Slightly OT - cable run lengths to monitor/keyboard/mouse

[Karl Engel]

I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be until
you start running into problems. A studio I work at has their
internet/email computer in a different room and the screen's annoyingly
blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run length. I'm
looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it goes along the
walls.

[EganMedia]

<< I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be until
you start running into problems. >><BR><BR>


This isn't OT at all. This is exactly what this forum is for. I have 37' of
VGA cable (a 7' cable and 3 10' extenders and have no problem with burriness.
I also have about 35' of USB cable between my keyboard/mouse/HUI/Miditimepiece
and computer. I had problems with the USB run until I put a powered USB hub
about halfway down the cable run. Everything exceeeds the recommend spec by a
lot, but it works beautifully. You can see a screen shot in a photo on my
website- www.eganmedia.com. Click "audio" then "audio post". It's not a high
res shot, but you get an idea of what a 17" monitor at 1280 X 1024 looks like
with 37' of cheap VGA extension cable.


Joe Egan
EMP
Colchester, VT
www.eganmedia.com

[EganMedia]

<< I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be until
you start running into problems. >><BR><BR>


This isn't OT at all. This is exactly what this forum is for. I have 37' of
VGA cable (a 7' cable and 3 10' extenders and have no problem with burriness.
I also have about 35' of USB cable between my keyboard/mouse/HUI/Miditimepiece
and computer. I had problems with the USB run until I put a powered USB hub
about halfway down the cable run. Everything exceeeds the recommend spec by a
lot, but it works beautifully. You can see a screen shot in a photo on my
website- www.eganmedia.com. Click "audio" then "audio post". It's not a high
res shot, but you get an idea of what a 17" monitor at 1280 X 1024 looks like
with 37' of cheap VGA extension cable.


Joe Egan
EMP
Colchester, VT
www.eganmedia.com

[Arny Krueger]

"Karl Engel" <karlengel-at-excite-dot-com> wrote in message


> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for
> when I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs
> can be until you start running into problems.

Longest keyboard cable I've used was 50 feet, but no problems at that point.
You can also get RF-based wireless keyboards for about $150 that work out to
100 feet or more.

Longest PC video monitor cable I've used was about 150'. Theres a slight
lost of visual punch and detail at 1024 x 768 x 60 at that point, but its
more than acceptable, even for use with a large screen projector for a large
audience.

> A studio I work at has their internet/email computer in a different room
> and the screen's
> annoyingly blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run
> length. I'm looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it
> goes along the walls.

IME it is often a matter of cable and switch quality. You can get PC video
cables and switches that have the right connectors but aren't really up to
handling signals hi-rez formats. PC RGB video can have some serious
bandwidth over 100 MHz, in contrast with TV video.

The crappy cabled ans switches visually can run out of gas at 800x600, even
after a few dozen feet. I use the thicker, stiffer kind of cable and proper
video switches that are usable with the fast, sharp pulses that you get with
hi-rez hi-refresh video.

[Arny Krueger]

"Karl Engel" <karlengel-at-excite-dot-com> wrote in message


> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for
> when I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs
> can be until you start running into problems.

Longest keyboard cable I've used was 50 feet, but no problems at that point.
You can also get RF-based wireless keyboards for about $150 that work out to
100 feet or more.

Longest PC video monitor cable I've used was about 150'. Theres a slight
lost of visual punch and detail at 1024 x 768 x 60 at that point, but its
more than acceptable, even for use with a large screen projector for a large
audience.

> A studio I work at has their internet/email computer in a different room
> and the screen's
> annoyingly blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run
> length. I'm looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it
> goes along the walls.

IME it is often a matter of cable and switch quality. You can get PC video
cables and switches that have the right connectors but aren't really up to
handling signals hi-rez formats. PC RGB video can have some serious
bandwidth over 100 MHz, in contrast with TV video.

The crappy cabled ans switches visually can run out of gas at 800x600, even
after a few dozen feet. I use the thicker, stiffer kind of cable and proper
video switches that are usable with the fast, sharp pulses that you get with
hi-rez hi-refresh video.

[Mike Rivers]

In article > "Karl Engel" <karlengel-at-excite-dot-com> writes:

> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be until
> you start running into problems.

Well, it's as long as it is until you can't tolerate the problems. It
depends on the resolution you're using, probably to a certain extent
the graphics card (driving impedance) and the cable itself. And now we
have the digital video interface, if that's what you're using. There are
special low capacitance video cables intended for extended distances.
You're looking at a length at which you should be looking into those
cables. Check with http://www.blackbox.com or someplace like that.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

[Mike Rivers]

In article > "Karl Engel" <karlengel-at-excite-dot-com> writes:

> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be until
> you start running into problems.

Well, it's as long as it is until you can't tolerate the problems. It
depends on the resolution you're using, probably to a certain extent
the graphics card (driving impedance) and the cable itself. And now we
have the digital video interface, if that's what you're using. There are
special low capacitance video cables intended for extended distances.
You're looking at a length at which you should be looking into those
cables. Check with http://www.blackbox.com or someplace like that.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

[Nmm]

"Karl Engel" <karlengel-at-excite-dot-com> wrote in message >...
> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be until
> you start running into problems. A studio I work at has their
> internet/email computer in a different room and the screen's annoyingly
> blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run length. I'm
> looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it goes along the
> walls.


There is an extender system called either Cytech, or Cybertech.

You can't just use some sort of hub, network setup?

[Nmm]

"Karl Engel" <karlengel-at-excite-dot-com> wrote in message >...
> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be until
> you start running into problems. A studio I work at has their
> internet/email computer in a different room and the screen's annoyingly
> blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run length. I'm
> looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it goes along the
> walls.


There is an extender system called either Cytech, or Cybertech.

You can't just use some sort of hub, network setup?

[Logan Shaw]

Karl Engel wrote:

> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be until
> you start running into problems. A studio I work at has their
> internet/email computer in a different room and the screen's annoyingly
> blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run length. I'm
> looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it goes along the
> walls.

If you are using a LCD, you're already going to have better luck getting
a good picture using (digital) DVI rather than (analog) VGA. This is
because the VGA is spitting out pixels at its own clock, and the LCD
has to figure out how to make the (essentially) analog pixels line up
with its discrete LCD elements. The result is sometimes ugly.

So, if you use DVI, apparently the maximum length is going to depend on
the type of cable used, but here is a place that sells (coincidentally)
a 23-foot DVI cable: http://www.ramelectronics.net/html/DVI_cables.html .
That site seems to claim that it's compatible with the standard despite
being longer than the nominal maximum 3m length.

You can also buy fiberoptic DVI repeaters for a grand or two, but somehow
I doubt you need to put the computer 1000 feet away from the keyboard
and mouse. :-)

- Logan

[Logan Shaw]

Karl Engel wrote:

> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be until
> you start running into problems. A studio I work at has their
> internet/email computer in a different room and the screen's annoyingly
> blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run length. I'm
> looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it goes along the
> walls.

If you are using a LCD, you're already going to have better luck getting
a good picture using (digital) DVI rather than (analog) VGA. This is
because the VGA is spitting out pixels at its own clock, and the LCD
has to figure out how to make the (essentially) analog pixels line up
with its discrete LCD elements. The result is sometimes ugly.

So, if you use DVI, apparently the maximum length is going to depend on
the type of cable used, but here is a place that sells (coincidentally)
a 23-foot DVI cable: http://www.ramelectronics.net/html/DVI_cables.html .
That site seems to claim that it's compatible with the standard despite
being longer than the nominal maximum 3m length.

You can also buy fiberoptic DVI repeaters for a grand or two, but somehow
I doubt you need to put the computer 1000 feet away from the keyboard
and mouse. :-)

- Logan

[reddred]

"Karl Engel" <karlengel-at-excite-dot-com> wrote in message
...
> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be
until
> you start running into problems. A studio I work at has their
> internet/email computer in a different room and the screen's annoyingly
> blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run length. I'm
> looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it goes along the
> walls.
>

You shouldn't have any issues with the keyboard and mouse. Depending on the
monitor, the video card, and where and how you are setting up you might get
some ghosting on your display. If the monitor is a purchase you have yet to
make, you can get an LCD with a DVID input (as opposed to VGA) and a
matching video card and have done with it.

jb

[reddred]

"Karl Engel" <karlengel-at-excite-dot-com> wrote in message
...
> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be
until
> you start running into problems. A studio I work at has their
> internet/email computer in a different room and the screen's annoyingly
> blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run length. I'm
> looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it goes along the
> walls.
>

You shouldn't have any issues with the keyboard and mouse. Depending on the
monitor, the video card, and where and how you are setting up you might get
some ghosting on your display. If the monitor is a purchase you have yet to
make, you can get an LCD with a DVID input (as opposed to VGA) and a
matching video card and have done with it.

jb

[Ricky W. Hunt]

"Karl Engel" <karlengel-at-excite-dot-com> wrote in message
...
>I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be
> until
> you start running into problems. A studio I work at has their
> internet/email computer in a different room and the screen's annoyingly
> blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run length. I'm
> looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it goes along the
> walls.

I have a 25ft. cable connected the 6ft cable on my LCD (computer in another
room) and it's fine. Just get GOOD SHIELDED cable.

[Ricky W. Hunt]

"Karl Engel" <karlengel-at-excite-dot-com> wrote in message
...
>I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be
> until
> you start running into problems. A studio I work at has their
> internet/email computer in a different room and the screen's annoyingly
> blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run length. I'm
> looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it goes along the
> walls.

I have a 25ft. cable connected the 6ft cable on my LCD (computer in another
room) and it's fine. Just get GOOD SHIELDED cable.

[Dale Farmer]

Karl Engel wrote:

> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be until
> you start running into problems. A studio I work at has their
> internet/email computer in a different room and the screen's annoyingly
> blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run length. I'm
> looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it goes along the
> walls.

VGA cables can be bought in lengths up to 150 feet at places like
blackbox and markertek. For the longer runs, you do need to buy the
good cables. Cheapies will smear out the video more. As for keyboard
and mouse, if you use USB, you can buy USB <->cat five<->USB
widgets that let you run them hundreds of feet away from the computer.
There are keyboard and mouse DIN extension cables, but I've not
seen them longer than about 20 feet, and are kinda pricey for what you
get. AV rental companies use these things all the time for conferences
and conventions. ( Video projector up front, tech table in back with
the computer, mouse on extension cable on the podium so the talking
head can flick forward and backward through their powerpoint
presentation. )

--Dale

[Dale Farmer]

Karl Engel wrote:

> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be until
> you start running into problems. A studio I work at has their
> internet/email computer in a different room and the screen's annoyingly
> blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run length. I'm
> looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it goes along the
> walls.

VGA cables can be bought in lengths up to 150 feet at places like
blackbox and markertek. For the longer runs, you do need to buy the
good cables. Cheapies will smear out the video more. As for keyboard
and mouse, if you use USB, you can buy USB <->cat five<->USB
widgets that let you run them hundreds of feet away from the computer.
There are keyboard and mouse DIN extension cables, but I've not
seen them longer than about 20 feet, and are kinda pricey for what you
get. AV rental companies use these things all the time for conferences
and conventions. ( Video projector up front, tech table in back with
the computer, mouse on extension cable on the podium so the talking
head can flick forward and backward through their powerpoint
presentation. )

--Dale

[Animix]

I've got 20' monitor, mouse, keyboard and USB cables. No problems at all.
For the USB, I'm using the *active* 16' extenders coupled to 4' cables.

Doug Joyce
Animix Productions
Durango, CO
http://www.graphicresultsofdurango.com/musicstudio.html




"Karl Engel" <karlengel-at-excite-dot-com> wrote in message
...
> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be
until
> you start running into problems. A studio I work at has their
> internet/email computer in a different room and the screen's annoyingly
> blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run length. I'm
> looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it goes along the
> walls.
>
>

[Animix]

I've got 20' monitor, mouse, keyboard and USB cables. No problems at all.
For the USB, I'm using the *active* 16' extenders coupled to 4' cables.

Doug Joyce
Animix Productions
Durango, CO
http://www.graphicresultsofdurango.com/musicstudio.html




"Karl Engel" <karlengel-at-excite-dot-com> wrote in message
...
> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be
until
> you start running into problems. A studio I work at has their
> internet/email computer in a different room and the screen's annoyingly
> blurry, they tell me it's because of the video cable run length. I'm
> looking at a run of about 7 metres (almost 23 ft) once it goes along the
> walls.
>
>

[james of tucson]

On 2004-11-17, Karl Engel <> wrote:
>
>
> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be until
> you start running into problems.

Consider using VNC instead. Put a fanless PC, like a mini-itx system
and a wireless network adapter, wherever you want it. Extra points if
you can make it *diskless* as well!

I routinely remote-control the machine that's in our family room from
another workstation using VNC. I've done much crazier things in a
professional environment using X (remote administration of racks of headless
servers).

Long cables are ok, probably not for USB though. The best cables I've
had in my hand don't cut it for 1600 or wider horizontal resolution for
very far. I wouldn't count on Firewire or USB working too well either.

[james of tucson]

On 2004-11-17, Karl Engel <> wrote:
>
>
> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth for when
> I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable runs can be until
> you start running into problems.

Consider using VNC instead. Put a fanless PC, like a mini-itx system
and a wireless network adapter, wherever you want it. Extra points if
you can make it *diskless* as well!

I routinely remote-control the machine that's in our family room from
another workstation using VNC. I've done much crazier things in a
professional environment using X (remote administration of racks of headless
servers).

Long cables are ok, probably not for USB though. The best cables I've
had in my hand don't cut it for 1600 or wider horizontal resolution for
very far. I wouldn't count on Firewire or USB working too well either.

[Arny Krueger]

"james of tucson" > wrote in
message atory.com
> On 2004-11-17, Karl Engel <> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth
>> for when I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable
>> runs can be until you start running into problems.
>
> Consider using VNC instead. Put a fanless PC, like a mini-itx system
> and a wireless network adapter, wherever you want it. Extra points if
> you can make it *diskless* as well!

If the computer you want to control is running XP Pro, Remote Desktop host
is part of XP Pro. Remote desktop Client software going all the way back to
Win 95 is available from MS for free.

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/mobility/getstarted/remoteintro.mspx

[Arny Krueger]

"james of tucson" > wrote in
message atory.com
> On 2004-11-17, Karl Engel <> wrote:
>>
>>
>> I want to set up an LCD monitor with keyboard & mouse in my booth
>> for when I'm wearing both hats, but have no idea how long the cable
>> runs can be until you start running into problems.
>
> Consider using VNC instead. Put a fanless PC, like a mini-itx system
> and a wireless network adapter, wherever you want it. Extra points if
> you can make it *diskless* as well!

If the computer you want to control is running XP Pro, Remote Desktop host
is part of XP Pro. Remote desktop Client software going all the way back to
Win 95 is available from MS for free.

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/mobility/getstarted/remoteintro.mspx