I have an Alesis Studio 32 mixer that makes a "seashore" noise in the
right outputs of both subgroups and in the main output. The source of
the noise in channel-11, and it's there regardless of the position of
the mute and pan controls for that channel.

To further describe the "seashore" noise, its a hissy, static-y (like AM
radios during a thunderstorm) sound with occasional deeper rumbles.

Although the problem has also surfaced on channel-6, it's most
reproducable in channel-11. It will start a few minutes after the mixer
is turned on, then will quiet down for hours at a time before
re-occuring. No signal needs to be present on any channel for this
problem to manifest.

Before I open this thing (or send it out for repair), I'd like to have
some idea of what components are the likely culprits.

Any ideas?

On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 20:00:26 GMT, GaryMedia
wrote:

a "seashore" noise

Any ideas?

A can of freeze spray is very handy for this kind of
problem, sometimes combined with a hair drier. Often
these culprits are thermally sensitive.

Good fortune,

Chris Hornbeck
"Shi mian mai fu"

GoobAudio philsaudio-remove this and the wrote:
Semiconductor signal devices. IC's or discrete in the
signal path can do that. The part must be replaced.
Send it to a pro. Usually happens when things warm up
though. Odd.

Is the Alesis Studio 32 one of the Alesis mixers with the carbon pot and
fader elements fabricated on the PC board? If so, it's due to one of the
deposited resistors failing and there isn't much to be done about it.
--scott


--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Scott Dorsey wrote:

GoobAudio philsaudio-remove this and the wrote:
Semiconductor signal devices. IC's or discrete in the
signal path can do that. The part must be replaced.
Send it to a pro. Usually happens when things warm up
though. Odd.

Is the Alesis Studio 32 one of the Alesis mixers with the carbon pot and
fader elements fabricated on the PC board? If so, it's due to one of the
deposited resistors failing and there isn't much to be done about it.

They screened pot tracks onto the pcb ?

What cheapskates ! The ultimate unrepairable mixer.


Graham

"Pooh Bear" wrote:

Scott Dorsey wrote:

GoobAudio philsaudio-remove this and the wrote:
Semiconductor signal devices. IC's or discrete in the
signal path can do that. The part must be replaced.
Send it to a pro. Usually happens when things warm up
though. Odd.

Is the Alesis Studio 32 one of the Alesis mixers with the carbon pot and
fader elements fabricated on the PC board? If so, it's due to one of
the
deposited resistors failing and there isn't much to be done about it.

They screened pot tracks onto the pcb ?

What cheapskates ! The ultimate unrepairable mixer.

Well... to be fair it was a 32 channel mixer that sold for maybe $5-600.
They had to get the price down somehow.

At that price you could buy three or four spares before you'd spent as much
as one actually serviceable mixer.

-jw

In article writes:

Is the Alesis Studio 32 one of the Alesis mixers with the carbon pot and
fader elements fabricated on the PC board?

Nope, they only made one of those, the 1622 Monolithic/Integrated
Surface (TM) Audio Console. The Studio series is a conventional
construction with real parts.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 22:38:52 +0000, Pooh Bear
wrote:

Is the Alesis Studio 32 one of the Alesis mixers with the carbon pot and
fader elements fabricated on the PC board? If so, it's due to one of the
deposited resistors failing and there isn't much to be done about it.

They screened pot tracks onto the pcb ?

What cheapskates ! The ultimate unrepairable mixer. snip

This goes for ALL Alesis gear...good performance UNTIL something goes
tits up, then it's disposable. You get what you pay for.

dB

This goes for ALL Alesis gear...good performance UNTIL something goes
tits up, then it's disposable. You get what you pay for.

dB

IMO generally speaking it can have its disadvantages before it goes wrong.

ROb

"GaryMedia"

I have an Alesis Studio 32 mixer that makes a "seashore" noise in the right
outputs of both subgroups and in the main output. The source of the noise
in channel-11, and it's there regardless of the position of the mute and
pan controls for that channel.

To further describe the "seashore" noise, its a hissy, static-y (like AM
radios during a thunderstorm) sound with occasional deeper rumbles.

Although the problem has also surfaced on channel-6, it's most
reproducable in channel-11. It will start a few minutes after the mixer
is turned on, then will quiet down for hours at a time before re-occuring.
No signal needs to be present on any channel for this problem to manifest.

Before I open this thing (or send it out for repair), I'd like to have
some idea of what components are the likely culprits.



** Had any spillages on it lately ??

Sometimes electro caps leak their juice and cause such noises.

Or, as others have said, bad op-amp ICs.




............. Phil

in article , Chris Hornbeck at
wrote on 12/10/04 12:29 PM:

Good fortune,

Chris Hornbeck
"Shi mian mai fu"

Do you play pipa or just like Chinese music in general?

Carlos

On Sat, 11 Dec 2004 05:40:28 -0800, Carlos Alden
wrote:

Do you play pipa or just like Chinese music in general?

Sadly, neither. Just a movie. Can you translate?

Thanks,

Chris Hornbeck
"Shi mian mai fu"

Pooh Bear wrote:
Scott Dorsey wrote:

GoobAudio philsaudio-remove this and the wrote:
Semiconductor signal devices. IC's or discrete in the
signal path can do that. The part must be replaced.
Send it to a pro. Usually happens when things warm up
though. Odd.

Is the Alesis Studio 32 one of the Alesis mixers with the carbon pot and
fader elements fabricated on the PC board? If so, it's due to one of the
deposited resistors failing and there isn't much to be done about it.

They screened pot tracks onto the pcb ?
What cheapskates ! The ultimate unrepairable mixer.

The Alesis ones were not only unrepairable but also unreliable. They quickly
developed a reputation as being a disaster and Alesis dropped the line and
stayed out of mixers completely for a few years after that.

But I do not remember if the Studio 32 is one of the nightmares or one of
the ones made a few years later when they had learned their lesson.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

GaryMedia wrote:
I have an Alesis Studio 32 mixer that makes a "seashore" noise in the
right outputs of both subgroups and in the main output. The source of
the noise in channel-11, and it's there regardless of the position of
the mute and pan controls for that channel.

To further describe the "seashore" noise, its a hissy, static-y (like AM
radios during a thunderstorm) sound with occasional deeper rumbles.

Although the problem has also surfaced on channel-6, it's most
reproducable in channel-11. It will start a few minutes after the mixer
is turned on, then will quiet down for hours at a time before
re-occuring. No signal needs to be present on any channel for this
problem to manifest.

Before I open this thing (or send it out for repair), I'd like to have
some idea of what components are the likely culprits.

Any ideas?


If you decide on a low cost replacment I have two Behringer 3242's for
sale perfect condition 350.00
george

It's almost ironic that you'd offer the Behringer 3242's. This all
started because I had two Behringer MX3242X's and added a third for my
home studio. I fired up a mix that I had been working on thru my Alesis
Studio 24 (not a typo, ...just follow the story) and listened to it thru
the MX3242X.

I was surprised at the difference in sound. There had been all kinds of
impolite and downright degrading commentary on this newsgroup and others
about Behringer sound, but this was the first time that I had an
opportunity to do some A/B comparisons in a controlled and known
environment.

After about 2 hours of going back and forth between the Studio 24 and
the MX3242X, I concluded that it was the handling of low-level signal
information that causes the downfall in the Behringer sound quality.
That is, the little reverb tails and soft decay edges of a variety of
instruments don't fade into the noise floor as gently as they do in the
Alesis. There was a secondary effect in that the bass seemed louder
relative to the rest of the mix when played thru the Behringer even
though the EQ controls were bypassed.

I'm not sure of which specification would affect this phenomenon the
most (THD+N?) but that was the only arena in the spec sheets where the
products differed in any great respect.

The subjective effect of the "rapid fade" problem in the MX3242X is that
the music is "dry", and "loses dimension" and is "flat" and certainly
less emotionally satisfying. It is much the same effect as like losing
bit resolution. The overall intuitive effect is quite surprising and
for the first time I understood a lot more about the reactions of people
who prefer the analog world.

Just as people have different visual sensitivities to vertical scan
rates in CRT monitors (some can tolerate 60hz and don't notice the
flicker, while it absolutely drives me out of the room), I imagine that
people have difference emotional sensitivities to the low-level
information in audio recordings.

Going back to THD+N as a suspect, I took the time to translate the
traditional percentage specification into dB in order to get a better
feel for what numbers the relationships are.

Behringer MX3242X THD+N = 0.005% = -86dB
Alesis Studio 24 and 32 THD+N = 0.001% = -100dB

Checking through some of my other equipment and looking around on the
web *almost* convinced me that I was on to something in that the
Focusrite, dbx, MOTU 1224 all had this spec in the -100 dB or better
ranges ...even the Studio Projects VTB-1 was at -97dB.

The theory took a torpedo in the side when I looked at the Avalon
preamps. The AD2022 had a spec of 0.05% for distortion which is -66dB.

Either that figure is a typo, or just more evidence that clearly
something else is going on here in the world of audio. Anyway, I
thought y'all would like read about my little rabbit trail of research.
The best quote I've read on this topic is "Reading specifications will
make you deaf."

The rest of the story is that I bought two Alesis Studio 32's to replace
the Behringers, and one turned up with a bad channel-11, so that
prompted this thread.


George Gleason wrote:
GaryMedia wrote:

I have an Alesis Studio 32 mixer that makes a "seashore" noise in the
right outputs of both subgroups and in the main output. The source of
the noise in channel-11, and it's there regardless of the position of
the mute and pan controls for that channel.

To further describe the "seashore" noise, its a hissy, static-y (like
AM radios during a thunderstorm) sound with occasional deeper rumbles.

Although the problem has also surfaced on channel-6, it's most
reproducable in channel-11. It will start a few minutes after the
mixer is turned on, then will quiet down for hours at a time before
re-occuring. No signal needs to be present on any channel for this
problem to manifest.

Before I open this thing (or send it out for repair), I'd like to have
some idea of what components are the likely culprits.

Any ideas?



If you decide on a low cost replacment I have two Behringer 3242's for
sale perfect condition 350.00
george

In article writes:

The Alesis [1622] were not only unrepairable but also unreliable. They quickly
developed a reputation as being a disaster and Alesis dropped the line and
stayed out of mixers completely for a few years after that.

I thought that the X2, a large format 8-bus console, came out while
the 1622 was still in production, but I can't confim that from the
catalogs I have on file. I have a 1989 brochure with the 1622, but the
earliest reference I have to the X2 is a 1995 price list, and I'm sure
it was out before that.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

thanks for your information
I only do live sound and none of this would ever come to light at a live gig
George

Mike Rivers wrote:


I thought that the X2, a large format 8-bus console, came out while
the 1622 was still in production, but I can't confim that from the
catalogs I have on file. I have a 1989 brochure with the 1622, but the
earliest reference I have to the X2 is a 1995 price list, and I'm sure
it was out before that.

I think the X2 came out about 93' or 94'.

I agree that none of this would come to light at most live gigs, and so
my MX3242x is being sold to a youth group that does really loud live
rock. I doubt that gentle reverb tails get much attention in that
environment. :-)

George Gleason wrote:

thanks for your information
I only do live sound and none of this would ever come to light at a live
gig
George

Do you play pipa or just like Chinese music in general?

Sadly, neither. Just a movie. Can you translate?

Thanks,

Chris Hornbeck
"Shi mian mai fu"

Shi Mian Mai Fu ("Sure mien my foo") means "Ambush from all sides (lit. ten
sides) and is the name of a famous pipa (lute like instrument) piece
portraying a famous historical battle about 200 BC. Lots of percussive
sounds and wailing cries of dying soldiers. Didn't realize it was a movie,
or from a movie. If so, it'd be lot like "Hero."

Carlos

On Sat, 11 Dec 2004 18:19:17 -0800, Carlos Alden
wrote:

Shi Mian Mai Fu ("Sure mien my foo") means "Ambush from all sides (lit. ten
sides) and is the name of a famous pipa (lute like instrument) piece
portraying a famous historical battle about 200 BC. Lots of percussive
sounds and wailing cries of dying soldiers. Didn't realize it was a movie,
or from a movie. If so, it'd be lot like "Hero."

Thank you very much. I'm a big Zhang YiMou fan, and it will likely
be very much like _Hero_. The American release title is _House of
Flying Daggers_ and hasn't reached this far into the boonies yet.

I don't know if it'll have a Tan Dun soundtrack either, but worse
things could happen.

If you're a fan of Zhang or Chen Kaige, or even Ang Lee, it might be
worth a couple hours. For me, he's *the* cinematographer of my
generation. Who would Godard have been without Coutard? Who would
Hal Hartley be without Michael Spiller?

Thanks again very much for the translation. I thought that "ambushed
from ten sides" was a funny newsgroup sig. Maybe.

Chris Hornbeck
"Shi mian mai fu"

in article , Chris Hornbeck at
wrote on 12/11/04 6:36 PM:

Thank you very much. I'm a big Zhang YiMou fan, and it will likely
be very much like _Hero_. The American release title is _House of
Flying Daggers_ and hasn't reached this far into the boonies yet.

WoW! I didn't know this was even out there. Thanks for the heads-up! It's
on my Christmas list, right next to "Hero." However, reading the film's
description puts it at the end of the Tang Dynasty, c. 750 AD, and it sounds
like the plot is different from what the song title is actually about.
Perhaps they just borrowed the title. It's all cool, though, and anything
by Ang Lee or Zhang Yi-Mou is fine by me. Always another way to practice my
Chinese listening skills.

By the way, if you're at all a fan of Chinese music you ought to check out
Shi Mian Mai Fu. It is THE classic Pipa song. Almost 7 minutes of
pyrotechnics depicting flying arrows, flashing swords, war drums, dying
soldiers - the whole shebang.

Carlos

George Gleason wrote:

thanks for your information
I only do live sound and none of this would ever come to light at a live gig
George

That's for sure - LMAO ! ;-)

It's an interesting subject though. I'm tempted to post more regarding other
product comparisons.


Graham

"GaryMedia" wrote in message
...

Going back to THD+N as a suspect, I took the time to translate the
traditional percentage specification into dB in order to get a better
feel for what numbers the relationships are.

Behringer MX3242X THD+N = 0.005% = -86dB
Alesis Studio 24 and 32 THD+N = 0.001% = -100dB

Checking through some of my other equipment and looking around on the
web *almost* convinced me that I was on to something in that the
Focusrite, dbx, MOTU 1224 all had this spec in the -100 dB or better
ranges ...even the Studio Projects VTB-1 was at -97dB.

The theory took a torpedo in the side when I looked at the Avalon
preamps. The AD2022 had a spec of 0.05% for distortion which is -66dB.

Either that figure is a typo, or just more evidence that clearly
something else is going on here in the world of audio.

The latter, I'd say. THD, or THD+N, is essentially a meaningless number
without (a) information on the conditions under which it's being measured
(level, load impedance, settings, etc.); (b) information on what frequencies
are being measured; and, most important, (c) information on the harmonic
spectrum produced. A low level of 7th harmonic distortion is a lot more
audible than higher levels of 2nd.

Backing up for a minute, THD is just one way of mapping the nonlinearities
of an amplifier circuit, and for most modern equipment, not a very good one.
IMD measurements can sometimes be more revealing, but we still haven't found
a way to map these nonlinearities in a way that correlates perfectly with
audibility, except in extremely bad cases (e.g., somethiing that measures
30% THD under normal operating conditions is likely to sound distorted).

Peace,
Paul

On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 06:57:55 -0800, Carlos Alden
wrote:

It's
on my Christmas list, right next to "Hero."
Always another way to practice my
Chinese listening skills.

www.edaymovie.com has very affordable Chinese (?) versions of
both of these. Also unobtainium like _Raise the Red Lantern_
and _The Story of Qui Ju_.

Navigation is pretty funny for an illiterate like me, but
English subtitles for the feature. They play and look just
fine.

By the way, if you're at all a fan of Chinese music you ought to check out
Shi Mian Mai Fu. It is THE classic Pipa song. Almost 7 minutes of
pyrotechnics depicting flying arrows, flashing swords, war drums, dying
soldiers - the whole shebang.

Thanks much. Will do.

Chris Hornbeck
"If we gave your unit armor, we'd have to give
it to everybody" -Big Don

Pooh Bear wrote:

Scott Dorsey wrote:

GoobAudio philsaudio-remove this and the wrote:
Semiconductor signal devices. IC's or discrete in the
signal path can do that. The part must be replaced.
Send it to a pro. Usually happens when things warm up
though. Odd.

Is the Alesis Studio 32 one of the Alesis mixers with the carbon pot and
fader elements fabricated on the PC board? If so, it's due to one of the
deposited resistors failing and there isn't much to be done about it.

They screened pot tracks onto the pcb ?

What cheapskates ! The ultimate unrepairable mixer.

Graham

Done right it can work well - I've not seen any complaints about the
switches on the Revox B77.

Cheers.

James.

James Perrett wrote:

Done right it can work well - I've not seen any complaints about the
switches on the Revox B77.

You haven't? They are a total disaster... when they work, they work fine,
but when they break, they break totally and the cost of repair is higher than
the cost of a new machine. That was the main reason that so many folks were
taking the A77 route instead of buying the newer machines. And they are the
only reason that I would not recommend the B77 today.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message
...
James Perrett wrote:

Done right it can work well - I've not seen any complaints about the
switches on the Revox B77.

You haven't? They are a total disaster... when they work, they work fine,
but when they break, they break totally and the cost of repair is higher
than
the cost of a new machine. That was the main reason that so many folks
were
taking the A77 route instead of buying the newer machines. And they are
the
only reason that I would not recommend the B77 today.

Don't forget the toggles on the record-enable switches that acted like a
vortex, grabbing every stray shirt cuff and breaking off.

Peace,
Paul

"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message
...
Pooh Bear wrote:
Scott Dorsey wrote:

GoobAudio philsaudio-remove this and the
wrote:
Semiconductor signal devices. IC's or discrete in the
signal path can do that. The part must be replaced.
Send it to a pro. Usually happens when things warm up
though. Odd.

Is the Alesis Studio 32 one of the Alesis mixers with the carbon pot
and
fader elements fabricated on the PC board? If so, it's due to one of
the
deposited resistors failing and there isn't much to be done about it.

They screened pot tracks onto the pcb ?
What cheapskates ! The ultimate unrepairable mixer.

The Alesis ones were not only unrepairable but also unreliable. They
quickly
developed a reputation as being a disaster and Alesis dropped the line and
stayed out of mixers completely for a few years after that.

But I do not remember if the Studio 32 is one of the nightmares or one of
the ones made a few years later when they had learned their lesson.
--scott

The Studio 32 is one of the more recent ones, almost exactly equivelant to a
Behringer. Nothing surface mounted, just flimsy.

jb

Paul Stamler wrote:

"Scott Dorsey" wrote in message
...
James Perrett wrote:

Done right it can work well - I've not seen any complaints about the
switches on the Revox B77.

You haven't? They are a total disaster... when they work, they work fine,
but when they break, they break totally and the cost of repair is higher
than
the cost of a new machine. That was the main reason that so many folks
were
taking the A77 route instead of buying the newer machines. And they are
the
only reason that I would not recommend the B77 today.

Don't forget the toggles on the record-enable switches that acted like a
vortex, grabbing every stray shirt cuff and breaking off.

Peace,
Paul

I guess I've been lucky - I've only had to replace one switch in about
20 years on my B77 but, yes, it was because the switch lever had been
knocked off.

Cheers.

James.