Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current Sony piece
of junk. I would also consider separate transport and tube processor.

My system is:

Brentworth Sound Lab Type IV speakers

Art Audio Diavolo amp

CAT SL-1 Ultimate preamp

RPM-2 turntable and arm with Lyra Helikon cartridge

McIntosh MR71 and MR66 tuners

Tandberg TD20A SE tape deck



What are the ones worth checking out?



Öökintölli

ToobZ!

Öökintölli wrote:

Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current Sony piece
of junk. I would also consider separate transport and tube processor.

My system is:

Brentworth Sound Lab Type IV speakers

Art Audio Diavolo amp

CAT SL-1 Ultimate preamp

RPM-2 turntable and arm with Lyra Helikon cartridge

McIntosh MR71 and MR66 tuners

Tandberg TD20A SE tape deck



What are the ones worth checking out?




If you are at all handy inside audio equipment, you may try modifying your
"piece of junk Sony". Take a look at my page:
http://home.netcom.com/~wa2ise/radios/tubedac.htm

Something else to try is to load the audio op-amp outputs with a resistor
to either a positive or a negative supply, say 12 to 24V DC.
Whatever a well filtered supply of these voltage levels is
present inside the player will do.
Select the resistor so you are drawing a few ma from the op-amp
at all times thruout the entire audio waveform. This makes the
op-amp behave as if it were single ended, thus avoiding class B
crossover distortion products (which the op-amp's feedback
loop tries to correct for, but some still gets thru). Some op-amps
benefit greatly, some this doesn't help. But this is an easy mod
to try.

Öökintölli wrote:

Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current Sony piece
of junk. I would also consider separate transport and tube processor.

My system is:

Brentworth Sound Lab Type IV speakers

Art Audio Diavolo amp

CAT SL-1 Ultimate preamp

RPM-2 turntable and arm with Lyra Helikon cartridge

McIntosh MR71 and MR66 tuners

Tandberg TD20A SE tape deck



What are the ones worth checking out?



Öökintölli

ToobZ!



You could try http://www.scott-nixon.com/dac.htm, I know of someone
building one, but as yet no reports.

--
Nick

Again that E88CC ........ :-(

"Nick Gorham" schreef in bericht
. ..
Öökintölli wrote:

Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current Sony
piece
of junk. I would also consider separate transport and tube processor.

My system is:

Brentworth Sound Lab Type IV speakers

Art Audio Diavolo amp

CAT SL-1 Ultimate preamp

RPM-2 turntable and arm with Lyra Helikon cartridge

McIntosh MR71 and MR66 tuners

Tandberg TD20A SE tape deck



What are the ones worth checking out?



Öökintölli

ToobZ!



You could try http://www.scott-nixon.com/dac.htm, I know of someone
building one, but as yet no reports.

--
Nick

"Nick Gorham" wrote in message


You could try http://www.scott-nixon.com/dac.htm, I know of someone
building one, but as yet no reports.

I'm *surprised* that none of our local HTML gurus have pointed out the
incompetent design of this web site. It's pretty obvious if you click any of
the links on the home page.

Actually, I'm not surprised at all, because these losers only go into HTML
critic mode if they disagree with the author or subject matter on the site.

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 10:15:32 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"Nick Gorham" wrote in message
om

You could try http://www.scott-nixon.com/dac.htm, I know of someone
building one, but as yet no reports.

I'm *surprised* that none of our local HTML gurus have pointed out the
incompetent design of this web site. It's pretty obvious if you click any of
the links on the home page.

Actually, I'm not surprised at all, because these losers only go into HTML
critic mode if they disagree with the author or subject matter on the site.

You mean like you're doing right now?

Thanks for pointing out a good example of such despicable behavior,
Arnold!

"dave weil" wrote in message

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 10:15:32 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"Nick Gorham" wrote in message


You could try http://www.scott-nixon.com/dac.htm, I know of someone
building one, but as yet no reports.

I'm *surprised* that none of our local HTML gurus have pointed out
the incompetent design of this web site. It's pretty obvious if you
click any of the links on the home page.

Actually, I'm not surprised at all, because these losers only go
into HTML critic mode if they disagree with the author or subject
matter on the site.

You mean like you're doing right now?

Wrong. I'd have pointed out the incompetent design regardless of the site's
content.

Thanks for pointing out a good example of such despicable behavior,
Arnold!

You're just making this up as you go along, Weil.

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 11:45:25 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"dave weil" wrote in message

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 10:15:32 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"Nick Gorham" wrote in message


You could try http://www.scott-nixon.com/dac.htm, I know of someone
building one, but as yet no reports.

I'm *surprised* that none of our local HTML gurus have pointed out
the incompetent design of this web site. It's pretty obvious if you
click any of the links on the home page.

Actually, I'm not surprised at all, because these losers only go
into HTML critic mode if they disagree with the author or subject
matter on the site.

You mean like you're doing right now?

Wrong. I'd have pointed out the incompetent design regardless of the site's
content.

So you say. Why haven't you pointed out your *own* incompetent design
then?

BTW, the design of the noted web site would be better served by
individual pages instead of one long scrolling page. The fact that
each link takes you to the top of the page isn't particularly onerous,
and could be corrected pretty easily. I assume that's what you're
talking about in terms of "incompetence". It's still a lot easier to
get the information on that web site than trying to negotiate through
your web of information.

*Your* web sites are an alarming mishmash of formatting and design
cues, veritable Frankensteins of web sites.

Thanks for pointing out a good example of such despicable behavior,
Arnold!

You're just making this up as you go along, Weil.

Nope. You're being disengenuous when you claim to to picking on this
web sitefor any other reason other than the fact that you despise tube
techonolgy. There's no other reason why you'd go to the lengths you
have to pick on a site that is generally pretty cleanly designed (from
a visual standpoint).

"Öökintölli" wrote in message


Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current Sony
piece of junk. I would also consider separate transport and tube
processor.

There is no such thing as a tube optical disc player. There never will be
such a thing. Were such a thing to be built, it would be the size of a house
or larger. What you may find some day is a solid state optical disc player
with a few thermionic noise and distortion enhancers slapped on, right
before the output terminals. Why would someone who is interested in pure
natural sound want such a thing?

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 06:09:00 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"Öökintölli" wrote in message
om

Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current Sony
piece of junk. I would also consider separate transport and tube
processor.

There is no such thing as a tube optical disc player. There never will be
such a thing. Were such a thing to be built, it would be the size of a house
or larger. What you may find some day is a solid state optical disc player
with a few thermionic noise and distortion enhancers slapped on, right
before the output terminals. Why would someone who is interested in pure
natural sound want such a thing?

Just to **** you off?

"dave weil" wrote in message
news
On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 06:09:00 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"Öökintölli" wrote in message


Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current
Sony piece of junk. I would also consider separate transport and
tube processor.

There is no such thing as a tube optical disc player. There never
will be such a thing. Were such a thing to be built, it would be the
size of a house or larger. What you may find some day is a solid
state optical disc player with a few thermionic noise and distortion
enhancers slapped on, right before the output terminals. Why would
someone who is interested in pure natural sound want such a thing?

Just to **** you off?

If you're observing that the original post was probably just a troll...

;-)

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 09:25:28 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"dave weil" wrote in message
news
On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 06:09:00 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"Öökintölli" wrote in message


Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current
Sony piece of junk. I would also consider separate transport and
tube processor.

There is no such thing as a tube optical disc player. There never
will be such a thing. Were such a thing to be built, it would be the
size of a house or larger. What you may find some day is a solid
state optical disc player with a few thermionic noise and distortion
enhancers slapped on, right before the output terminals. Why would
someone who is interested in pure natural sound want such a thing?

Just to **** you off?

If you're observing that the original post was probably just a troll...

;-)

Or maybe they knew that you'd post a typically biased and useless
answer...

;-) (just for you, Arnold)

"dave weil" wrote in message

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 09:25:28 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"dave weil" wrote in message
news
On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 06:09:00 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"Öökintölli" wrote in message


Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current
Sony piece of junk. I would also consider separate transport and
tube processor.

There is no such thing as a tube optical disc player. There never
will be such a thing. Were such a thing to be built, it would be
the size of a house or larger. What you may find some day is a
solid state optical disc player with a few thermionic noise and
distortion enhancers slapped on, right before the output
terminals. Why would someone who is interested in pure natural
sound want such a thing?

Just to **** you off?

If you're observing that the original post was probably just a
troll...

;-)

Or maybe they knew that you'd post a typically biased and useless
answer...

As if you don't flood this place with biased and useless posts of your own,
Weil.

;-) (just for you, Arnold)

On that day in the distant future when you find your first clue Weil, why
not post again?

LOL!

Arny Krueger wrote:
"dave weil" wrote in message
news
On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 06:09:00 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:


"Öökintölli" wrote in message
om


Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current
Sony piece of junk. I would also consider separate transport and
tube processor.

There is no such thing as a tube optical disc player. There never
will be such a thing. Were such a thing to be built, it would be the
size of a house or larger. What you may find some day is a solid
state optical disc player with a few thermionic noise and distortion
enhancers slapped on, right before the output terminals. Why would
someone who is interested in pure natural sound want such a thing?

Just to **** you off?


If you're observing that the original post was probably just a troll...

;-)

No, I don't think it was an intentional troll. However, I think it was
very naive of the OP to cross-post his question to r.a.o.

Oh well. I'm sure he'll know better next time.

Cheers,
Fred
--
+--------------------------------------------+
| Music: http://www3.telus.net/dogstarmusic/ |
| Projects, Vacuum Tubes & other stuff: |
| http://www.dogstar.dantimax.dk |
+--------------------------------------------+

Fred Nachbaur said to ****-for-Brains:

No, I don't think it was an intentional troll. However, I think it was
very naive of the OP to cross-post his question to r.a.o.

Oh well. I'm sure he'll know better next time.

Indeed. One sliming by the Krooborg is enough for any Normal.

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

There


**** off, retard.


Öökintölli

ToobZ!

"Öökintölli" wrote in message


"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

There

**** off, retard.

Thanks for the evidence required to place your IQ in the lower two digit
range.

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 10:24:33 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"Öökintölli" wrote in message
om

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

There

**** off, retard.

Thanks for the evidence required to place your IQ in the lower two digit
range.

Actually, it showed a high level of intelligence to cut you off at the
knees like that.

"dave weil" wrote in message

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 10:24:33 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"Öökintölli" wrote in message


"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

There

**** off, retard.

Thanks for the evidence required to place your IQ in the lower two
digit range.

Actually, it showed a high level of intelligence to cut you off at the
knees like that.

If you think that crude epithets constitute "cutting off at the knees" Weil,
then we've got your IQ pegged at well below that of a carrot.

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 14:19:39 GMT, "Öökintölli"
wrote:


"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

There


**** off, retard.


Öökintölli

ToobZ!

THAT'S what I call a preemptive strike!

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 06:09:00 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"Öökintölli" wrote in message
om

Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current Sony
piece of junk. I would also consider separate transport and tube
processor.

There is no such thing as a tube optical disc player. There never will be
such a thing. Were such a thing to be built, it would be the size of a house
or larger. What you may find some day is a solid state optical disc player
with a few thermionic noise and distortion enhancers slapped on, right
before the output terminals. Why would someone who is interested in pure
natural sound want such a thing?

I really hate to come to Arnie's defense but the use of tubes in any
silver-disc player is limited to the analog/output stages. As a
result, you may have more success finding a suitable tube-based DAC
with multiple inputs and controls to mate with a transport than you
will in finding a tube-containing player that does everything you
need.

Kal

In article ,
Kalman Rubinson wrote:

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 06:09:00 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"Öökintölli" wrote in message
om

Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current Sony
piece of junk. I would also consider separate transport and tube
processor.

There is no such thing as a tube optical disc player. There never will be
such a thing. Were such a thing to be built, it would be the size of a house
or larger. What you may find some day is a solid state optical disc player
with a few thermionic noise and distortion enhancers slapped on, right
before the output terminals. Why would someone who is interested in pure
natural sound want such a thing?

I really hate to come to Arnie's defense but the use of tubes in any
silver-disc player is limited to the analog/output stages.

That's the commonly accepted view. It's Arny who is adopting a peculiar
definition.

See a similar RAO thread about "tubed cd players".

... As a
result, you may have more success finding a suitable tube-based DAC
with multiple inputs and controls to mate with a transport than you
will in finding a tube-containing player that does everything you
need.

Be prepared to have "tube-based DAC" redefined as, "solid state with a
few thermionic noise and distortion enhancers slapped on."

Stephen

"MiNe 109" wrote in message

In article ,
Kalman Rubinson wrote:

On Wed, 16 Jul 2003 06:09:00 -0400, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

"Öökintölli" wrote in message


Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current
Sony piece of junk. I would also consider separate transport and
tube processor.

There is no such thing as a tube optical disc player. There never
will be such a thing. Were such a thing to be built, it would be
the size of a house or larger. What you may find some day is a
solid state optical disc player with a few thermionic noise and
distortion enhancers slapped on, right before the output terminals.
Why would someone who is interested in pure natural sound want such
a thing?

I really hate to come to Arnie's defense but the use of tubes in any
silver-disc player is limited to the analog/output stages.

That's the commonly accepted view. It's Arny who is adopting a
peculiar definition.

There's nothing wrong with calling something what it is. Stephen, if you
think that calling walnut veneer solid walnut, please chime in.

See a similar RAO thread about "tubed cd players".

... As a
result, you may have more success finding a suitable tube-based DAC
with multiple inputs and controls to mate with a transport than you
will in finding a tube-containing player that does everything you
need.

Be prepared to have "tube-based DAC" redefined as, "solid state with a
few thermionic noise and distortion enhancers slapped on."

Which is exactly what it is. Prove otherwise if you can, Stephen.

Arny Krueger wrote:

What you may find some day is a solid state optical disc player
with a few thermionic noise and distortion enhancers slapped on, right
before the output terminals. Why would someone who is interested in pure
natural sound want such a thing?




Some people dislike the sound of op-amps. Some op-amps try to correct
serious defects
in their design with lots of negative feedback. The class B output
stages in many op-amps
can have traces of crossover distortion products even after NFB. Some
op-amps can
be made to act as if they are "single ended" if you connect a resistor
from the output to
either a negative or a positive supply of DC of around 20V. The
resistor should draw
current thruout the entire audio waveform.

Robert Casey wrote in
:

Arny Krueger wrote:

What you may find some day is a solid state optical disc player
with a few thermionic noise and distortion enhancers slapped on, right
before the output terminals. Why would someone who is interested in pure
natural sound want such a thing?




Some people dislike the sound of op-amps. Some op-amps try to correct
serious defects
in their design with lots of negative feedback. The class B output
stages in many op-amps
can have traces of crossover distortion products even after NFB. Some
op-amps can
be made to act as if they are "single ended" if you connect a resistor
from the output to
either a negative or a positive supply of DC of around 20V. The
resistor should draw
current thruout the entire audio waveform.



Those people who dislike the sound of an op-amp will hate nearly every
recording made since about 1980 or so. Mixing boards have many op-amps in
them as do many distribution amps. Personally, I will take a well designed
op-amp circuit over discrete components.

r


--
"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from
magic."

Arthur C. Clarke (1917 - ), "Technology and the Future"

"Rich Andrews" wrote in message
4...



Those people who dislike the sound of an op-amp will hate nearly every
recording made since about 1980 or so.

Count me in.

"Sockpuppet Yustabe" wrote in
news

"Rich Andrews" wrote in message
4...



Those people who dislike the sound of an op-amp will hate nearly every
recording made since about 1980 or so.

Count me in.




Do I detect a little bit of ludditeism? (:)

r


--
"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from
magic."

Arthur C. Clarke (1917 - ), "Technology and the Future"

"Öökintölli" wrote in message
. ..
Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current Sony
piece
of junk. I would also consider separate transport and tube processor.

My system is:

Brentworth Sound Lab Type IV speakers

Art Audio Diavolo amp

CAT SL-1 Ultimate preamp

RPM-2 turntable and arm with Lyra Helikon cartridge

McIntosh MR71 and MR66 tuners

Tandberg TD20A SE tape deck



What are the ones worth checking out?



Öökintölli

ToobZ!

If you're into DIY, there's some interesting projects described at
http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTri...6/indexeng.htm that
would likely fit the bill.

"Öökintölli" wrote in message
. ..
Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current Sony
piece
of junk. I would also consider separate transport and tube processor.


I'd like to thank everyone except Arny Krueger for helping me map out my
choices for a new tube rig. It is really cool to hear from esteemed audio
personalities such as Robert Deutsch and Kalman Rubinson on Usenet. It is
too bad that they don't participate more frequently. But maybe one blessed
day someone will put a cap on Krueger and the audio groups will flourish
again. I pray for it every night.

I'm thinking of retaining my Sony DVP-NS999ES for DVD playback and getting
one of the ModWright Absolute Truth modded Sonys. (Thanks Mr. Deutsch!)

The problem is that I cannot decide whether I should go with the SCD-1 or
the XA-777ES. A friend of mine who has both without any mods says that the
SCD-1 sounds better with CD's but the XA-777ES sounds better with SACD's and
can do multi-channel SACD audio. But I'm not sure if this matters once the
mods are in place. My friend also says that the SCD-1 disc loading is
painfully slow. Anyone have experience with both machines, modded or not?

Thanks!


Öökintölli

ToobZ!

"Öökintölli" wrote in message ...
Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player

I'm not aware of such a beast. If you must have tubes in your system,
they'll have to be elsewhere.

I assume that if consumer interest in SACD grows, eventually we might
see a tube SACD and/or DVD player marketed as a high-end item. (Same
goes for a DVD-Audio player, if you become interested in that later.)

to replace my current Sony piece
of junk. I would also consider separate transport and tube processor.

I'm no expert, but I'm not aware of any products like that for SACD
and DVD. See above.

There are a few tube CD players. You could get one of those now, and
you'd partly achieve your tube goals. You probably have many more CDs
than SACDs, so with the tube CD player you'd probably have tubes at
work most of your listening time.

After you buy the tube CD player, you could hang onto your current
Sony SACD and/or DVD gear, wait until tube SACD and DVD gear appears
(assuming it does appear), and then look at the situation at a later
date.

(I'm not taking sides in any SS vs. tubes debate. Just pointing out
that it's possible to have a tube CD player that you'll probably use
most of the time an might satisfy your goal most of the time.)

My system is:

Brentworth Sound Lab Type IV speakers

Art Audio Diavolo amp

CAT SL-1 Ultimate preamp

RPM-2 turntable and arm with Lyra Helikon cartridge

McIntosh MR71 and MR66 tuners

Tandberg TD20A SE tape deck



What are the ones worth checking out?



Öökintölli

ToobZ!

"Öökintölli" wrote in message
. ..
Need a really good tube CD/SACD/DVD player to replace my current Sony
piece
of junk. I would also consider separate transport and tube processor.

My system is:

Brentworth Sound Lab Type IV speakers

Art Audio Diavolo amp

CAT SL-1 Ultimate preamp

RPM-2 turntable and arm with Lyra Helikon cartridge

McIntosh MR71 and MR66 tuners

Tandberg TD20A SE tape deck



What are the ones worth checking out?



Öökintölli

ToobZ!

If you're into DIY, there's some interesting projects described at
http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTri...6/indexeng.htm that
would likely fit the bill.