.
tape cost is just too prohibitive if we want to work at all.
This rig used to have two jh-24's.
Nahh, throw in a 4-track 1/2" machine or an 8-track 1" machine.
They sound good, they have enough channels that you can easily
record stems to them, and they won't cost much to keep them full of
tape. Much more cost-effective than a 2" machine.
Have thought about that, and will do that eventually. Like
the idea of a 1" 8.
MOst common machine I remember were the SKully which were a
maintenance nightmare but didn't sound bad.

NOte a friend of mine in Iowa who jumped on the pt
bandwagon's going analog again. I think he bought a NEotech
console recently and iirc got another sTudor to replace the
one he sold g.
The thing is, the stuff sounds good, and it's paid for. Why
should I put more money into a machine with a five-year lifespan?
I can relate to that. I had to start fresh with a machine.
Hence we put the hd recorder in because it would be more
cost effective.





Richard webb,
replace anything before at with elspider

[Scott Dorsey]

wrote:
Have thought about that, and will do that eventually. Like
the idea of a 1" 8.
MOst common machine I remember were the SKully which were a
maintenance nightmare but didn't sound bad.

I'd recommend the Ampex 440-8. Good sounding machine, very easy to
maintain.

There are basically three Scully families that did eight-track variants.
The original 280 was germanium stuff, not reliable and frankly I was never
impressed with the sound quality either. The 280B has a much more reliable
transport with some rudimentary tension control, modern silicon electronics
without the stupid predistortion network, and won't go flinging your tape
across the room when the direction sensor gets dirty, the way the 280 will.

The Scully 100 was a mistake in every possible way, starting with the fixed
heads (you use metal shims to adjust azimuth) and going down. I doubt there
are any still in operation today.

So, Scully 280B.... get one if you find one. 280 and 100... stay away.

MCI also made a bunch of 1" machines too.

NOte a friend of mine in Iowa who jumped on the pt
bandwagon's going analog again. I think he bought a NEotech
console recently and iirc got another sTudor to replace the
one he sold g.
The thing is, the stuff sounds good, and it's paid for. Why
should I put more money into a machine with a five-year lifespan?
I can relate to that. I had to start fresh with a machine.
Hence we put the hd recorder in because it would be more
cost effective.

Makes sense.

You can get a 440-8 for around $500 these days, though. It takes up a lot
of space in the truck for something that isn't used all that much, but you
can bill a lot for it when you use it.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[WillStG]

On Jun 9, 1:26*pm, (Scott Dorsey) wrote:

You can get a 440-8 for around $500 these days, though. *It takes up a lot
of space in the truck for something that isn't used all that much, but you
can bill a lot for it when you use it.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. *C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Just because one knows how to use Protools doesn't mean you have
to like it.
So how much to use the 2" one track?


Will Miho
NY TV/Audio Post/Music/Live Sound Guy
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits

[Scott Dorsey]

WillStG wrote:
On Jun 9, 1:26=A0pm, (Scott Dorsey) wrote:

You can get a 440-8 for around $500 these days, though. =A0It takes up a l=
ot
of space in the truck for something that isn't used all that much, but you=

can bill a lot for it when you use it.

Just because one knows how to use Protools doesn't mean you have
to like it.

True enough, but if I installed a DAW, I'd have to change my ads and I
think I'd lose some of the cachet.

So how much to use the 2" one track?

Well, for every hour of actual recording time, it takes an hour to set the
azimuth.... so it adds up...
--scott

Full track mono is going to be the next big craze, though. Stereo only
sounds good in one place, but mono sounds good everywhere in the room...
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[[email protected]]

On 2008-06-09 (ScottDorsey) said:
Romeo Rondeau wrote:
The thing is, the stuff sounds good, and it's paid for. Why
should I put more money into a machine with a five-year lifespan?
You don't have to as long as your clients don't need you to do
anything that requires a workstation.
If they do, I subcontract it. Everybody in the world has a
workstation, so it's no problem to find folks to do that stuff.
My operating phiolsophy as well. iF I"m not producing, I"m
just recording, you want to manipulate it in a way that only
a daw can do, here's your hard disk.
IF I'm producing, if you can't play well enough, we'll go
somewhere we can get the pt expert with all the tools you
need, and chances are I won't be producing if you need
autotune and major surgery to get good tracks for mixing.
IF you're in that league the songs you write had better be
damned good to get my interest g. OTherwise, I"ll take
your money, get good live tracks, take it wherever you want,
there again, here's your hard drive(s) with the sessions.





Richard webb,
replace anything before at with elspider

[[email protected]]

On 2008-06-09 (ScottDorsey) said:
Have thought about that, and will do that eventually. Like
the idea of a 1" 8.
MOst common machine I remember were the SKully which were a
maintenance nightmare but didn't sound bad.
I'd recommend the Ampex 440-8. Good sounding machine, very easy to
maintain.
Yep recall seeing one of those. THey're more rare though.

There are basically three Scully families that did eight-track
variants. The original 280 was germanium stuff, not reliable and
frankly I was never impressed with the sound quality either. The
280B has a much more reliable transport with some rudimentary
tension control, modern silicon electronics without the stupid
predistortion network, and won't go flinging your tape across the
room when the direction sensor gets dirty, the way the 280 will.
YEp, that was the machine i used most. Ran lots of 456 over
one of them back in the '80's.

The Scully 100 was a mistake in every possible way, starting with
the fixed heads (you use metal shims to adjust azimuth) and going
down. I doubt there are any still in operation today.
I do too. Only encountered one and thought it sucked. Glad
I didn't have to maintain it.

MCI also made a bunch of 1" machines too.
I"ll talk to our man in Nashville about those g.

I can relate to that. I had to start fresh with a
machine. Hence we put the hd recorder in because it would be more
cost effective.
Makes sense.
You can get a 440-8 for around $500 these days, though. It takes
up a lot of space in the truck for something that isn't used all
that much, but you can bill a lot for it when you use it.

I"ll keep my eyes open. IT's sure a thought. wIth the hd
recorder already there it gives us another offering to the
clients not everybody's offering these days.



Richard webb,
replace anything before at with elspider

[Adrian Tuddenham]

Scott Dorsey wrote:


[...] Stereo only
sounds good in one place, but mono sounds good everywhere in the room...

Depends which room.

--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

[Laurence Payne[_2_]]

On 9 Jun 2008 23:01:06 -0400, (Scott Dorsey) wrote:

Full track mono is going to be the next big craze, though. Stereo only
sounds good in one place, but mono sounds good everywhere in the room...

You mean you have't discovered Bose? :-)

"I have a set of 30 yerar old Bose 501's. I think the base and tremble
are both shot ...."
http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/1/177604.html

[david gourley]

Laurence Payne put forth the notion
om:

On 9 Jun 2008 23:01:06 -0400, (Scott Dorsey) wrote:

Full track mono is going to be the next big craze, though. Stereo only
sounds good in one place, but mono sounds good everywhere in the room...

You mean you have't discovered Bose? :-)

"I have a set of 30 yerar old Bose 501's. I think the base and tremble
are both shot ...."
http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/1/177604.html


Problem is, they were both shot right out of the box, and time could not hurt
them so badly.

david

[Scott Dorsey]

Adrian Tuddenham wrote:
Scott Dorsey wrote:


[...] Stereo only
sounds good in one place, but mono sounds good everywhere in the room...

Depends which room.

It even sounds good in the neighbor's apartment! They're always banging on
the wall and yelling "Hey, that sounds good!"
--scott


--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Adrian Tuddenham]

Scott Dorsey wrote:

Adrian Tuddenham wrote:
Scott Dorsey wrote:


[...] Stereo only
sounds good in one place, but mono sounds good everywhere in the room...

Depends which room.

It even sounds good in the neighbor's apartment! They're always banging on
the wall and yelling "Hey, that sounds good!"

Just ignore them and carry on practicing your bagpipes.


--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

[Adrian Tuddenham]

Laurence Payne wrote:

On 9 Jun 2008 23:01:06 -0400, (Scott Dorsey) wrote:

Full track mono is going to be the next big craze, though. Stereo only
sounds good in one place, but mono sounds good everywhere in the room...

You mean you have't discovered Bose? :-)

"I have a set of 30 yerar old Bose 501's. I think the base and tremble
are both shot ...."
http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/1/177604.html

I wonder what sort of difference he has noticed?

--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

[Carey Carlan]

Laurence Payne wrote in
:

"I have a set of 30 yerar old Bose 501's. I think the base and tremble
are both shot ...."
http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/1/177604.html

Is that the "base" calibre of the salepeople and the "tremble" when you
pull out your wallet to pay for this overpriced gear?

[david correia]

In article ,
Romeo Rondeau wrote:

I'm not mastering music CDs with it, I'm making archival copies. If I
set it to 0dB gain it must reliably, without fail, *always* deliver 0dB
gain - each sample coming out must be the identical with the sample that
went in. If there is the slightest chance that it will do something
else, it is no use whatsoever as an archival tool.

A small change (or even quite a large one) doesn't matter much to
someone doing subjective artistic work, which was what I was doing when
I discovered the gain change; but I don't do that very often.

If ProTools changed your gain, you did something to it. The program
works fine.



Hardware inserts?

The possibility exists that there's a spanner in the works in your
precedure.
I'd have to be there and see to be more sure.

There may well be lots wrong with it, but as I don't use PT very often,
I don't have the time to spare to learn more about it. Perhaps this is
the opposite side of my original comment: I don't use PT very often, so
I don't know much about using it, so I don't use it very often.

I think you hit the nail right on the head, you are inexperienced with
the program.



If PT was haphazardly changing gain, there would be many more folks than
just Adrian talking about it.

Someone previously mentioned dealing with stereo and mono files.

If you take a stereo file of something that's actually stereo, and
create 2 mono files of it, and then take those 2 mono files and pan them
to the center (instead of leaving them panned full left and full right)
or move the pans any way other than full left and right, then you
certainly will get a changed, louder level.

I have using Digi software (PT, Sound Designer, & MasterlistCD)
extensively since 1991 and have never had it change the level of
anything.




David Correia
www.Celebrationsound.com