From the Archives

[[email protected]]

This was so good, I thought it should be shared.

"There is no way the ABX comparator can be used to prove or disprove
the existence of a caring God. But it does offer hope of proving, for
the first time, whether some of the less-credible observations of
perfectionists have any basis in reality or are magnificently-conceived
self-deceptions. That is why, even though I feel that the device itself
needs further implementation, as the jargoncrats would put it, I also
feel it is the most significant contribution to audio that has come
upon us in years."

J. Gordon Holt

http://www.stereophile.com/asweseeit/121/index2.html

[Howard Ferstler]

" wrote:
>
> This was so good, I thought it should be shared.
>
> "There is no way the ABX comparator can be used to prove or disprove
> the existence of a caring God. But it does offer hope of proving, for
> the first time, whether some of the less-credible observations of
> perfectionists have any basis in reality or are magnificently-conceived
> self-deceptions. That is why, even though I feel that the device itself
> needs further implementation, as the jargoncrats would put it, I also
> feel it is the most significant contribution to audio that has come
> upon us in years."
>
> J. Gordon Holt
>
> http://www.stereophile.com/asweseeit/121/index2.html

Oh, oh. You copied something from the archives and posted it
here.

More power to Holt, though, who I profiled in The
Encyclopedia of Recorded Sound.

Howard Ferstler

[[email protected]]

wrote:
> This was so good, I thought it should be shared.
>
> "There is no way the ABX comparator can be used to prove or disprove
> the existence of a caring God. But it does offer hope of proving, for
> the first time, whether some of the less-credible observations of
> perfectionists have any basis in reality or are magnificently-conceived
> self-deceptions. That is why, even though I feel that the device itself
> needs further implementation, as the jargoncrats would put it, I also
> feel it is the most significant contribution to audio that has come
> upon us in years."
>
> J. Gordon Holt
>
> http://www.stereophile.com/asweseeit/121/index2.html
>
>
Wherein J.Gordon Holt, founder of Stereophile writes:


"I feel this is the first really significant contribution to the audio
field in years"

and


"I can only hope ABX sells a lot of these"


and closes with this gem:


"But, God, how I'd like to put some 'undergound' reporters claims to
the test with this"


I can hardly wait to hear the Atkinsonian blather/spin/bull**** on
this. :-D

[Robert Morein]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
> This was so good, I thought it should be shared.
>
> "There is no way the ABX comparator can be used to prove or disprove
> the existence of a caring God. But it does offer hope of proving, for
> the first time, whether some of the less-credible observations of
> perfectionists have any basis in reality or are magnificently-conceived
> self-deceptions. That is why, even though I feel that the device itself
> needs further implementation, as the jargoncrats would put it, I also
> feel it is the most significant contribution to audio that has come
> upon us in years."
>
> J. Gordon Holt
>
> http://www.stereophile.com/asweseeit/121/index2.html
>
and
"And speaking of power amplifiers, the ABX is not really designed for
testing them all. While the manual-which itself is not as clear nor
comprehensive as it could be --shows how the relay box can be connected so
as to switch loudspeakers between two power amps, it cites the relays as
being rated at 100 milliamps, which equates to a power-handling capacity of
about 0.08 watts into an 8-ohm load. With most loudspeakers, this would
elicit an output level of about 80dB at 1 meter, which is not quite adequate
for serious analytical listening."

I find I get along very well with the idea of ABX. I don't get along with
the proponents of it, because they tend to have nasty dispositions, and they
use this rather underengineered device as a tool to "prove" far ranging,
false implications about audio.

The ABXers tend to have poor social skills. They don't understand that the
alienation they cause is a result of mixing two logically separate beliefs:
1. that sighted listening is inadequate (or, as I would prefer to say,
suboptimal)
2. that some large proportion of audio components that are purported to
sound substantially different, do, in fact, not.

To add to the "insult", whenever someone remarks that he's heard some
difference, the ABXers shout him down. If the ABX philosophy had any chance
of adoption, this would not be the way to do it.

Arny Krueger thinks I want to "destroy" him. This absurd personalization is
a symptom of a highly warped mind. His "science" was a good first try. A
real scientist would try again, without letting himself be captured by the
belief, as he apparently has, that I want to "destroy" him. He's really too
much fun to have around. As someone said, "If the devil did not exist, we
would have to invent him."

I am no enemy of ABX. I criticize pseudoscience when I see it. I criticize
individuals who have done poor science, and try to get up on some kind of a
pedestal.

Arny, clean up your act, and I'll listen to what you have to say. You must
improve your apparatus, and cease reaching far ranging conclusions based
upon meager samples. And above all, get rid of those QSC amps. They are for
deaf people only.

[[email protected]]

Robert "bad scientist" Morein wrote:

"Arny Krueger thinks I want to "destroy" him."

I doubt it. I doubt he thinks about a failure like you at all.
Mostly, he probably just laughs at all the things you get wrong.

"This absurd personalization is
a symptom of a highly warped mind."

Of course it couldn't have anything to do with all the personal attacks
you launch against him, or the name calling.

"I criticize pseudoscience when I see it"

LOL! You engage in and endorse pseudoscience, on an almost daily
basis.


"And above all, get rid of those QSC amps. They are for
deaf people only."

As if to prove my point.

What bias free, level matched comparisons of QSC USA amps have you
done?
What bias free, level matched comparisons have you done of anything?

[[email protected]]

Oh, oh. You copied something from the archives and posted it
here.

More power to Holt, though, who I profiled in The
Encyclopedia of Recorded Sound.


Howard Ferstler

I made sure everybody knew where I got it and I'm not going to profit
from it in any way, other some major giggles when I first read it.

[[email protected]]

wrote:
> Robert "bad scientist" Morein wrote:
>
> "Arny Krueger thinks I want to "destroy" him."
>
> I doubt it. I doubt he thinks about a failure like you at all.
> Mostly, he probably just laughs at all the things you get wrong.
>
> "This absurd personalization is
> a symptom of a highly warped mind."
>
> Of course it couldn't have anything to do with all the personal attacks
> you launch against him, or the name calling.
>
> "I criticize pseudoscience when I see it"
>
> LOL! You engage in and endorse pseudoscience, on an almost daily
> basis.
>
>
> "And above all, get rid of those QSC amps. They are for
> deaf people only."
>
> As if to prove my point.
>
> What bias free, level matched comparisons of QSC USA amps have you
> done?
> What bias free, level matched comparisons have you done of anything?


Back at you. What "bias free" level matched comparisons have *you*
done?




Scott Wheeler

[Robert Morein]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
> Robert "bad scientist" Morein wrote:
>
> "Arny Krueger thinks I want to "destroy" him."
>
> I doubt it. I doubt he thinks about a failure like you at all.
> Mostly, he probably just laughs at all the things you get wrong.
>
Actually, Arny believes a number of people want to "destroy" him:
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?as_q=&num=10&scoring=r&hl=en&as_epq=destroy+me&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_ugroup=&as_usubject=&as_uauthors=Arny+Krueger&lr=&as_drrb=q&as_qdr=&as_mind=1&as_minm=1&as_miny=1981&as_maxd=27&as_maxm=5&as_maxy=2005&safe=off

No healthy person would think something like that. This is a RECREATIONAL
group, not a World Court.
He's blown this completely out of perspective.

[George M. Middius]

Robert Morein said:

> Actually, Arny believes a number of people want to "destroy" him:
> http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?as_q=&num=10&scoring=r&hl=en&as_epq=destroy+me&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_ugroup=&as_usubject=&as_uauthors=Arny+Krueger&lr=&as_drrb=q&as_qdr=&as_mind=1&as_minm=1&as_miny=1981&as_maxd=27&as_maxm=5&as_maxy=2005&safe=off

I'd like to see that. If I went to shul, I'd ask the Rabbi to take up a
collection to pay for somebody to destroy the Krooborg.

> He's blown this completely out of perspective.

Did you say Arnii has blown somebody? That'll set Lionella off. Watch your
back!

[[email protected]]

The Bad Scientist runs amok:

"Actually, Arny believes a number of people want to "destroy" him:
http://groups-beta.google.com/=ADgroups?as_q=3D&num=3D10&scoring=3Dr&=ADhl=
=3Den&as_...


No healthy person would think something like that. This is a
RECREATIONAL
group, not a World Court.
He's blown this completely out of perspective."

Oh, I get it, it's Arny who's blown things out of proportion, not the
group of muddle headed fools with nothing better to do than attack
people who try to dispel mythology about audio.

Do you not have any idea how small minded and petty you guys seem?

Somebody challenges your mysticism with some facts and the call go out
to mock and ridicule. That you don't try to elevate the discussion or
find something that might be better science, shows how much denial you
wallow in.

[Robert Morein]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
The Bad Scientist runs amok:

"Actually, Arny believes a number of people want to "destroy" him:
http://groups-beta.google.com/*groups?as_q=&num=10&scoring=r&*hl=en&as_...


No healthy person would think something like that. This is a
RECREATIONAL
group, not a World Court.
He's blown this completely out of perspective."

Oh, I get it, it's Arny who's blown things out of proportion, not the
group of muddle headed fools with nothing better to do than attack
people who try to dispel mythology about audio.

Do you not have any idea how small minded and petty you guys seem?

Of course:
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?as_q=&num=10&scoring=r&hl=en&as_epq=destroy+me&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_ugroup=&as_usubject=&as_uauthors=Arny+Krueger&lr=&as_drrb=q&as_qdr=&as_mind=1&as_minm=1&as_miny=1981&as_maxd=27&as_maxm=5&as_maxy=2005&safe=off

We're trying to destroy a small minded and petty person :)

[Robert Morein]

----- Original Message -----
From: >
Newsgroups: rec.audio.opinion
Sent: Friday, May 27, 2005 8:47 PM
Subject: Re: From the Archives


The Bad Scientist runs amok:

"Actually, Arny believes a number of people want to "destroy" him:
http://groups-beta.google.com/*groups?as_q=&num=10&scoring=r&*hl=en&as_...


No healthy person would think something like that. This is a
RECREATIONAL
group, not a World Court.
He's blown this completely out of perspective."

>Oh, I get it, it's Arny who's blown things out of proportion, not the
>group of muddle headed fools with nothing better to do than attack
>people who try to dispel mythology about audio.

>Do you not have any idea how small minded and petty you guys seem?

>Somebody challenges your mysticism with some facts and the call go out
>to mock and ridicule. That you don't try to elevate the discussion or
>find something that might be better science, shows how much denial you
>wallow in.

No, we have water here. Believe me. It's much more pleasant than denial.

[Lionel]

George "Betty Boop" Middius a écrit :


> Watch your back!

George's prefered phantasm... ;-)

[[email protected]]

Robert Moreing wrote:

We're trying to destroy a small minded and petty person :)


That would mean you will be commiting suicide soon.

[Robert Morein]

> wrote in message
oups.com...
> Robert Moreing wrote:
>
> We're trying to destroy a small minded and petty person :)
>
>
> That would mean you will be commiting suicide soon.
>
I enjoy what I do too much :)

[John Atkinson]

Howard Ferstler wrote:
> " wrote:
> > http://www.stereophile.com/asweseeit/121/index2.html
>
> Oh, oh. You copied something from the archives and posted
> it here.

"NYOB"'s quoting of the Holt article was fair use, as he only
reproduced as much as was needed to make his argument. He did
not reprint the entire article, as you did with another
Stereophile article, Mr. Ferstler. What you did by definition
is _not_ fair use, which is why I forced you to delete the
offending post.

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

[[email protected]]

Scott Wheeler said:

"Back at you. What "bias free" level matched comparisons have *you*
done?"

I'm not making the claim about an amplifier sounding bad. I would not
make such a claim without doing a level matched, bias controlled
comparison. Morein wants to have it both ways, he wants to accuse
others of not being rigorous enough, while not making any attempt on
his own to adhere to his own supposed standards.

I have done some very simple tests on speaker cables, and CD players
that were level matched. The results were as one would expect.

[[email protected]]

John "anally retentive" Atkinson wrote:
>
>

> I forced you to delete the
> offending post.
>
> John Atkinson
> Editor, $tereopile
>
>


The only thing you've forced in recent history is a very hard turd out
your very clenched asshole.

[[email protected]]

wrote:
> Scott Wheeler said:
>
> "Back at you. What "bias free" level matched comparisons have *you*
> done?"

Two. Both with positive results. ARC preamp and amp v. a Yamaha
reciever of equal power.



>
> I'm not making the claim about an amplifier sounding bad. I would not
> make such a claim without doing a level matched, bias controlled
> comparison. Morein wants to have it both ways, he wants to accuse
> others of not being rigorous enough, while not making any attempt on
> his own to adhere to his own supposed standards.
>
> I have done some very simple tests on speaker cables, and CD players
> that were level matched. The results were as one would expect.



Useless.





Scott Wheeler

[severian]

> wrote in message
ups.com...
>
>
> wrote:
> > This was so good, I thought it should be shared.
> >
> > "There is no way the ABX comparator can be used to prove or disprove
> > the existence of a caring God. But it does offer hope of proving, for
> > the first time, whether some of the less-credible observations of
> > perfectionists have any basis in reality or are magnificently-conceived
> > self-deceptions. That is why, even though I feel that the device itself
> > needs further implementation, as the jargoncrats would put it, I also
> > feel it is the most significant contribution to audio that has come
> > upon us in years."
> >
> > J. Gordon Holt
> >
> > http://www.stereophile.com/asweseeit/121/index2.html
> >
> >
> Wherein J.Gordon Holt, founder of Stereophile writes:
>
>
> "I feel this is the first really significant contribution to the audio
> field in years"
>
> and
>
>
> "I can only hope ABX sells a lot of these"
>
>
> and closes with this gem:
>
>
> "But, God, how I'd like to put some 'undergound' reporters claims to
> the test with this"
>
>
> I can hardly wait to hear the Atkinsonian blather/spin/bull**** on
> this. :-D
>

Well, if you go back and read the older Sphiles when JGH was in charge, the
editorial tone of the mag was completely different, and in my opinion
superior. The descriptions of the sound, subjective though they were, were
nowhere near as extreme or flowery, the equipment was not nose bleed
expensive, and the whole feel and editorial drift was closer to todays
Sensible Sound than what Stereophile has become. There also was a decided
skepticism, especially toward tweeko mods and claims. Somewhere in the whole
progression of the magazine this editorial slant disappeared.

[severian]

"Robert Morein" > wrote in message
...
>
> > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> The Bad Scientist runs amok:
>
> "Actually, Arny believes a number of people want to "destroy" him:
> http://groups-beta.google.com/*groups?as_q=&num=10&scoring=r&*hl=en&as_...
>
>
> No healthy person would think something like that. This is a
> RECREATIONAL
> group, not a World Court.
> He's blown this completely out of perspective."
>
> Oh, I get it, it's Arny who's blown things out of proportion, not the
> group of muddle headed fools with nothing better to do than attack
> people who try to dispel mythology about audio.
>
> Do you not have any idea how small minded and petty you guys seem?
>
> Of course:
>
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?as_q=&num=10&scoring=r&hl=en&as_epq=destroy+me&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_ugroup=&as_usubject=&as_uauthors=Arny+Krueger&lr=&as_drrb=q&as_qdr=&as_mind=1&as_minm=1&as_miny=1981&as_maxd=27&as_maxm=5&as_maxy=2005&safe=off
>
> We're trying to destroy a small minded and petty person :)
>
>
>

Thus proving how large minded and magnanimus you are?

[[email protected]]

severian wrote:
> > wrote in message
> ups.com...
> >
> >
> > wrote:
> > > This was so good, I thought it should be shared.
> > >
> > > "There is no way the ABX comparator can be used to prove or disprove
> > > the existence of a caring God. But it does offer hope of proving, for
> > > the first time, whether some of the less-credible observations of
> > > perfectionists have any basis in reality or are magnificently-conceived
> > > self-deceptions. That is why, even though I feel that the device itself
> > > needs further implementation, as the jargoncrats would put it, I also
> > > feel it is the most significant contribution to audio that has come
> > > upon us in years."
> > >
> > > J. Gordon Holt
> > >
> > > http://www.stereophile.com/asweseeit/121/index2.html
> > >
> > >
> > Wherein J.Gordon Holt, founder of Stereophile writes:
> >
> >
> > "I feel this is the first really significant contribution to the audio
> > field in years"
> >
> > and
> >
> >
> > "I can only hope ABX sells a lot of these"
> >
> >
> > and closes with this gem:
> >
> >
> > "But, God, how I'd like to put some 'undergound' reporters claims to
> > the test with this"
> >
> >
> > I can hardly wait to hear the Atkinsonian blather/spin/bull**** on
> > this. :-D
> >
>
> Well, if you go back and read the older Sphiles when JGH was in charge, the
> editorial tone of the mag was completely different, and in my opinion
> superior. The descriptions of the sound, subjective though they were, were
> nowhere near as extreme or flowery, the equipment was not nose bleed
> expensive, and the whole feel and editorial drift was closer to todays
> Sensible Sound than what Stereophile has become.
>
>
Yes, I well remember the old S'phile under the direction of JGH. It was
a refreshing contrast to the other US mags of the day.
>
>
> There also was a decided
> skepticism, especially toward tweeko mods and claims.
>
>
Agreed. One can see that from the last line of the quoted article:
"But, God, how I'd like to put some 'underground' reporters claims to
the test with this". IMO, at the time, Holt was refering mainly to
Pearson et al at TAS, but I'm sure it would apply to the $tereophile of
today, as well.
>
>
> Somewhere in the whole
> progression of the magazine this editorial slant disappeared.
>
>
Drowned in a torrent of snakeoil and greed when Atkinson took over. :-(

[Robert Morein]

"severian" > wrote in message
ink.net...
>
> "Robert Morein" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > > wrote in message
> > oups.com...
> > The Bad Scientist runs amok:
> >
> > "Actually, Arny believes a number of people want to "destroy" him:
> >
http://groups-beta.google.com/*groups?as_q=&num=10&scoring=r&*hl=en&as_...
> >
> >
> > No healthy person would think something like that. This is a
> > RECREATIONAL
> > group, not a World Court.
> > He's blown this completely out of perspective."
> >
> > Oh, I get it, it's Arny who's blown things out of proportion, not the
> > group of muddle headed fools with nothing better to do than attack
> > people who try to dispel mythology about audio.
> >
> > Do you not have any idea how small minded and petty you guys seem?
> >
> > Of course:
> >
>
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?as_q=&num=10&scoring=r&hl=en&as_epq=destroy+me&as_oq=&as_eq=&as_ugroup=&as_usubject=&as_uauthors=Arny+Krueger&lr=&as_drrb=q&as_qdr=&as_mind=1&as_minm=1&as_miny=1981&as_maxd=27&as_maxm=5&as_maxy=2005&safe=off
> >
> > We're trying to destroy a small minded and petty person :)
> >
> >
> >
>
> Thus proving how large minded and magnanimus you are?
>
The correct spelling is "magnanimous".
I suppose a "magnanimus" would be a species of large rodent.

[[email protected]]

Robert Morein said:

I enjoy what I do too much :)


You mean being the Ward Churchill of audio?

[George M. Middius]

Robert Morein said:

> > Thus proving how large minded and magnanimus you are?

> The correct spelling is "magnanimous".
> I suppose a "magnanimus" would be a species of large rodent.

'Borgs aren't allowed to read dictionaries, you know. They might get ideas.

[Robert Morein]

"George M. Middius" <cmndr [underscore] george [at] comcast [dot] net> wrote
in message ...
>
>
> Robert Morein said:
>
> > > Thus proving how large minded and magnanimus you are?
>
> > The correct spelling is "magnanimous".
> > I suppose a "magnanimus" would be a species of large rodent.
>
> 'Borgs aren't allowed to read dictionaries, you know. They might get
ideas.
>
If you look at the root, "magnanimus" is almost "large dislike".
http://www.hyperdictionary.com/search.aspx?define=animus

[Robert Morein]

> wrote in message
ups.com...
> Robert Morein said:
>
> I enjoy what I do too much :)
>
>
> You mean being the Ward Churchill of audio?
>
Winston Churchill.

[George M. Middius]

Robert Morein said:

> > > > Thus proving how large minded and magnanimus you are?

> > > The correct spelling is "magnanimous".
> > > I suppose a "magnanimus" would be a species of large rodent.

> > 'Borgs aren't allowed to read dictionaries, you know. They might get ideas.

> If you look at the root, "magnanimus" is almost "large dislike".
> http://www.hyperdictionary.com/search.aspx?define=animus

That's very generous of you.

[Arny Krueger]

Robert Morein wrote:

> We're trying to destroy a small minded and petty person.

Time to get some help with those thoughts of suicide,
Robert. ;-(

[Howard Ferstler]

John Atkinson wrote:
>
> Howard Ferstler wrote:
> > " wrote:
> > > http://www.stereophile.com/asweseeit/121/index2.html
> >
> > Oh, oh. You copied something from the archives and posted
> > it here.

> "NYOB"'s quoting of the Holt article was fair use, as he only
> reproduced as much as was needed to make his argument. He did
> not reprint the entire article, as you did with another
> Stereophile article, Mr. Ferstler. What you did by definition
> is _not_ fair use, which is why I forced you to delete the
> offending post.
>
> John Atkinson
> Editor, Stereophile

I'll bet you and your crew of sockpuppets read everything I
post here, John, and everything I publish, too. I'll bet you
have even had staff meetings about me.

Actually, you and your churlish, sockpuppet minions should
relax. I am backing off from my audio-writing work (both
here and in the "legitimate" press), and intend to actually
retire and "get a life" as they say.

Yeah, I finally realize that your kind (meaning
tweako-believer journalists, tweako-trickster journalists,
and goofy tweako believers who read tweak-audio journals and
believe what those publish) are not worth the trouble.

Yeah, you win. Enjoy the money. Your only problem now is to
learn how to live with yourself.

Howard Ferstler

[John Atkinson]

Howard Ferstler wrote:
> I'll bet you and your crew of sockpuppets read
> everything I post here, John, and everything I
> publish, too.

To my regret, I do read what you publish, Mr. Ferstler,
though not everything you post to the newsgroups. But
please note that I do not have a "crew" of sockpuppets.
Every Stereophile writer who posts to the newsgroups
does so under his own name.

> I'll bet you have even had staff meetings about me.

Nope. That's not correct, either.

John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile

[Howard Ferstler]

John Atkinson wrote:
>
> Howard Ferstler wrote:
> > I'll bet you and your crew of sockpuppets read
> > everything I post here, John, and everything I
> > publish, too.

> To my regret, I do read what you publish, Mr. Ferstler,
> though not everything you post to the newsgroups.

Still, it has to be assumed that this often regretful
reading has resulted in at least a minor increase in your
knowledge of audio. Fortunately, it does not seem to have
done you much good.

> But
> please note that I do not have a "crew" of sockpuppets.
> Every Stereophile writer who posts to the newsgroups
> does so under his own name.

How on earth would you know?

It is preposterous for anyone to assume that your crew posts
under their own names, because we hardly ever see those
posts. We have to assume that because you are here and
posting copiously, your fellow Stereophile writers also lurk
and would be unable to not post almost as much as you do.
(The compulsion would be overwhelming.) However, they do not
post as much as you do, or even close to as much, and so my
assumption is that they operate as sockpuppets and post
aplenty.

Heck, I would not be in the least surprised if they have
been instructed to work that way, in order to minimize the
derision they would encounter when they posted one silly and
error-filled post after another.

> > I'll bet you have even had staff meetings about me.

> Nope. That's not correct, either.

You guys disappoint. Anyway, glad to see that you responded
to my previous post so quickly. Must be slow at the shop
today, John. I can get away with behavior like that, because
I am retired. However, you are supposed to be working at
your day job.

Howard Ferstler

[MINe 109]

In article >,
Howard Ferstler > wrote:

> You guys disappoint. Anyway, glad to see that you responded
> to my previous post so quickly. Must be slow at the shop
> today, John. I can get away with behavior like that, because
> I am retired. However, you are supposed to be working at
> your day job.

Hmm. See post, compose reply, post reply.

How long should it take?

Stephen

[Howard Ferstler]

MINe 109 wrote:
>
> In article >,
> Howard Ferstler > wrote:
>
> > You guys disappoint. Anyway, glad to see that you responded
> > to my previous post so quickly. Must be slow at the shop
> > today, John. I can get away with behavior like that, because
> > I am retired. However, you are supposed to be working at
> > your day job.

> Hmm. See post, compose reply, post reply.
>
> How long should it take?
>
> Stephen

Well, one would think that it is quite odd that you are
ALWAYS here when I drop in. My point was that you and some
of the others here need to get out more. Actually, assuming
that you have jobs, you need to stop horsing around on RAO
and get back to work.

Howard Ferstler

[George Middius]

Brother Horace the Eternally Overmatched whined:
>> > I am retired. However, you are supposed to be working at
>> > your day job.

>> Hmm. See post, compose reply, post reply.
>> How long should it take?

>Well, one would think that it is quite odd that you are
>ALWAYS here when I drop in.

Are you aware of the contradictions in your whining? You "drop in" to RAO
because you crave abuse. Then you get the abuse, and you complain that Normals
are paying attention to you. Then we might leave you alone for a bit, and you
engage in passive-aggressive posturing in order to keep the attention coming.


>My point was that you and some
>of the others here need to get out more.

Who's afraid of the Big Silver Bird?

[MINe 109]

In article >,
Howard Ferstler > wrote:

> MINe 109 wrote:
> >
> > In article >,
> > Howard Ferstler > wrote:
> >
> > > You guys disappoint. Anyway, glad to see that you responded
> > > to my previous post so quickly. Must be slow at the shop
> > > today, John. I can get away with behavior like that, because
> > > I am retired. However, you are supposed to be working at
> > > your day job.
>
> > Hmm. See post, compose reply, post reply.
> >
> > How long should it take?
> >
> > Stephen
>
> Well, one would think that it is quite odd that you are
> ALWAYS here when I drop in.

Big deal. I have time to check the group two or three times a day.

> My point was that you and some
> of the others here need to get out more.

Jeez. I practiced two hours, spent an hour waiting for an audition,
drove 45 minutes to rehearse and accompany four more auditions (two
hours total), return drive then had a four-hour theater rehearsal.
That's twelve hours away and if I choose to relax by reading articles,
email and newsgroups when I'm home, tain't nobody's business if I do.

> Actually, assuming
> that you have jobs, you need to stop horsing around on RAO
> and get back to work.

That's odd. You posted when you were still working. Is this the usual
Howard double-standard?

Stephen

[George M. Middius]

Brother Horace the Eternally Dim lied:

> I'll bet you and your crew of sockpuppets

You mean the sockpuppets like Dickie "torrie****s" Malesweski, Mickey "NYOB"
McMickey, Lionella "La Salope" Sha-pwee, and Michael "Bwian McLardass"
Conzo? Guess what, Clerkie -- they're all fans of yours and Krooger's.

Your crew of sockpuppets, and welcome to Them.

[[email protected]]

A small and petty person named Robert Morein wrote:

"We're trying to destroy a small minded and petty person :)"

If that were true all you need to do is leave him alone and let people
judge for themselves.
You obviously feel threatened by the fact that he makes sense and knows
vastly more about electronics than you do, and science in general.

[George Middius]

Mikey the Bug Eater pleads for the Normals to leave poor Arnii alone.

> >"We're trying to destroy a small minded and petty person :)"

>If that were true all you need to do is leave him alone and let people
>judge for themselves.

Poor little Arnii. Everybody's picking on him.

Did you ever share a plate of bugs with Mr. Kroofeces? I realize he likes ****
and you like insects. Maybe you can settle on a turd with flies swarming on it.
Arnii gets the turd and you get the flies. If you invite Lionella, I'm sure
she'll take care of the libations.

>You obviously feel threatened by the fact that he makes sense and knows
>vastly more about electronics than you do, and science in general.

<snicker>

Arnii eats his dinner out of a toilet. Where do you think he gets his
"sieccnccce" from, Mickey?


P.S. You still haven't figured out how to quote text properly. You and the
Krooborg wear your incompetence as a badge of dishonor, and you're oh so proud
to be known as anti-clarity and anti-consideration of others.

[Howard Ferstler]

MINe 109 wrote:
>
> In article >,
> Howard Ferstler > wrote:

> > Actually, assuming
> > that you have jobs, you need to stop horsing around on RAO
> > and get back to work.
>
> That's odd. You posted when you were still working. Is this the usual
> Howard double-standard?

I retired years ago (seven, actually), but continued to do
sub work for the library up until about two years ago. They
were lucky to have me (remember, they hired me part time to
help out and not the other way around) and I could have
spent 3/4 of my time duking it out with you nitwits and the
library would still have been happy to have me on hand.

In any case, my point was that you guys seem ready to
respond to my post on almost a moment's notice, which tells
me that many of you sit at your desks all day long and
desperately try to make connections with fellow freakos.
Some of you also get a self-esteem boost from duking it out
with audio-writer notables.

You really SHOULD try to get out more.

Howard Ferstler

[George M. Middius]

Brother Horace the Endlessly Repetitive said:

> Some of you also get a self-esteem boost from duking it out
> with audio-writer notables.

The only "audio-writer notables" who frequents RAO are John Atkinson and
some others from Stereophile. As I've mentioned before, Clerkie, those guys
are the recipients of soggy spitballs from sockpuppets like Dickie
"torrie****s" Malesweski, Mickey "NYOB" McMickey, Lionella "La Salope"
Sha-pwee, and Michael "Bwian McLardass" Conzo? Guess what, Clerkie --
they're all fans of yours and Krooger's.

Your army of sockpuppets, and welcome to Them.

[MINe 109]

In article >,
Howard Ferstler > wrote:

> MINe 109 wrote:
> >
> > In article >,
> > Howard Ferstler > wrote:
>
> > > Actually, assuming
> > > that you have jobs, you need to stop horsing around on RAO
> > > and get back to work.
> >
> > That's odd. You posted when you were still working. Is this the usual
> > Howard double-standard?
>
> I retired years ago (seven, actually), but continued to do
> sub work for the library up until about two years ago. They
> were lucky to have me (remember, they hired me part time to
> help out and not the other way around) and I could have
> spent 3/4 of my time duking it out with you nitwits and the
> library would still have been happy to have me on hand.
>
> In any case, my point was that you guys seem ready to
> respond to my post on almost a moment's notice, which tells
> me that many of you sit at your desks all day long and
> desperately try to make connections with fellow freakos.
> Some of you also get a self-esteem boost from duking it out
> with audio-writer notables.

I don't 'duke it out' with JA.

> You really SHOULD try to get out more.

Haw, haw. Took six hours to see this one.

Are you disappointed not to make a connection?

Stephen

[dave weil]

On Tue, 07 Jun 2005 04:20:06 GMT, MINe 109 >
wrote:

>> You really SHOULD try to get out more.
>
>Haw, haw. Took six hours to see this one.

Maybe I should have waited until after I see Cheap Trick on Wed. to
answer this one.

[Schizoid Man]

dave weil wrote:

> On Tue, 07 Jun 2005 04:20:06 GMT, MINe 109 >
> wrote:
>
>
>>>You really SHOULD try to get out more.
>>
>>Haw, haw. Took six hours to see this one.
>
>
> Maybe I should have waited until after I see Cheap Trick on Wed. to
> answer this one.

My options for Wednesday evening are Robert Fripp at The Fillmore or the
Giants vs Kansas Cityat SBC Park.

I'm inclined towards the ball game, since Fripper's probably won't play
21st Century...

[MINe 109]

In article >,
Schizoid Man > wrote:

> dave weil wrote:
>
> > On Tue, 07 Jun 2005 04:20:06 GMT, MINe 109 >
> > wrote:
> >
> >
> >>>You really SHOULD try to get out more.
> >>
> >>Haw, haw. Took six hours to see this one.
> >
> >
> > Maybe I should have waited until after I see Cheap Trick on Wed. to
> > answer this one.
>
> My options for Wednesday evening are Robert Fripp at The Fillmore or the
> Giants vs Kansas Cityat SBC Park.
>
> I'm inclined towards the ball game, since Fripper's probably won't play
> 21st Century...

The Giants are terrible this year, but the ballpark's said to be cool.

I don't know what a Fripp solo show is like, but I doubt that playing
hits for fans is high on his list.

Stephen

[Howard Ferstler]

MINe 109 wrote:
>
> In article >,
> Howard Ferstler > wrote:

> > You really SHOULD try to get out more.

> Haw, haw. Took six hours to see this one.

I'll bet you fidgeted continuously as you counted every
minute.

Howard Ferstler

[MINe 109]

In article >,
Howard Ferstler > wrote:

> MINe 109 wrote:
> >
> > In article >,
> > Howard Ferstler > wrote:
>
> > > You really SHOULD try to get out more.
>
> > Haw, haw. Took six hours to see this one.
>
> I'll bet you fidgeted continuously as you counted every
> minute.

No, I read the time from the header and calculated the approximate
duration.

See you tomorrow,

Stephen

[Howard Ferstler]

MINe 109 wrote:
>
> In article >,
> Howard Ferstler > wrote:

> > MINe 109 wrote:

> > > In article >,
> > > Howard Ferstler > wrote:

> > > > You really SHOULD try to get out more.

> > > Haw, haw. Took six hours to see this one.

> > I'll bet you fidgeted continuously as you counted every
> > minute.

> No, I read the time from the header and calculated the approximate
> duration.
>
> See you tomorrow,
>
> Stephen

Don't bet on it. Interesting that this time you answered my
post in about 20 minutes.

Get a life.

Howard Ferstler

[Clyde Slick]

"Howard Ferstler" > wrote in message
...

> Don't bet on it. Interesting that this time you answered my
> post in about 20 minutes.
>
> Get a life.
>


And you responded back in 15 minutes.
Haw,haw, haw!!



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[MINe 109]

In article >,
Howard Ferstler > wrote:

> MINe 109 wrote:
> >
> > In article >,
> > Howard Ferstler > wrote:
>
> > > MINe 109 wrote:
>
> > > > In article >,
> > > > Howard Ferstler > wrote:
>
> > > > > You really SHOULD try to get out more.
>
> > > > Haw, haw. Took six hours to see this one.
>
> > > I'll bet you fidgeted continuously as you counted every
> > > minute.
>
> > No, I read the time from the header and calculated the approximate
> > duration.
> >
> > See you tomorrow,

> Don't bet on it. Interesting that this time you answered my
> post in about 20 minutes.
>
> Get a life.

Sorry, I don't bother worrying how long I should wait before answering a
post. This afternoon, I checked my messages and found yours was there
and had been for twenty minutes, taking your word for it.

I came home from work just now, and here's your message, seven hours old.

Work was fun, BTW, and involved earplugs.

Stephen

[Howard Ferstler]

Clyde Slick wrote:
>
> "Howard Ferstler" > wrote in message
> ...
>
> > Don't bet on it. Interesting that this time you answered my
> > post in about 20 minutes.
> >
> > Get a life.
> >
>
> And you responded back in 15 minutes.
> Haw,haw, haw!!

Sure. I drop in every few days and scope for about an hour,
or maybe a bit longer. Obviously, then, I would be in a
position to answer messages that appeared during that
period.

However, I then drop out for several days (this message
comes three days after yours) and do something productive.

On the other hand, virtually every time I drop in and post I
see responses to my messages that come within minutes. This
always seems to be the case, and I have to conclude that you
guys must have toilets built into your computer chairs.

You are always here, ready to respond at an instant.

Howard Ferstler

[Howard Ferstler]

MINe 109 wrote:

> Sorry, I don't bother worrying how long I should wait before answering a
> post. This afternoon, I checked my messages and found yours was there
> and had been for twenty minutes, taking your word for it.
>
> I came home from work just now, and here's your message, seven hours old.
>
> Work was fun, BTW, and involved earplugs.

My take on this is that you either operate a jackhammer or
work at a shooting range. Good thing you have those
earplugs.

Howard Ferstler

[MINe 109]

In article >,
Howard Ferstler > wrote:

> MINe 109 wrote:
>
> > Sorry, I don't bother worrying how long I should wait before answering a
> > post. This afternoon, I checked my messages and found yours was there
> > and had been for twenty minutes, taking your word for it.
> >
> > I came home from work just now, and here's your message, seven hours old.
> >
> > Work was fun, BTW, and involved earplugs.
>
> My take on this is that you either operate a jackhammer or
> work at a shooting range. Good thing you have those
> earplugs.

No, and no. Yes, I need those earplugs: the work environment peaks at
102 dB.

Stephen

[Clyde Slick]

"Howard Ferstler" > wrote in message
...

>
> You are always here, ready to respond at an instant.
>

2 hours, 30 minutes, to be exact



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[Howard Ferstler]

MINe 109 wrote:
>
> In article >,
> Howard Ferstler > wrote:
>
> > MINe 109 wrote:
> >
> > > Sorry, I don't bother worrying how long I should wait before answering a
> > > post. This afternoon, I checked my messages and found yours was there
> > > and had been for twenty minutes, taking your word for it.
> > >
> > > I came home from work just now, and here's your message, seven hours old.
> > >
> > > Work was fun, BTW, and involved earplugs.
> >
> > My take on this is that you either operate a jackhammer or
> > work at a shooting range. Good thing you have those
> > earplugs.
>
> No, and no. Yes, I need those earplugs: the work environment peaks at
> 102 dB.
>
> Stephen

Car-assembly plant? Jet engine test facility? Clown at kids'
birthday parties?

Howard Ferstler

[Clyde Slick]

"Howard Ferstler" > wrote in message
...

> Clown at kids'
> birthday parties?
>

"At least" he's not an audio clown.



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[MINe 109]

In article >,
Howard Ferstler > wrote:

> MINe 109 wrote:
> >
> > In article >,
> > Howard Ferstler > wrote:
> >
> > > MINe 109 wrote:
> > >
> > > > Sorry, I don't bother worrying how long I should wait before answering
> > > > a
> > > > post. This afternoon, I checked my messages and found yours was there
> > > > and had been for twenty minutes, taking your word for it.
> > > >
> > > > I came home from work just now, and here's your message, seven hours
> > > > old.
> > > >
> > > > Work was fun, BTW, and involved earplugs.
> > >
> > > My take on this is that you either operate a jackhammer or
> > > work at a shooting range. Good thing you have those
> > > earplugs.
> >
> > No, and no. Yes, I need those earplugs: the work environment peaks at
> > 102 dB.

> Car-assembly plant? Jet engine test facility? Clown at kids'
> birthday parties?

Musician.

Stephen

[George M. Middius]

MINe 109 said:

> > > No, and no. Yes, I need those earplugs: the work environment peaks at
> > > 102 dB.

> > Car-assembly plant? Jet engine test facility? Clown at kids'
> > birthday parties?

> Musician.

Harold read a book about music once. For all these years, he has
believed that musicians are magical creatures who exist only in fairy
tales.

[Howard Ferstler]

MINe 109 wrote:
>
> In article >,
> Howard Ferstler > wrote:
>
> > MINe 109 wrote:
> > >
> > > In article >,
> > > Howard Ferstler > wrote:
> > >
> > > > MINe 109 wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Sorry, I don't bother worrying how long I should wait before answering
> > > > > a
> > > > > post. This afternoon, I checked my messages and found yours was there
> > > > > and had been for twenty minutes, taking your word for it.
> > > > >
> > > > > I came home from work just now, and here's your message, seven hours
> > > > > old.
> > > > >
> > > > > Work was fun, BTW, and involved earplugs.
> > > >
> > > > My take on this is that you either operate a jackhammer or
> > > > work at a shooting range. Good thing you have those
> > > > earplugs.
> > >
> > > No, and no. Yes, I need those earplugs: the work environment peaks at
> > > 102 dB.
>
> > Car-assembly plant? Jet engine test facility? Clown at kids'
> > birthday parties?
>
> Musician.
>
> Stephen

At 102 dB? Yoiks. We are talking about music degradation of
an extreme nature when ear plugs must be worn during a
performance.

Howard Ferstler

[Howard Ferstler]

"George M. Middius" wrote:

> Harold read a book about music once. For all these years, he has
> believed that musicians are magical creatures who exist only in fairy
> tales.

For the record, I do want to point out that I also have
published two books chock full of record reviews.

Howard Ferstler

[George Middius]

Brother Horace the Tone-Deaf said:

>> Harold read a book about music once. For all these years, he has
>> believed that musicians are magical creatures who exist only in fairy
>> tales.

>For the record, I do want to point out that I also have
>published two books chock full of record reviews.

Do you mean records as in vinyl? I'm sure you had a lot of good things to say
about them.

[dave weil]

On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 14:54:48 -0400, Howard Ferstler
> wrote:

>MINe 109 wrote:
>>
>> In article >,
>> Howard Ferstler > wrote:
>>
>> > MINe 109 wrote:
>> > >
>> > > In article >,
>> > > Howard Ferstler > wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > MINe 109 wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > > Sorry, I don't bother worrying how long I should wait before answering
>> > > > > a
>> > > > > post. This afternoon, I checked my messages and found yours was there
>> > > > > and had been for twenty minutes, taking your word for it.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > I came home from work just now, and here's your message, seven hours
>> > > > > old.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Work was fun, BTW, and involved earplugs.
>> > > >
>> > > > My take on this is that you either operate a jackhammer or
>> > > > work at a shooting range. Good thing you have those
>> > > > earplugs.
>> > >
>> > > No, and no. Yes, I need those earplugs: the work environment peaks at
>> > > 102 dB.
>>
>> > Car-assembly plant? Jet engine test facility? Clown at kids'
>> > birthday parties?
>>
>> Musician.
>>
>> Stephen
>
>At 102 dB? Yoiks. We are talking about music degradation of
>an extreme nature when ear plugs must be worn during a
>performance.

I take it then that your system at home never hits 102 dB. Good for
you, Howard.

[dave weil]

On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 14:55:48 -0400, Howard Ferstler
> wrote:

>"George M. Middius" wrote:
>
>> Harold read a book about music once. For all these years, he has
>> believed that musicians are magical creatures who exist only in fairy
>> tales.
>
>For the record, I do want to point out that I also have
>published two books chock full of record reviews.

How many cost more than $5.98 new at Amazon?

[Sander deWaal]

Howard Ferstler > said:

>> > > No, and no. Yes, I need those earplugs: the work environment peaks at
>> > > 102 dB.

>> > Car-assembly plant? Jet engine test facility? Clown at kids'
>> > birthday parties?

>> Musician.

>At 102 dB? Yoiks. We are talking about music degradation of
>an extreme nature when ear plugs must be worn during a
>performance.


Are you aware of the SPL of a symphony orchestra when sitting in the
middle of it?

--

"Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes."
- Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005

[Clyde Slick]

"dave weil" > wrote in message
...
>
> I take it then that your system at home never hits 102 dB. Good for
> you, Howard.
>

Maybe he has Quads!



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[Howard Ferstler]

George Middius wrote:
>
> Brother Horace the Tone-Deaf said:

> >For the record, I do want to point out that I also have
> >published two books chock full of record reviews.

> Do you mean records as in vinyl? I'm sure you had a lot of good things to say
> about them.

These days, the CD is a record. Vinyl is, well, archaic. How
many record-review books (dealing with either the LP or the
CD) have you published, tweako?

Howard Ferstler

[Howard Ferstler]

dave weil wrote:
>
> On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 14:54:48 -0400, Howard Ferstler
> > wrote:

> >At 102 dB? Yoiks. We are talking about music degradation of
> >an extreme nature when ear plugs must be worn during a
> >performance.

> I take it then that your system at home never hits 102 dB. Good for
> you, Howard.

Generally, 100 dB peaks are tops, and then only with action
movies. Never with music, even pop stuff. Ironically, this
means that I probably have four times the total system amp
power I need.

Howard Ferstler

[Howard Ferstler]

Sander deWaal wrote:
>
> Howard Ferstler > said:
>
> >> > > No, and no. Yes, I need those earplugs: the work environment peaks at
> >> > > 102 dB.
>
> >> > Car-assembly plant? Jet engine test facility? Clown at kids'
> >> > birthday parties?
>
> >> Musician.
>
> >At 102 dB? Yoiks. We are talking about music degradation of
> >an extreme nature when ear plugs must be worn during a
> >performance.

> Are you aware of the SPL of a symphony orchestra when sitting in the
> middle of it?

I would imagine that it is pretty impressive if one is
sitting right in front of the horn sections. I wonder how
many classical musicians wear ear plugs when working that
way. I also wonder if such ear plug use would make it
difficult for the musicians to get their auditory clues and
cues correctly.

Howard Ferstler

[Clyde Slick]

"Howard Ferstler" > wrote in message
...
> Sander deWaal wrote:
>>
>> Howard Ferstler > said:
>>
>> >> > > No, and no. Yes, I need those earplugs: the work environment peaks
>> >> > > at
>> >> > > 102 dB.
>>
>> >> > Car-assembly plant? Jet engine test facility? Clown at kids'
>> >> > birthday parties?
>>
>> >> Musician.
>>
>> >At 102 dB? Yoiks. We are talking about music degradation of
>> >an extreme nature when ear plugs must be worn during a
>> >performance.
>
>> Are you aware of the SPL of a symphony orchestra when sitting in the
>> middle of it?
>
> I would imagine that it is pretty impressive if one is
> sitting right in front of the horn sections. I wonder how
> many classical musicians wear ear plugs when working that
> way. I also wonder if such ear plug use would make it
> difficult for the musicians to get their auditory clues and
> cues correctly.
>

In my younger days, playing and conducting,
I never had such problems. It didn't seem so
loud up on the stage.



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[George M. Middius]

Brother Horace the Prematurely Ancient said:

> > >For the record, I do want to point out that I also have
> > >published two books chock full of record reviews.
>
> > Do you mean records as in vinyl? I'm sure you had a lot of good things to say
> > about them.
>
> These days, the CD is a record. Vinyl is, well, archaic. How
> many record-review books (dealing with either the LP or the
> CD) have you published, tweako?

Oh, this is a dick-measuring contest? A minute ago you were begging me to
buy one of your sad little books.

I will say this about that, though: If my writing were as lifeless as
yours, I'd hang up my keyboard and become a fisherman.

[Lionel]

George "Gapping Ass" Middius :

> I will say this about that, though: If my writing were as lifeless as
> yours, I'd hang up my keyboard and become a fisherman.

Note that with your keyboard you have only fished Art "Tiny" Sackman... :-D

[dave weil]

On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 16:34:39 -0400, Howard Ferstler
> wrote:

>dave weil wrote:
>>
>> On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 14:54:48 -0400, Howard Ferstler
>> > wrote:
>
>> >At 102 dB? Yoiks. We are talking about music degradation of
>> >an extreme nature when ear plugs must be worn during a
>> >performance.
>
>> I take it then that your system at home never hits 102 dB. Good for
>> you, Howard.
>
>Generally, 100 dB peaks are tops, and then only with action
>movies. Never with music, even pop stuff.

Ten you very likely never listen to orchestral music at lifelike
volumes.

> Ironically, this
>means that I probably have four times the total system amp
>power I need.

Yep - that's money that could have been spent on software.

(the Ferstler Imperative)

[MINe 109]

In article >,
Howard Ferstler > wrote:

> MINe 109 wrote:
> >
> > In article >,
> > Howard Ferstler > wrote:
> >
> > > MINe 109 wrote:
> > > >
> > > > In article >,
> > > > Howard Ferstler > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > MINe 109 wrote:

> > > > No, and no. Yes, I need those earplugs: the work environment peaks at
> > > > 102 dB.
> >
> > > Car-assembly plant? Jet engine test facility? Clown at kids'
> > > birthday parties?
> >
> > Musician.

> At 102 dB? Yoiks. We are talking about music degradation of
> an extreme nature when ear plugs must be worn during a
> performance.

No, the volume is an idiomatic requirement.

And, no, I don't play the viola.

Stephen

[Sander deWaal]

"Clyde Slick" > said:

>>> Are you aware of the SPL of a symphony orchestra when sitting in the
>>> middle of it?

>> I would imagine that it is pretty impressive if one is
>> sitting right in front of the horn sections. I wonder how
>> many classical musicians wear ear plugs when working that
>> way. I also wonder if such ear plug use would make it
>> difficult for the musicians to get their auditory clues and
>> cues correctly.

>In my younger days, playing and conducting,
>I never had such problems. It didn't seem so
>loud up on the stage.


It exceeds 100 dB SPL.

--

"Audio as a serious hobby is going down the tubes."
- Howard Ferstler, 25/4/2005

[Howard Ferstler]

dave weil wrote:
>
> On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 16:34:39 -0400, Howard Ferstler
> > wrote:
>
> >dave weil wrote:
> >>
> >> On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 14:54:48 -0400, Howard Ferstler
> >> > wrote:
> >
> >> >At 102 dB? Yoiks. We are talking about music degradation of
> >> >an extreme nature when ear plugs must be worn during a
> >> >performance.
> >
> >> I take it then that your system at home never hits 102 dB. Good for
> >> you, Howard.
> >
> >Generally, 100 dB peaks are tops, and then only with action
> >movies. Never with music, even pop stuff.
>
> Ten you very likely never listen to orchestral music at lifelike
> volumes.

Sure, live orchestral ensembles can get louder than that.
However, in small listening rooms SPLs at live-music levels
are more obnoxious than they would be in larger spaces. I
suggest you get a good SPL meter and monitor just how loud
the orchestral peaks are when you listen at home.

> > Ironically, this
> >means that I probably have four times the total system amp
> >power I need.

> Yep - that's money that could have been spent on software.
>
> (the Ferstler Imperative)

High power is cheap, and anyway, I got a great deal on the
gear. If my big, 23-year-old Carver M500 finally craps out I
will revert to using just the amps in my Yamaha RX-Z1
receiver. As it is, I use its two main amps to power that
custom-built center speaker and use the Carver to power the
mains.

Howard Ferstler