The softwa

So you have a file, you set the out ceiling to whatever say -.03...process
& your peak is never going to go above -.03 right. If you totally abuse the
threshold the peak will still never go above that yet the region is
obviously going to be cut off as in flat. So when does "clipping"
technically occur here?


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a.m. wrote:
The softwa

So you have a file, you set the out ceiling to whatever say -.03...process
& your peak is never going to go above -.03 right. If you totally abuse the
threshold the peak will still never go above that yet the region is
obviously going to be cut off as in flat. So when does "clipping"
technically occur here?

It depends on what you consider "clipping." In practical terms,
"clipping" occurs when it starts sounding bad because the short-term
dynamic range has been reduced.

If you stick to the strict definition of clipping, the waveform has to
not just be flat on top, but the top of a cycle has to be chopped off.
The L2 (and other limiters) work by reducing gain when the threshold is
exceeded, so while that changes the shape of the wave, it doesn't
necessarily chop off the top. If zoom in far enough, you can see this.

So you have a file, you set the out ceiling to whatever
ay -.03...process
& your peak is never going to go above -.03 right. If you totally abuse
the
threshold the peak will still never go above that yet the region is
obviously going to be cut off as in flat. So when does "clipping"
technically occur here?

There's no convention on the matter, but the limiting becomes audible when
the maximum output is sustained for a period of time. I stop at an RMS
level of -3dB if I'm really pumping it.

Zigakly wrote:

I stop at an RMS
level of -3dB if I'm really pumping it.

I'd like to hear an example of that. -3dB RMS is absolutely insane. I
can't imagine you can achieve that with an L2 without horrendous
artifacts. Can you post a short clip?


--
Eric

Practice Your Mixing Skills
www.Raw-Tracks.com
www.Mad-Host.com

I was thinking the same thing. -12dB RMS crosses the suckage threshold to my
ears. -3dB is sorta awful to contemplate.

;o)

"EricK" wrote in message
...
Zigakly wrote:

I stop at an RMS
level of -3dB if I'm really pumping it.

I'd like to hear an example of that. -3dB RMS is absolutely insane. I
can't imagine you can achieve that with an L2 without horrendous
artifacts. Can you post a short clip?


--
Eric

Practice Your Mixing Skills
www.Raw-Tracks.com
www.Mad-Host.com

In article , EricK wrote:
Zigakly wrote:

I stop at an RMS
level of -3dB if I'm really pumping it.

I'd like to hear an example of that. -3dB RMS is absolutely insane. I
can't imagine you can achieve that with an L2 without horrendous
artifacts. Can you post a short clip?

Horrendous artifacts are the LATEST THING, man! If you can still make
out the words, it's not RADIO-READY!
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

In article ,
(Scott Dorsey) wrote:

In article , EricK wrote:
Zigakly wrote:

I stop at an RMS
level of -3dB if I'm really pumping it.

I'd like to hear an example of that. -3dB RMS is absolutely insane. I
can't imagine you can achieve that with an L2 without horrendous
artifacts. Can you post a short clip?

Horrendous artifacts are the LATEST THING, man! If you can still make
out the words, it's not RADIO-READY!
--scott

Seeing 3dB of gain reduction on the L2 is one thing, but an RMS level of
-3dB is simply unlistenable. Can he really mean a -3dB RMS level? Is it
possible? It must be a mistake.

--
Jay Frigoletto
Mastersuite
www.promastering.com

"Jay-atldigi" wrote in message
...
In article ,
(Scott Dorsey) wrote:

In article , EricK
wrote:
Zigakly wrote:

I stop at an RMS
level of -3dB if I'm really pumping it.

I'd like to hear an example of that. -3dB RMS is absolutely insane. I
can't imagine you can achieve that with an L2 without horrendous
artifacts. Can you post a short clip?

Horrendous artifacts are the LATEST THING, man! If you can still make
out the words, it's not RADIO-READY!
--scott

Seeing 3dB of gain reduction on the L2 is one thing, but an RMS level of
-3dB is simply unlistenable. Can he really mean a -3dB RMS level? Is it
possible? It must be a mistake.

Maybe the tools you're using give different numbers than mine (Waves PAZ).
I also don't mean an average level throughout the whole song, I mean the
strongest vocal passage. I keep the instrumentation under -6dB RMS max.
And these are numbers for severely smushed rock stuff, does not apply to all
genres.

Digging through the archives and finding a passage that actually hits -3dB
RMS is a little too time-consuming for me, but check out any radio fodder,
many go past -3.

I also don't imply that I personally prefer that much pump, but if it's pump
they need, that's as far as I go. I also use T-Racks Soft Clipper for a
hint of tape saturation and usually not L2, and no limiting whatsoever if
it's going to 3rd party mastering.

In article .com,
"Mike Rivers" wrote:

a.m. wrote:
The softwa

So you have a file, you set the out ceiling to whatever say -.03...process
& your peak is never going to go above -.03 right. If you totally abuse the
threshold the peak will still never go above that yet the region is
obviously going to be cut off as in flat. So when does "clipping"
technically occur here?

It depends on what you consider "clipping." In practical terms,
"clipping" occurs when it starts sounding bad because the short-term
dynamic range has been reduced.

If you stick to the strict definition of clipping, the waveform has to
not just be flat on top, but the top of a cycle has to be chopped off.
The L2 (and other limiters) work by reducing gain when the threshold is
exceeded, so while that changes the shape of the wave, it doesn't
necessarily chop off the top. If zoom in far enough, you can see this.

As shown he

http://homepage.mac.com/jchestek/Lim..._Clipping.html

Jeff C.

--
Anti-Spam email address in effect.
My real email should be pretty obvious to an actual human being.

Animix wrote:

I was thinking the same thing. -12dB RMS crosses the suckage threshold to my
ears. -3dB is sorta awful to contemplate.

I tend to use -12dB as a kind of magic number above
which the sound of the drums starts to get lost.
But even smashing to -12 is somewhat pushing things.
I like the sound of the drums too much to go any further.
-3 must be like a buzzsaw.

rd