http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=7313800 921
&rd=1

Animix is depressed:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=7313800 921
&rd=1

Beautiful downtown Cleveland - just like I pictured it.... Hey,
they have some kind of "Tommy, The Amazing Journey" thing going on down
at the Rock and Roll Hall Of Fame don't they?

(Wonder how much an hour you can charge for guitar lessons in
Cleveland?)

Will Miho
NY Music and TV Audio Guy
Staff Audio / Fox News / M-AES
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits

Well, I charge (and get) more than that for studio time at my place out in
the middle of nowhere. I guess I just think of all of the time and work and
money it took for me to put together a rather small studio in comparison and
I have some sympathy for an operation that has invested this much on rooms
and equipment and on a good year, might make $100k if the studio was booked
solid.............but yeah, the owner and staff suck and don't deserve to
live because it's in Cleveland.


"WillStG" wrote in message
oups.com...
Animix is depressed:


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=7313800 921
&rd=1

Beautiful downtown Cleveland - just like I pictured it.... Hey,
they have some kind of "Tommy, The Amazing Journey" thing going on down
at the Rock and Roll Hall Of Fame don't they?

(Wonder how much an hour you can charge for guitar lessons in
Cleveland?)

Will Miho
NY Music and TV Audio Guy
Staff Audio / Fox News / M-AES
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits

Animix wrote:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=7313800 921
&rd=1

Yes it *is* sad and shows how little record companies care about the supporting
industries. Then again what *do* record companies care about ?


Graham

Pooh Bear wrote:

Yes it *is* sad and shows how little record companies care about the
supporting industries. Then again what *do* record companies care about ?

I don't think it shows that at all. This is a business. If Cleveland
can't support such a studio, and it looks like a very nice studio, how
does this show how much or how little the record companies care about
supporting industries?

How are the rest of the studios in Cleveland fairing? Maybe this one
just had a poor marketing strategy? Anyway, if anybody is in or near the
Cleveland area and wants to record, this looks like a great deal.

In fact, somebody in that area thinking about building their own home
studio might want to think twice, and save the thousands and thousands
they are about to part with and book some time there!

"Joe Sensor" wrote in message
...
Pooh Bear wrote:

Yes it *is* sad and shows how little record companies care about the
supporting industries. Then again what *do* record companies care about ?

I don't think it shows that at all. This is a business. If Cleveland can't
support such a studio, and it looks like a very nice studio, how does this
show how much or how little the record companies care about supporting
industries?

How are the rest of the studios in Cleveland fairing? Maybe this one just
had a poor marketing strategy? Anyway, if anybody is in or near the
Cleveland area and wants to record, this looks like a great deal.

In fact, somebody in that area thinking about building their own home
studio might want to think twice, and save the thousands and thousands
they are about to part with and book some time there!

It does say that this rate is for their 'B' room too. Maybe their 'A' room
is so much better that everyone uses it instead, even though it costs a lot
more, and the B room has been gathering dust?
--
John L Rice

Animix wrote:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=7313800 921
&rd=1

It might just be smart business. Airlines sell seats on airplanes
for a huge discount if they get near the time of the flight and
they don't expect to fill the plane. They've already lost the
money it costs to put the plane in the air, so almost any amount
of money they can make for the empty seats is better than nothing.

In other words, for all I know they are just trying to get their
studio utilized 100% of the time, since they have put the investment
in already and it costs them nothing (but time) to do it.

- Logan

I hope they make it. To me this looks like a last gasp effort. Here's hoping
I'm wrong.

DJ

"Logan Shaw" wrote in message
...
Animix wrote:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=7313800 921
&rd=1

It might just be smart business. Airlines sell seats on airplanes
for a huge discount if they get near the time of the flight and
they don't expect to fill the plane. They've already lost the
money it costs to put the plane in the air, so almost any amount
of money they can make for the empty seats is better than nothing.

In other words, for all I know they are just trying to get their
studio utilized 100% of the time, since they have put the investment
in already and it costs them nothing (but time) to do it.

- Logan

"John L Rice" wrote in message
...

"Joe Sensor" wrote in message
...
Pooh Bear wrote:

Yes it *is* sad and shows how little record companies care about the
supporting industries. Then again what *do* record companies care about
?

I don't think it shows that at all. This is a business. If Cleveland
can't
support such a studio, and it looks like a very nice studio, how does
this
show how much or how little the record companies care about supporting
industries?

How are the rest of the studios in Cleveland fairing? Maybe this one
just
had a poor marketing strategy? Anyway, if anybody is in or near the
Cleveland area and wants to record, this looks like a great deal.

In fact, somebody in that area thinking about building their own home
studio might want to think twice, and save the thousands and thousands
they are about to part with and book some time there!

It does say that this rate is for their 'B' room too. Maybe their 'A'
room
is so much better that everyone uses it instead, even though it costs a
lot
more, and the B room has been gathering dust?
--
John L Rice



The offer is for tracking in the 'A' room (Neve 8100) and the rest in the
'B' room (SSL 5000), but judging by the equipment list, there can't be a big
difference in rates.

Although both consoles are big names, neither of them is exactly the real
thing. It could be a case of "close, but no cigar".

Predrag

Why? It makes me want to sign up for a couple of weeks and do some
recordings I've been meaning to do but simply can't find the time to try to
attack by myself. ****, this is not only a great deal, but it can help a
decent facility stave off the wolves at the door. It's cheap at 3 times the
price.

What's sad is places like the Hit Factory not noticing the writing on the
walls and coming up with just such a scheme to get people in. For $35 per
hour, a lot of musicians will be wanting to get in there and won't be
worried about $1500 per day rates where they have to produce rather than
have the option to experiment. And if something positive comes of it in the
national market, Sweet Spot just might make themselves noticed enough to get
back into the sweet spot.

Besides, their mic selection does leave a little to be desired for a live
band type recording, as do their mic pres, if that's what they wanted to
base it on. Personally it wouldn't bother me one whit to track through the
Neve in Studio A and mix on the SSL in Studio B without all the whiz-bang
names and I'd still get far more than my $35 per hour worth.

Hell, it might even be worth it to grab a couple of weeks between a number
of us that have things they want to record and not enough people to do the
job, and just go get all the stuff done. I'm not saying it wouldn't cost
because there's still hotel/motel rooms, etc., but hey 5, 6 or 8 qualified
musicians all going at one time could come up with all they want and do all
of what the others want too. Get 10 or 15 groups of people doing the same
thing, sometimes moving in and out of other groups of people, and you could
come up with some really good stuff. OK, so you could come up with some
real **** too, but if you don't do it, you don't even have ****! g

It's all a matter of perspective. One could even look at it from the
perspective of taking promising musicians or trainees, or simply call up the
old band that never got to record. At $35 per hour ($420 per 12 hour day)
tons of work could get done, and all any one individual might have to do is
come up with one day's worth of cash plus their own room at the motel and
some MickeyD's money. Well, there's travel too, but let's assume that there
are 30 people within striking distance who could drive or take a bus or
train. That's way over $30000 worth of recording for $12,600.

Now I can drive to Cleveland in a day and I can afford to get a cheap motel
room and eat some bad-for-you food. Anyone else want to make the drive, the
stay and the recordings? The going price is $420 (plus your lodging) and a
minimum of 10 people. That's 10 days of 12 hours worth of recording with
responding musicians for $420 dollars. ****, what a sweet spot deal! g

--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio
http://blogs.salon.com/0004478/
"Animix" wrote in message
...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=7313800 921
&rd=1

This price DOES include a top quality engineer!


Yaa. Sure.


The even sadder thing is that its been up for 3 days and no one has
clicked on their But It Now.




David Correia
Celebration Sound
Warren, Rhode Island


www.CelebrationSound.com

I see your point. Maybe it shouldn't make me sad to see this industry
change but I see lots of big studios closing their doors. This is what makes
me sad, I guess, though maybe it's just empathy. I'm small potatoes, but
I've worked hard, spent more money than I want to think about and have seen
a bit of my business trickle away to bedroom studios. I do think you've got
the right attitude about it. Hell, take them up on it. I wish I had had a
facility like this available for $35.00 per hour when my wife and I were
cutting demo's for publishers and I decided to build my own studio *to save
money*. I've almost saved my ass into bankruptcy a few times over the years.

;o)


"Roger W. Norman" wrote in message
...
Why? It makes me want to sign up for a couple of weeks and do some
recordings I've been meaning to do but simply can't find the time to try
to
attack by myself. ****, this is not only a great deal, but it can help a
decent facility stave off the wolves at the door. It's cheap at 3 times
the
price.

What's sad is places like the Hit Factory not noticing the writing on the
walls and coming up with just such a scheme to get people in. For $35 per
hour, a lot of musicians will be wanting to get in there and won't be
worried about $1500 per day rates where they have to produce rather than
have the option to experiment. And if something positive comes of it in
the
national market, Sweet Spot just might make themselves noticed enough to
get
back into the sweet spot.

Besides, their mic selection does leave a little to be desired for a live
band type recording, as do their mic pres, if that's what they wanted to
base it on. Personally it wouldn't bother me one whit to track through
the
Neve in Studio A and mix on the SSL in Studio B without all the whiz-bang
names and I'd still get far more than my $35 per hour worth.

Hell, it might even be worth it to grab a couple of weeks between a number
of us that have things they want to record and not enough people to do the
job, and just go get all the stuff done. I'm not saying it wouldn't cost
because there's still hotel/motel rooms, etc., but hey 5, 6 or 8 qualified
musicians all going at one time could come up with all they want and do
all
of what the others want too. Get 10 or 15 groups of people doing the same
thing, sometimes moving in and out of other groups of people, and you
could
come up with some really good stuff. OK, so you could come up with some
real **** too, but if you don't do it, you don't even have ****! g

It's all a matter of perspective. One could even look at it from the
perspective of taking promising musicians or trainees, or simply call up
the
old band that never got to record. At $35 per hour ($420 per 12 hour day)
tons of work could get done, and all any one individual might have to do
is
come up with one day's worth of cash plus their own room at the motel and
some MickeyD's money. Well, there's travel too, but let's assume that
there
are 30 people within striking distance who could drive or take a bus or
train. That's way over $30000 worth of recording for $12,600.

Now I can drive to Cleveland in a day and I can afford to get a cheap
motel
room and eat some bad-for-you food. Anyone else want to make the drive,
the
stay and the recordings? The going price is $420 (plus your lodging) and
a
minimum of 10 people. That's 10 days of 12 hours worth of recording with
responding musicians for $420 dollars. ****, what a sweet spot deal! g

--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio
http://blogs.salon.com/0004478/
"Animix" wrote in message
...


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=7313800 921
&rd=1

On Sat, 9 Apr 2005 21:36:20 -0400, "Roger W. Norman"
wrote:

What's sad is places like the Hit Factory not noticing the writing on the
walls and coming up with just such a scheme to get people in.

I don't think you could afford to sell studio time that cheap in New
York... the overhead is probably a bit more than it is in Cleveland.

Al

On Sat, 09 Apr 2005 21:57:27 -0400, david wrote:

This price DOES include a top quality engineer!


Yaa. Sure.


The even sadder thing is that its been up for 3 days and no one has
clicked on their But It Now.

I think it's more of an ad than an auction. Ebay is the cheapest
worldwide advertising you can get.

Al

playon wrote:


Ebay is the cheapest worldwide advertising you can get.


Bingo.

Animix wrote:
I hope they make it. To me this looks like a last gasp effort. Here's hoping
I'm wrong.

Well, it could be that too.

I was just trying to say it's not *necessarily* a tragic situation.
It could just a clever little trick to squeeze out a few extra bucks
from a basically-healthy business and get new people to try out the
studio (and potentially be repeat customers) at the same time. Some
people are good at coming up with creative ideas like that to give
the business a boost.

- Logan

"Logan Shaw" wrote in message
...
Animix wrote:
I hope they make it. To me this looks like a last gasp effort. Here's
hoping
I'm wrong.

Well, it could be that too.

I was just trying to say it's not *necessarily* a tragic situation.
It could just a clever little trick to squeeze out a few extra bucks
from a basically-healthy business and get new people to try out the
studio (and potentially be repeat customers) at the same time. Some
people are good at coming up with creative ideas like that to give
the business a boost.


In that case I'd be more than a little worried about how my regular clients
would react to my offering the studio time for a fraction of what I charge
them.

Predrag

How much can you afford to just up and declare bankruptcy? Let's face it,
though. They had a long run of quality products from great musicians, a
couple of whom have actually recorded here! (really)

There are so many factors involved that it's actually pretty much impossible
to pinpoint why some companies go out of business. First and foremost is
attitude. This work can kill you young if you don't absolutely love it.
And if things start going bad it gets harder and harder to love. Some
landlords are greedy ****s that want more from your gross than you can give
and still have a positive net, particularly if your place becomes popular
and busy. Instead of being glad that someone is making it and able to pay
the rent, they drive the business out in order to garner another $1 per sq
ft (of course, for some places, that's easily another $20,000 per year).

There's also the constant and total uphill battle to remain current in the
equipment whilst still trying to maintain older equipment some of your
returning clients like.

Everything we go through as small project studios or even medium commercial
ventures can be multiplied exponentially by large facilities. The question
of "How do you make a million dollars with a recording studio? Start with
two million" is very appropriate and all too true.

--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio
http://blogs.salon.com/0004478/
"playon" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 9 Apr 2005 21:36:20 -0400, "Roger W. Norman"
wrote:

What's sad is places like the Hit Factory not noticing the writing on the
walls and coming up with just such a scheme to get people in.

I don't think you could afford to sell studio time that cheap in New
York... the overhead is probably a bit more than it is in Cleveland.

Al

And they don't sound too terribly desperate , so filling in the gap ?

regards Greg


"John L Rice" wrote in message
...

"Joe Sensor" wrote in message
...
Pooh Bear wrote:

Yes it *is* sad and shows how little record companies care about the
supporting industries. Then again what *do* record companies care about
?

I don't think it shows that at all. This is a business. If Cleveland
can't
support such a studio, and it looks like a very nice studio, how does
this
show how much or how little the record companies care about supporting
industries?

How are the rest of the studios in Cleveland fairing? Maybe this one
just
had a poor marketing strategy? Anyway, if anybody is in or near the
Cleveland area and wants to record, this looks like a great deal.

In fact, somebody in that area thinking about building their own home
studio might want to think twice, and save the thousands and thousands
they are about to part with and book some time there!

It does say that this rate is for their 'B' room too. Maybe their 'A'
room
is so much better that everyone uses it instead, even though it costs a
lot
more, and the B room has been gathering dust?
--
John L Rice

In article , Predrag Trpkov
wrote:

"Logan Shaw" wrote in message
...
Animix wrote:
I hope they make it. To me this looks like a last gasp effort. Here's
hoping
I'm wrong.

Well, it could be that too.

I was just trying to say it's not *necessarily* a tragic situation.
It could just a clever little trick to squeeze out a few extra bucks
from a basically-healthy business and get new people to try out the
studio (and potentially be repeat customers) at the same time. Some
people are good at coming up with creative ideas like that to give
the business a boost.


In that case I'd be more than a little worried about how my regular clients
would react to my offering the studio time for a fraction of what I charge
them.

Predrag



Predrag hit the nail on the head. They ain't chargin $35 an hour cuz
things are going good.

I have similiar feelings as Animix, watching big studios become
extinct. I'm the only big space left in my neck of the woods. It would
def be a loss for the local music community if I no longer existed, as
it is a great space that gets great sounds you cannot get in a basement
or a bedroom.

But it is the dollar bills that do the voting. We ain't the airline
industry or farmers or tobacco growers that get government handouts.




David Correia
Celebration Sound
Warren, Rhode Island


www.CelebrationSound.com