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#1
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RCA 77A mic
Does anybody have any experience with the various vintage RCA mics?
What is the difference in sound between the 77A and the 77B, B1, C, C1, D and DX and other ribbons? What do you think a fair price would be for a fully functional 77A with a new cable and the original desk stand? Thanks in advance... ....Moose |
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#2
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in article , Moose at
wrote on 6/20/04 1:07 AM: Does anybody have any experience with the various vintage RCA mics? What is the difference in sound between the 77A and the 77B, B1, C, C1, D and DX and other ribbons? What do you think a fair price would be for a fully functional 77A with a new cable and the original desk stand? 'fair'? something that rare would be whatever the owner wanted. You want one to COLLECT? or one to USE? If the latter, buy the AEA ribbon http://www.wesdooley.com/aea/R84.html -- John I-22 (that's 'I' for Initial...) Recognising what's NOT worth your time, THAT'S the key. -- |
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#3
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"Moose" wrote in message
... Does anybody have any experience with the various vintage RCA mics? What is the difference in sound between the 77A and the 77B, B1, C, C1, D and DX and other ribbons? The 77a was produced during the '30s and cardioid only. In fact it was the first cardioid mike ever made. -- Bob Olhsson Audio Mastery, Nashville TN Mastering, Audio for Picture, Mix Evaluation and Quality Control Over 40 years making people sound better than they ever imagined! 615.385.8051 http://www.hyperback.com |
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#4
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Moose: What is the difference in sound between the 77A and the 77B, B1, C,
C1, D and DX and other ribbons? I have a 77d and a 77dx. The main difference seems to be the transformer strappings. When strapped the same (I think mine are set up at 150 ohms), my humble ears cannot distinguish which is which. To be a bit more clear: the choices are indeed different on the two, but at least one, maybe two, are the same. If you really want to know the choices, let me know. |
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#5
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The dx has a slightly higher output than the d.
The a is a different animal altogether. It's huge and sounds pretty good for a mic that's very old. I recovered one once from the rafters of a church where it was the sole pickup mic for the service The c, i think that's the one with the pattern ring around the bottom of the mic and really barely exists any more. If you check the Vintage Microphones site, it commands a high price if one ever shows up My brother has one in his collection. RCA recalled most of them and replaced them with the c1. The dx was the last mic in the series and sounds best in my opinion in bi directional but it usually was used in cardiod in radio control rooms. The bk 5 is probably the best sounding unidiirectional but the best sounding bi directional to me is the 44bx and the BK 11 as the more modern version. I love RCA ribbons. Stephen Sank probably can give you a better review of the entire series as could Clarence Kane or Wes Dooley. Stephen hangs around this forum but I've never seen Clarence or Wes post here. These guys are the last living authorities on RCA ribbons with Clarence being the senior expert and all do re-ribboning and refurbishing of top calibre. On 20 Jun 2004 16:00:33 GMT, (Jim Kollens) wrote: Moose: What is the difference in sound between the 77A and the 77B, B1, C, C1, D and DX and other ribbons? I have a 77d and a 77dx. The main difference seems to be the transformer strappings. When strapped the same (I think mine are set up at 150 ohms), my humble ears cannot distinguish which is which. To be a bit more clear: the choices are indeed different on the two, but at least one, maybe two, are the same. If you really want to know the choices, let me know. Mike Cleaver Broadcast Services Voice-overs, Newscaster, Engineering and Consulting Vancouver, BC, Canada |
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#6
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In article ,
JoVee wrote: in article , Moose at wrote on 6/20/04 1:07 AM: Does anybody have any experience with the various vintage RCA mics? What is the difference in sound between the 77A and the 77B, B1, C, C1, D and DX and other ribbons? What do you think a fair price would be for a fully functional 77A with a new cable and the original desk stand? 'fair'? something that rare would be whatever the owner wanted. You want one to COLLECT? or one to USE? If the latter, buy the AEA ribbon http://www.wesdooley.com/aea/R84.html I disagree, since the 77 has adjustable patterns and more top end detail than the AEA has. The R84 is a good mike, but the 77DX is hard to beat. I think the difference between the 77 models is mostly in the pattern control. There was a ribbon assembly change too, that Mr. Sank will know far more about than I do. If you want to use it, you probably want the DX model, not only because it has the best pattern control, but because it is less collectable and therefore sells for a more reasonable price. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
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#7
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In article ,
JoVee wrote: in article , Moose at wrote on 6/20/04 1:07 AM: Does anybody have any experience with the various vintage RCA mics? What is the difference in sound between the 77A and the 77B, B1, C, C1, D and DX and other ribbons? What do you think a fair price would be for a fully functional 77A with a new cable and the original desk stand? 'fair'? something that rare would be whatever the owner wanted. You want one to COLLECT? or one to USE? If the latter, buy the AEA ribbon http://www.wesdooley.com/aea/R84.html I disagree, since the 77 has adjustable patterns and more top end detail than the AEA has. The R84 is a good mike, but the 77DX is hard to beat. I think the difference between the 77 models is mostly in the pattern control. There was a ribbon assembly change too, that Mr. Sank will know far more about than I do. If you want to use it, you probably want the DX model, not only because it has the best pattern control, but because it is less collectable and therefore sells for a more reasonable price. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
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#8
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Moose wrote in message . ..
What do you think a fair price would be for a fully functional 77A with a new cable and the original desk stand? I don't know about 'fair' but eBay is useful for calibrating current market value. If you do an advanced search for "RCA 77" and check the 'completed items' box, you'll see matching auctions that completed in the last month or so. Note that 'completed' doesn't mean 'sold' (might be no bid, or reserve not met). I just did so and found the following that actually sold in June: A dropped/dented 77DX for $761 A 77DX in seemingly good shape with case/cable for $1527 Another 77DX in seemingly good shape with case/cable for $1326 A banged-up 77D for $655 Sorry, no As, but I suspect that they would run a little less than the DX, even though they are rarer. DX seems to be the most sought-after model for reasons discussed in other posts in this thread. I've seen mint (or expertly refurbished) DXs go for $2k, $3K, and higher. --Da5id |
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#9
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Moose wrote in message . ..
What do you think a fair price would be for a fully functional 77A with a new cable and the original desk stand? I don't know about 'fair' but eBay is useful for calibrating current market value. If you do an advanced search for "RCA 77" and check the 'completed items' box, you'll see matching auctions that completed in the last month or so. Note that 'completed' doesn't mean 'sold' (might be no bid, or reserve not met). I just did so and found the following that actually sold in June: A dropped/dented 77DX for $761 A 77DX in seemingly good shape with case/cable for $1527 Another 77DX in seemingly good shape with case/cable for $1326 A banged-up 77D for $655 Sorry, no As, but I suspect that they would run a little less than the DX, even though they are rarer. DX seems to be the most sought-after model for reasons discussed in other posts in this thread. I've seen mint (or expertly refurbished) DXs go for $2k, $3K, and higher. --Da5id |
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#10
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77A's are so rare that I've yet to see one in person(and the couple I've seen sold have gone
$4-6K). I have done a number of 77-B's & C's, though, and I have to say that I think they sound much better than the 77D/DX to me, for usually about the same money. Kind of halfway between the D/DX sound & the big fat sound of a 44BX. The 77A/B/C are, indeed, completely different animals than the D/DX. They are double ribbon mics, with the top ribbon section being bipolar/velocity & the bottom section omni/pressure. The two sections are summed to produce the cardioid pattern, or, in the 77-C, a switch selects between omni, bipolar or cardioid by selecting either or both ribbon sections. The RCA KU-2 "Skunk mic" is also a double ribbon, and is basically a 77-B in a different body. This is the traditional idea of double ribbon design, as distinguished from the Beyer M130/M160, which simply have two ribbons sandwiched together to get usable output from a small magnet structure. The 77D/DX is a single ribbon, with a shutter plate on the back to vary backwave exposure for pattern control. The only difference between a D & a DX is a stronger AlnicoV magnet on the DX, producing 2dB higher rated output. -- Stephen Sank, Owner & Ribbon Mic Restorer Talking Dog Transducer Company http://stephensank.com 5517 Carmelita Drive N.E. Albuquerque, New Mexico [87111] 505-332-0336 Auth. Nakamichi & McIntosh servicer Payments preferred through Paypal.com "David Curtis" wrote in message om... Moose wrote in message . .. What do you think a fair price would be for a fully functional 77A with a new cable and the original desk stand? I don't know about 'fair' but eBay is useful for calibrating current market value. If you do an advanced search for "RCA 77" and check the 'completed items' box, you'll see matching auctions that completed in the last month or so. Note that 'completed' doesn't mean 'sold' (might be no bid, or reserve not met). I just did so and found the following that actually sold in June: A dropped/dented 77DX for $761 A 77DX in seemingly good shape with case/cable for $1527 Another 77DX in seemingly good shape with case/cable for $1326 A banged-up 77D for $655 Sorry, no As, but I suspect that they would run a little less than the DX, even though they are rarer. DX seems to be the most sought-after model for reasons discussed in other posts in this thread. I've seen mint (or expertly refurbished) DXs go for $2k, $3K, and higher. --Da5id |
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#11
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77A's are so rare that I've yet to see one in person(and the couple I've seen sold have gone
$4-6K). I have done a number of 77-B's & C's, though, and I have to say that I think they sound much better than the 77D/DX to me, for usually about the same money. Kind of halfway between the D/DX sound & the big fat sound of a 44BX. The 77A/B/C are, indeed, completely different animals than the D/DX. They are double ribbon mics, with the top ribbon section being bipolar/velocity & the bottom section omni/pressure. The two sections are summed to produce the cardioid pattern, or, in the 77-C, a switch selects between omni, bipolar or cardioid by selecting either or both ribbon sections. The RCA KU-2 "Skunk mic" is also a double ribbon, and is basically a 77-B in a different body. This is the traditional idea of double ribbon design, as distinguished from the Beyer M130/M160, which simply have two ribbons sandwiched together to get usable output from a small magnet structure. The 77D/DX is a single ribbon, with a shutter plate on the back to vary backwave exposure for pattern control. The only difference between a D & a DX is a stronger AlnicoV magnet on the DX, producing 2dB higher rated output. -- Stephen Sank, Owner & Ribbon Mic Restorer Talking Dog Transducer Company http://stephensank.com 5517 Carmelita Drive N.E. Albuquerque, New Mexico [87111] 505-332-0336 Auth. Nakamichi & McIntosh servicer Payments preferred through Paypal.com "David Curtis" wrote in message om... Moose wrote in message . .. What do you think a fair price would be for a fully functional 77A with a new cable and the original desk stand? I don't know about 'fair' but eBay is useful for calibrating current market value. If you do an advanced search for "RCA 77" and check the 'completed items' box, you'll see matching auctions that completed in the last month or so. Note that 'completed' doesn't mean 'sold' (might be no bid, or reserve not met). I just did so and found the following that actually sold in June: A dropped/dented 77DX for $761 A 77DX in seemingly good shape with case/cable for $1527 Another 77DX in seemingly good shape with case/cable for $1326 A banged-up 77D for $655 Sorry, no As, but I suspect that they would run a little less than the DX, even though they are rarer. DX seems to be the most sought-after model for reasons discussed in other posts in this thread. I've seen mint (or expertly refurbished) DXs go for $2k, $3K, and higher. --Da5id |
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#13
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Steven, thanks for the descriptions. I recommended the AEA 84 (still am as
both a results and price/practicality thing) and -was- going to post that 'why' is that I've never met 77 that I like, esp compared to a 44 or say a 639A Altec, but now you teach me that it's important that all of the 77's I've played with were -D- versions with the shutter thingie and only the full open bipolar setting held any sense of character for me. in article , Stephen Sank at wrote on 6/24/04 5:11 AM: The 77A/B/C are, indeed, completely different animals than the D/DX. They are double ribbon mics, with the top ribbon section being bipolar/velocity & the bottom section omni/pressure. The two sections are summed to produce the cardioid pattern, or, in the 77-C, a switch selects between omni, bipolar or cardioid by selecting either or both ribbon sections. ... The 77D/DX is a single ribbon, with a shutter plate on the back to vary backwave exposure for pattern control. The only difference between a D & a DX is a stronger AlnicoV magnet on the DX, producing 2dB higher rated output. "David Curtis" wrote in message om... Moose wrote in message . .. What do you think a fair price would be for a fully functional 77A with a new cable and the original desk stand? -- John I-22 (that's 'I' for Initial...) Recognising what's NOT worth your time, THAT'S the key. -- |
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