Amazing NO COST Audio Tweak No. 3 !! For Advanced Audiophiles Only!

[[email protected]]

Grounding your speakers for better sound: This only requires some spare
light gauge copper wire and soldering equipment. It's for advanced
audiophiles who are not afraid to go into their (dynamic) speakers. Cut
single lengths of wire about the length of your regular speaker wire.
Solder each piece of wire to the positive terminals of each driver
connected to the crossover board inside the speaker. Do the same for
the other speaker. Now combine the free ends of all 4 (or 6) wires, and
connect this to the terminal grounding screw at the back of your amp.

[[email protected]]

François Yves Le Gal wrote:

> On 14 Mar 2006 20:14:53 -0800, wrote:
>
> >Solder each piece of wire to the positive terminals of each driver
> >connected to the crossover board inside the speaker. Do the same for
> >the other speaker. Now combine the free ends of all 4 (or 6) wires, and
> >connect this to the terminal grounding screw at the back of your amp.
>
> Then you've shorted your amp. Nice tweak.

Which translated from foolspeak means: you've never tried it. You
wouldn't be the first here to let theory stand in the way of fact. Well
unlike you, I have experience in this area. In fact, I have been doing
this with various speakers and amps for 12 years, with only benefits as
a result. Some very good speaker designs already incorporate a third
jack for grounding. I don't know of any speaker companies that would
sell speakers guaranteed to short your amp. The only thing shorted here
is your brain, ignorant twit.

[Robert Morein]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> Grounding your speakers for better sound: This only requires some spare
> light gauge copper wire and soldering equipment. It's for advanced
> audiophiles who are not afraid to go into their (dynamic) speakers. Cut
> single lengths of wire about the length of your regular speaker wire.
> Solder each piece of wire to the positive terminals of each driver
> connected to the crossover board inside the speaker. Do the same for
> the other speaker. Now combine the free ends of all 4 (or 6) wires, and
> connect this to the terminal grounding screw at the back of your amp.
>
I would only point out that there are certain amplifiers with "floating
outputs" for which this must not be done. One such is the Acoustat TNT
series of amplifiers. A connection to chassis ground is deadly to these
amplifiers, which are otherwise robust. In some other designs, the amplifier
is not harmed, but the connection defeats a part of the design intended to
reduce hum-loop problems.

This prohibition also applies to amplifiers operated in "bridged" mode, as
it will damage them.

[Arny Krueger]

> wrote in message
oups.com


>Well unlike you, I have experience in
> this area. In fact, I have been doing this with various
> speakers and amps for 12 years, with only benefits as a
> result.

What specific benefits have you observed?

[Trevor Wilson]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> Grounding your speakers for better sound: This only requires some spare
> light gauge copper wire and soldering equipment. It's for advanced
> audiophiles who are not afraid to go into their (dynamic) speakers. Cut
> single lengths of wire about the length of your regular speaker wire.
> Solder each piece of wire to the positive terminals of each driver
> connected to the crossover board inside the speaker. Do the same for
> the other speaker. Now combine the free ends of all 4 (or 6) wires, and
> connect this to the terminal grounding screw at the back of your amp.

**WARNING! This advice may do several things:

* Destroy the output stage/s of your amplifier (many amplifiers are not
designed to operate with their outputs at ground potential).
* Void any warranty on speakers and/or amplifier.

Be aware that he original poster has little or no experience or
qualifications in any facet of audio. His suggestions must be viewed as
possibly a scurrilous attempt to cause people to damage their equipment.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

[WillBrink]

In article . com>,
wrote:

> Grounding your speakers for better sound: This only requires some spare
> light gauge copper wire and soldering equipment. It's for advanced
> audiophiles who are not afraid to go into their (dynamic) speakers. Cut
> single lengths of wire about the length of your regular speaker wire.
> Solder each piece of wire to the positive terminals of each driver
> connected to the crossover board inside the speaker. Do the same for
> the other speaker. Now combine the free ends of all 4 (or 6) wires, and
> connect this to the terminal grounding screw at the back of your amp.

And the proof this silly tweak will have any effects on sound quality is
where again?

--
Will Brink @ http://www.brinkzone.com/

[Arny Krueger]

"WillBrink" > wrote in
message

> In article
> . com>,
> wrote:
>
>> Grounding your speakers for better sound: This only
>> requires some spare light gauge copper wire and
>> soldering equipment. It's for advanced audiophiles who
>> are not afraid to go into their (dynamic) speakers. Cut
>> single lengths of wire about the length of your regular
>> speaker wire. Solder each piece of wire to the positive
>> terminals of each driver connected to the crossover
>> board inside the speaker. Do the same for the other
>> speaker. Now combine the free ends of all 4 (or 6)
>> wires, and connect this to the terminal grounding screw
>> at the back of your amp.
>
> And the proof this silly tweak will have any effects on
> sound quality is where again?

It's obvious - by muting most if not all of the drivers in your speaker
system and possibly destroying your power amp, audible distortion and noise
will be dramatically reduced.

[[email protected]]

Trevor Wilson lied again:

> > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> >
> > Grounding your speakers for better sound: This only requires some spare
> > light gauge copper wire and soldering equipment. It's for advanced
> > audiophiles who are not afraid to go into their (dynamic) speakers. Cut
> > single lengths of wire about the length of your regular speaker wire.
> > Solder each piece of wire to the positive terminals of each driver
> > connected to the crossover board inside the speaker. Do the same for
> > the other speaker. Now combine the free ends of all 4 (or 6) wires, and
> > connect this to the terminal grounding screw at the back of your amp.
>
> **WARNING! This advice may do several things:
> --
> Trevor Wilson
> www.rageaudio.com.au


**WARNING! ACHTUNG! ATTENTION! This poster's advice is not to be
heeded.

Be aware that Trevor Wilson, is a raving, profanity-spewing lunatic,
and an objectivist extremist. His intention here is merely to be
contrary and provocative, because he's a troll with a vendetta against
me. He has little or no experience or qualifications in this area of
audio, and has never attempted the above tweak of which he nevertheless
speaks on. On the other hand, I have. I've performed the above redesign
of many loudspeakers and tried it with numerous amplifiers for years,
with zero problems. Suffice to say the above presumes you don't have or
don't care about warranties on a speaker, assuming your speakers even
came with one, since you will have to open it up. However, if you would
like to see whether I'm right about the tweak and Trevor is full of it,
you can do so in 5 seconds. Instead of opening up the speakers, simply
connect one wire to the positive terminal of your speakers, and both
ends to the grounding screw on the back of the amp. (I haven't bothered
to try this "quick fix", but theoretically, as it works on a similar
principle to the full tweak, it should be of some benefit. I do not
expect it to improve things as much as the full tweak, if at all, but
like I said, it takes seconds to check out).

You cannot however void a warranty on your amplifier by connecting a
ground wire to it, otherwise, the amplifier would not have what's
called a "grounding screw". So that's more of Trevor the Troll's
idiotic ignorance speaking. Trevor is as ignorant about loudspeakers as
he is about turntables. He is ignorant of the fact that some hifi
loudspeaker designs incorporate a third jack for a grounding wire. He,
like many of his objectivist ilk, is against any and all forms of
"tweaking". His suggestions must be viewed as possibly a scurrilous
attempt to cause people to avoid ever improving their sound quality.
Basically, he wants you to be as miserable a person as he is!

[[email protected]]

WillBrink wrote:

> In article . com>,
> wrote:
>
> > Grounding your speakers for better sound: This only requires some spare
> > light gauge copper wire and soldering equipment. It's for advanced
> > audiophiles who are not afraid to go into their (dynamic) speakers. Cut
> > single lengths of wire about the length of your regular speaker wire.
> > Solder each piece of wire to the positive terminals of each driver
> > connected to the crossover board inside the speaker. Do the same for
> > the other speaker. Now combine the free ends of all 4 (or 6) wires, and
> > connect this to the terminal grounding screw at the back of your amp.
>
> And the proof this silly tweak will have any effects on sound quality is
> where again?

Duh. Its in your speakers you silly twit.


> Will Brink @ http://www.brinkzone.com/

[[email protected]]

Arny Krueger wrote:

> > wrote in message
> oups.com
>
>
> >Well unlike you, I have experience in
> > this area. In fact, I have been doing this with various
> > speakers and amps for 12 years, with only benefits as a
> > result.
>
> What specific benefits have you observed?

Increased resolution in all drivers. When you have 6 drivers combined
in two speakers, it can make a significant upgrade to your spekers,
worth opening them up IMHO. Although you probably don't need to,
because I posted a simpler version of the tweak in this thread that
takes 5 seconds to do (but I haven't tested that yet). Beyond that, try
it yourself if you want to exactly what it does. If you can ever tear
yourself away from fiddling with the knobs on your EQ and figure out
how to open up your speakers.

[[email protected]]

Arny Krueger wrote:

> > wrote in message
> oups.com
>
>
> >Well unlike you, I have experience in
> > this area. In fact, I have been doing this with various
> > speakers and amps for 12 years, with only benefits as a
> > result.
>
> What specific benefits have you observed?

Increased resolution in all drivers. When you have 6 drivers combined
in two speakers, it can make a significant upgrade to your spekers,
worth opening them up IMHO. Although you probably don't need to,
because I posted a simpler version of the tweak in this thread that
takes 5 seconds to do (but I haven't tested that yet). Beyond that, try
it yourself if you want to exactly what it does. If you can ever tear
yourself away from fiddling with the knobs on your EQ and figure out
how to open up your speakers.

[[email protected]]

Arny Krueger wrote:

> > wrote in message
> oups.com
>
>
> >Well unlike you, I have experience in
> > this area. In fact, I have been doing this with various
> > speakers and amps for 12 years, with only benefits as a
> > result.
>
> What specific benefits have you observed?

Increased resolution in all drivers. When you have 6 drivers combined
in two speakers, it can make a significant upgrade to your spekers,
worth opening them up IMHO. Although you probably don't need to,
because I posted a simpler version of the tweak in this thread that
takes 5 seconds to do (but I haven't tested that yet). Beyond that, try
it yourself if you want to exactly what it does. If you can ever tear
yourself away from fiddling with the knobs on your EQ and figure out
how to open up your speakers.

[[email protected]]

Robert Morein wrote:

> > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> >
> > Grounding your speakers for better sound: This only requires some spare
> > light gauge copper wire and soldering equipment. It's for advanced
> > audiophiles who are not afraid to go into their (dynamic) speakers. Cut
> > single lengths of wire about the length of your regular speaker wire.
> > Solder each piece of wire to the positive terminals of each driver
> > connected to the crossover board inside the speaker. Do the same for
> > the other speaker. Now combine the free ends of all 4 (or 6) wires, and
> > connect this to the terminal grounding screw at the back of your amp.
> >
> I would only point out that there are certain amplifiers with "floating
> outputs" for which this must not be done. One such is the Acoustat TNT
> series of amplifiers. A connection to chassis ground is deadly to these
> amplifiers, which are otherwise robust. In some other designs, the amplifier
> is not harmed, but the connection defeats a part of the design intended to
> reduce hum-loop problems.
>
> This prohibition also applies to amplifiers operated in "bridged" mode, as
> it will damage them.

That sounds reasonable. Having no experience with those specific types
of setups, I'll give you the benefit of doubt here. Going by my
experience with my amps, I do think the tweak will work fine with no
problem with most standard amps that have a grounding screw. In all
this insane, misguided, ignorant hysteria about amps blowing up in your
face, none of the self-proclaimed "audio geniuses" here bothered to
think that you might be able to use another source to ground the extra
speaker wire than your amp, and perhaps still retain some benefit if
the wire is being connected to a ground.

[Robert Morein]

> wrote in message
ups.com...
>
> Robert Morein wrote:
>
>> > wrote in message
>> oups.com...
>> >
>> > Grounding your speakers for better sound: This only requires some spare
>> > light gauge copper wire and soldering equipment. It's for advanced
>> > audiophiles who are not afraid to go into their (dynamic) speakers. Cut
>> > single lengths of wire about the length of your regular speaker wire.
>> > Solder each piece of wire to the positive terminals of each driver
>> > connected to the crossover board inside the speaker. Do the same for
>> > the other speaker. Now combine the free ends of all 4 (or 6) wires, and
>> > connect this to the terminal grounding screw at the back of your amp.
>> >
>> I would only point out that there are certain amplifiers with "floating
>> outputs" for which this must not be done. One such is the Acoustat TNT
>> series of amplifiers. A connection to chassis ground is deadly to these
>> amplifiers, which are otherwise robust. In some other designs, the
>> amplifier
>> is not harmed, but the connection defeats a part of the design intended
>> to
>> reduce hum-loop problems.
>>
>> This prohibition also applies to amplifiers operated in "bridged" mode,
>> as
>> it will damage them.
>
> That sounds reasonable. Having no experience with those specific types
> of setups, I'll give you the benefit of doubt here. Going by my
> experience with my amps, I do think the tweak will work fine with no
> problem with most standard amps that have a grounding screw. In all
> this insane, misguided, ignorant hysteria about amps blowing up in your
> face, none of the self-proclaimed "audio geniuses" here bothered to
> think that you might be able to use another source to ground the extra
> speaker wire than your amp, and perhaps still retain some benefit if
> the wire is being connected to a ground.
>
With Acoustats, and with bridged amps, the speaker terminals have to float.
If you connect one of the speaker terminals to, say, a hot water pipe, the
circuit will complete to the chassis of the amp, either through the ground
lead of the power cord, or the braid of the signal feed. The result will be
damage. A user can measure the resistance between the black amplifier
output post, and chassis ground. If the resistance is less than half an ohm,
then the post is either connected directly to the chassis, or through a
small value resistor. This is indicative of conventional amplifier design,
which will not be damaged by the arrangment you suggest. There may, however,
be an obvious increase in hum, caused by increased flow of current on the
input cable braid. The user can decide this for himself.

[Ruud Broens]

"Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
...
: "WillBrink" > wrote in
: message
:
: > In article
: > . com>,
: > wrote:
: >
: >> Grounding your speakers for better sound: This only
: >> requires some spare light gauge copper wire and
: >> soldering equipment. It's for advanced audiophiles who
: >> are not afraid to go into their (dynamic) speakers. Cut
: >> single lengths of wire about the length of your regular
: >> speaker wire. Solder each piece of wire to the positive
: >> terminals of each driver connected to the crossover
: >> board inside the speaker. Do the same for the other
: >> speaker. Now combine the free ends of all 4 (or 6)
: >> wires, and connect this to the terminal grounding screw
: >> at the back of your amp.
: >
: > And the proof this silly tweak will have any effects on
: > sound quality is where again?
:
: It's obvious - by muting most if not all of the drivers in your speaker
: system and possibly destroying your power amp, audible distortion and noise
: will be dramatically reduced.

amazingly enough, exactly what i thought here
proves it _is_ possible that i agree with Arny
:-)
Rudy

[[email protected]]

Fella wrote:
> Ruud Broens wrote:
>
> > "Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > : "WillBrink" > wrote in
> > : message
> > :
> > : > In article
> > : > . com>,
> > : > wrote:
> > : >
> > : >> Grounding your speakers for better sound: This only
> > : >> requires some spare light gauge copper wire and
> > : >> soldering equipment. It's for advanced audiophiles who
> > : >> are not afraid to go into their (dynamic) speakers. Cut
> > : >> single lengths of wire about the length of your regular
> > : >> speaker wire. Solder each piece of wire to the positive
> > : >> terminals of each driver connected to the crossover
> > : >> board inside the speaker. Do the same for the other
> > : >> speaker. Now combine the free ends of all 4 (or 6)
> > : >> wires, and connect this to the terminal grounding screw
> > : >> at the back of your amp.
> > : >
> > : > And the proof this silly tweak will have any effects on
> > : > sound quality is where again?
> > :
> > : It's obvious - by muting most if not all of the drivers in your speaker
> > : system and possibly destroying your power amp, audible distortion and noise
> > : will be dramatically reduced.
> >
> > amazingly enough, exactly what i thought here
> > proves it _is_ possible that i agree with Arny
> > :-)
> > Rudy
> >
> >
>
> The jury is still out on this one Ruud.
>
> http://www.tannoy.com/media/Eyris.pdf
>
> In the manual the tannoy people say something *very* similar to what our
> pal shp is saying.

Yes, similar but not quite the same.
The literature from Tannoy is different.
That sounds like the marketing guys spin.
I looked at the manual and the connection diagrams.
I'd like to see how the x-over is configured since you
can jumper the terminals or run bi-amp.
Does not show jumpered to earthing terminal.
The earthing feature is interesting, but doesn't actually
indicate where the connection is inside.
Shielding isn't very effective if the wires terminate outside
an unshielded enclosure, the ends are still exposed to RFI.
RFI is usually a source cable problem and amplified, or a
poor design issue at the circuit component level.

[Ruud Broens]

"Fella" > wrote in message
...
: Ruud Broens wrote:
:
: > "Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
: > ...
: > : "WillBrink" > wrote in
: > : message
: > :
: > : > In article
: > : > . com>,
: > : > wrote:
: > : >
: > : >> Grounding your speakers for better sound: This only
: > : >> requires some spare light gauge copper wire and
: > : >> soldering equipment. It's for advanced audiophiles who
: > : >> are not afraid to go into their (dynamic) speakers. Cut
: > : >> single lengths of wire about the length of your regular
: > : >> speaker wire. Solder each piece of wire to the positive
: > : >> terminals of each driver connected to the crossover
: > : >> board inside the speaker. Do the same for the other
: > : >> speaker. Now combine the free ends of all 4 (or 6)
: > : >> wires, and connect this to the terminal grounding screw
: > : >> at the back of your amp.
: > : >
: > : > And the proof this silly tweak will have any effects on
: > : > sound quality is where again?
: > :
: > : It's obvious - by muting most if not all of the drivers in your speaker
: > : system and possibly destroying your power amp, audible distortion and noise
: > : will be dramatically reduced.
: >
: > amazingly enough, exactly what i thought here
: > proves it _is_ possible that i agree with Arny
: > :-)
: > Rudy
: >
: >
:
: The jury is still out on this one Ruud.
:
: http://www.tannoy.com/media/Eyris.pdf
:
: In the manual the tannoy people say something *very* similar to what our
: pal shp is saying.

heh. while using shielding for a lsp cable is not a bad idea
(anyone living close to a radio amateur may know this :),
connecting it to the +phase of the drivers ...
don't try this at home, kids :-)

Rudy

[Arny Krueger]

"Fella" > wrote in message


> The jury is still out on this one Ruud.
>
> http://www.tannoy.com/media/Eyris.pdf
>
> In the manual the tannoy people say something *very*
> similar to what our pal shp is saying.

It's only similar if you have not a clue about how electricity works.

There's an immense difference between chassis grounding and grounding the
hot terminal. The difference can be quanitifed as being the difference
between good wiring practice and total insanity.

[[email protected]]

Ruud Broens wrote:

> "Fella" > wrote in message
> ...
> : Ruud Broens wrote:
> :
> : > : > And the proof this silly tweak will have any effects on
> : > : > sound quality is where again?
> : > :
> : > : It's obvious - by muting most if not all of the drivers in your speaker
> : > : system and possibly destroying your power amp, audible distortion and noise
> : > : will be dramatically reduced.
> : >
> : > amazingly enough, exactly what i thought here
> : > proves it _is_ possible that i agree with Arny
> : > :-)
> : > Rudy
> : >
> : >
> :
> : The jury is still out on this one Ruud.
> :
> : http://www.tannoy.com/media/Eyris.pdf
> :
> : In the manual the tannoy people say something *very* similar to what our
> : pal shp is saying.
>
> heh. while using shielding for a lsp cable is not a bad idea
> (anyone living close to a radio amateur may know this :),
> connecting it to the +phase of the drivers ...
> don't try this at home, kids :-)
>
> Rudy

I tire of your ignorance. You've never tried this or any of my other
tweaks, so as with everyone else who hasn't tried the tweaks, you don't
know what you're talking about. You're trying to obfuscate the matter
with technical arguments that are not valid in my case, any more than
they invalidate the manufacturers of grounded loudspeakers. Your
arguments only prove your ignorance. So as I have extended to others, I
invite you to come to my place and I will demonstrate how tragically
wrong you are. You will be able to see the wires connected from the +
terminals of the drivers on the x-over of both speakers to the
grounding screw terminal on my amp; as it and numerous other
amp/loudspeaker combinations I've owned have been so wired for 7 years.
You will hear the amp driving the speakers at realistic volumes.

Among the things I will prove are that: there is no hum, there are no
sparks, there are no detrimental effects from RFI or EMI, the speakers
sound worse when the ground wires are displaced from the amp, the amp
does not blow up, and that you're a dogmatic ignorant twit, who
arrogantly speaks with confidence over things that are false. If I am
not able to demonstrate any of the above, you will have your travel
fare fully reimbursed. If I am, then you agree to post an apology on
RAO to me excusing your mindless ignorance, and admit that I'm right.
(The only condition I will not guarantee, is the part about hearing the
improvement. Like everything in audio, that is entirely a subjective
matter, and being a religious pseudo-objectivist, my belief is that
your listening skills are non-existent, or thereabout.).

Since nothing but demonstration can convince the truly ignorant, this
will put the issue to rest as to whether attaching earth wires from the
loudspeakers to the amp's grounding terminal will blow up an amplifier.
For the last time, either put up or SHUT UP.

[[email protected]]

François Yves Le Gal wrote;

> On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 15:49:15 +0200, Fella > wrote:
>
> >In the manual the tannoy people say something *very* similar to what our
> >pal shp is saying.
>
> Nope. Tannoy as well as other manufacturers only ground the baskets. This
> can be safe with most amps, even floating ones, as there is no direct
> connection between grounds.
>
> Sonics benefits, if any, are another story. This approach creates nice
> antennas picking up RFI...
>
> The initial post
> oups.com>
> mentioned:
>
> >Solder each piece of wire to the positive terminals of each driver
> >connected to the crossover board inside the speaker. Do the same for
> >the other speaker. Now combine the free ends of all 4 (or 6) wires, and
> >connect this to the terminal grounding screw at the back of your amp.
>
> Positive to ground = short circuit for non floating amps, where the "+"is
> live and the "-" is referenced to ground; a short plus a common ground for
> floating amps. A very stupid thing to do in both cases...

I tire of your ignorance. You've never tried this or any of my other
tweaks, so as with everyone else who hasn't tried the tweaks, you don't
know what you're talking about. You're trying to obfuscate the matter
with technical arguments that are not valid in my case, any more than
they invalidate the manufacturers of grounded loudspeakers. Your
arguments only prove your ignorance. So as I have extended to others, I
invite you to come to my place and I will demonstrate how tragically
wrong you are. You will be able to see the wires connected from the +
terminals of the drivers on the x-over of both speakers to the
grounding screw terminal on my amp; as it and numerous other
amp/loudspeaker combinations I've owned have been so wired for 7 years.
You will hear the amp driving the speakers at realistic volumes.

Among the things I will prove are that: there is no hum, there are no
sparks, there are no detrimental effects from RFI or EMI, the speakers
sound worse when the ground wires are displaced from the amp, the amp
does not blow up, and that you're a dogmatic ignorant twit, who
arrogantly speaks with confidence over things that are false. If I am
not able to demonstrate any of the above, you will have your travel
fare fully reimbursed. If I am, then you agree to post an apology on
RAO to me excusing your mindless ignorance, and admit that I'm right.
(The only condition I will not guarantee, is the part about hearing the
improvement. Like everything in audio, that is entirely a subjective
matter, and being a religious pseudo-objectivist, my belief is that
your listening skills are non-existent, or thereabout.).

Since nothing but demonstration can convince the truly ignorant, this
will put the issue to rest as to whether attaching earth wires from the
loudspeakers to the amp's grounding terminal will blow up an amplifier.
For the last time, either put up or SHUT UP.

[[email protected]]

Arny Krueger wrote:

> "Fella" > wrote in message
>
>
> > The jury is still out on this one Ruud.
> >
> > http://www.tannoy.com/media/Eyris.pdf
> >
> > In the manual the tannoy people say something *very*
> > similar to what our pal shp is saying.
>
> It's only similar if you have not a clue about how electricity works.
>
> There's an immense difference between chassis grounding and grounding the
> hot terminal. The difference can be quanitifed as being the difference
> between good wiring practice and total insanity.

I tire of your ignorance. You've never tried this or any of my other
tweaks, so as with everyone else who hasn't tried the tweaks, you don't
know what you're talking about. You're trying to obfuscate the matter
with technical arguments that are not valid in my case, any more than
they invalidate the manufacturers of grounded loudspeakers. Your
arguments only prove your ignorance.
So as I have extended to others, I invite you to come to my place and I
will demonstrate how tragically wrong you are. You will be able to see
the wires connected from the + terminals of the drivers on the x-over
of both speakers to the grounding screw terminal on my amp; as it and
numerous other amp/loudspeaker combinations I've owned have been so
wired for 7 years. You will hear the amp driving the speakers at
realistic volumes.

Among the things I will prove are that: there is no hum, there are no
sparks, there are no detrimental effects from RFI or EMI, the speakers
sound worse when the ground wires are displaced from the amp, the amp
does not blow up, and that you're a dogmatic ignorant twit, who
arrogantly speaks with confidence over things that are false. If I am
not able to demonstrate any of the above, you will have your travel
fare fully reimbursed. If I am, then you agree to post an apology on
RAO to me excusing your mindless ignorance, and admit that I'm right.
(The only condition I will not guarantee, is the part about hearing the
improvement. Like everything in audio, that is entirely a subjective
matter, and being a religious pseudo-objectivist, my belief is that
your listening skills are non-existent, or thereabout.).

Since nothing but demonstration can convince the truly ignorant, this
will put the issue to rest as to whether attaching earth wires from the
loudspeakers to the amp's grounding terminal will blow up an amplifier.
For the last time, either put up or SHUT UP.

[Trevor Wilson]

"Fella" > wrote in message
...
> Arny Krueger wrote:
>> "Fella" > wrote in message
>>
>>
>>
>>>The jury is still out on this one Ruud.
>>>
>>>http://www.tannoy.com/media/Eyris.pdf
>>>
>>>In the manual the tannoy people say something *very*
>>>similar to what our pal shp is saying.
>>
>>
>> It's only similar if you have not a clue about how electricity works.
>
> Shp claimed that some manufacturers have a third (fifth) post to do this
> earthing thing, and so yes, the tannoys do have it. Hence the similarity.
>
>>
>> There's an immense difference between chassis grounding and grounding the
>> hot terminal.
>
> How do you know *what* the tannoy people ground? How is it obvious from
> the URLs I provided? This is not a confrontational question, it is just a
> question, if you, or anyone else cares to answer it.

**Because Tannoy state as much in their promotional literature.

"......provides the facility for drive unit earthing, or grounding."

>
> I did ask, to be sure, about the original "tweak" suggestion of shp (the
> 3rd one of course) to a friend who actualy builds some sweet sweet
> sounding amps in these parts of the woods, has his own private workshop /
> lab kind of a dungeon, etc, and he also confirmed that what shp is
> suggesting is actually quite dangerous and would cause a short in most
> cases.

**Of course. SHP is just joking. It took me awhile to figure that out.

>
>
> The difference can be quanitifed as being the difference
>> between good wiring practice
>
>
> Does this mean that you are endorsing the tannoy "marketing hype" as
> others suggest it is? Again, just a question, nothing confrontational.

**What Tannoy are suggesting is of limited benefit, since most of the
problem lies with the speaker cables themselves. And only under extreme
conditions. I have encountered the problem a few times, where the client
lived close (less than a few hundred Metres) to a local TV transmission
tower. The high power RF insinuates itself on the speaker cabling, then
enters the amplifier (through the outputs) and is then routed to the front
end of the amplifier via the negative feedback line. The only solutions are:

* To shield everything in the speaker circuit. This includes the cables, the
crossover and the speakers themselves.
* To use an amplifier which has no global NFB or one which uses 'nested'
feedback.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

[Sander deWaal]

"Trevor Wilson" > said:

>**What Tannoy are suggesting is of limited benefit, since most of the
>problem lies with the speaker cables themselves. And only under extreme
>conditions. I have encountered the problem a few times, where the client
>lived close (less than a few hundred Metres) to a local TV transmission
>tower. The high power RF insinuates itself on the speaker cabling, then
>enters the amplifier (through the outputs) and is then routed to the front
>end of the amplifier via the negative feedback line. The only solutions are:

>* To shield everything in the speaker circuit. This includes the cables, the
>crossover and the speakers themselves.
>* To use an amplifier which has no global NFB or one which uses 'nested'
>feedback.


Trevor,

Do you have any experience with class D amplifiers such as the Hypex
UcD modules wrt. RFI?

--

- Never argue with idiots, they drag you down their level and beat you with experience. -

[Trevor Wilson]

"Sander deWaal" > wrote in message
...
> "Trevor Wilson" > said:
>
>>**What Tannoy are suggesting is of limited benefit, since most of the
>>problem lies with the speaker cables themselves. And only under extreme
>>conditions. I have encountered the problem a few times, where the client
>>lived close (less than a few hundred Metres) to a local TV transmission
>>tower. The high power RF insinuates itself on the speaker cabling, then
>>enters the amplifier (through the outputs) and is then routed to the front
>>end of the amplifier via the negative feedback line. The only solutions
>>are:
>
>>* To shield everything in the speaker circuit. This includes the cables,
>>the
>>crossover and the speakers themselves.
>>* To use an amplifier which has no global NFB or one which uses 'nested'
>>feedback.
>
>
> Trevor,
>
> Do you have any experience with class D amplifiers such as the Hypex
> UcD modules wrt. RFI?

**Nope, but I have experienced other amps which use SMPS and measured the
problems they exhibit on AM radio reception.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

[Goofball_star_dot_etal]

On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 22:25:37 +0100, Sander deWaal >
wrote:

>"Trevor Wilson" > said:
>
>>**What Tannoy are suggesting is of limited benefit, since most of the
>>problem lies with the speaker cables themselves. And only under extreme
>>conditions. I have encountered the problem a few times, where the client
>>lived close (less than a few hundred Metres) to a local TV transmission
>>tower. The high power RF insinuates itself on the speaker cabling, then
>>enters the amplifier (through the outputs) and is then routed to the front
>>end of the amplifier via the negative feedback line. The only solutions are:
>
>>* To shield everything in the speaker circuit. This includes the cables, the
>>crossover and the speakers themselves.
>>* To use an amplifier which has no global NFB or one which uses 'nested'
>>feedback.
>
>
>Trevor,
>
>Do you have any experience with class D amplifiers such as the Hypex
>UcD modules wrt. RFI?

Problems? I made one years ago and RFI was much less of a problem
than I expected although a few things exoloded in the early days. If
all else fails use Filtercons.(sp?)

[Arny Krueger]

"Fella" > wrote in message

> Arny Krueger wrote:
>> "Fella" > wrote in message
>>
>>
>>
>>> The jury is still out on this one Ruud.
>>>
>>> http://www.tannoy.com/media/Eyris.pdf
>>>
>>> In the manual the tannoy people say something *very*
>>> similar to what our pal shp is saying.

>> It's only similar if you have not a clue about how
>> electricity works.

> Shp claimed that some manufacturers have a third (fifth)
> post to do this earthing thing, and so yes, the tannoys
> do have it. Hence the similarity.

No way is any commercial speaker manufacturer shorting the positive
terminals of all drivers in all speakers together and connecting them to the
amplifier's chassis.

>> There's an immense difference between chassis grounding
>> and grounding the hot terminal.

> How do you know *what* the tannoy people ground?

Since Tannoy's speakers work normally, anybody who understands much about
audio knows that they are not shorting the positive terminals of all drivers
in all speakers together and connecting them to the amplifier's chassis.

> How is it obvious from the URLs I provided?

Common sense.

> This is not a
> confrontational question, it is just a question, if you,
> or anyone else cares to answer it.

The answer should be obvious.

> I did ask, to be sure, about the original "tweak"
> suggestion of shp (the 3rd one of course) to a friend who
> actualy builds some sweet sweet sounding amps in these
> parts of the woods, has his own private workshop / lab
> kind of a dungeon, etc, and he also confirmed that what
> shp is suggesting is actually quite dangerous and would
> cause a short in most cases.

SHP's tweak 3 will cause one or more serious problems in just about every
case.

> The difference can be quanitifed as being the difference
>> between good wiring practice

> Does this mean that you are endorsing the tannoy
> "marketing hype" as others suggest it is? Again, just a
> question, nothing confrontational.

Not at all. Connecting all of the driver chassis of a speaker system
together and making them available for grounding is a little excessive.
Unlike SHP's bizarre tweak, its not going to cause serious problems.

[Ruud Broens]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
:
: Ruud Broens wrote:
:
: > "Fella" > wrote in message
: > ...
: > : Ruud Broens wrote:
: > :
: > : > : > And the proof this silly tweak will have any effects on
: > : > : > sound quality is where again?
: > : > :
: > : > : It's obvious - by muting most if not all of the drivers in your speaker
: > : > : system and possibly destroying your power amp, audible distortion and
noise
: > : > : will be dramatically reduced.
: > : >
: > : > amazingly enough, exactly what i thought here
: > : > proves it _is_ possible that i agree with Arny
: > : > :-)
: > : > Rudy
: > : >
: > : >
: > :
: > : The jury is still out on this one Ruud.
: > :
: > : http://www.tannoy.com/media/Eyris.pdf
: > :
: > : In the manual the tannoy people say something *very* similar to what our
: > : pal shp is saying.
: >
: > heh. while using shielding for a lsp cable is not a bad idea
: > (anyone living close to a radio amateur may know this :),
: > connecting it to the +phase of the drivers ...
: > don't try this at home, kids :-)
: >
: > Rudy
:
: I tire of your ignorance.
............... ................. .......... ...,
OK, let's play along.
That is not ignoring, hence not ignorance, you will note.
I think it is outside the arena of fun when suggestions that will cause
serious damage to gear are posted. Your reply ?

: You've never tried this or any of my other
: tweaks, so as with everyone else who hasn't tried the tweaks, you don't
: know what you're talking about.

You are confusing issues. Posting things that have destructive results
are not tweaks, but plainly unethical posts.

: You're trying to obfuscate the matter
: with technical arguments that are not valid in my case, any more than
: they invalidate the manufacturers of grounded loudspeakers.

Please state your case as to why the technical arguments that
strongly suggest _not_ to evaluate this tweak for real are not valid.

: Your
: arguments only prove your ignorance. So as I have extended to others, I
: invite you to come to my place and I will demonstrate how tragically
: wrong you are.

does that demo involve chainsaws-in-action perchance ? no thx ;-)

: You will be able to see the wires connected from the +
: terminals of the drivers on the x-over of both speakers to the
: grounding screw terminal on my amp; as it and numerous other
: amp/loudspeaker combinations I've owned have been so wired for 7 years.

shorting/near shorting problems aside,
connecting all + phase connections of the drivers together will result in:

no longer functioning crossover filter
tweeter being blown out in a matter of seconds - they don't like 50 Hz, mucho
:-)

: You will hear the amp driving the speakers at realistic volumes.
:
Post a picture of your system(s). It will add to the imagining one does.
may need complex math, though

: Among the things I will prove are that: there is no hum, there are no
: sparks, there are no detrimental effects from RFI or EMI, the speakers
: sound worse when the ground wires are displaced from the amp, the amp
: does not blow up,
: and that you're a dogmatic ignorant twit,

yep, class act
or was that 'classing up' ?

: who arrogantly speaks with confidence over things that are false. If I am
: not able to demonstrate any of the above, you will have your travel
: fare fully reimbursed.

As i'm about to be stationed at Nova Scotia, an advanced research project,
you will note,

i've checked:
travel costs including helicopter, submarine, private jet, concorde and
regular airline & taxis comes to about 37,400 USD . you understand
a letter of credit from a reputable bank about your financial position
is in order, here.

If I am, then you agree to post an apology on
: RAO to me excusing your mindless ignorance, and admit that I'm right.
: (The only condition I will not guarantee, is the part about hearing the
: improvement. Like everything in audio, that is entirely a subjective
: matter, and being a religious pseudo-objectivist, my belief is that
: your listening skills are non-existent, or thereabout.).
:
: Since nothing but demonstration can convince the truly ignorant, this
: will put the issue to rest as to whether attaching earth wires from the
: loudspeakers to the amp's grounding terminal will blow up an amplifier.
: For the last time, either put up or SHUT UP.
:
i always put up

when i'm in the mood,
that is
:-)

Rucy

[Fella]

Arny Krueger wrote:

> "Fella" > wrote in message
>
>
>>Arny Krueger wrote:
>>
>>>"Fella" > wrote in message

>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>The jury is still out on this one Ruud.
>>>>
>>>>http://www.tannoy.com/media/Eyris.pdf
>>>>
>>>>In the manual the tannoy people say something *very*
>>>>similar to what our pal shp is saying.
>
>
>>>It's only similar if you have not a clue about how
>>>electricity works.
>
>
>>Shp claimed that some manufacturers have a third (fifth)
>>post to do this earthing thing, and so yes, the tannoys
>>do have it. Hence the similarity.
>
>
> No way is any commercial speaker manufacturer shorting the positive
> terminals of all drivers in all speakers together and connecting them to the
> amplifier's chassis.
>

English lessons, anyone?

[Sander deWaal]

"Trevor Wilson" > said:


>> Trevor,

>> Do you have any experience with class D amplifiers such as the Hypex
>> UcD modules wrt. RFI?

>**Nope, but I have experienced other amps which use SMPS and measured the
>problems they exhibit on AM radio reception.



Interesting.
I have a RAM audio pro-amplifier here, which also employs a switch
mode power supply.
It is supposed to put out 2 kW per channel in 4 ohms, and has switched
rails as well.
When the grounding is poor, there is audible noise coming out of the
speakers.....

I still haven't come around to measure what influence the PS has on
the amplifier part in terms of IM (it runs at about 200 kHz).

IMO, class D amps may suffer from the same phenomenon, when not
implemented correctly.
Hypex is pretty unsuspect in this regard, but the ICE-power B&O amps I
have heard may have some serious issues, if I am to believe my ears.

--

- Never argue with idiots, they drag you down their level and beat you with experience. -

[[email protected]]

Ruud Broens wrote:

> > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> :
> : Ruud Broens wrote:
> :
> : > "Fella" > wrote in message
> : > ...
> That is not ignoring, hence not ignorance, you will note.

> I think it is outside the arena of fun when suggestions that will cause
> serious damage to gear are posted. Your reply ?

My reply was that you're dead wrong, and you're adamant about being
dead wrong, too. I've offered proof that you're wrong, I've told you
that I've had no problems whatsoever grounding my speakers, and have
done this with numerous amps; only benefits result. Whether you want to
perform this or any other tweak or whether you don't, that's your
business. Whether anyone else wishes to, that's theirs. Since you don't
believe in doing tweaks, it's a moot point, isn't it. You think your
miserable standard of sound quality should be eveyrone else's.

> : You've never tried this or any of my other
> : tweaks, so as with everyone else who hasn't tried the tweaks, you don't
> : know what you're talking about.
>
> You are confusing issues. Posting things that have destructive results
> are not tweaks, but plainly unethical posts.

YOURS is the plainly unethical post, to claim "destructive results"
over a tweak you've never tried, but that I have many times without any
such thing whatsoever. You, like many others around here, have a
problem admitting when you're wrong.

> : You're trying to obfuscate the matter
> : with technical arguments that are not valid in my case, any more than
> : they invalidate the manufacturers of grounded loudspeakers.
>
> Please state your case as to why the technical arguments that
> strongly suggest _not_ to evaluate this tweak for real are not valid

Are you really that stupid? I'm not going to keep explaining this to
you for three weeks, if you still don't get it: my positive results
with the technique negates the need to argue theories for the next
three weeks. I've already proven your theories wrong by experience. And
I'm fully prepared to demonstrate the validity of my technique in
person. That means you need to educate yourself on what you're talking
about.

> : Your
> : arguments only prove your ignorance. So as I have extended to others, I
> : invite you to come to my place and I will demonstrate how tragically
> : wrong you are.
>
> does that demo involve chainsaws-in-action perchance ? no thx ;-)

You're afraid that I'm gong to murder you with a chainsaw if you come
round for a demosntration of my speaker grounding technique? God, I
knew you people on RAO were a fearful lot, but you have to take the
cake, mate. How do you manage to even go outside the house to fetch the
paper in the morning?

> shorting/near shorting problems aside,
> connecting all + phase connections of the drivers together will result in:
>
> no longer functioning crossover filter
> tweeter being blown out in a matter of seconds - they don't like 50 Hz, mucho
> :-)

Yeah, all that and aliens probing you anally. STOP posting deliberate
misinformation in order to obfuscate and misguide people. I've already
proven you wrong about all of that, I have a perfectly working system
that sounds far better than without the speaker grounding, and as I've
said many times, I'm ready to demonstrate that to anyone who is
serious.

> : You will hear the amp driving the speakers at realistic volumes.
> :
> Post a picture of your system(s). It will add to the imagining one does.
> may need complex math, though

I've posted detailed instructions on how to do the wiring. If you can't
figure it out by that, then you're not an advanced audiophile and the
tweak is not for you. The problem is you need to stop imaginging and
try it yourself, if you're that interested. If you're only interested
in Monty Python style arguments, then bugger off.
You're clearly trying to be deceitful here, and not at all sincere with
me.


> i've checked:
> travel costs including helicopter, submarine, private jet, concorde and
> regular airline & taxis comes to about 37,400 USD . you understand
> a letter of credit from a reputable bank about your financial position
> is in order, here.

Like I said, when you're serious about having me demonstrate the tweak,
we can talk seriously. Until then, please refer to the above "bugger
off".

> i always put up
>
> when i'm in the mood,
> that is

You obviously weren't in the mood, so you decided to repeat your same
ignorant and deceitful arguments. One thing about you RAO addicts, is
that you can sure as well argue until you're blue in the face. And then
argue some more, until you turn other colours.

[[email protected]]

wrote:
> Ruud Broens wrote:
>
> > > wrote in message
> > oups.com...
> > :
> > : Ruud Broens wrote:
> > :
> > : > "Fella" > wrote in message
> > : > ...
> > That is not ignoring, hence not ignorance, you will note.
>
> > I think it is outside the arena of fun when suggestions that will cause
> > serious damage to gear are posted. Your reply ?
>
> My reply was that you're dead wrong, and you're adamant about being
> dead wrong, too. I've offered proof that you're wrong, I've told you
> that I've had no problems whatsoever grounding my speakers, and have
> done this with numerous amps; only benefits result. Whether you want to
> perform this or any other tweak or whether you don't, that's your
> business. Whether anyone else wishes to, that's theirs. Since you don't
> believe in doing tweaks, it's a moot point, isn't it. You think your
> miserable standard of sound quality should be eveyrone else's.
>
> > : You've never tried this or any of my other
> > : tweaks, so as with everyone else who hasn't tried the tweaks, you don't
> > : know what you're talking about.
> >
> > You are confusing issues. Posting things that have destructive results
> > are not tweaks, but plainly unethical posts.
>
> YOURS is the plainly unethical post, to claim "destructive results"
> over a tweak you've never tried, but that I have many times without any
> such thing whatsoever. You, like many others around here, have a
> problem admitting when you're wrong.
>
> > : You're trying to obfuscate the matter
> > : with technical arguments that are not valid in my case, any more than
> > : they invalidate the manufacturers of grounded loudspeakers.
> >
> > Please state your case as to why the technical arguments that
> > strongly suggest _not_ to evaluate this tweak for real are not valid
>
> Are you really that stupid? I'm not going to keep explaining this to
> you for three weeks, if you still don't get it: my positive results
> with the technique negates the need to argue theories for the next
> three weeks. I've already proven your theories wrong by experience. And
> I'm fully prepared to demonstrate the validity of my technique in
> person. That means you need to educate yourself on what you're talking
> about.
>
> > : Your
> > : arguments only prove your ignorance. So as I have extended to others, I
> > : invite you to come to my place and I will demonstrate how tragically
> > : wrong you are.
> >
> > does that demo involve chainsaws-in-action perchance ? no thx ;-)
>
> You're afraid that I'm gong to murder you with a chainsaw if you come
> round for a demosntration of my speaker grounding technique? God, I
> knew you people on RAO were a fearful lot, but you have to take the
> cake, mate. How do you manage to even go outside the house to fetch the
> paper in the morning?
>
> > shorting/near shorting problems aside,
> > connecting all + phase connections of the drivers together will result in:
> >
> > no longer functioning crossover filter
> > tweeter being blown out in a matter of seconds - they don't like 50 Hz, mucho
> > :-)
>
> Yeah, all that and aliens probing you anally. STOP posting deliberate
> misinformation in order to obfuscate and misguide people. I've already
> proven you wrong about all of that, I have a perfectly working system
> that sounds far better than without the speaker grounding, and as I've
> said many times, I'm ready to demonstrate that to anyone who is
> serious.
>
> > : You will hear the amp driving the speakers at realistic volumes.
> > :
> > Post a picture of your system(s). It will add to the imagining one does.
> > may need complex math, though
>
> I've posted detailed instructions on how to do the wiring. If you can't
> figure it out by that, then you're not an advanced audiophile and the
> tweak is not for you. The problem is you need to stop imaginging and
> try it yourself, if you're that interested. If you're only interested
> in Monty Python style arguments, then bugger off.
> You're clearly trying to be deceitful here, and not at all sincere with
> me.
>
>
> > i've checked:
> > travel costs including helicopter, submarine, private jet, concorde and
> > regular airline & taxis comes to about 37,400 USD . you understand
> > a letter of credit from a reputable bank about your financial position
> > is in order, here.
>
> Like I said, when you're serious about having me demonstrate the tweak,
> we can talk seriously. Until then, please refer to the above "bugger
> off".
>
> > i always put up
> >
> > when i'm in the mood,
> > that is
>
> You obviously weren't in the mood, so you decided to repeat your same
> ignorant and deceitful arguments. One thing about you RAO addicts, is
> that you can sure as well argue until you're blue in the face. And then
> argue some more, until you turn other colours.

You still haven't told us the model of the amp in Famous Tweak #3.
or the model of loudspeakers with voice coils that are so robust
they could be toaster elements.
That's a long time to be hooked up in such a fashion.
If all + terminals on the speakers are connected directly together
as you have described, then you have bypassed the crossover.
Your tweeters are truly exceptional in power handling.
You did check to see if the mains were not open, and that
that supurb music you were hearing was just not the neighbors tunes.

Being the great philosopher and philanthropist you that you are,
one would expect you would be more gracious for our skepticism.
Does not learning occur through questioning the topography of the
concepts and how they differ from the known standard?

[Ruud Broens]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
:
: Ruud Broens wrote:
:
: > > wrote in message
: > oups.com...
: > :
: > : Ruud Broens wrote:
:
: > I think it is outside the arena of fun when suggestions that will cause
: > serious damage to gear are posted. Your reply ?
:
: My reply was that you're dead wrong, and you're adamant about being
: dead wrong, too.

prove it.

I've offered proof that you're wrong, I've told you
: that I've had no problems whatsoever grounding my speakers, and have
: done this with numerous amps; only benefits result.

telling it is so doesn't make it so. i could tell you, for instance,
i've got some cold fusion generators in the basement, generating
net energy in abundance...

: Whether you want to
: perform this or any other tweak or whether you don't, that's your
: business. Whether anyone else wishes to, that's theirs. Since you don't
: believe in doing tweaks, it's a moot point, isn't it. You think your
: miserable standard of sound quality should be eveyrone else's.

delusions of omniscience, noted
:
: > : You've never tried this or any of my other
: > : tweaks, so as with everyone else who hasn't tried the tweaks, you don't
: > : know what you're talking about.
: >
: > You are confusing issues. Posting things that have destructive results
: > are not tweaks, but plainly unethical posts.
:
: YOURS is the plainly unethical post, to claim "destructive results"
: over a tweak you've never tried, but that I have many times without any
: such thing whatsoever. You, like many others around here, have a
: problem admitting when you're wrong.

but you're wrong, having a problem admitting to be wrong
is an ego issue - don't have 'm ;-)
:
: > : You're trying to obfuscate the matter
: > : with technical arguments that are not valid in my case, any more than
: > : they invalidate the manufacturers of grounded loudspeakers.
: >
: > Please state your case as to why the technical arguments that
: > strongly suggest _not_ to evaluate this tweak for real are not valid
:
: Are you really that stupid? I'm not going to keep explaining this to
: you for three weeks, if you still don't get it: my positive results
: with the technique negates the need to argue theories for the next
: three weeks.

hm, are you saying you have a required recuperation period of 3 weeks,
when confronted with arguments ? That must explain your perception
of 'class' :-)

I've already proven your theories wrong by experience. And
: I'm fully prepared to demonstrate the validity of my technique in
: person. That means you need to educate yourself on what you're talking
: about.
:
: > : Your
: > : arguments only prove your ignorance. So as I have extended to others, I
: > : invite you to come to my place and I will demonstrate how tragically
: > : wrong you are.
: >
: > shorting/near shorting problems aside,
: > connecting all + phase connections of the drivers together will result in:
: > no longer functioning crossover filter
: > tweeter being blown out in a matter of seconds - they don't like 50 Hz, mucho
: > :-)
:
: Yeah, all that and aliens probing you anally.

he, that was a lucky guess, yes ?
can't recall i've posted that
anyway, you should've seen their faces, when i said:
"now, it's _my_ probing time" :-)

: STOP posting detailed instructions on how to do the wiring. If i can't
: figure it out by then, then you're not an advanced audiophile and the
: tweak is not for you. The problem is you need to stop imaginging and
: try it yourself, if you're that interested. If you're only interested
: in Monty Python style arguments, then bugger off.
: You're clearly trying to be deceitful here, and not at all sincere with
: me.
: >
: > when i'm in the mood,
: > that is
:
: You obviously weren't in the mood, so you decided to repeat your same
: ignorant and deceitful arguments. One thing about you RAO addicts, is
: that you can sure as well argue until you're blue in the face. And then
: argue some more, until you turn other colours.
:
once in a blue moon,
post tweaker
Rudy

[[email protected]]

wrote:

> wrote:
> > paul packer, gripped by fear, wrote:
> >
> > > On 16 Mar 2006 00:36:21 -0800, wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > > The tweaks are the most sincere,
> > > >intelligent, truthful and significant thing about audio anyone has
> > > >written about here in this back-alley-bare-fisted-brawl of a newsgroup
> > > >in a long time. In fact, I'd even venture to say that the tweaks I
> > > >posted are the most significant things anyone has ever written about
> > > >audio in the history of this newsgroup.
> > >
> > > Be afraid. Be very afraid.
> >
> > Thanks for proving my point! That seems to be the motto of most
> > everyone here. Fear of the unknown, which keeps you blind and ignorant.
> > Which keeps you saying ignorant things (see example above) about audio
> > for years and years, without ever trying to find out whether you're
> > right or wrong. Do you know the difference betwen right and wrong? (tm)
> > Didn't think so!
>
> SHP's fear speaks in response to the non-beliver. Loud as ever.

And I see that proof of your ridiculous assertions is as non-existent
as ever. You're the one too scared to try my tweaks, troll. Not me.


> You haven't told us the model of the amp in Famous Tweak #3.
> or the loudspeakers that are so robust they could be toaster elements.
> That's a long time to be hooked up in such a fashion.

I have indeed described the components of my hifi kit, that you're
too stupid to have figured that or anything else out, is not my
problem. You putting your foot in your fat mouth all the time is not my
problem either, Westface. The fact that I proved you and everyone else
wrong about the validity of my speaker grounding tweak in no. 3 is also
not my problem, but apparently, a big problem for you. The reason my
speakers have been playing much better than yours can for many years,
grounded to the amp isn't because

> You did check to see if the mains were not open, and that
> that supurb music you were hearing was just not the neighbors tunes.

"That's so funny I forgot to laugh". Don't attempt humour Westface,
its even more pathetic than your lame virtual threats to me. I offered
to demonstrate in person to several pig-ignorant skeptics and naysayers
like you, that my grounding tweak works on my equipment exactly as I
said it did. That shut up you and all the other big mouths real quick,
and no one accepted my generous offer.

> Being the great philosopher and philanthropist you that you are,
> one would expect you would be more gracious for our skepticism.

I don't suffer fools gladly, Westface. No greater fool I have seen
than you.

> You appear to be upset that we are not the sheep you seek.

You appear to not have a clue as to what people's thoughts, feelings
and motivations are. But then, you prove what a fool you are by
believing that you can, from only viewing words on your computer
screen. Case in point, fool: I am not "seeking sheep". It is "sheep"
that I have found throuhgout this group, and I'm sorry for being the
only one honest and insightful enough to point it out to you, but I am
certainly not responsible for you being one.

Until you are able to try all the alternative tweaks I have posted
without any shred of prejudice or "expectation effect" (negative or
positive), then you will remain sheep.


> Does not learning occur through questioning the topography of the
> concepts and how they differ from the known standard?

No, that's where you chuckleheads always get it wrong. Theory is a
poor substitute for experience, when empirical evidence is readily
available. Learning occurs when you actually find the courage or
knowledge to TRY the tweaks. That's where you put your theory to the
test, and find out how valid it is or ISN'T. No one here has done so,
except me. Therefore, I'm the only true expert on the subject of
whether this tweak will blow your amp up or simply improve the sound of
your speakers.

[[email protected]]

wrote:
much obfuscation and out of context quotes

Do you suffer from adult ADD?

Please show the date of the post that details your equipment that
you used for tweak #3. Unless it was deleted, all you have stated is
a generic amp/speaker reference in any post that is still on Google.

You are welcome to call me a fool for not shorting my amplifier.
Your empirical evidence isn't doing it for me or anyone else for that
matter.

Actually you never offered a personal demonstration to me, but
perhaps you could do a webcast,and then put all your non-believers
to shame for doubting your intellect.

Please send me the details of the device which allows my computer
screen to view what people's thoughts, feelings and motivations are.

I accept your apology for calling me a sheep.
I will point out that I have the charred remains of a QSC amplifier
that was shorted + terminal to ground long before you posted your
Tweak#3 so I personally have PROOF that it does not improve the sound.

Are you so certain that it's a flock of sheep that are reading the
wisdom that you are so willing to share?
You really shouldn't be dissing the aliens, since you don't believe
the principles of physics applies :-)

[dizzy]

wrote:

>he's a troll

Oh, I think we can all see who the troll here is.

What's amazing is how much time people waste on you.