"Robert Morein" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
...

"George M. Middius" cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast [dot] net
wrote in message ...


Trevor Wilson said:

**Not so. Some of us live our lives based on reality. Further, few of
us are
professionally involved in delusions.

You should make an effort to distinguish between delusions and
superstitions.

**I think the line is blurred.

Most religionists are sane enough to realize that they are
substituting faith in the unproven for knowledge. Very few are daft
enough
to say they "know" that their beliefs are congruent with reality.

**I disagree.

Trevor, I'm an agnostic myself. But I find surprising that you do not
acknowledge that many clerics, at least the better ones, provide valuable
life counseling to their parishoners.

**On the contrary, I do. My mother is a Christian. She was conselled by one
of the finest humans I have ever met, on the death of my father - the
minister of her local Church. He was able to provide valuable assistance to
my mother. Assistance I had no hope of ever being able to provide. OTOH, the
man could do nothing to assuage my grief at the time. All of this takes
nothign away from the fact that he is/was a deluded human. I have NEVER
denied the value of worthy humans (whether they be Ministers of religion,
psychiatrists, social workers or mates down at the local pub) in councelling
those in need.

Anecdote mode ON
Some years ago, I recall reading about a doctor down in the Cajun area of
Louisiana. Part of his treatment of these extremely superstitious people,
was to banish black magic effects on his patients. He did not do so, by
explaining that such things did not exist (he related stories of several
patients who had died, as a result of alleged 'spells' cast by those who
wished them ill will), but he actually treated those people by pretending to
use that same magic to help them. He stressed that he held no belief in
magic, but often felt that there was no other way to treat his patients,
without making them think that he was using magic.

Anecdote mode /OFF

Moral guidance provided by religion
comes packaged in an assortment of superstitions, myths, demands for
fealty, promises of favor/forgiveness, distinction, exclusion, ritual, and
ceremony, which both you and I consider unpalatable. But this is precisely
what the vast majority of humanity requires, who are not possessed of
universal minds.

**Indeed. However, IMO, superstition is no replacement for understanding.
Education is the real answer to people's problems. They may not enjoy those
answers at a given time, but for humanity as a whole, true understanding of
the nature of this universe is the ONLY answer. Superstition and
gobbledegook merely leads to more superstition and gobbledegook.


And you and I, as rationalists, have other problems with reality. Modern
physics has almost reached the conclusion that objective reality, in the
absolute sense, does not exist. What seems to be replacing it is a
Universe that is only as rational as it has to be.

**True enough, but that just makes it ever more fascinating.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au