dave weil wrote:

On Tue, 31 May 2005 13:24:46 -0400, Howard Ferstler
wrote:

In any case, I have stated in some of my subwoofer reviews
(both of Velodyne subs and the competition) that while the
Velodyne servo subs had outstandingly low distortion (subtly
audible with test-tone signals), that edge of theirs did not
really matter when musical source material is considered.
However, some purists might just like to have a subwoofer
with distortion levels only a fraction of what some Hsu and
SVS versions exhibit, and lower than just about anything
else, too, at any price. For them, the price of the servo
versions is justified.

Hmmmm, sounds like someone who might want to spend $50,000 on a pair
of Wilson speakers. After all, it's 100% certain that they sound
"different" than, say a pair of IC-20s, or any other speaker system,
for that matter.

Well, they certainly should sound different, although that
does not mean they would sound better. I believe that a pair
of Wilson WATT speakers were once evaluated via the
facilities at the Canadian NRC, and they generated a rather
poor response curve. Now, those curves are not everything,
but one would think that a speaker as expensive and
supposedly as superior as the WATT could at least produce a
respectable curve, its other supposedly superior attributes
notwithstanding.

Or that a purist might want to spend $10,000 on an
amp because of some differences that might show up on a test sheet?

In this case, the only differences I could see happening
would be that the ten-grand amp would measure inferior to
something costing a lot less. Even with decent performance
from the upscale job, we are talking about differences that
are a lot smaller than what we have with those various
subwoofers - even servo jobs. Remember, in the latter case
we might hear differences with test tones (might, remember),
but not with music, whereas with the amp situation no
differences would be audible even with test tones.

I
guess you're now saying that it's OK to exhibit such behavior.
Congratuations on moving forward, Howard. I think that you're starting
to 'get it".

Far be it for me to condemn people for being stupid. (That's
a joke.) However, my point as it relates to audio is that
the attitude has resulted in the hobby turning into a
pastime for true-believing nitwits. The entire enterprise
has been damaged.

At least the differences are real and
not imaginary, even if they only show up with test tones.

If they only show up with test tones, what does it matter?

Not to me, it doesn't. However, it might to some people. I
point that out in my subwoofer reviews. I do head-to-head
comparisons with those as a matter of policy, and the
conclusions are made very clear.

Isn't your
point that someone shouldn't spend a grand for differences that "don't
matter"?

Well, with subwoofers we are at best hair splitting. With
amps we are entering the realm of goofyland.

Shouldn't they be spending their money on CDs or something?

Given the money they would save by not purchasing one of
those overhyped Wilson systems (remember, some models cost
more than a hundred grand), they could purchase a new,
upscale car, or even a cheap house.

Or are you excusing paying for "overkill" products because YOU likely
didn't spend an "overkill" price on them?

Sure. If you can get an upscale product by means of a real
deal, then go for it. However, if you can get something as
good for considerably less I would go for that instead. I
did get a hell of a deal with that F1800RII sub (and the
FSR-12, too) after I did the reviewing work, but at that
time I had no subwoofer at all and wanted one. Later on
(only a week later, actually) I encountered that Hsu TN1220
and quickly realized that I would have been as happy with it
as I was with the Velodyne, and could have gotten it for
considerably less. If you read my review of the Hsu unit you
will see that I lauded it as a practical-performance equal
of the big Velodyne.

Regarding me purchasing something so upscale, it is a good
idea for a product reviewer to have some reference standards
to go by (not in every category, but at least in some), and
so the Velodyne models have served well in that context.

Would you give, say Audio
Note, a pass if they sold you an amp for $300?

I have no idea, since I am not familiar with the product.

Howard Ferstler