Factory sub box resonates too much

[Bruce Musgrove]

2003 FOrd Explorer Eddie bauer - Factory Premium radio with factorysub.
In a effort to improve bass I experimented with swapping the factory 6.5
inch sub with a JL audio 8" inch 8w3v2 (It fits with a 3/4 inch spacer
ring) . Tha factory box is between .4 and .6 cubic feet so the space should
work. I am using a alpine 450 w mon sub amp to run it.
It was muffled and farty (for ant of a bettter word) It was very obvious
the plastic sub enclosre flexed badly.

I layed 4 coats of fiberglass over it to try and stiffen it. The bass has
tightened up, but now the box has developed a horrible resonance that
overrides everythig else.. It literally resonates like the body of Cello
(the musical instrument). Run a orbital sander over it and it is like
running the bow across the strings of the Cello. Install the sub and
speaking voices of the DJ's now resonate so loudly in the truck you have to
crank the bass way down.

Any Ideas how to change that? I want to keep the factory sub mount ing
location as I need my cargo space. Unfortunately I have Rear Air
conditioning so the JL audio Stealth box will not work.

[Tony F]

"Install the sub and speaking voices of the DJ's now resonate so loudly in
the truck you have to crank the bass way down."

What do you have the sub low-passed at? You shouldn't be able to hear
voices coming from your sub...at least that bad.

Tony



--
2001 Nissan Maxima SE Anniversary Edition
Clarion DRZ9255 Head Unit, Phoenix Gold ZX475ti, ZX450 and Xenon X1200.1
Amplifiers, Dynaudio System 360 Tri-Amped In Front and Focal 130HCs For Rear
Fill, Image Dynamics IDMAX10 D4 v.3 Sub

2001 Chevy S10 ZR2
Pioneer DEH-P9600MP Head Unit, Phoenix Gold Ti500.4 Amp, Focal 165HC
Speakers & Image Dynamics ID8 D4 v.3 Sub

2006 Mustang GT Coupe

[Mister.Lull]

I wonder if you might be completely hosed simply because of the box
material...

What do you think might happen if you try porting the box?
I feel that might fix a large part of the problem...

~Mister.Lull

Bruce Musgrove wrote:
> 2003 FOrd Explorer Eddie bauer - Factory Premium radio with factorysub.
> In a effort to improve bass I experimented with swapping the factory 6.5
> inch sub with a JL audio 8" inch 8w3v2 (It fits with a 3/4 inch spacer
> ring) . Tha factory box is between .4 and .6 cubic feet so the space should
> work. I am using a alpine 450 w mon sub amp to run it.
> It was muffled and farty (for ant of a bettter word) It was very obvious
> the plastic sub enclosre flexed badly.
>
> I layed 4 coats of fiberglass over it to try and stiffen it. The bass has
> tightened up, but now the box has developed a horrible resonance that
> overrides everythig else.. It literally resonates like the body of Cello
> (the musical instrument). Run a orbital sander over it and it is like
> running the bow across the strings of the Cello. Install the sub and
> speaking voices of the DJ's now resonate so loudly in the truck you have to
> crank the bass way down.
>
> Any Ideas how to change that? I want to keep the factory sub mount ing
> location as I need my cargo space. Unfortunately I have Rear Air
> conditioning so the JL audio Stealth box will not work.

[GregS]

In article om>, "Mister.Lull" > wrote:
>I wonder if you might be completely hosed simply because of the box
>material...
>
>What do you think might happen if you try porting the box?
>I feel that might fix a large part of the problem...
>
>~Mister.Lull
>
>Bruce Musgrove wrote:
>> 2003 FOrd Explorer Eddie bauer - Factory Premium radio with factorysub.
>> In a effort to improve bass I experimented with swapping the factory 6.5
>> inch sub with a JL audio 8" inch 8w3v2 (It fits with a 3/4 inch spacer
>> ring) . Tha factory box is between .4 and .6 cubic feet so the space should
>> work. I am using a alpine 450 w mon sub amp to run it.
>> It was muffled and farty (for ant of a bettter word) It was very obvious
>> the plastic sub enclosre flexed badly.
>>
>> I layed 4 coats of fiberglass over it to try and stiffen it. The bass has
>> tightened up, but now the box has developed a horrible resonance that
>> overrides everythig else.. It literally resonates like the body of Cello
>> (the musical instrument). Run a orbital sander over it and it is like
>> running the bow across the strings of the Cello. Install the sub and
>> speaking voices of the DJ's now resonate so loudly in the truck you have to
>> crank the bass way down.
>>
>> Any Ideas how to change that? I want to keep the factory sub mount ing
>> location as I need my cargo space. Unfortunately I have Rear Air
>> conditioning so the JL audio Stealth box will not work.

The box probably resonated at a different frequency before the treatment.
So, is the box stuffed with foam. Is at least 2 inches of
foam glued to the sides inside the box. With squared off wood boxes, I
usually add braces if necessary to siffen. Whats the shape of the box?

greg

[Bruce Musgrove]

To answer a few of the questions: A picture of the Factory box:
http://home.comcast.net/~katkom/OEMSub.jpg This is before fiberglassing and
with the factory amp still attached. It is injection molded plastic and the
back side is molded to fit the weird curves of the car body.

It is not lined with foam. There is Jute (auto carpet backing material
stuffing material that extends about 2-3 inches on each side of the speaker
and from top to bottom. It does not fill the entire box.

The amp is low passed from 70-120 (alpine MRP-M450). I have experimented in
that range with these settings on the amp. I prefer it to be 90 or below,
but the Ford Factory MACH6 / CD6 head unit (No I am not yet ready to give up
and replace it :) has a crappy crossover point (aftermarket guesstimate is
140-200, Visteon will not say) and going too low loses some midbass. Right
now I am set at around 75 (based on the printing on the amp). This has cut
out a lot of it , but I need to pull it back up to 90 or so to bring a
little more low end bass.

Poritng - I wouldn't even know where to beging calculating a port length for
this oddball shape, and the depth is only about 4.5 inches if the port opens
the same direction the sub faces......

I did pull my 10 inch Bazooka tube out of my 1989 Mustang sedan, and it
sounded crappy in the big open SUV truck, even though it is fantastic in the
trunk of the Mustang sedan (clean, tight, good SQ, no booming at all).


"Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
...
> 2003 FOrd Explorer Eddie bauer - Factory Premium radio with factorysub.
> In a effort to improve bass I experimented with swapping the factory 6.5
> inch sub with a JL audio 8" inch 8w3v2 (It fits with a 3/4 inch spacer
> ring) . Tha factory box is between .4 and .6 cubic feet so the space
> should work. I am using a alpine 450 w mon sub amp to run it.
> It was muffled and farty (for ant of a bettter word) It was very obvious
> the plastic sub enclosre flexed badly.
>
> I layed 4 coats of fiberglass over it to try and stiffen it. The bass has
> tightened up, but now the box has developed a horrible resonance that
> overrides everythig else.. It literally resonates like the body of Cello
> (the musical instrument). Run a orbital sander over it and it is like
> running the bow across the strings of the Cello. Install the sub and
> speaking voices of the DJ's now resonate so loudly in the truck you have
> to crank the bass way down.
>
> Any Ideas how to change that? I want to keep the factory sub mount ing
> location as I need my cargo space. Unfortunately I have Rear Air
> conditioning so the JL audio Stealth box will not work.
>

[Austin Becker]

I am not exactly sure what the setup looks like, but is there any way that
you could take a dremel and rid yourself of the actual factory enclosure and
fiberglass one under the panels where your sub is currently at? If so, you
could take the interior panel off, fiberglass a new enclosure inside the
panel, put the mounting ring into the panel, and replace the interior panel
so it's as if you did nothing at all. This would still be 'stealth' and
it'd be build much better. Maybe???? I dunno

--
- AUSTIN BECKER
"Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
...
> To answer a few of the questions: A picture of the Factory box:
> http://home.comcast.net/~katkom/OEMSub.jpg This is before fiberglassing
and
> with the factory amp still attached. It is injection molded plastic and
the
> back side is molded to fit the weird curves of the car body.
>
> It is not lined with foam. There is Jute (auto carpet backing material
> stuffing material that extends about 2-3 inches on each side of the
speaker
> and from top to bottom. It does not fill the entire box.
>
> The amp is low passed from 70-120 (alpine MRP-M450). I have experimented
in
> that range with these settings on the amp. I prefer it to be 90 or below,
> but the Ford Factory MACH6 / CD6 head unit (No I am not yet ready to give
up
> and replace it :) has a crappy crossover point (aftermarket guesstimate is
> 140-200, Visteon will not say) and going too low loses some midbass. Right
> now I am set at around 75 (based on the printing on the amp). This has cut
> out a lot of it , but I need to pull it back up to 90 or so to bring a
> little more low end bass.
>
> Poritng - I wouldn't even know where to beging calculating a port length
for
> this oddball shape, and the depth is only about 4.5 inches if the port
opens
> the same direction the sub faces......
>
> I did pull my 10 inch Bazooka tube out of my 1989 Mustang sedan, and it
> sounded crappy in the big open SUV truck, even though it is fantastic in
the
> trunk of the Mustang sedan (clean, tight, good SQ, no booming at all).
>
>
> "Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
> ...
> > 2003 FOrd Explorer Eddie bauer - Factory Premium radio with factorysub.
> > In a effort to improve bass I experimented with swapping the factory 6.5
> > inch sub with a JL audio 8" inch 8w3v2 (It fits with a 3/4 inch spacer
> > ring) . Tha factory box is between .4 and .6 cubic feet so the space
> > should work. I am using a alpine 450 w mon sub amp to run it.
> > It was muffled and farty (for ant of a bettter word) It was very
obvious
> > the plastic sub enclosre flexed badly.
> >
> > I layed 4 coats of fiberglass over it to try and stiffen it. The bass
has
> > tightened up, but now the box has developed a horrible resonance that
> > overrides everythig else.. It literally resonates like the body of
Cello
> > (the musical instrument). Run a orbital sander over it and it is like
> > running the bow across the strings of the Cello. Install the sub and
> > speaking voices of the DJ's now resonate so loudly in the truck you have
> > to crank the bass way down.
> >
> > Any Ideas how to change that? I want to keep the factory sub mount ing
> > location as I need my cargo space. Unfortunately I have Rear Air
> > conditioning so the JL audio Stealth box will not work.
> >
>
>

[Bruce Musgrove]

This pic is identical to my interior
http://www.leasetrader.com/auto/lease/search/2003_Ford_Explorer_Eddie_Bauer_4WD_93057.xhtml#pnl Photos

That thought has occured to me, but my experience in building a fiberglass
sub from scratch is woefully inadequate. Local shops are talking 500-750
dollars to do it. Also, if fiberglassing the factory sub box didn't stiffen
it enough (4 layers), how many darn layers would I need for a all
fiberglass box that would equal good MDF (tight solid bass, not boom boxes)?
I am also not sure how it would be solidly mounted if I did the molding off
of the interior trim panel, vs the sheet metal........

I am still studying that one along with trying to do it out of MDF. I am
decent with wood and such but I relaize this would be a bear as there are
lot's of angles and small pieces to make it fit the area.


Did that make sense?


"Austin Becker" > wrote in message
news:pNmWf.651313$084.511425@attbi_s22...
>I am not exactly sure what the setup looks like, but is there any way that
> you could take a dremel and rid yourself of the actual factory enclosure
> and
> fiberglass one under the panels where your sub is currently at? If so,
> you
> could take the interior panel off, fiberglass a new enclosure inside the
> panel, put the mounting ring into the panel, and replace the interior
> panel
> so it's as if you did nothing at all. This would still be 'stealth' and
> it'd be build much better. Maybe???? I dunno
>
> --
> - AUSTIN BECKER
> "Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
> ...
>> To answer a few of the questions: A picture of the Factory box:
>> http://home.comcast.net/~katkom/OEMSub.jpg This is before fiberglassing
> and
>> with the factory amp still attached. It is injection molded plastic and
> the
>> back side is molded to fit the weird curves of the car body.
>>
>> It is not lined with foam. There is Jute (auto carpet backing material
>> stuffing material that extends about 2-3 inches on each side of the
> speaker
>> and from top to bottom. It does not fill the entire box.
>>
>> The amp is low passed from 70-120 (alpine MRP-M450). I have experimented
> in
>> that range with these settings on the amp. I prefer it to be 90 or
>> below,
>> but the Ford Factory MACH6 / CD6 head unit (No I am not yet ready to give
> up
>> and replace it :) has a crappy crossover point (aftermarket guesstimate
>> is
>> 140-200, Visteon will not say) and going too low loses some midbass.
>> Right
>> now I am set at around 75 (based on the printing on the amp). This has
>> cut
>> out a lot of it , but I need to pull it back up to 90 or so to bring a
>> little more low end bass.
>>
>> Poritng - I wouldn't even know where to beging calculating a port length
> for
>> this oddball shape, and the depth is only about 4.5 inches if the port
> opens
>> the same direction the sub faces......
>>
>> I did pull my 10 inch Bazooka tube out of my 1989 Mustang sedan, and it
>> sounded crappy in the big open SUV truck, even though it is fantastic in
> the
>> trunk of the Mustang sedan (clean, tight, good SQ, no booming at all).
>>
>>
>> "Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > 2003 FOrd Explorer Eddie bauer - Factory Premium radio with factorysub.
>> > In a effort to improve bass I experimented with swapping the factory
>> > 6.5
>> > inch sub with a JL audio 8" inch 8w3v2 (It fits with a 3/4 inch spacer
>> > ring) . Tha factory box is between .4 and .6 cubic feet so the space
>> > should work. I am using a alpine 450 w mon sub amp to run it.
>> > It was muffled and farty (for ant of a bettter word) It was very
> obvious
>> > the plastic sub enclosre flexed badly.
>> >
>> > I layed 4 coats of fiberglass over it to try and stiffen it. The bass
> has
>> > tightened up, but now the box has developed a horrible resonance that
>> > overrides everythig else.. It literally resonates like the body of
> Cello
>> > (the musical instrument). Run a orbital sander over it and it is like
>> > running the bow across the strings of the Cello. Install the sub and
>> > speaking voices of the DJ's now resonate so loudly in the truck you
>> > have
>> > to crank the bass way down.
>> >
>> > Any Ideas how to change that? I want to keep the factory sub mount ing
>> > location as I need my cargo space. Unfortunately I have Rear Air
>> > conditioning so the JL audio Stealth box will not work.
>> >
>>
>>
>
>

[Bruce Musgrove]

To clarify.... Can a fiberglass be made good and solid like MDF? All of the
ones I have seen were boomers built for SPL, not SQ.....


"Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
...
> This pic is identical to my interior
> http://www.leasetrader.com/auto/lease/search/2003_Ford_Explorer_Eddie_Bauer_4WD_93057.xhtml#pnl Photos
>
> That thought has occured to me, but my experience in building a fiberglass
> sub from scratch is woefully inadequate. Local shops are talking 500-750
> dollars to do it. Also, if fiberglassing the factory sub box didn't
> stiffen it enough (4 layers), how many darn layers would I need for a all
> fiberglass box that would equal good MDF (tight solid bass, not boom
> boxes)?
> I am also not sure how it would be solidly mounted if I did the molding
> off of the interior trim panel, vs the sheet metal........
>
> I am still studying that one along with trying to do it out of MDF. I am
> decent with wood and such but I relaize this would be a bear as there are
> lot's of angles and small pieces to make it fit the area.
>
>
> Did that make sense?
>
>
> "Austin Becker" > wrote in message
> news:pNmWf.651313$084.511425@attbi_s22...
>>I am not exactly sure what the setup looks like, but is there any way that
>> you could take a dremel and rid yourself of the actual factory enclosure
>> and
>> fiberglass one under the panels where your sub is currently at? If so,
>> you
>> could take the interior panel off, fiberglass a new enclosure inside the
>> panel, put the mounting ring into the panel, and replace the interior
>> panel
>> so it's as if you did nothing at all. This would still be 'stealth' and
>> it'd be build much better. Maybe???? I dunno
>>
>> --
>> - AUSTIN BECKER
>> "Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> To answer a few of the questions: A picture of the Factory box:
>>> http://home.comcast.net/~katkom/OEMSub.jpg This is before fiberglassing
>> and
>>> with the factory amp still attached. It is injection molded plastic and
>> the
>>> back side is molded to fit the weird curves of the car body.
>>>
>>> It is not lined with foam. There is Jute (auto carpet backing material
>>> stuffing material that extends about 2-3 inches on each side of the
>> speaker
>>> and from top to bottom. It does not fill the entire box.
>>>
>>> The amp is low passed from 70-120 (alpine MRP-M450). I have experimented
>> in
>>> that range with these settings on the amp. I prefer it to be 90 or
>>> below,
>>> but the Ford Factory MACH6 / CD6 head unit (No I am not yet ready to
>>> give
>> up
>>> and replace it :) has a crappy crossover point (aftermarket guesstimate
>>> is
>>> 140-200, Visteon will not say) and going too low loses some midbass.
>>> Right
>>> now I am set at around 75 (based on the printing on the amp). This has
>>> cut
>>> out a lot of it , but I need to pull it back up to 90 or so to bring a
>>> little more low end bass.
>>>
>>> Poritng - I wouldn't even know where to beging calculating a port length
>> for
>>> this oddball shape, and the depth is only about 4.5 inches if the port
>> opens
>>> the same direction the sub faces......
>>>
>>> I did pull my 10 inch Bazooka tube out of my 1989 Mustang sedan, and it
>>> sounded crappy in the big open SUV truck, even though it is fantastic in
>> the
>>> trunk of the Mustang sedan (clean, tight, good SQ, no booming at all).
>>>
>>>
>>> "Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>> > 2003 FOrd Explorer Eddie bauer - Factory Premium radio with
>>> > factorysub.
>>> > In a effort to improve bass I experimented with swapping the factory
>>> > 6.5
>>> > inch sub with a JL audio 8" inch 8w3v2 (It fits with a 3/4 inch
>>> > spacer
>>> > ring) . Tha factory box is between .4 and .6 cubic feet so the space
>>> > should work. I am using a alpine 450 w mon sub amp to run it.
>>> > It was muffled and farty (for ant of a bettter word) It was very
>> obvious
>>> > the plastic sub enclosre flexed badly.
>>> >
>>> > I layed 4 coats of fiberglass over it to try and stiffen it. The bass
>> has
>>> > tightened up, but now the box has developed a horrible resonance that
>>> > overrides everythig else.. It literally resonates like the body of
>> Cello
>>> > (the musical instrument). Run a orbital sander over it and it is like
>>> > running the bow across the strings of the Cello. Install the sub and
>>> > speaking voices of the DJ's now resonate so loudly in the truck you
>>> > have
>>> > to crank the bass way down.
>>> >
>>> > Any Ideas how to change that? I want to keep the factory sub mount
>>> > ing
>>> > location as I need my cargo space. Unfortunately I have Rear Air
>>> > conditioning so the JL audio Stealth box will not work.
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

[Austin Becker]

Why not make the front of the enclosure run the length of where the black
plastic is now with MDF, and just do glassing on the back. Fiberglass will
bond to the MDF and if could be made to the same size that you have it now.
Similar to this http://web.njit.edu/~cas1383/proj/Glassing1/index.htm setup,
but like in reverse. That way, the interior panel is still flush against
it, but the front of the inner enclosure is still nice and flat. This
website http://web.njit.edu/~cas1383/proj/main/ has a hell of a nice
tutorial for the basics of fiberglassing, and seeing as how it is underneat
the panel, it doesn't have to be beautiful, just sufficient for sealed. I
think most people do 7-8 layers of glass depending on the type of glass
matting you use, but I think it would workout very well.

--
- AUSTIN BECKER
"Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
...
> To clarify.... Can a fiberglass be made good and solid like MDF? All of
the
> ones I have seen were boomers built for SPL, not SQ.....
>
>
> "Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
> ...
> > This pic is identical to my interior
> >
http://www.leasetrader.com/auto/lease/search/2003_Ford_Explorer_Eddie_Bauer_4WD_93057.xhtml#pnl Photos
> >
> > That thought has occured to me, but my experience in building a
fiberglass
> > sub from scratch is woefully inadequate. Local shops are talking
500-750
> > dollars to do it. Also, if fiberglassing the factory sub box didn't
> > stiffen it enough (4 layers), how many darn layers would I need for a
all
> > fiberglass box that would equal good MDF (tight solid bass, not boom
> > boxes)?
> > I am also not sure how it would be solidly mounted if I did the molding
> > off of the interior trim panel, vs the sheet metal........
> >
> > I am still studying that one along with trying to do it out of MDF. I
am
> > decent with wood and such but I relaize this would be a bear as there
are
> > lot's of angles and small pieces to make it fit the area.
> >
> >
> > Did that make sense?
> >
> >
> > "Austin Becker" > wrote in message
> > news:pNmWf.651313$084.511425@attbi_s22...
> >>I am not exactly sure what the setup looks like, but is there any way
that
> >> you could take a dremel and rid yourself of the actual factory
enclosure
> >> and
> >> fiberglass one under the panels where your sub is currently at? If so,
> >> you
> >> could take the interior panel off, fiberglass a new enclosure inside
the
> >> panel, put the mounting ring into the panel, and replace the interior
> >> panel
> >> so it's as if you did nothing at all. This would still be 'stealth'
and
> >> it'd be build much better. Maybe???? I dunno
> >>
> >> --
> >> - AUSTIN BECKER
> >> "Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
> >> ...
> >>> To answer a few of the questions: A picture of the Factory box:
> >>> http://home.comcast.net/~katkom/OEMSub.jpg This is before
fiberglassing
> >> and
> >>> with the factory amp still attached. It is injection molded plastic
and
> >> the
> >>> back side is molded to fit the weird curves of the car body.
> >>>
> >>> It is not lined with foam. There is Jute (auto carpet backing
material
> >>> stuffing material that extends about 2-3 inches on each side of the
> >> speaker
> >>> and from top to bottom. It does not fill the entire box.
> >>>
> >>> The amp is low passed from 70-120 (alpine MRP-M450). I have
experimented
> >> in
> >>> that range with these settings on the amp. I prefer it to be 90 or
> >>> below,
> >>> but the Ford Factory MACH6 / CD6 head unit (No I am not yet ready to
> >>> give
> >> up
> >>> and replace it :) has a crappy crossover point (aftermarket
guesstimate
> >>> is
> >>> 140-200, Visteon will not say) and going too low loses some midbass.
> >>> Right
> >>> now I am set at around 75 (based on the printing on the amp). This has
> >>> cut
> >>> out a lot of it , but I need to pull it back up to 90 or so to bring
a
> >>> little more low end bass.
> >>>
> >>> Poritng - I wouldn't even know where to beging calculating a port
length
> >> for
> >>> this oddball shape, and the depth is only about 4.5 inches if the port
> >> opens
> >>> the same direction the sub faces......
> >>>
> >>> I did pull my 10 inch Bazooka tube out of my 1989 Mustang sedan, and
it
> >>> sounded crappy in the big open SUV truck, even though it is fantastic
in
> >> the
> >>> trunk of the Mustang sedan (clean, tight, good SQ, no booming at all).
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> "Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
> >>> ...
> >>> > 2003 FOrd Explorer Eddie bauer - Factory Premium radio with
> >>> > factorysub.
> >>> > In a effort to improve bass I experimented with swapping the factory
> >>> > 6.5
> >>> > inch sub with a JL audio 8" inch 8w3v2 (It fits with a 3/4 inch
> >>> > spacer
> >>> > ring) . Tha factory box is between .4 and .6 cubic feet so the
space
> >>> > should work. I am using a alpine 450 w mon sub amp to run it.
> >>> > It was muffled and farty (for ant of a bettter word) It was very
> >> obvious
> >>> > the plastic sub enclosre flexed badly.
> >>> >
> >>> > I layed 4 coats of fiberglass over it to try and stiffen it. The
bass
> >> has
> >>> > tightened up, but now the box has developed a horrible resonance
that
> >>> > overrides everythig else.. It literally resonates like the body of
> >> Cello
> >>> > (the musical instrument). Run a orbital sander over it and it is
like
> >>> > running the bow across the strings of the Cello. Install the sub
and
> >>> > speaking voices of the DJ's now resonate so loudly in the truck you
> >>> > have
> >>> > to crank the bass way down.
> >>> >
> >>> > Any Ideas how to change that? I want to keep the factory sub mount
> >>> > ing
> >>> > location as I need my cargo space. Unfortunately I have Rear Air
> >>> > conditioning so the JL audio Stealth box will not work.
> >>> >
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
>

[MOSFET]

All of the
> ones I have seen were boomers built for SPL, not SQ.....

I'm sorry, I just have to chime in here. The characteristics that make an
enclosure good for SPL ARE ALSO the same characteristics that make it good
for SQ. Namely, an enclosure's ONLY job is to hold air (not leak) AND not
resonate. For the boomer, if the enclosure is resonating this represents
wasted energy that could be producing more SPL. Frankly, my experience has
been that serious SPL competitors spend more time, money and energy making
their enclosures completely resonance-free than the SQ fanatic. They often
use INCREDIBLY THICK (AND HEAVY) material for their sub enclosures. In the
world of high-end home audio, many enclosure builders (Michael Green
Designs, for instance) actually design their enclosures to resonate some.
The rational being that when producing acoustic music, having a speaker
resonate (like a musical instrument) will produce a more "natural sound".
My point is that minimizing enclosure resonance IS NOT solely the concern of
the audiophile.

MOSFET

MOSFET

[Austin Becker]

Well said. SPL is definitely not limited to fiberglass enclosures, in fact
the best that I have seen were made with MDF (very thick and heavy like you
said), but resonation is all a matter of design. If this guy were to cover
the outside of his enclosure with something like dynamat on all sides,
chances are that in that snug little area, he wouldn't rattle hardly at all.
but that has to be done to the rest of the car also. Not just that side.

--
- AUSTIN BECKER
"MOSFET" > wrote in message
m...
> All of the
> > ones I have seen were boomers built for SPL, not SQ.....
>
> I'm sorry, I just have to chime in here. The characteristics that make an
> enclosure good for SPL ARE ALSO the same characteristics that make it good
> for SQ. Namely, an enclosure's ONLY job is to hold air (not leak) AND not
> resonate. For the boomer, if the enclosure is resonating this represents
> wasted energy that could be producing more SPL. Frankly, my experience
has
> been that serious SPL competitors spend more time, money and energy making
> their enclosures completely resonance-free than the SQ fanatic. They
often
> use INCREDIBLY THICK (AND HEAVY) material for their sub enclosures. In
the
> world of high-end home audio, many enclosure builders (Michael Green
> Designs, for instance) actually design their enclosures to resonate some.
> The rational being that when producing acoustic music, having a speaker
> resonate (like a musical instrument) will produce a more "natural sound".
> My point is that minimizing enclosure resonance IS NOT solely the concern
of
> the audiophile.
>
> MOSFET
>
> MOSFET
>
>

[Bruce Musgrove]

That is a option I have been considering..... I have looked at both of those
pages in the past when researching how to do this...... My inexperience
left me in the dark in planning what is needed IE can I make the back and
sides tough enough from fibrtglas and get it to hold to the MDF Etc.

I need to go to the junkyard and get another box play with......




"Austin Becker" > wrote in message
news:yFnWf.651383$084.394767@attbi_s22...
> Why not make the front of the enclosure run the length of where the black
> plastic is now with MDF, and just do glassing on the back. Fiberglass
> will
> bond to the MDF and if could be made to the same size that you have it
> now.
> Similar to this http://web.njit.edu/~cas1383/proj/Glassing1/index.htm
> setup,
> but like in reverse. That way, the interior panel is still flush against
> it, but the front of the inner enclosure is still nice and flat. This
> website http://web.njit.edu/~cas1383/proj/main/ has a hell of a nice
> tutorial for the basics of fiberglassing, and seeing as how it is
> underneat
> the panel, it doesn't have to be beautiful, just sufficient for sealed. I
> think most people do 7-8 layers of glass depending on the type of glass
> matting you use, but I think it would workout very well.
>
> --
> - AUSTIN BECKER
> "Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
> ...
>> To clarify.... Can a fiberglass be made good and solid like MDF? All of
> the
>> ones I have seen were boomers built for SPL, not SQ.....
>>
>>
>> "Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > This pic is identical to my interior
>> >
> http://www.leasetrader.com/auto/lease/search/2003_Ford_Explorer_Eddie_Bauer_4WD_93057.xhtml#pnl Photos
>> >
>> > That thought has occured to me, but my experience in building a
> fiberglass
>> > sub from scratch is woefully inadequate. Local shops are talking
> 500-750
>> > dollars to do it. Also, if fiberglassing the factory sub box didn't
>> > stiffen it enough (4 layers), how many darn layers would I need for a
> all
>> > fiberglass box that would equal good MDF (tight solid bass, not boom
>> > boxes)?
>> > I am also not sure how it would be solidly mounted if I did the molding
>> > off of the interior trim panel, vs the sheet metal........
>> >
>> > I am still studying that one along with trying to do it out of MDF. I
> am
>> > decent with wood and such but I relaize this would be a bear as there
> are
>> > lot's of angles and small pieces to make it fit the area.
>> >
>> >
>> > Did that make sense?
>> >
>> >
>> > "Austin Becker" > wrote in message
>> > news:pNmWf.651313$084.511425@attbi_s22...
>> >>I am not exactly sure what the setup looks like, but is there any way
> that
>> >> you could take a dremel and rid yourself of the actual factory
> enclosure
>> >> and
>> >> fiberglass one under the panels where your sub is currently at? If
>> >> so,
>> >> you
>> >> could take the interior panel off, fiberglass a new enclosure inside
> the
>> >> panel, put the mounting ring into the panel, and replace the interior
>> >> panel
>> >> so it's as if you did nothing at all. This would still be 'stealth'
> and
>> >> it'd be build much better. Maybe???? I dunno
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> - AUSTIN BECKER
>> >> "Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
>> >> ...
>> >>> To answer a few of the questions: A picture of the Factory box:
>> >>> http://home.comcast.net/~katkom/OEMSub.jpg This is before
> fiberglassing
>> >> and
>> >>> with the factory amp still attached. It is injection molded plastic
> and
>> >> the
>> >>> back side is molded to fit the weird curves of the car body.
>> >>>
>> >>> It is not lined with foam. There is Jute (auto carpet backing
> material
>> >>> stuffing material that extends about 2-3 inches on each side of the
>> >> speaker
>> >>> and from top to bottom. It does not fill the entire box.
>> >>>
>> >>> The amp is low passed from 70-120 (alpine MRP-M450). I have
> experimented
>> >> in
>> >>> that range with these settings on the amp. I prefer it to be 90 or
>> >>> below,
>> >>> but the Ford Factory MACH6 / CD6 head unit (No I am not yet ready to
>> >>> give
>> >> up
>> >>> and replace it :) has a crappy crossover point (aftermarket
> guesstimate
>> >>> is
>> >>> 140-200, Visteon will not say) and going too low loses some midbass.
>> >>> Right
>> >>> now I am set at around 75 (based on the printing on the amp). This
>> >>> has
>> >>> cut
>> >>> out a lot of it , but I need to pull it back up to 90 or so to bring
> a
>> >>> little more low end bass.
>> >>>
>> >>> Poritng - I wouldn't even know where to beging calculating a port
> length
>> >> for
>> >>> this oddball shape, and the depth is only about 4.5 inches if the
>> >>> port
>> >> opens
>> >>> the same direction the sub faces......
>> >>>
>> >>> I did pull my 10 inch Bazooka tube out of my 1989 Mustang sedan, and
> it
>> >>> sounded crappy in the big open SUV truck, even though it is fantastic
> in
>> >> the
>> >>> trunk of the Mustang sedan (clean, tight, good SQ, no booming at
>> >>> all).
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> "Bruce Musgrove" > wrote in message
>> >>> ...
>> >>> > 2003 FOrd Explorer Eddie bauer - Factory Premium radio with
>> >>> > factorysub.
>> >>> > In a effort to improve bass I experimented with swapping the
>> >>> > factory
>> >>> > 6.5
>> >>> > inch sub with a JL audio 8" inch 8w3v2 (It fits with a 3/4 inch
>> >>> > spacer
>> >>> > ring) . Tha factory box is between .4 and .6 cubic feet so the
> space
>> >>> > should work. I am using a alpine 450 w mon sub amp to run it.
>> >>> > It was muffled and farty (for ant of a bettter word) It was very
>> >> obvious
>> >>> > the plastic sub enclosre flexed badly.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > I layed 4 coats of fiberglass over it to try and stiffen it. The
> bass
>> >> has
>> >>> > tightened up, but now the box has developed a horrible resonance
> that
>> >>> > overrides everythig else.. It literally resonates like the body of
>> >> Cello
>> >>> > (the musical instrument). Run a orbital sander over it and it is
> like
>> >>> > running the bow across the strings of the Cello. Install the sub
> and
>> >>> > speaking voices of the DJ's now resonate so loudly in the truck you
>> >>> > have
>> >>> > to crank the bass way down.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > Any Ideas how to change that? I want to keep the factory sub mount
>> >>> > ing
>> >>> > location as I need my cargo space. Unfortunately I have Rear Air
>> >>> > conditioning so the JL audio Stealth box will not work.
>> >>> >
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>