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Serge Auckland wrote:
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Serge Auckland wrote:
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Stewart Pinkerton wrote:
On 17 Feb 2006 00:28:19 GMT, " wrote:


But one thing I do disagree on, sincerely: Good engineering an
production values are the most inexpensive means and methods for
the
long run, not necessarily in any great quantity. Yes and most
certainly
a lot of boutique stuff suffers greatly from the lack of such, but
by
my definition they would be then excluded from the realm of
'high-end'.

Pity that many of the subjectivists don't seem to agree with you!

Funny, you didn't agree with him either.



And stuff that uses _inexpensive_ materials and methods in a
thoughtful
way might achieve that status. Liken it to using a torque-wrench
and
anti-seize on spark-plugs. One can use twice-as-expensive plated
plugs
and no such wrench and not necessarily strip the threads when they
need
replacement in 30,000 miles, or one can use anti-seize and the
wrench
and then it does not matter which plug. The boutique makers will
brag
about the expense of their spark-plug equivalents but either not
tighten at all or have a moose tighten each one with his last,
dying
strain. Neither makes sense, both are easily avoided.

Not easily avoided if you are technically incompetent, as are many
of
the high-end audio 'designers', such as Yves Bernard Andre, Peter
Qvortrup and Julian Vereker.


Please tell us how any of the following equipment is incompetently
designed
http://www.audioplusservices.com/yba/mission.html

I don't have any reason to dislike YBA's amplifiers, as I know little
about
their design.

http://www.audionote.co.uk/

I can find no reedeming features in Audionote products:

yet others can.


60 year old
technology,


Is that a problem?

Yes when there more modern technolgies that result in much better
performance at a much lower price.


But that isn't the case with tubes.

Why should tubes be any different to anything else? If the technology has
been superceded, then it's old hat. SETs are old technology that has been
demonstrably superceded firstly by PP, then by PPUL, then by SS.




appalling performance (high distortion, high noise, high output
impedance, low power) depending on series,


I see but have youy ever listened to them?

Yes I have. I spent several hours in Audionote's premises in Paris. They
had advertised many thousands of records for sale, so I went there. There
were a few hundred, not thousands, and the Audionote system playing there
didn't impress.

OK but no blind A/B comaprisons with their tube elecronics against
electronics you believe o be superior.

Even if no blind A/B comparisons have been done, what makes you think that
SETs are better than anything that has come after? Blind faith?

unnecessary use of exotic
materials without any sound engineering reason,


Other opinions seem to vary on this subject.

So what sound engineering reason can you see for the use of silver
windings in the transformers?


You are asking the wrong person. that question should go to the folks
that are designing those transformers. Have you ever asked them by the
way?


No because anyone who winds tranformers for a living uses silver cable. Do
Sowter use silver, do Lundahl use silver. Did Parmeko and Gardners and all
the other tube luminaries in the '60s ever use silver? No, of course not,
they knew that silver wouldn't make a ha'worth or difference to the sound,
just add to cost.


ludicrously high prices,
without even the benefit of being well styled and built.


What is wrong with the build quality? Styling is highly subjective
so....

Mechanical assembly looks poor.


Can you elaborate? Have you looked under the hood? What speifically is
poorly done in the build?


Styling I agree is subjective, I just
don't like it.


I'm not crazy about it either.





From this you may
be able to tell I don't care for them very much, and in my view they
are
not
only *not* high-end, but a con on the buying public.


A con? I quite disagree. The buyers of Audio Note probably have a
better idea of wnat they are getting than the buyers of most consumer
electronics. Where is the con?
Scott

That people with more money than sense are being persuaded that the
AudioNote way is better than more conventional ways.

Sorry but this is just your prejudices coming out here. What do you
know about the sensibilities of these people who buy these products.
your comment is pure prejudice and prejudice is not a worthy premise
for any arument. you will have to do better than that.


Any objective
consideration of what is being provided (low power, high distortion etc
etc) would conclude that not only isn't worth the money, but is trying it
on.


That is a rather narrow view. *Any* objective consideration would
include cost of materials and labor not to mention cost of importation.

AudioNote are a UK company, so there is no importation cost over here. They
are still ludicrously overpriced.

They are a small company.

So their overheads should be low

The amount of time and effort that goes into
designing each product and bringing it to the market is considerable
when one looks at how limited their production runs are. These are
objective considerations of "what is being provided" and you are
ignoring them. you are also ignoring that they may have a particular
sound that is preffered by their customers.

Sure, there;s no accounting for taste.

I for one am not interested
in their products for a few reasons. But I won't dismiss them out of
hand or make outrageous claims of a "con" or "technical incompetence"
just because their products do not suit my needs. nor will I make
claims of poor quality in construction based on a mere glance at the
exterior of their products.

They are selling a premium price product to people who, by and large, are
not technical experts. Therefore, it would seem reasonable that they would
put a certain emphasis on what the exterior looks like. When that is clearly
lacking, one wonders what the inside can be like. Magazine reviews have
shown photos of the inside. They inspire no more confidence than the
outside. I therefore maintain that AudioNote UK products are designed to con
gullible albeit rich people to part with their money for substandard goods.
By substandard I mean below the standard required of audio reproducing
equipment of that price. Just look at the distortion, output impedance,
power delivery, power response of any AudioNote product. The cheapest
Marantz/Denon or whatever your favourite mass-market brand will do better.

S