Re: A better front end?

[MINe 109]

In article >,
fathom > wrote:

> I've been using the $249 Squeezebox from SlimDevices as the
> main audio player for my primary system. I also have one in
> the bedroom.

http://www.slimdevices.com/pi_overview.html

> Besides the unprecedented flexibility of the
> thing (I can easily find and play any of over 15,000 tracks),
> I am finding a few aspects of this system that offer real (and
> theoretical) sonic advantages over tradional players and
> transports.
>
> The first thing of interest is a playback unit with NO MOVING
> PARTS. No spinning disc, no spinning hard drive, no fan, no
> static, no rumble, no hiss, no feedback. The audio files
> reside on a remote PC (which can be anywhere; mine is in a
> closet), and are smoothly streamed to the player via Ethernet
> or WiFi. As someone who has worn out over a dozen bedroom CD
> players, I can tell you the Squeezebox is a godsend for
> playing music in a quiet room.

You mean that the moving parts are someplace else.

> The other interesting property is this: The error correction
> is performed well before playback, and a bit-perfect stream is
> always sent to the player. This is because it is possible to
> correct all errors at the time you "rip" a CD. Exact Audio
> Copy can do this, re-reading the disc several times if needed,
> and the resulting file is a perfect clone which can be
> streamed directly to the player's buffer and which needs no
> further audio error correction.
>
> There is also the matter of deterioration. CDs do pick up
> dust and small scratches over the years, and disc player laser
> lenses can also get dirty. The traditional player must reread
> and attempt to re-correct the disc each time it is played -
> and must do it on the fly, leaving the possibility for
> uncorrected data errors. That's not the case when you have a
> bit-accurate file to playback, as the file does not
> deteriorate and needs no correction.
>
> Of course, to get CD-quality (or better!) playback, you need
> to use PCM wav files or a lossless encoder like FLAC (Free
> Lossless Audio Codec).
>
> We're seeing a wave of new computer-based systems for audio
> playback. They are generally quite inexpensive, but do not
> think these can't be high-end devices - it mostly depends on
> the quality of the file you serve up, and that is something we
> can easily control.

Looks like fun. If I already had a wireless network for the computer, I
might try this in the main system.

Stephen

[Bill Riel]

In article >, says...
> I've been using the $249 Squeezebox from SlimDevices as the
> main audio player for my primary system. I also have one in
> the bedroom. Besides the unprecedented flexibility of the
> thing (I can easily find and play any of over 15,000 tracks),
> I am finding a few aspects of this system that offer real (and
> theoretical) sonic advantages over tradional players and
> transports.

I've got one of these as well, and it functions as my main playback
device. I do sometimes play CDs on a changer that's hooked up, but the
Squeezebox gets most of the use. It is a cool technology - I'm thinking
of buying another & hooking up powered speakers to add music to other
parts of the house.

--
Bill

[Bill Riel]

In article >,
says...

> I have one Squeezebox networked using "powerline" networking
> (the electric wires running through the walls). It works
> flawlessly - I didn't even read the manual, just plugged in the
> Netgear XE102 Wall-Plugged Ethernet Bridges and they worked.
>
> This allowed me to build a networked "boombox" from a Squeezebox
> and a set of Aego2 powered speakers. I can plug it into any
> electric outlet inside or outside the house, and it gets both
> power and signal over the same wire - very cool.

That's a great use of technology! I've been thinking of something
similar to get "portable" music that I can easily take outside, though I
am networked wirelessly at this point in time. Still, the network range
covers a decent portion of my yard so I'd have no problem in that regard
- I'd generally be staying close to the house to power the speakers (&
the Squeezebox) anyway.

[[email protected]]

The analog sections of these things are probably not that great, but
one that could feed an outboard DAC might be really something.

[Arny Krueger]

> wrote in message
oups.com

> The analog sections of these things are probably not that great, but
> one that could feed an outboard DAC might be really something.

How good could these products be in your eyes, Cal?

No toobs, right?

[Rui Pedro Mendes Salgueiro]

The description of the Squeezebox2 is on the web:

http://www.slimdevices.com/pi_specs.html

The information below is quotedfrom there.

> > wrote in message
> oups.com
>> The analog sections of these things are probably not that great,

Analog RCA outputs

* High fidelity Burr-Brown 24-bit DAC
* Two dedicated linear power regulators for DAC and line-out stages
* Full 6.0Vpp line-level signals
* Signal-to-noise ratio: over 100dB
* Total harmonic distortion: less than 0.003%

>>but one that could feed an outboard DAC might be really something.

Digital S/PDIF outputs

* Optical and coax digital connections
* Dedicated high-precision crystal oscillators (no PLL, no resampling)
* Standard IEC-958 (S/PDIF) encoding
* Optical connector: TOSLINK 660nm
* Coax connector: RCA, 500mVpp into 75 ohms
* Sample rates: 44.1Khz, 48Khz
* Audio format: linear PCM, 16 or 24 bits per sample

--
http://www.mat.uc.pt/~rps/

..pt is Portugal| `Whom the gods love die young'-Menander (342-292 BC)
Europe | Villeneuve 50-82, Toivonen 56-86, Senna 60-94

[Arny Krueger]

"fathom" > wrote in message

> Here's some more info on the hardware and possible future
> capabilities, from Slim CEO Sean Adams:

>> * High fidelity Burr-Brown 24-bit DAC
>> * Two dedicated linear power regulators for DAC and
>> line-out stages * Full 6.0Vpp line-level signals
>> * Signal-to-noise ratio: over 100dB
>> * Total harmonic distortion: less than 0.003%

Missing - which DAC chips and which line out buffer chips.

[[email protected]]

Despite that handicap they could be pretty good, but running off a wall
wart isn't a great sign.

[Arny Krueger]

> wrote in message
ups.com

> Despite that handicap they could be pretty good, but running off a
> wall wart isn't a great sign.

Apparently according to Cal, electrons are permanently warped by wall warts,
and nothing that runs off them can sound good.

[[email protected]]

Wall warts are single-ended crude supplies and solid state analog
sections of quality usually need bipolar supplies. Therefore a
switchmode converter is needed and in this appliance it's probably on
the single board.

[Arny Krueger]

> wrote in message
ups.com

> Wall warts are single-ended crude supplies

Accepted wisdom is that wall warts typically use full-wave rectifiers for
pretty pragmatic reasons - the second diode (or third and fourth) cost less
money and take up less space than the larger filter cap required to handle
the far lower half-wave ripple frequencies.



>and solid state analog
> sections of quality usually need bipolar supplies.

Typically, such equipment (example, my highly-regarded Symetrix SX-202 mic
preamp, and Rane equipment) uses AC wall warts and handles the bipolar
supply issue inside the equipment box.


> Therefore a switchmode converter is needed and in this appliance it's
probably on
> the single board.

There is no reasonable requirement that a switchmode supply would be
required to develop bipolar voltages.

The major advantages of switchmode supplies are size, weight, heat, and
ability to work on a wide range of domestic electrical outlets without user
set switches.

[[email protected]]

Arny Krueger wrote:
> > wrote in message
> ups.com
>
> > Wall warts are single-ended crude supplies
>
> Accepted wisdom is that wall warts typically use full-wave rectifiers
for
> pretty pragmatic reasons - the second diode (or third and fourth)
cost less
> money and take up less space than the larger filter cap required to
handle
> the far lower half-wave ripple frequencies.
>
>
>
> >and solid state analog
> > sections of quality usually need bipolar supplies.
>
> Typically, such equipment (example, my highly-regarded Symetrix
SX-202 mic
> preamp, and Rane equipment) uses AC wall warts and handles the
bipolar
> supply issue inside the equipment box.
>


Highly regarded by whom? Gosh you are using a discontinued preamp from
the eighties. So much for all your posturing about vintage equipment.



>
> > Therefore a switchmode converter is needed and in this appliance
it's
> probably on
> > the single board.
>
> There is no reasonable requirement that a switchmode supply would be
> required to develop bipolar voltages.
>
> The major advantages of switchmode supplies are size, weight, heat,
and
> ability to work on a wide range of domestic electrical outlets
without user
> set switches.

[Arny Krueger]

> wrote in message
oups.com
> Arny Krueger wrote:
>> > wrote in message
>> ups.com
>>
>>> Wall warts are single-ended crude supplies
>>
>> Accepted wisdom is that wall warts typically use full-wave
>> rectifiers for pretty pragmatic reasons - the second diode (or
>> third and fourth) cost less money and take up less space than the
>> larger filter cap required to handle the far lower half-wave ripple
>> frequencies.


>>> and solid state analog
>>> sections of quality usually need bipolar supplies.

>> Typically, such equipment (example, my highly-regarded Symetrix
>> SX-202 mic preamp, and Rane equipment) uses AC wall warts and
>> handles the bipolar supply issue inside the equipment box.

> Highly regarded by whom?

Pros that know their stuff. Sorry, I guess that lets you off the hook,
Scott.

>Gosh you are using a discontinued preamp from the eighties.

Never heard of classic equipment, I guess.

> So much for all your posturing about vintage equipment.

Scott, thanks for admitting that you can't distinguish between the 60s
Klipsch La-Scalas and the 80s SS pro audio mic preamps.

[George M. Middius]

****-forBrains rocks 'n' rolls. Ugh.

> > So much for all your posturing about vintage equipment.
>
> Scott, thanks for admitting that you can't distinguish between the 60s
> Klipsch La[sic]-Scalas and the 80s SS pro audio mic preamps.

Arnii, thanks for admitting you can't tell food from waste.

[[email protected]]

Special Agent Double-O-Kroo is trying his debating tactics again, but
he's bumbling as so often he does, because he knows full well
everyone's on to him and he's digging himself in deeper.

[[email protected]]

Arny Krueger wrote:
> > wrote in message
> oups.com
> > Arny Krueger wrote:
> >> > wrote in message
> >> ups.com
> >>
> >>> Wall warts are single-ended crude supplies
> >>
> >> Accepted wisdom is that wall warts typically use full-wave
> >> rectifiers for pretty pragmatic reasons - the second diode (or
> >> third and fourth) cost less money and take up less space than the
> >> larger filter cap required to handle the far lower half-wave
ripple
> >> frequencies.
>
>
> >>> and solid state analog
> >>> sections of quality usually need bipolar supplies.
>
> >> Typically, such equipment (example, my highly-regarded Symetrix
> >> SX-202 mic preamp, and Rane equipment) uses AC wall warts and
> >> handles the bipolar supply issue inside the equipment box.
>
> > Highly regarded by whom?
>
> Pros that know their stuff.

The good ones do. Funny, you still haven't answered the question. This
preamp is highly regarded by whom? Can you cite any pros with a track
record of excellent recordings that rwgard this preamp highly?


Sorry, I guess that lets you off the hook,
> Scott.


You to.



>
> >Gosh you are using a discontinued preamp from the eighties.
>
> Never heard of classic equipment, I guess.


Sure I have. That is pretty much all I own. You're the hypocrite who
starts whining about other people favoring outdated equipment yet you
tout outdated equipment when you own it.


>
> > So much for all your posturing about vintage equipment.
>
> Scott, thanks for admitting that you can't distinguish between the
60s
> Klipsch La-Scalas and the 80s SS pro audio mic preamps.


Arny, thanks for demonstrating your inability to distignuish between
reality and your fantasy world. Where did I ever mention anything about
60s Kliph La-Scalas?


Scott Wheeler

[[email protected]]

You didn't, I did, but that was awhile ago and another discussion. He's
delusional and can no longer distinguish between posters, or for that
matter gear.