any1 thinks about

[bob wald]

music n the proformers???
Like that bon jovie guy..uugghh i'm sick..he was a pretender i
think..singing a song ''have a nice day''
what guy could rock hard n sing haVE A NICE DAY????lol faker...
now my hero Billy Idol has stayed true for 20yrs.......
King IdoL......

[Chad Wahls]

"bob wald" > wrote in message
...
> music n the proformers???
> Like that bon jovie guy..uugghh i'm sick..he was a pretender i
> think..singing a song ''have a nice day''
> what guy could rock hard n sing haVE A NICE DAY????lol faker...
> now my hero Billy Idol has stayed true for 20yrs.......
> King IdoL......
>

I saw Billy Idol in concert not too long ago.... F-ing bad ass! Great show.

Chad

[bob wald]

Billy IdoL in the 80s. theBest!!!!
Hes had so many double gold songs its insane!
Hes 100proof too!
Hes a badass too.....
It must be so cool to be him....
I figure hes 1 of the top 3 hard rockers in history.
They'll never be a better rocker like him either.
Thats why i figure theyre not any acting like him now.
I'm happy with who i am.but if i had a choice hed be my 1st or 2nd
choice to be some1 else.
Oh n sex..i bet hes had more sex n better sex than just about any1 on
this planet.
Or at least in the top 5.

[bob wald]

it suprises me how most of you know knowing about car audio.....
1st. never turn your volume knob over 77% up.
you're doing nothing but increasing the noise in the music...lol
2nd if you must turn your stereo up over that to get it loud enough.YOUR
stereo SYSTEM is CRAP!
3rd. this is the best free information youll ever get.

[Chad Wahls]

"bob wald" > wrote in message
...
> it suprises me how most of you know knowing about car audio.....
> 1st. never turn your volume knob over 77% up.
> you're doing nothing but increasing the noise in the music...lol
> 2nd if you must turn your stereo up over that to get it loud enough.YOUR
> stereo SYSTEM is CRAP!
> 3rd. this is the best free information youll ever get.
>

If your Headunit will do full output at 0dBFS without clipping it's actually
wiser to utilize the whole throw of the volume attenuator.

I will usually gain everything out so that if the headunit clips at a
certain level then the amps do too. Then give the amps around another 6dB to
accomodate for CD's that aren't recorded hot enough. If the headunit does
not clip wide open I will set the amps to clip at wide open then give them
6dB more.

This is actually the PROPER way of doing it to reduce the noise floor. It
allows the amplifiers to not have to be turned up as far therefore not
amplifying unwanted noise.

In other words at 0dBFS my system clips 6dB below the max on the big knob on
the left. That is way over your presumed 77% (how did you come up with 77?)
I can make the system so it would kill wiht the headunit 1/2 or 1/4 up but
what would be the point? The volume control is stepped, using the whole
throw makes the space between the "clicks" represent smaller increments.

Screw car audio, it suprises me how little you know about audio in
general.....

Chad

[pithecanthropus]

back to billy idol thing, I think Steve Stevens contribution to his
greatness can't be ignored.

[Chad Wahls]

"bob wald" > wrote in message
...
> 77% just a safe percentage..but could be 88% if your system in ultra
> clean.....
> 'not knowing'' meant ''nothing'' on 1st post..lol
> thinking 85% might be a safe percentage now i think of it.
> never ever seen any stereo or amp that didnt give more noise at higher
> volumes.of any system.always cleaner at lower volumes.
>

It's difficult to put a preset percentage number on a volume control figure.
For example with NO EQ my headunit will not put out it's full rated voltage
at wide open. It's saving a little headroom because the designers knew some
moron would reach for the bass knob and Wang it wide open thus causing
immediate distortion. The designers also know that over a certain level of
boost at ANY frequency the outputs could become overloaded so it limits the
maximum output on the master volume by the difference of that threshold set
in the DSP EQ section. The outputs can theoretically NEVER clip. So in
this instance it's perfectly fine to run the head unit wide open and set the
amp gains so that the amp will clip at wide open plus a fudge factor for
recordings that don't hit the 0dBFS benchmark.

But I agree that looking at noise figures is a very important thing to
proper system set up (I think what you are getting at). If you know what
the maximum output voltage is and where that is at on the volume control
AFTER INTERNAL EQ then you can set up the system gain (would be a
percentage). Every headunit will differ but putting a broad number on a
volume control percentage is way too much of a generalization. MANY units
will not increase noise figures at higher volumes and will not clip with
sensible EQ. In this case, with proper gain structure, the system noise
will go down due to the overall attenuation of the amplifiers.

These type of headunits do not use a traditional analog volume control. Few
do today. The output buffers are wide open all the time and the gain of
them does not change with volume adjustment. That is done with DSP or a VCA
BEFORE the final output buffer. No matter the volume setting there will
ALWAYS be a certain amount of thermal noise from the final stage till the
0-Bit mute kicks in.

Chad

BTW, When I was younger I always idolized David Lee Roth, I still think he's
a fine showman :)

[bob wald]

most stereos put out full power 90%.....
youre just closing the headroom turning it up 100%....i think....
dont fight me..i know all. ive been doing this before most of your
daddys started driving.....
its the lil things that make systems great...

[Chad Wahls]

"bob wald" > wrote in message
...
> most stereos put out full power 90%.....
> youre just closing the headroom turning it up 100%....i think....
> dont fight me..i know all. ive been doing this before most of your
> daddys started driving.....
> its the lil things that make systems great...
>

You are a very funny little man, I design the stuff, implement the stuff and
have made my living in professional audio using the stuff.

Now go ride along on your adult tricycle with the big orange flag wearing
your spill bucket, I hear your mommy calling.

Chad

[Chad Wahls]

"bob wald" > wrote in message
...
> most stereos put out full power 90%.....

No, they put out full power at 100% At 90% they put out.... 90% Out to
what skippy? The ether?

> youre just closing the headroom turning it up 100%

Closing the headroom......mmK

> ..i think....

No you don't


> dont fight me..

mmK


> i Know all.

mmK, about what?

ive been doing this before most of your
> daddys started driving.....

Highly unlikely, care to go over the history of auto electronics let alone
public address in the mid 1950's?


> its the lil things that make systems great...
>

No argument there, set-em how you want-em, I don't drive it.

Chad

[jlaine]

As funny as the situation is Chad, arguing with Bob follows the old
addage of arguing with an idiot... They simply drag you down to their
level and pummel you with experience.

I think most everyone has learned to just tune him out.


--
jlaine

[bob wald]

chad you are so WRONG! different stereos are
more/less sensitive.PLUS your power supply plus the amps n all wiring n
battery make EVERY stereo controls slightly DIFFERENT! LOL..go back to
school lil boy.....
and as for my riddle..if i been doing this 20yrs.
n your dad started driving at 20. that means your dad must be over
42....to make me wrong.

[Chad Wahls]

bob wald wrote:
> chad you are so WRONG! different stereos are
> more/less sensitive.PLUS your power supply plus the amps n all wiring n
> battery make EVERY stereo controls slightly DIFFERENT! LOL..go back to
> school lil boy.....
> and as for my riddle..if i been doing this 20yrs.
> n your dad started driving at 20. that means your dad must be over
> 42....to make me wrong.

I'm probably older than you. Yes my dad is over 42, well over 42.
I've been at it for more than 20 years.

What you said above, is very correct if read and re-read. Although it
looks as if it was written by a first grader. But I understand the
convenience of poor grammatical skills. What I am trying to say is
that it's improper to put a percentage judgment on a volume control
without first knowing at what point the source will produce distortion
(clipping). Sometimes a lesser head unit will clip before your
presumed 77% if an audio taper is used for the attenuator and the
loudness is on and the EQ/Tone control is cranked. By God it's up to
24dB of bandwidth specific gain. In this case your percentage number
would be wrong anf your rig would sound terrible with such broad
blanket drivel as yours.

If you could read and comprehend, in previous posts I actually said you
were right but you are too smart to read and comprehend, oR mabee i sed
ti rong n stuff. Remember when I said I run my amps out 6dB before
headunit clipping? Hmmmm, that it getting close to your percentage
there bird-caller! But because i mentioned a more scientific approach
other then rock clacking and hand waving you became defensive and are
simply arguing with someone who agrees with you but in a different
sense. This sir makes you look like a senseless buffoon. Read man,
lets have an intelligent conversation, show us you can do it Bob.

Chad

[Chad Wahls]

Yeah I know but I don't mind the seemingly strange brand loyalty, hell,
I use strange brands with great results (albeit higher end.) But hey,
to each his own. I don't mind the solo pomp and circumstance of a self
proclaimed god of car audio, not one bit, everyone deserves a moment,
it's just longer for some of the slower.

But what I do try to watch out for is the pour innocent soul reading
this quickly dying group trying to learn something and getting wrong
information and for god's sakes implementing it.

I realize it's like talking to a wall, but the joy of Usenet is that
it's un-moderated, and I can back nonsense with knowledge, he may
never get it, but from the outside looking in, his mission becomes
apparent and he is taken with a grain of salt from a young casual
reader.

I don't see it as feeding a troll as much as providing correct
information and backing it up. I let most of them fly right by but
when it contains information this poor and easy to implement then I
gotta say something. Which I think I've done and MAY just leave it
alone now :)

Chad

[bob wald]

chad chad chad..its not ez pulling ya foot outa ya month as it is for
you to put it there...lol
dont try to reverse what you said or say ''i meant something other than
what you said.''lol
just say chad..i'm older n i'm wrong to the piont you were making..say
i'm sorry bob..
say it!

[bob wald]

when i say dont play it over 77% of full power more or less.i'm thinking
of my system of coarse.with a+++ wiring n power supply...
but i still get alil loop noise sometimes...so id say 80% of max is
fair..to my example..
but afew points either way is ok.
''have you pulled that outta ya mouth yet?'' lol

[bob wald]

point....its hard being the brains here.all alone....

[John Durbin]

you are without a doubt the stupidest individual ever to darken the door
of RAC... we are all that much dumber for having had to listen to your
drivel.

JD

bob wald wrote:
> it suprises me how most of you know knowing about car audio.....
> 1st. never turn your volume knob over 77% up.
> you're doing nothing but increasing the noise in the music...lol
> 2nd if you must turn your stereo up over that to get it loud enough.YOUR
> stereo SYSTEM is CRAP!
> 3rd. this is the best free information youll ever get.
>

[bob wald]

jd i gave you yrs of my experience.n got back
ungrateful spoiled lil i know it all kids....HahA
that why youll always be wanting to have a solid stereo system.but never
having 1.
I've pulled in afew stereo hook up places.where smart kids tried telling
me stuff. i laughed in afew faces before i left.
Stupid kids trying telling me it'd take some long to hook stuff up and
cost $40 a hour plus parts..lol
I've told afew. id stop car audio before id pay some kid failing in high
school $40 a hour labor!
Usely some kids in a lil garage doing nothing when i pulled in. n doing
nothing when i pulled out.lol

[KU40]

if you're such an expert bob,why don't you get rid of that loop noise
problem you have?


--
KU40

[John Durbin]

What a prince you are... if only the years of experience - was that 2 or
3? - had actually taught you something.

Oh well, at least we can sleep well at night knowing you're so easily
amused. Hopefully your therapist will be able to help you resolve the
deep-seated feelings of inadequacy that compel you to drive to stereo
shops seeking out cheap entertainment.

JD

P.S. I think if you look back when you pull out, the kids in the lil
garage actually ARE doing something... my guess would be a) laughing at
your dumb ass, and b) shooting you the bird

bob wald wrote:
> jd i gave you yrs of my experience.n got back
> ungrateful spoiled lil i know it all kids....HahA
> that why youll always be wanting to have a solid stereo system.but never
> having 1.
> I've pulled in afew stereo hook up places.where smart kids tried telling
> me stuff. i laughed in afew faces before i left.
> Stupid kids trying telling me it'd take some long to hook stuff up and
> cost $40 a hour plus parts..lol
> I've told afew. id stop car audio before id pay some kid failing in high
> school $40 a hour labor!
> Usely some kids in a lil garage doing nothing when i pulled in. n doing
> nothing when i pulled out.lol
>

[bob wald]

look this is ez..i never come on to get advice on car stuf.does that
tell you something?
I dont have problems with my car stuff like you...lol
i built my system to run at 75% of max power n not be too much for 1
good battery...
thats another reason to run your system only like 80% max. easier on
your battery too...lol
n clearer music more powerful music with alot of headroom also....
''headroom'' laughs.....

[John Durbin]

yes... it tells me you are so impressed with your own brilliance that
you're unable and unwilling to learn from your betters. And, that you
would probably try and teach your granny how to suck eggs.

JD

bob wald wrote:

> look this is ez..i never come on to get advice on car stuf.does that
> tell you something?
> I dont have problems with my car stuff like you...lol
> i built my system to run at 75% of max power n not be too much for 1
> good battery...
> thats another reason to run your system only like 80% max. easier on
> your battery too...lol
> n clearer music more powerful music with alot of headroom also....
> ''headroom'' laughs.....
>