I have a Dual 622 purchased in 1980 and it has worked perfectly (with a
little oiling in 1994) until the day before yesterday! At the end of
the side the arm lifts but no longer moves back to the tonearm rest.
Instead it sets down right where it lifted off, and therefore
immediately lifts again (because it's still at the end of the side),
sets down again, lifts again, sets down again ad infinitum.
I live in New York City. Can anybody recommend a provider of Dual
service somewhere in the NYC metro area? Thanks.

wrote:
I have a Dual 622 purchased in 1980 and it has worked perfectly (with a
little oiling in 1994) until the day before yesterday! At the end of
the side the arm lifts but no longer moves back to the tonearm rest.
Instead it sets down right where it lifted off, and therefore
immediately lifts again (because it's still at the end of the side),
sets down again, lifts again, sets down again ad infinitum.
I live in New York City. Can anybody recommend a provider of Dual
service somewhere in the NYC metro area? Thanks.

Everybody hates working on these things. They are a major pain in the
neck because of all the fiddly mechanical stuff involved in the automatic
stuff.

I would strongly recommend getting a better turntable rather than putting
a whole lot of money into the Dual....

You might try BLR in Kew Gardens... they do a lot of Thorens repair and
they might be willing to point you toward someone that will look at the
Dual. You might also try Euro-Tech on West 44th street, who used to be
the Dual importers. Lyle Cartridges is long gone but Eric LeWinter might
still be found in town somewhere.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Scott Dorsey wrote:
wrote:
I have a Dual 622 purchased in 1980 and it has worked perfectly (with a
little oiling in 1994) until the day before yesterday! At the end of
the side the arm lifts but no longer moves back to the tonearm rest.
Instead it sets down right where it lifted off, and therefore
immediately lifts again (because it's still at the end of the side),
sets down again, lifts again, sets down again ad infinitum.
I live in New York City. Can anybody recommend a provider of Dual
service somewhere in the NYC metro area? Thanks.

Everybody hates working on these things. They are a major pain in the
neck because of all the fiddly mechanical stuff involved in the automatic
stuff.

I'm glad to finally hear someone else slag those monstrosities. Of
course, this isn't an audiophool group, but on so many occasions I've
seen people acting like these were worth fixing. IMO, they're not even
worth listening to when the work like new.

I would strongly recommend getting a better turntable rather than putting
a whole lot of money into the Dual....

Hear, hear!

jak
You might try BLR in Kew Gardens... they do a lot of Thorens repair and
they might be willing to point you toward someone that will look at the
Dual. You might also try Euro-Tech on West 44th street, who used to be
the Dual importers. Lyle Cartridges is long gone but Eric LeWinter might
still be found in town somewhere.
--scott

In article ,
says...

Scott Dorsey wrote:
wrote:
I have a Dual 622 purchased in 1980 and it has worked perfectly (with a
little oiling in 1994) until the day before yesterday! At the end of
the side the arm lifts but no longer moves back to the tonearm rest.
Instead it sets down right where it lifted off, and therefore
immediately lifts again (because it's still at the end of the side),
sets down again, lifts again, sets down again ad infinitum.
I live in New York City. Can anybody recommend a provider of Dual
service somewhere in the NYC metro area? Thanks.

Everybody hates working on these things. They are a major pain in the
neck because of all the fiddly mechanical stuff involved in the automatic
stuff.

I'm glad to finally hear someone else slag those monstrosities. Of
course, this isn't an audiophool group, but on so many occasions I've
seen people acting like these were worth fixing. IMO, they're not even
worth listening to when the work like new.


I've never understood why people call Dual a poor-man's 'audiophile' turntable,
either. The first turntable I bought about 8 years ago was a Dual, on that
advice, and it sucked. The turntable played on a warp, and it soon developed a
metal scraping sound as pieces of its innards rubbed together as it spun. I
took it apart to see what I could do to fix it, and was disappointed to see a
crazily-engineered metal monstrosity of a contraption that I would have no
hope in penetrating or re-assembling if I did manage to penetrate it. So I
quickly replaced it with a cheap direct drive 1980s
era JVC, which was quite a bit better than the Dual, even the quartz-lock
function made it sound a lot better than the Dual, but I eventually replaced
that with a nice beefy Sanyo belt-driven table which has served me well ever
since and especially sounds superb after I learned how to set the arm weight
and skating controls properly.



I would strongly recommend getting a better turntable rather than putting
a whole lot of money into the Dual....

Hear, hear!

jak
You might try BLR in Kew Gardens... they do a lot of Thorens repair and
they might be willing to point you toward someone that will look at the
Dual. You might also try Euro-Tech on West 44th street, who used to be
the Dual importers. Lyle Cartridges is long gone but Eric LeWinter might
still be found in town somewhere.
--scott

wrote in message
oups.com...
I have a Dual 622 purchased in 1980 and it has worked perfectly (with a
little oiling in 1994) until the day before yesterday! At the end of
the side the arm lifts but no longer moves back to the tonearm rest.
Instead it sets down right where it lifted off, and therefore
immediately lifts again (because it's still at the end of the side),
sets down again, lifts again, sets down again ad infinitum.
I live in New York City. Can anybody recommend a provider of Dual
service somewhere in the NYC metro area? Thanks.


Ignore all the voices of doom. Duals are fine machines if properly
maintained and will run forever. I have a 701 that I placed head to head
against my line....same phono cartridge, same headamp, same
suspension....and it matched the Linn in the midrange, beat it in the bass,
and lost out slightly but significantly to the Syrinx PSU arm on the Linn in
the high frequencies. On this basis I sold the Linn and have kept using the
Dual. I've had a this Dual in my system for 25 years without service,
another (the 601 belt drive) in use for ten years following service.

As for service, the best in the area is Sound Smith in Peekskill, NY. He
takes great pride in his Dual work, and just repaird on for a friend of
mine, who paid more than I would have but nonetheless feels she got
excellent value.

www.sound-smith.com

There was a fellow in Oyster Bay, NY who worked on my 601...can't remember
his name. His Dual experience was less, but he did do them...and did the
work at a fair price for the time. Can't remember his company name, though,
and he may be out of business.

Hope this helps.

In article ,
jakdedert wrote:

Scott Dorsey wrote:
wrote:
I have a Dual 622 purchased in 1980 and it has worked perfectly (with a
little oiling in 1994) until the day before yesterday! At the end of
the side the arm lifts but no longer moves back to the tonearm rest.
Instead it sets down right where it lifted off, and therefore
immediately lifts again (because it's still at the end of the side),
sets down again, lifts again, sets down again ad infinitum.
I live in New York City. Can anybody recommend a provider of Dual
service somewhere in the NYC metro area? Thanks.

Everybody hates working on these things. They are a major pain in the
neck because of all the fiddly mechanical stuff involved in the automatic
stuff.

I'm glad to finally hear someone else slag those monstrosities. Of
course, this isn't an audiophool group, but on so many occasions I've
seen people acting like these were worth fixing. IMO, they're not even
worth listening to when the work like new.

I would strongly recommend getting a better turntable rather than putting
a whole lot of money into the Dual....


Maybe. I have a 704 that I bought for $150 in the 80s and just put maybe
$80 in refurbishment (some suspension stuff needed fixing) and it's been
fine. I haven't really compared it head to head with anything else, but
when I have been looking and listening for an upgrade, nothing has
really inspired me to spend the money to get something that felt like a
serious upgrade. If anyone has any suggestions, I'd be open to hearing
them.

Edwin

"Edwin Hurwitz" wrote in message
...
In article ,
jakdedert wrote:

Scott Dorsey wrote:
wrote:
I have a Dual 622 purchased in 1980 and it has worked perfectly (with
a
little oiling in 1994) until the day before yesterday! At the end of
the side the arm lifts but no longer moves back to the tonearm rest.
Instead it sets down right where it lifted off, and therefore
immediately lifts again (because it's still at the end of the side),
sets down again, lifts again, sets down again ad infinitum.
I live in New York City. Can anybody recommend a provider of Dual
service somewhere in the NYC metro area? Thanks.

Everybody hates working on these things. They are a major pain in the
neck because of all the fiddly mechanical stuff involved in the
automatic
stuff.

I'm glad to finally hear someone else slag those monstrosities. Of
course, this isn't an audiophool group, but on so many occasions I've
seen people acting like these were worth fixing. IMO, they're not even
worth listening to when the work like new.

I would strongly recommend getting a better turntable rather than
putting
a whole lot of money into the Dual....


Maybe. I have a 704 that I bought for $150 in the 80s and just put maybe
$80 in refurbishment (some suspension stuff needed fixing) and it's been
fine. I haven't really compared it head to head with anything else, but
when I have been looking and listening for an upgrade, nothing has
really inspired me to spend the money to get something that felt like a
serious upgrade. If anyone has any suggestions, I'd be open to hearing
them.

Your post reminded me that in my earlier post I forgot to mention that the
"semi-automatics" (like your 704, my 701, and my 601) are the least complex
and therefore most trouble-free of all the Duals. But all the later direct
drives and belt drives *sound* good. They tend to have better, medium-low
mass arms and heavier platters. The only ones I would consider would be the
earlier rim-drive models (1019, 1219, etc.) although they have their fans.
I found on my earliest system (Dynaco, AR-3, etc) that I could easily hear
the rumble at higher volumes from the idler-wheel drive systems (I owned
both of these at one time or another). No such sound on later models.

In article ,
says...

The only ones I would consider would be the
earlier rim-drive models (1019, 1219, etc.) although they have their fans.

ugh, the one I had was a 1019, and as I already stated, I hated it. It had a
pretty punchy sound, but introduced all sorts of artifacts from the spinning of
the vinyl that every other turntable I've owned manages to remove or avoid.


I found on my earliest system (Dynaco, AR-3, etc) that I could easily hear
the rumble at higher volumes from the idler-wheel drive systems (I owned
both of these at one time or another). No such sound on later models.

That's exactly the sort of thing I had to put up with with the 1019

Chevdo wrote:

In article ,
says...

The only ones I would consider would be the
earlier rim-drive models (1019, 1219, etc.) although they have their fans.

ugh, the one I had was a 1019, and as I already stated, I hated it. It had a
pretty punchy sound, but introduced all sorts of artifacts from the spinning of
the vinyl that every other turntable I've owned manages to remove or avoid.


I found on my earliest system (Dynaco, AR-3, etc) that I could easily hear
the rumble at higher volumes from the idler-wheel drive systems (I owned
both of these at one time or another). No such sound on later models.

That's exactly the sort of thing I had to put up with with the 1019

Wow. My Dad bought one off those in the 60s.

Graham

"Harry Lavo" wrote in message
...

"Edwin Hurwitz" wrote in message
...
In article ,
jakdedert wrote:

Scott Dorsey wrote:
wrote:
I have a Dual 622 purchased in 1980 and it has worked perfectly (with
a
little oiling in 1994) until the day before yesterday! At the end of
the side the arm lifts but no longer moves back to the tonearm rest.
Instead it sets down right where it lifted off, and therefore
immediately lifts again (because it's still at the end of the side),
sets down again, lifts again, sets down again ad infinitum.
I live in New York City. Can anybody recommend a provider of Dual
service somewhere in the NYC metro area? Thanks.

Everybody hates working on these things. They are a major pain in the
neck because of all the fiddly mechanical stuff involved in the
automatic
stuff.

I'm glad to finally hear someone else slag those monstrosities. Of
course, this isn't an audiophool group, but on so many occasions I've
seen people acting like these were worth fixing. IMO, they're not even
worth listening to when the work like new.

I would strongly recommend getting a better turntable rather than
putting
a whole lot of money into the Dual....


Maybe. I have a 704 that I bought for $150 in the 80s and just put maybe
$80 in refurbishment (some suspension stuff needed fixing) and it's been
fine. I haven't really compared it head to head with anything else, but
when I have been looking and listening for an upgrade, nothing has
really inspired me to spend the money to get something that felt like a
serious upgrade. If anyone has any suggestions, I'd be open to hearing
them.

Your post reminded me that in my earlier post I forgot to mention that the
"semi-automatics" (like your 704, my 701, and my 601) are the least
complex and therefore most trouble-free of all the Duals. But all the
later direct drives and belt drives *sound* good. They tend to have
better, medium-low mass arms and heavier platters. The only ones I would
consider would be the earlier rim-drive models (1019, 1219, etc.) although
they have their fans. I found on my earliest system (Dynaco, AR-3, etc)
that I could easily hear the rumble at higher volumes from the idler-wheel
drive systems (I owned both of these at one time or another). No such
sound on later models.


That should have been "The only ones I would *NOT* consider would be the
earlier rim-drive models (1019, 1219, etc.) .

Edwin Hurwitz wrote:

Maybe. I have a 704 that I bought for $150 in the 80s and just put maybe
$80 in refurbishment (some suspension stuff needed fixing) and it's been
fine. I haven't really compared it head to head with anything else, but
when I have been looking and listening for an upgrade, nothing has
really inspired me to spend the money to get something that felt like a
serious upgrade. If anyone has any suggestions, I'd be open to hearing
them.

Well, what do you listen to and what sort of cartridges do you like?
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

I miss my minimalist Connoisseur turntable because it looked so cool.
Anyone got one of them that's still functioning??

I replaced it back in the day with a Linn that still works like a clock.
In fact, I did a mastering session a couple weeks ago that included 2
shrinkwrapped vinyl copies of someone's album from 1981, and even I was
amazed at how wonderful the transfer went. Wow!





David Correia
www.Celebrationsound.com

david correia wrote:

I miss my minimalist Connoisseur turntable because it looked so cool.
Anyone got one of them that's still functioning??

The one that'll run backwards ? Not only minimalist but quite inexpensive too
IIRC.

"david correia" wrote in message
...
I miss my minimalist Connoisseur turntable because it looked so cool.
Anyone got one of them that's still functioning??

Not the minimalist one, but I've got a BD103 that I use all the time for 78
transfers. As long as I take the belt off when I'm not using it, so it
doesn't get all stretched out and loose, and keep the contacts clean in the
speed-control circuits,, it's a fine table.

Peace,
Paul

wrote:
I have a Dual 622 purchased in 1980 and it has worked perfectly (with a
little oiling in 1994) until the day before yesterday! At the end of
the side the arm lifts but no longer moves back to the tonearm rest.
Instead it sets down right where it lifted off, and therefore
immediately lifts again (because it's still at the end of the side),
sets down again, lifts again, sets down again ad infinitum.
I live in New York City. Can anybody recommend a provider of Dual
service somewhere in the NYC metro area? Thanks.


Did you try Analogique Systems lab?

http://www.analogique.com/

27 WEST 20th STREET Suite # 406 NEW YORK, NY 10011
Tel. (212) 989-4240 Fax. (212) 633-9389

Harry Lavo wrote:

Your post reminded me that in my earlier post I forgot to mention that the
"semi-automatics" (like your 704, my 701, and my 601) are the least
complex and therefore most trouble-free of all the Duals. But all the
later direct drives and belt drives *sound* good. They tend to have
better, medium-low mass arms and heavier platters. The only ones I would
consider would be the earlier rim-drive models (1019, 1219, etc.) although
they have their fans. I found on my earliest system (Dynaco, AR-3, etc)
that I could easily hear the rumble at higher volumes from the idler-wheel
drive systems (I owned both of these at one time or another). No such
sound on later models.


That should have been "The only ones I would *NOT* consider would be the
earlier rim-drive models (1019, 1219, etc.) .

It's true that the 704 and 701 are probably the best things Dual made, and
they aren't the mechanical disasters that the 1019/1219 series are.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Pooh Bear wrote:
david correia wrote:

I miss my minimalist Connoisseur turntable because it looked so cool.
Anyone got one of them that's still functioning??

The one that'll run backwards ? Not only minimalist but quite inexpensive too
IIRC.

I think these are still in production but I don't think they are inexpensive
any more. Try Acoustic Sounds in Salinas, KS.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message
...
Pooh Bear wrote:
david correia wrote:

I miss my minimalist Connoisseur turntable because it looked so cool.
Anyone got one of them that's still functioning??

The one that'll run backwards ? Not only minimalist but quite inexpensive
too
IIRC.

I think these are still in production but I don't think they are
inexpensive
any more. Try Acoustic Sounds in Salinas, KS.

Nope, no Connoisseur at Acoustic Sounds (and they could use some help
organizing their website). I'm pretty sure the company folded in the early
1980s.

Peace,
Paul

In article ,
says...



Chevdo wrote:

In article ,
says...

The only ones I would consider would be the
earlier rim-drive models (1019, 1219, etc.) although they have their fans.

ugh, the one I had was a 1019, and as I already stated, I hated it. It had
a
pretty punchy sound, but introduced all sorts of artifacts from the spinning
of
the vinyl that every other turntable I've owned manages to remove or avoid.


I found on my earliest system (Dynaco, AR-3, etc) that I could easily hear
the rumble at higher volumes from the idler-wheel drive systems (I owned
both of these at one time or another). No such sound on later models.

That's exactly the sort of thing I had to put up with with the 1019

Wow. My Dad bought one off those in the 60s.


hmm I dont think mine was that old, but possibly. I just googled 1019 and it
looked similar to the one I had, but I don't really know if that was the model
# or not. I'm also not sure if its still in the basement or if I managed to
get it deposited into a landfill...

wrote in message
oups.com...
I have a Dual 622 purchased in 1980 and it has worked perfectly (with a
little oiling in 1994) until the day before yesterday! At the end of
the side the arm lifts but no longer moves back to the tonearm rest.
Instead it sets down right where it lifted off, and therefore
immediately lifts again (because it's still at the end of the side),
sets down again, lifts again, sets down again ad infinitum.
I live in New York City. Can anybody recommend a provider of Dual
service somewhere in the NYC metro area? Thanks.


I mentioned Sound Smith in Peekskill, NY before. Here is more info,
courtesy of my friend:

Soundsmith
8 John Walsh Blvd. Suite 417
Peekskill, NY 10566
Peter Ledermann-President
Phone: 914-739-2885
Fax: 914-739-5204
www. sound-smith.com

"Pooh Bear" wrote
in message
Chevdo wrote:

In article
,
says...

The only ones I would consider would be the
earlier rim-drive models (1019, 1219, etc.) although
they have their fans.

ugh, the one I had was a 1019, and as I already stated,
I hated it. It had a pretty punchy sound, but
introduced all sorts of artifacts from the spinning of
the vinyl that every other turntable I've owned manages
to remove or avoid.

I found on my earliest system (Dynaco, AR-3, etc) that
I could easily hear the rumble at higher volumes from
the idler-wheel drive systems (I owned both of these
at one time or another). No such sound on later
models.

I never had a turntable with inaudible low frequency noise. Some of it is on
the LP.

That's exactly the sort of thing I had to put up with
with the 1019

Wow. My Dad bought one off those in the 60s.

http://www.compassnet.com/concept/tables/1019.htm

Wow, I sold dozens of them in the Lafayette Radio Associate store I worked
in the 60s.

The only Dual turntable I ever personally owned was a 1209.

http://www.compassnet.com/concept/tables/1209.htm

In the day of, I invested in AR turntables (I eventually owned 3 or 4, each
sold off to be replaced by *something better*, until I finally obtained a
Thorens TD 125/SME 3009 setup that I kept about a year after the advent of
the CD player.

The -59 dB rumble cited in the 1019 web page above has to involve a really
incredible weighting curve. ;-) The 1209 page actually cites which
weighting curve was allegedly used, but the spec has to be very optimistic
or be based on a very high recorded level for "0 dB".

"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message

Harry Lavo wrote:

Your post reminded me that in my earlier post I forgot
to mention that the "semi-automatics" (like your 704,
my 701, and my 601) are the least complex and therefore
most trouble-free of all the Duals. But all the later
direct drives and belt drives *sound* good. They tend
to have better, medium-low mass arms and heavier
platters. The only ones I would consider would be the
earlier rim-drive models (1019, 1219, etc.) although
they have their fans. I found on my earliest system
(Dynaco, AR-3, etc) that I could easily hear the rumble
at higher volumes from the idler-wheel drive systems (I
owned both of these at one time or another). No such
sound on later models.

Audible rumble is often a system problem, and can be magnified by low
frequency structural or acoustic feedback and incipient instability.

That should have been "The only ones I would *NOT*
consider would be the earlier rim-drive models (1019,
1219, etc.) .

It's true that the 704 and 701 are probably the best
things Dual made, and they aren't the mechanical
disasters that the 1019/1219 series are. --scott

I had the opportunity to do some lab tests on someone's Dual 701/Shure
V15-V combo a few years ago. There was unusual measurable, but not
necessarily audible high frequency FM distortion, probably due to the direct
drive.

Arny Krueger wrote:

I never had a turntable with inaudible low frequency noise. Some of it is on
the LP.

This is a shame, and this, in short, is why you need to listen to a good
LP on a good system.

It's difficult to machine a center bearing for low noise in the vertical
plane and it's difficult to isolate the motor noise from the platter. Sadly
it's not cheap.

And it's true that this has to be done both on the playback turntable and
on the cutting lathe.

But there are some very, very quiet pressings and tables out there today.
The technology is a whole lot better than it was when I was a kid.

The -59 dB rumble cited in the 1019 web page above has to involve a really
incredible weighting curve. ;-) The 1209 page actually cites which
weighting curve was allegedly used, but the spec has to be very optimistic
or be based on a very high recorded level for "0 dB".

The 1019 is an example of why I consider idler designs totally unacceptable
for transcription work today.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Arny writes:
I had the opportunity to do some lab tests on someone's Dual 701/Shure
V15-V combo a few years ago. There was unusual measurable, but not
necessarily audible high frequency FM distortion, probably due to the direct
drive.

Yes, there is measurable cogging on the 701. This results in a loss of
perceived detail and a sense of "smearing." But, I'll say that although
it's a lot worse on the 701 than on a high grade modern table, it's a whole
lot worse on the Technics SL-1200, by at least an order of magnitude.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Tim Padrick wrote:

If in good shape, a used Rega Planar2 will get you into decent performance
at a resonable price. If you have cash to blow, a Linn LP12 is my choice,
but it's easy to get hosed, as there are many versions, and a lot of
tonearms with ruined bearings out there.

The LP12 thing seems too much like Scientology to me... you start out buying
a fairly inexpensive model, but then you are stuck in a lifetime of hundreds
of available upgrades.

With all the upgrades in place, the LP12 is a great turntable, but it winds
up costing a lot more than comparable gear. Without the upgrades in place,
it's got some resonance issues. The thing is there are a huge number of
very different turntables, all called the LP12.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message
...
Arny Krueger wrote:

I never had a turntable with inaudible low frequency noise. Some of it is
on
the LP.

This is a shame, and this, in short, is why you need to listen to a good
LP on a good system.

It's difficult to machine a center bearing for low noise in the vertical
plane and it's difficult to isolate the motor noise from the platter.
Sadly
it's not cheap.

And it's true that this has to be done both on the playback turntable and
on the cutting lathe.

But there are some very, very quiet pressings and tables out there today.
The technology is a whole lot better than it was when I was a kid.

The -59 dB rumble cited in the 1019 web page above has to involve a really
incredible weighting curve. ;-) The 1209 page actually cites which
weighting curve was allegedly used, but the spec has to be very optimistic
or be based on a very high recorded level for "0 dB".

The 1019 is an example of why I consider idler designs totally
unacceptable
for transcription work today.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

I learned that years ago when I sold a belt drive Pioneer (PL41?) and got a
Dual 1229, 'cause all the magazines said it was good. What a piece of
garbage!

If a turntable does not have an unweighted rumble spec, run away.

If in good shape, a used Rega Planar2 will get you into decent performance
at a resonable price. If you have cash to blow, a Linn LP12 is my choice,
but it's easy to get hosed, as there are many versions, and a lot of
tonearms with ruined bearings out there.

"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message

Arny Krueger wrote:

I never had a turntable with inaudible low frequency
noise. Some of it is on the LP.

This is a shame, and this, in short, is why you need to
listen to a good LP on a good system.

Don't be insulting! I've heard lots of LPs on what were presented to me as
being good systems. Last year I went to HE2005 spent two days listening.
You're saying there were no good LPs played on good systems there?

Arny Krueger wrote:
"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message
Arny Krueger wrote:

I never had a turntable with inaudible low frequency
noise. Some of it is on the LP.

This is a shame, and this, in short, is why you need to
listen to a good LP on a good system.

Don't be insulting! I've heard lots of LPs on what were presented to me as
being good systems. Last year I went to HE2005 spent two days listening.
You're saying there were no good LPs played on good systems there?

If you could hear low frequency noise over the room noise on all of them,
probably not.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Arny Krueger wrote:
Don't be insulting! I've heard lots of LPs on what were presented to me as
being good systems. Last year I went to HE2005 spent two days listening.
You're saying there were no good LPs played on good systems there?

they were in the audiophile section,
which is probably why you missed them.

to busy strutting your abx to the masses.

"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message

Arny Krueger wrote:
"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message
Arny Krueger wrote:

I never had a turntable with inaudible low frequency
noise. Some of it is on the LP.

This is a shame, and this, in short, is why you need to
listen to a good LP on a good system.

Don't be insulting! I've heard lots of LPs on what were
presented to me as being good systems. Last year I went
to HE2005 spent two days listening. You're saying there
were no good LPs played on good systems there?

If you could hear low frequency noise over the room noise
on all of them, probably not.

The only way I know to avoid audible LF noise from LPs involves some kind of
high pass filter.

wrote in message
oups.com

Arny Krueger wrote:

Don't be insulting! I've heard lots of LPs on what were
presented to me as being good systems. Last year I went
to HE2005 spent two days listening. You're saying there
were no good LPs played on good systems there?

they were in the audiophile section, which is probably why you missed
them.

Try again, this time with brains.

to busy strutting your abx to the masses.

I surely did not mention ABX in the exhibits area.

Howefver, given that I was there for the express purpose of engaging in a
debate that related to ABX, I did mention ABX there.

Got a problem with me fulfilling an agreement that I made for valuable
consideration?

Arny Krueger wrote:

If you could hear low frequency noise over the room noise
on all of them, probably not.

The only way I know to avoid audible LF noise from LPs involves some kind of
high pass filter.

There's one that is part of the RIAA network. It's not as extreme as you
might like, but it helps a phenomenal amount.

Much remaining rumble can be easily removed with a sharp high-pass, but
the key is that the rumble needs to be reduced mechanically down to around
15 Hz and below so that the high-pass corner can be made very low. A lot
of this involves controlling arm resonances so that the problems in the low
octave aren't emphasized.

And, of course, the BIG deal is to cut records nice and hot so that the
average levels are much higher than the noise floor. The attempts to get
as much running time on LPs as possible always result in serious problems.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..

If you could hear low frequency noise over the room noise
on all of them, probably not.

The only way I know to avoid audible LF noise from LPs involves some kind
of
high pass filter.

Naw. I've heard a few LPs -- not many, but a few -- that didn't have audible
LF noise. With a *lot* of care and careful processing it can be done.

Peace,
Paul

Don't be insulting!
Try again, this time with brains.
Howefver, given that I was there for the express purpose of engaging in a
debate that related to ABX, I did mention ABX there.
Got a problem with me fulfilling an agreement that I made for valuable
consideration?
Howefver, given that I was there for the express purpose of engaging in a
debate that related to ABX, I did mention ABX there.
Don't be insulting!

two days there debating how "audiophools" are not real
then milking it for all it wasn't worth.

who is insulting whom.

so an articulate question is...

did you check out the Continuum Audio Labs Caliburn turntable & Cobra
tonearm??

On Wed, 24 May 2006 14:25:55 -0400, Paul Stamler wrote
(in article ):

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..

If you could hear low frequency noise over the room noise
on all of them, probably not.

The only way I know to avoid audible LF noise from LPs involves some kind
of
high pass filter.

Naw. I've heard a few LPs -- not many, but a few -- that didn't have audible
LF noise. With a *lot* of care and careful processing it can be done.

Peace,
Paul



Pro Digital in Broomall, PA, near Philly.

Regards,

Ty Ford



-- Ty Ford's equipment reviews, audio samples, rates and other audiocentric
stuff are at www.tyford.com

wrote in message
ps.com
Don't be insulting!
Try again, this time with brains.
Howefver, given that I was there for the express purpose
of engaging in a debate that related to ABX, I did
mention ABX there.
Got a problem with me fulfilling an agreement that I
made for valuable consideration?
Howefver, given that I was there for the express purpose
of engaging in a debate that related to ABX, I did
mention ABX there.
Don't be insulting!

two days there debating how "audiophools" are not real
then milking it for all it wasn't worth.

Nothing like that happened, except maybe in your dreams.


who is insulting whom.

Nothing has changed - your talking out the back of your neck to make
yourself feel better.

so an articulate question is...

did you check out the Continuum Audio Labs Caliburn
turntable & Cobra tonearm??

I didn't hear "Music jumps from the speakers like you've never heard!"

;-)

Besides, I'm pretty sure that would be more of a bug than a feature.