Audiophile Quality System for less than 800 dollars

[Mariachi]

I'm starting this thread for people who are on a budget and who are
interested in sound quality. Please share any great deals that you
know of (on head units, speakers, amplifiers, subwoofers), but are
good quality products at the same time. Another words, best bang for
the buck.

Here's what I have:

head unit: Sony CDX-GT805DX
retail: $330---bought price: $ 148 dollars
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=280162182289&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:VRI

6.5" coaxials: Polk Audio db650
retail: $100---bought price: $ 60 dollars (out of stock at
crutchfield)

Amplifier paired with 6.5"s: MTX Thunder8302
retail: $ 310.49---bought price: $90 dollars (won the bid off a
private seller)

6x9" speakers: Soundstream Tarantula SST6.9 150Watts RMSx2
retail: $300---bought price: $100 (excellent speakers by the way)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/SOUNDSTREAM-SST6-9-6-x9-TARANTULA-CAR-SPEAKERS-6x9-NEW_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ38646QQihZ015QQitem Z250176156174QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW

I got a profile amp 125Wx2 for my 6x9's from crutchfield, but that's
not worth mentioning... The price I got that was 120 dollars.

148 + 60 + 90 + 100 + 120 = 518 dollars
which leaves 282 dollars left for sound deadening, amplifier wiring
kits, tools and other accessories needed to install system.

I didn't really want a sub at the moment.

[DJ NoMore]

Mariachi wrote:
> I'm starting this thread for people who are on a budget and who are
> interested in sound quality. Please share any great deals that you
> know of (on head units, speakers, amplifiers, subwoofers), but are
> good quality products at the same time. Another words, best bang for
> the buck.
>
> Here's what I have:
>
> head unit: Sony CDX-GT805DX
> retail: $330---bought price: $ 148 dollars
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=280162182289&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:VRI
>
> 6.5" coaxials: Polk Audio db650
> retail: $100---bought price: $ 60 dollars (out of stock at
> crutchfield)
>
> Amplifier paired with 6.5"s: MTX Thunder8302
> retail: $ 310.49---bought price: $90 dollars (won the bid off a
> private seller)
>
> 6x9" speakers: Soundstream Tarantula SST6.9 150Watts RMSx2
> retail: $300---bought price: $100 (excellent speakers by the way)
> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/SOUNDSTREAM-SST6-9-6-x9-TARANTULA-CAR-SPEAKERS-6x9-NEW_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ38646QQihZ015QQitem Z250176156174QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
>
> I got a profile amp 125Wx2 for my 6x9's from crutchfield, but that's
> not worth mentioning... The price I got that was 120 dollars.
>
> 148 + 60 + 90 + 100 + 120 = 518 dollars
> which leaves 282 dollars left for sound deadening, amplifier wiring
> kits, tools and other accessories needed to install system.
>
> I didn't really want a sub at the moment.
>
I would say you are going to be sorry you did not get a sub because you
will be "missing" something.

Then again, I had some 6X9s many years ago, and my friends used to
always think that I had a 10" subwoofer in the trunk, even though all I
had were amplified 6X9s in the rear deck. IIRC they were some Boston
Acoustics Pro Series 6X9s driven with a Punch 75 in my POS 1984 Crown
Vic in 1992 or so. Sniff, sniff, that very system was pulled from my
totaled 1986 Buick Grand National that died prematurely due to my
stupidity (Drinking + Driving + telephone pole = no more car).

[Captain Howdy[_3_]]

Where is the sound quality if you dont have or want a sub? This is like
talking about Audiophile Quality comming out of a ghetto-blaster.


In article . com>, Mariachi
> wrote:
>I'm starting this thread for people who are on a budget and who are
>interested in sound quality. Please share any great deals that you
>know of (on head units, speakers, amplifiers, subwoofers), but are
>good quality products at the same time. Another words, best bang for
>the buck.
>
>Here's what I have:
>
>head unit: Sony CDX-GT805DX
>retail: $330---bought price: $ 148 dollars
>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=280162182289&ssPageName
>=STRK:MEWA:VRI
>
>6.5" coaxials: Polk Audio db650
>retail: $100---bought price: $ 60 dollars (out of stock at
>crutchfield)
>
>Amplifier paired with 6.5"s: MTX Thunder8302
>retail: $ 310.49---bought price: $90 dollars (won the bid off a
>private seller)
>
>6x9" speakers: Soundstream Tarantula SST6.9 150Watts RMSx2
>retail: $300---bought price: $100 (excellent speakers by the way)
>http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/SOUNDSTREAM-SST6-9-6-x9-TARANTULA-CAR-SPEAKERS-6
>x9-NEW_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ38646QQihZ015QQitem Z250176156174QQrdZ1QQsspag
>enameZWDVW
>
>I got a profile amp 125Wx2 for my 6x9's from crutchfield, but that's
>not worth mentioning... The price I got that was 120 dollars.
>
>148 + 60 + 90 + 100 + 120 = 518 dollars
>which leaves 282 dollars left for sound deadening, amplifier wiring
>kits, tools and other accessories needed to install system.
>
>I didn't really want a sub at the moment.
>

[Mariachi]

On Oct 18, 4:05 pm, (Captain Howdy) wrote:
> Where is the sound quality if you dont have or want a sub? This is like
> talking about Audiophile Quality comming out of a ghetto-blaster.
>
> In article . com>, Mariachi
>
> > wrote:
> >I'm starting this thread for people who are on a budget and who are
> >interested in sound quality. Please share any great deals that you
> >know of (on head units, speakers, amplifiers, subwoofers), but are
> >good quality products at the same time. Another words, best bang for
> >the buck.
>
> >Here's what I have:
>
> >head unit: Sony CDX-GT805DX
> >retail: $330---bought price: $ 148 dollars
> >http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=280162182289&...
> >=STRK:MEWA:VRI
>
> >6.5" coaxials: Polk Audio db650
> >retail: $100---bought price: $ 60 dollars (out of stock at
> >crutchfield)
>
> >Amplifier paired with 6.5"s: MTX Thunder8302
> >retail: $ 310.49---bought price: $90 dollars (won the bid off a
> >private seller)
>
> >6x9" speakers: Soundstream Tarantula SST6.9 150Watts RMSx2
> >retail: $300---bought price: $100 (excellent speakers by the way)
> >http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/SOUNDSTREAM-SST6-9-6-x9-TARANTULA-CAR-...
> >x9-NEW_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ38646QQihZ015QQitem Z250176156174QQrdZ1QQsspag
> >enameZWDVW
>
> >I got a profile amp 125Wx2 for my 6x9's from crutchfield, but that's
> >not worth mentioning... The price I got that was 120 dollars.
>
> >148 + 60 + 90 + 100 + 120 = 518 dollars
> >which leaves 282 dollars left for sound deadening, amplifier wiring
> >kits, tools and other accessories needed to install system.
>
> >I didn't really want a sub at the moment.

some audiophiles don't have subs... my 6x9's produce more than enough
bass to satisfy my needs. Although, when I do get more money and a
new car, i might get a low powered 10 inch sub to put behind the front
seat.

[Captain Howdy[_3_]]

Ask yourself this. Chicks with dicks. They look like girls,walk like girls.
Does ****ing them up the ass make you gay?

Some pedophiles like girls, some like boys, and some like them both. Botton
line is they all like them young.


>
>some audiophiles don't have subs... my 6x9's produce more than enough
>bass to satisfy my needs. Although, when I do get more money and a
>new car, i might get a low powered 10 inch sub to put behind the front
>seat.
>

[DJ NoMore]

Captain Howdy wrote:
> Ask yourself this. Chicks with dicks. They look like girls,walk like girls.
> Does ****ing them up the ass make you gay?
>
> Some pedophiles like girls, some like boys, and some like them both. Botton
> line is they all like them young.
>
>
>> some audiophiles don't have subs... my 6x9's produce more than enough
>> bass to satisfy my needs. Although, when I do get more money and a
>> new car, i might get a low powered 10 inch sub to put behind the front
>> seat.
>>
I am confused with your reply, but then again, I just totaled a car on
Sunday so maybe the pain medication is ****ing me up.....


BUT, thanks for the laugh because I have never seen audiophiles compared
to pedophiles (LMAO)! Okay, stop with that **** because my bruised ribs
can not take laughter!

[Mariachi]

On Oct 18, 8:27 pm, (Captain Howdy) wrote:
> Ask yourself this. Chicks with dicks. They look like girls,walk like girls.
> Does ****ing them up the ass make you gay?
>
> Some pedophiles like girls, some like boys, and some like them both. Botton
> line is they all like them young.
>
>
>
> >some audiophiles don't have subs... my 6x9's produce more than enough
> >bass to satisfy my needs. Although, when I do get more money and a
> >new car, i might get a low powered 10 inch sub to put behind the front
> >seat.

*confused* I guess you are saying that without subs you can't be an
audiophile... but i did say i will get a 10" inch sub in the future
(probably with a sealed enclosure).

pedophiles and gays are a bit off topic... and it's hurting my brain
to think how they are analogous to audiophiles.

[Captain Howdy[_3_]]

Im just messing with Mariachi. I guess that audiophiles and pedophiles both
share a compulsive disorder. Car audio has something better,it has SQ guys
they dont like overly loud systems because it distracts them while they fondle
their balls.

In article >, DJ NoMore
> wrote:
>Captain Howdy wrote:
>> Ask yourself this. Chicks with dicks. They look like girls,walk like girls.
>> Does ****ing them up the ass make you gay?
>>
>> Some pedophiles like girls, some like boys, and some like them both. Botton
>> line is they all like them young.
>>
>>
>>> some audiophiles don't have subs... my 6x9's produce more than enough
>>> bass to satisfy my needs. Although, when I do get more money and a
>>> new car, i might get a low powered 10 inch sub to put behind the front
>>> seat.
>>>
>I am confused with your reply, but then again, I just totaled a car on
>Sunday so maybe the pain medication is ****ing me up.....
>
>
>BUT, thanks for the laugh because I have never seen audiophiles compared
>to pedophiles (LMAO)! Okay, stop with that **** because my bruised ribs
>can not take laughter!

[Captain Howdy[_3_]]

Didnt your mom ever tell you that you can be whatever you wanna be?
>
>*confused* I guess you are saying that without subs you can't be an
>audiophile... but i did say i will get a 10" inch sub in the future
>(probably with a sealed enclosure).

What I was trying to say is that no matter what a pedophile likes, they all
like it to be young. Just as audiophiles like clean even sounding systems that
dont roll off like an ass below 80hz. Not even the half breed car audio SQ
guys roll into an SQ comp sporting 6x9's to reproduce the whole low end of
their system.
>
>pedophiles and gays are a bit off topic... and it's hurting my brain
>to think how they are analogous to audiophiles.
>
>

[Captain Howdy[_3_]]

The other guy that hit you must of been an SQ guy. LOL At least you had a
mounting bracket. I cant even count the amount of people that I have seen over
the years sporting a big ass sub box in the back of their hatch-back just
flopping about without being mounted just waiting to take their heads off.
Just like some jokers in their SUV's feel that they dont need to mount their
boxes because the back seat will save them. SUV's like nothing better then to
flip. Nuff said I wont name any names LOL.


>>
>OK, so I can't blame my confusion on the Lortab...
>
>But, if you get the right combination of 6X9 with the right vehicle, YOU
>WILL get decent bass. If it does not happen, you will feel like
>something is lacking. Regardless, your initial system is a good start
>at a great bargain. I am sure that Bob Wald will come along to say how
>you got screwed.
>
>I am kind of bummed that my 2007 Accord EX-L V6 6MT is totaled because I
>just got the damn thing in February and was slowly upgrading the sound
>system. My left wrist was torqued so bad from the airbag deploying
>while blowing the horn, that I can't even get my 10" Memphis Audio DVC
>sub/box and amp out of the car. Since the other guy was in the wrong, I
>guess his insurance is going to foot the bill for my loss. After all
>the sub box detached from its mounting bracket and slammed into the amp
>so I don't want to get it only to find out that the amp is DOA anyhow or
>the sub is FUBAR.
>
>I was doing 35 and the other guy was doing 35 when he hit me in a
>driver's side offset head on collision. Man am I in ****ing pain right now.

[Kosh]

Here is the direction I am going in for a budget SQ system. Using
Craigslist, ebay, ubid, crutchfield.

Eclipse CD7000 $210 on ebay
Boston Pro 5.5 $50 on craigslist
Kicker 700.5 amp $185 from Ubid.
Image Dynamics 12" Sub w box $35 on craigslist
Polk DB651S $80 from crutchfield (will probably replace these with
mid-bass drivers for rear fill. Will need to find a passive filter)
Monster RCA's $35 Ebay
Speaker wire. Had some left over from other projects, but cheap to
find a spool.

$600 so far, for about $1400 worth of stuff.

Blood and Sweat, free.


--
Kosh
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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View this thread: http://www.caraudioforum.com/vbb3/showthread.php?t=282087
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--
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[who cares[_2_]]

"DJ NoMore" > wrote in message
...
> Mariachi wrote:
>> On Oct 18, 8:27 pm, (Captain Howdy) wrote:
>>> Ask yourself this. Chicks with dicks. They look like girls,walk like
>>> girls.
>>> Does ****ing them up the ass make you gay?
>>>
>>> Some pedophiles like girls, some like boys, and some like them both.
>>> Botton
>>> line is they all like them young.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> some audiophiles don't have subs... my 6x9's produce more than enough
>>>> bass to satisfy my needs. Although, when I do get more money and a
>>>> new car, i might get a low powered 10 inch sub to put behind the front
>>>> seat.
>>
>> *confused* I guess you are saying that without subs you can't be an
>> audiophile... but i did say i will get a 10" inch sub in the future
>> (probably with a sealed enclosure).
>>
>> pedophiles and gays are a bit off topic... and it's hurting my brain
>> to think how they are analogous to audiophiles.
>>
>>
> OK, so I can't blame my confusion on the Lortab...
>
> But, if you get the right combination of 6X9 with the right vehicle, YOU
> WILL get decent bass. If it does not happen, you will feel like something
> is lacking. Regardless, your initial system is a good start at a great
> bargain. I am sure that Bob Wald will come along to say how you got
> screwed.
>

My definition of Audiophile is someone who is seeking sonic nirvana within
their automobile. To do that you need a couple of things to happen:

1. Full frequency coverage w/ no major spikes or dips in the frequency
response
2. The absolute least amount of drivers you can use to produce stereo sound
at full audio spectrum
3. Proper soundstage, which is accomplished by doing the following
A. Proper speaker location
B. Proper speaker location
C. Proper speaker location
4. Some way to minimize rattles in the vehicle
5. Since you are talking about a stereo, and not a surround sound
system...only front speakers are needed for anything above ~80Hz, so ditch
the rear fill
6. A subwoofer is absolutely essential to proper sound reproduction.
Period.

[Eric Desrochers[_2_]]

> My definition of Audiophile is someone who is seeking sonic nirvana within
> their automobile. To do that you need a couple of things to happen:
>
> 1. Full frequency coverage w/ no major spikes or dips in the frequency
> response
> 2. The absolute least amount of drivers you can use to produce stereo sound
> at full audio spectrum
> 3. Proper soundstage, which is accomplished by doing the following
> A. Proper speaker location
> B. Proper speaker location
> C. Proper speaker location
> 4. Some way to minimize rattles in the vehicle
> 5. Since you are talking about a stereo, and not a surround sound
> system...only front speakers are needed for anything above ~80Hz, so ditch
> the rear fill
> 6. A subwoofer is absolutely essential to proper sound reproduction.
> Period.

Amen!

--
Eric (Dero) Desrochers
http://homepage.mac.com/dero72

" Hiroshima 45, Tchernobyl 86, Windows 95 "

[Mariachi]

On Nov 4, 10:14 pm, "who cares" <ifyoudontknowitdontmatter> wrote:
> "DJ NoMore" > wrote in message
>
> ...
>
>
>
> > Mariachi wrote:
> >> On Oct 18, 8:27 pm, (Captain Howdy) wrote:
> >>> Ask yourself this. Chicks with dicks. They look like girls,walk like
> >>> girls.
> >>> Does ****ing them up the ass make you gay?
>
> >>> Some pedophiles like girls, some like boys, and some like them both.
> >>> Botton
> >>> line is they all like them young.
>
> >>>> some audiophiles don't have subs... my 6x9's produce more than enough
> >>>> bass to satisfy my needs. Although, when I do get more money and a
> >>>> new car, i might get a low powered 10 inch sub to put behind the front
> >>>> seat.
>
> >> *confused* I guess you are saying that without subs you can't be an
> >> audiophile... but i did say i will get a 10" inch sub in the future
> >> (probably with a sealed enclosure).
>
> >> pedophiles and gays are a bit off topic... and it's hurting my brain
> >> to think how they are analogous to audiophiles.
>
> > OK, so I can't blame my confusion on the Lortab...
>
> > But, if you get the right combination of 6X9 with the right vehicle, YOU
> > WILL get decent bass. If it does not happen, you will feel like something
> > is lacking. Regardless, your initial system is a good start at a great
> > bargain. I am sure that Bob Wald will come along to say how you got
> > screwed.
>
> My definition of Audiophile is someone who is seeking sonic nirvana within
> their automobile. To do that you need a couple of things to happen:
>
> 1. Full frequency coverage w/ no major spikes or dips in the frequency
> response
> 2. The absolute least amount of drivers you can use to produce stereo sound
> at full audio spectrum
> 3. Proper soundstage, which is accomplished by doing the following
> A. Proper speaker location
> B. Proper speaker location
> C. Proper speaker location
> 4. Some way to minimize rattles in the vehicle
> 5. Since you are talking about a stereo, and not a surround sound
> system...only front speakers are needed for anything above ~80Hz, so ditch
> the rear fill
> 6. A subwoofer is absolutely essential to proper sound reproduction.
> Period.

this would mean you would have to lift up your highs and vocals
relatively to your ears, which would include angling the speakers or
lifting them up. At the same time, the distance between the left
speaker and your left ear would have to be the same as the distance
between the right speaker and your right ear, which is pretty hard to
do in a car.

The subwoofer (in a sealed enclosure) would cover anything below 80
Hz, and I would install woofer components on each side of the car to
cover anywhere between 80Hz - 200hz.

[who cares[_2_]]

"Mariachi" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> On Nov 4, 10:14 pm, "who cares" <ifyoudontknowitdontmatter> wrote:
>> "DJ NoMore" > wrote in message
>>
>> ...
>>
>>
>>
>> > Mariachi wrote:
>> >> On Oct 18, 8:27 pm, (Captain Howdy) wrote:
>> >>> Ask yourself this. Chicks with dicks. They look like girls,walk like
>> >>> girls.
>> >>> Does ****ing them up the ass make you gay?
>>
>> >>> Some pedophiles like girls, some like boys, and some like them both.
>> >>> Botton
>> >>> line is they all like them young.
>>
>> >>>> some audiophiles don't have subs... my 6x9's produce more than
>> >>>> enough
>> >>>> bass to satisfy my needs. Although, when I do get more money and a
>> >>>> new car, i might get a low powered 10 inch sub to put behind the
>> >>>> front
>> >>>> seat.
>>
>> >> *confused* I guess you are saying that without subs you can't be an
>> >> audiophile... but i did say i will get a 10" inch sub in the future
>> >> (probably with a sealed enclosure).
>>
>> >> pedophiles and gays are a bit off topic... and it's hurting my brain
>> >> to think how they are analogous to audiophiles.
>>
>> > OK, so I can't blame my confusion on the Lortab...
>>
>> > But, if you get the right combination of 6X9 with the right vehicle,
>> > YOU
>> > WILL get decent bass. If it does not happen, you will feel like
>> > something
>> > is lacking. Regardless, your initial system is a good start at a great
>> > bargain. I am sure that Bob Wald will come along to say how you got
>> > screwed.
>>
>> My definition of Audiophile is someone who is seeking sonic nirvana
>> within
>> their automobile. To do that you need a couple of things to happen:
>>
>> 1. Full frequency coverage w/ no major spikes or dips in the frequency
>> response
>> 2. The absolute least amount of drivers you can use to produce stereo
>> sound
>> at full audio spectrum
>> 3. Proper soundstage, which is accomplished by doing the following
>> A. Proper speaker location
>> B. Proper speaker location
>> C. Proper speaker location
>> 4. Some way to minimize rattles in the vehicle
>> 5. Since you are talking about a stereo, and not a surround sound
>> system...only front speakers are needed for anything above ~80Hz, so
>> ditch
>> the rear fill
>> 6. A subwoofer is absolutely essential to proper sound reproduction.
>> Period.
>
> this would mean you would have to lift up your highs and vocals
> relatively to your ears, which would include angling the speakers or
> lifting them up. At the same time, the distance between the left
> speaker and your left ear would have to be the same as the distance
> between the right speaker and your right ear, which is pretty hard to
> do in a car.
>
> The subwoofer (in a sealed enclosure) would cover anything below 80
> Hz, and I would install woofer components on each side of the car to
> cover anywhere between 80Hz - 200hz.
>
I agree that you should do your best to equalize pathlengths and properly
aim the speakers....hence the reason responses 3-A, 3-B and 3-C are all
"Proper speaker location". In a car, it is very hard, if not entirely
impossible to get exactly the same speaker distance from the left and right
speakers, however, the closer you get to equality the better (hence the
reason many people use kickpanel enclosures in SQ vehicles).

I'm not sure what you are refering to by "woofer components", I assume you
mean a dedicated midbass driver (6" or 8") complimenting a set of mids &
tweeters. While this can help, it certainly isn't a 100% must have all the
time. For example, a well designed set of 6.5" component speakers will
often cover the 80Hz-20,000Hz spectrum quite well (with proper preparation
of course...sound deadening, etc...) and the least number of directional
drivers you use (anything besides subwoofers really) the less likelihood you
have of overlapping frequencies causing spikes or cancellations and the less
time you need to spend aiming your speakers.

[Eddie Runner]

who cares wrote:
> My definition of Audiophile is someone who is seeking sonic nirvana within
> their automobile.

Why do you think an audiophile has to be in an automobile?
Most audiophiles seek good sound in homes, many (maybe most)
car audio guys dont care about the pure audio (only bass)
and I would not classify most of them as audiophiles.

> To do that you need a couple of things to happen:

You used a good word in your first sentence. *SEEKING*
You do NOT need these things to SEEK, there are many audiophiles
with all kinds of systems, some crappy, some inexpensive,
some very expensive, the fact that they are truely SEEKING
happiness with their music reproduction makes them the audiophle,
NOT their system. So the rest of what you wrote is irrelevant
to your definition using the word SEEKING (which I liked)

Eddie Runner

> 1. Full frequency coverage w/ no major spikes or dips in the frequency
> response
> 2. The absolute least amount of drivers you can use to produce stereo sound
> at full audio spectrum
> 3. Proper soundstage, which is accomplished by doing the following
> A. Proper speaker location
> B. Proper speaker location
> C. Proper speaker location
> 4. Some way to minimize rattles in the vehicle
> 5. Since you are talking about a stereo, and not a surround sound
> system...only front speakers are needed for anything above ~80Hz, so ditch
> the rear fill
> 6. A subwoofer is absolutely essential to proper sound reproduction.
> Period.
>
>

[Eddie Runner]

who cares wrote:
> I agree that you should do your best to equalize pathlengths

Why are path lengths important?

> and properly
> aim the speakers....

Define properly aiming speakers? On Axis?

Eddie Runner

[Eddie Runner]

Mariachi wrote:

> At the same time, the distance between the left
> speaker and your left ear would have to be the same as the distance
> between the right speaker and your right ear, which is pretty hard to
> do in a car.

Can you tell me why you think this is all that important?

Eddie Runner

[Christopher \Torroid\ Ott]

"Eddie Runner" > wrote in message
...
> Mariachi wrote:
>
>> At the same time, the distance between the left
>> speaker and your left ear would have to be the same as the distance
>> between the right speaker and your right ear, which is pretty hard to
>> do in a car.
>
> Can you tell me why you think this is all that important?
>
> Eddie Runner

Interesting... Are you going somewhere with this, or just being grumpy? ;-)

It's not too difficult to demonstrate from approximately midbass on up, that
the time delay generated by the few feet of path difference in a car will
begin to have an effect on measured sound (time domain) from left vs. right.
As we increase frequency, this becomes more significant. I can measure this
pretty easily. But this is with sine waves and a DSO.

I guess the question is whether real ears, listening to real music in a real
car can hear the effect.

Alas, I have no idea...

Chris

[Eddie Runner]

Christopher "Torroid" Ott wrote:
> "Eddie Runner" > wrote in message
>> Can you tell me why you think this is all that important?
>>
>> Eddie Runner
>
> Interesting... Are you going somewhere with this, or just being grumpy? ;-)

Wondering if they are concerned about arrival times, or phase
differences at arrival, or volume differences at arrival, if they
simply believe speakers sound better along way off, or are simply
BLINDLY repeating something they read somewhere (this is
usually it.) So yeah, you could call that being grumpy ;-)

> It's not too difficult to demonstrate from approximately midbass on up, that
> the time delay generated by the few feet of path difference in a car will
> begin to have an effect on measured sound (time domain) from left vs. right.
> As we increase frequency, this becomes more significant. I can measure this
> pretty easily. But this is with sine waves and a DSO.

Most folks might agree with you, too bad most folks dont consider the
whole picture.

Your right, with the very slow speed of sound, short distance
differences, might be hear able.
Can we really control the arrival times between two speakers? Sure,
Can we really control the arrival times between two speakers in a car?
Sure,
But what about all the reflections? (this is where it gets interesting)

Each reflection is a new arrival time, and because of the REFLECTIVE CAR
GLASS, there are ALOT of reflections, even if you only had ONE speaker
you would still have many arrival times because of reflections, the
problem your trying to eliminate will be massive and you just cant do it.

So spending time trying to make equal path lengths to me is only
worth a small effort. IMO some people place way to much emphasis on its
importance. Im not saying its not important, but I am saying without
lining the interior of your car with SONEX (including the window glass)
your just ****ing in the wind, your efforts will be useless.

Eddie Runner

[Mariachi]

On Nov 5, 4:14 pm, Eddie Runner > wrote:
> Christopher "Torroid" Ott wrote:
> > "Eddie Runner" > wrote in message
> >> Can you tell me why you think this is all that important?
>
> >> Eddie Runner
>
> > Interesting... Are you going somewhere with this, or just being grumpy? ;-)
>
> Wondering if they are concerned about arrival times, or phase
> differences at arrival, or volume differences at arrival, if they
> simply believe speakers sound better along way off, or are simply
> BLINDLY repeating something they read somewhere (this is
> usually it.) So yeah, you could call that being grumpy ;-)
>
> > It's not too difficult to demonstrate from approximately midbass on up, that
> > the time delay generated by the few feet of path difference in a car will
> > begin to have an effect on measured sound (time domain) from left vs. right.
> > As we increase frequency, this becomes more significant. I can measure this
> > pretty easily. But this is with sine waves and a DSO.
>
> Most folks might agree with you, too bad most folks dont consider the
> whole picture.
>
> Your right, with the very slow speed of sound, short distance
> differences, might be hear able.
> Can we really control the arrival times between two speakers? Sure,
> Can we really control the arrival times between two speakers in a car?
> Sure,
> But what about all the reflections? (this is where it gets interesting)
>
> Each reflection is a new arrival time, and because of the REFLECTIVE CAR
> GLASS, there are ALOT of reflections, even if you only had ONE speaker
> you would still have many arrival times because of reflections, the
> problem your trying to eliminate will be massive and you just cant do it.
>
> So spending time trying to make equal path lengths to me is only
> worth a small effort. IMO some people place way to much emphasis on its
> importance. Im not saying its not important, but I am saying without
> lining the interior of your car with SONEX (including the window glass)
> your just ****ing in the wind, your efforts will be useless.
>
> Eddie Runner

My head unit does provide intelligent time alignment features for each
speaker. I noticed a big difference in imaging when I set the ITA
properly, and when I had it off. It does matter, believe me, in terms
of sound quality. Time alignment would be ideal if you have each
speaker perpendicular to your ears, therefore you won't have to deal
with weird angles when you move from the driver's seat to the
passengers seat. Also, my amplifier has a gain control for each
speaker (or you can just use the balance control on the head unit), if
you are closer to the left speaker, then turn the left speaker gain
down and the right speaker gain up, since sound waves spread out over
a distance, 'Z'.

If you do it that way, you wouldn't have to worry about placing a
speaker in the middle of the car, just to maintain a center sound
stage while you're in your drivers seat.

In regards to reflections, I would cover your door panels with some
sort of acoustical foam, and then make it look decorative for a
natural look. It is impossible to eliminate all reflections, but you
can certainly dampen them down. You would just have make your car
look like a recording studio :)

[Mariachi]

Forgot to mention that window glass would present a major problem...
as you mentioned. I always noticed that my sound system did play
better with the windows down.