Best Cans for $x?

[U-CDK_CHARLES\\Charles]

What are the best headphones at various price points? Something that
won't kill the singer's head (save THAT for ME *evil cackle*), or
fatigue my ears . . .

My present situation is such that I often need to monitor using cans. I
realize that's not idea, but I've a wife and a Mother in Law. I don't
wanna trade in the wife, and the MiL is part of the set for now .. . .

So my application is BOTH "Talent Monitors" AND "My Own Ears"

How'bout these price points:

Sub $100?

$100~250?

$250~500?

What if I win the lottery?


Thanks

[Scott Dorsey]

U-CDK_CHARLES\\Charles > wrote:
>
>What are the best headphones at various price points? Something that
>won't kill the singer's head (save THAT for ME *evil cackle*), or
>fatigue my ears . . .

The problem is that headphones use your ear canals as part of a resonant
system, and everyone's ears are different. So the headphones that give
you flattest response may not give anyone else flattest response.

>My present situation is such that I often need to monitor using cans. I
>realize that's not idea, but I've a wife and a Mother in Law. I don't
>wanna trade in the wife, and the MiL is part of the set for now .. . .

So, is this because you have issues with outside noise leaking in or
because you have issues with annoying other folks with outside noise?

The Grado headphones sound great, but they also make bad things sound
great. They do not block outside noise in any way, though. The Etymotic
in-ears are much more accurate, and block outside noise better than anything
out there, but they are not fun to wear for long term listening and they
are not pleasant-sounding.

The Sony MDR-V6 has a horribly pitched-up top end that is anything but
accurate, but that means you can often turn the levels down a little
for tracking, and it makes them great tracking monitors.

All of these will have different low end on different ears, because of
the ear canal differences.
--scott


--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Scott Dorsey]

U-CDK_CHARLES\\Charles > wrote:
>
>What are the best headphones at various price points? Something that
>won't kill the singer's head (save THAT for ME *evil cackle*), or
>fatigue my ears . . .

The problem is that headphones use your ear canals as part of a resonant
system, and everyone's ears are different. So the headphones that give
you flattest response may not give anyone else flattest response.

>My present situation is such that I often need to monitor using cans. I
>realize that's not idea, but I've a wife and a Mother in Law. I don't
>wanna trade in the wife, and the MiL is part of the set for now .. . .

So, is this because you have issues with outside noise leaking in or
because you have issues with annoying other folks with outside noise?

The Grado headphones sound great, but they also make bad things sound
great. They do not block outside noise in any way, though. The Etymotic
in-ears are much more accurate, and block outside noise better than anything
out there, but they are not fun to wear for long term listening and they
are not pleasant-sounding.

The Sony MDR-V6 has a horribly pitched-up top end that is anything but
accurate, but that means you can often turn the levels down a little
for tracking, and it makes them great tracking monitors.

All of these will have different low end on different ears, because of
the ear canal differences.
--scott


--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[U-CDK_CHARLES\\Charles]

On 13 Aug 2004 10:17:32 -0400, Scott Dorsey > wrote:
> U-CDK_CHARLES\\Charles > wrote:
>>
>>What are the best headphones at various price points? Something that
>>won't kill the singer's head (save THAT for ME *evil cackle*), or
>>fatigue my ears . . .
>
> The problem is that headphones use your ear canals as part of a resonant
> system, and everyone's ears are different. So the headphones that give
> you flattest response may not give anyone else flattest response.
>
>>My present situation is such that I often need to monitor using cans. I
>>realize that's not idea, but I've a wife and a Mother in Law. I don't
>>wanna trade in the wife, and the MiL is part of the set for now .. . .
>
> So, is this because you have issues with outside noise leaking in or
> because you have issues with annoying other folks with outside noise?

Sound getting OUT is more of an issue. I can usually tell the
difference between sound in disk vs sound coming from upstairs.

> The Grado headphones sound great, but they also make bad things sound
> great. They do not block outside noise in any way, though. The Etymotic
> in-ears are much more accurate, and block outside noise better than anything
> out there, but they are not fun to wear for long term listening and they
> are not pleasant-sounding.
>
> The Sony MDR-V6 has a horribly pitched-up top end that is anything but
> accurate, but that means you can often turn the levels down a little
> for tracking, and it makes them great tracking monitors.
>
> All of these will have different low end on different ears, because of
> the ear canal differences.
> --scott

Are the low-end differences more pronounced than the difference between
a set of nearfields vs a set of nearfields with a subwoofer?

[U-CDK_CHARLES\\Charles]

On 13 Aug 2004 10:17:32 -0400, Scott Dorsey > wrote:
> U-CDK_CHARLES\\Charles > wrote:
>>
>>What are the best headphones at various price points? Something that
>>won't kill the singer's head (save THAT for ME *evil cackle*), or
>>fatigue my ears . . .
>
> The problem is that headphones use your ear canals as part of a resonant
> system, and everyone's ears are different. So the headphones that give
> you flattest response may not give anyone else flattest response.
>
>>My present situation is such that I often need to monitor using cans. I
>>realize that's not idea, but I've a wife and a Mother in Law. I don't
>>wanna trade in the wife, and the MiL is part of the set for now .. . .
>
> So, is this because you have issues with outside noise leaking in or
> because you have issues with annoying other folks with outside noise?

Sound getting OUT is more of an issue. I can usually tell the
difference between sound in disk vs sound coming from upstairs.

> The Grado headphones sound great, but they also make bad things sound
> great. They do not block outside noise in any way, though. The Etymotic
> in-ears are much more accurate, and block outside noise better than anything
> out there, but they are not fun to wear for long term listening and they
> are not pleasant-sounding.
>
> The Sony MDR-V6 has a horribly pitched-up top end that is anything but
> accurate, but that means you can often turn the levels down a little
> for tracking, and it makes them great tracking monitors.
>
> All of these will have different low end on different ears, because of
> the ear canal differences.
> --scott

Are the low-end differences more pronounced than the difference between
a set of nearfields vs a set of nearfields with a subwoofer?

[J.W.]

On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 14:11:48 GMT, "U-CDK_CHARLES\\Charles" <"Charles
> wrote:

>
>What are the best headphones at various price points? Something that
>won't kill the singer's head (save THAT for ME *evil cackle*), or
>fatigue my ears . . .
>
>My present situation is such that I often need to monitor using cans. I
>realize that's not idea, but I've a wife and a Mother in Law. I don't
>wanna trade in the wife, and the MiL is part of the set for now .. . .
>
>So my application is BOTH "Talent Monitors" AND "My Own Ears"
>
>How'bout these price points:
>
>Sub $100?
>
>$100~250?
>
>$250~500?
>
>What if I win the lottery?
>

Go to www.headphone.com

It looks like you're looking for closed-back "sealed" headphones.
They have ratings and a buying guide there. The Sennheiser HD 280 Pro
for $199 is highly regarded.

[J.W.]

On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 14:11:48 GMT, "U-CDK_CHARLES\\Charles" <"Charles
> wrote:

>
>What are the best headphones at various price points? Something that
>won't kill the singer's head (save THAT for ME *evil cackle*), or
>fatigue my ears . . .
>
>My present situation is such that I often need to monitor using cans. I
>realize that's not idea, but I've a wife and a Mother in Law. I don't
>wanna trade in the wife, and the MiL is part of the set for now .. . .
>
>So my application is BOTH "Talent Monitors" AND "My Own Ears"
>
>How'bout these price points:
>
>Sub $100?
>
>$100~250?
>
>$250~500?
>
>What if I win the lottery?
>

Go to www.headphone.com

It looks like you're looking for closed-back "sealed" headphones.
They have ratings and a buying guide there. The Sennheiser HD 280 Pro
for $199 is highly regarded.

[Scott Dorsey]

U-CDK_CHARLES\\Charles > wrote:
>
>Are the low-end differences more pronounced than the difference between
>a set of nearfields vs a set of nearfields with a subwoofer?

I'm not sure what you mean. One set of nearfields may have no subwoofer,
and much greater extension than another set that does.

But the low end differences are significant and measurable. And it is not
just a matter of extension... the MDR-V6 may have horribly bloated bass for
one person, but comparatively flat bass for another.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Scott Dorsey]

U-CDK_CHARLES\\Charles > wrote:
>
>Are the low-end differences more pronounced than the difference between
>a set of nearfields vs a set of nearfields with a subwoofer?

I'm not sure what you mean. One set of nearfields may have no subwoofer,
and much greater extension than another set that does.

But the low end differences are significant and measurable. And it is not
just a matter of extension... the MDR-V6 may have horribly bloated bass for
one person, but comparatively flat bass for another.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Kurt Albershardt]

U-CDK_CHARLES\Charles wrote:

> What are the best headphones at various price points? Something that
> won't kill the singer's head (save THAT for ME *evil cackle*), or
> fatigue my ears . . .
> ...
> Sub $100?

I'll vote for the Sennheiser HD-280 Pro there--decent, not-too-peaky sound, great isolation, and easy to drive.



> $100~250?
> $250~500?

I'm using Sennheiser HD-600's (in the first category when I bought mine) with an external amp (which brings things into the second range.) No isolation from outside noises, though.



>> What if I win the lottery?

Build a new room.

[Kurt Albershardt]

U-CDK_CHARLES\Charles wrote:

> What are the best headphones at various price points? Something that
> won't kill the singer's head (save THAT for ME *evil cackle*), or
> fatigue my ears . . .
> ...
> Sub $100?

I'll vote for the Sennheiser HD-280 Pro there--decent, not-too-peaky sound, great isolation, and easy to drive.



> $100~250?
> $250~500?

I'm using Sennheiser HD-600's (in the first category when I bought mine) with an external amp (which brings things into the second range.) No isolation from outside noises, though.



>> What if I win the lottery?

Build a new room.

[Leoaw3]

For letting the musicians use to record... nothing beats the MoreMe headphones
from Harvey Gerst.
$20. for standard model, $30 for the "studio deluxe" model.
GREAT customer service.
http://www.itrstudio.com/moreme.html

(not affilliated with him, just a VERY happy customer)
-lee-

[Leoaw3]

For letting the musicians use to record... nothing beats the MoreMe headphones
from Harvey Gerst.
$20. for standard model, $30 for the "studio deluxe" model.
GREAT customer service.
http://www.itrstudio.com/moreme.html

(not affilliated with him, just a VERY happy customer)
-lee-

[reddred]

"U-CDK_CHARLES\Charles" <"Charles > wrote in message
news:E_3Tc.11$si.10@trndny06...

> So my application is BOTH "Talent Monitors" AND "My Own Ears"
>
> How'bout these price points:
>
> Sub $100?
>

Try the AT m40fs set. I like them, but everyone is different.

> $100~250?
>

At about $100, take your pick, sennhieser, sony, etc.,


> What if I win the lottery?
>

Spend a hundred dollars on headphones and buy your mother in law a condo.

jb

[reddred]

"U-CDK_CHARLES\Charles" <"Charles > wrote in message
news:E_3Tc.11$si.10@trndny06...

> So my application is BOTH "Talent Monitors" AND "My Own Ears"
>
> How'bout these price points:
>
> Sub $100?
>

Try the AT m40fs set. I like them, but everyone is different.

> $100~250?
>

At about $100, take your pick, sennhieser, sony, etc.,


> What if I win the lottery?
>

Spend a hundred dollars on headphones and buy your mother in law a condo.

jb

[Les Cargill]

U-CDK_CHARLES\Charles wrote:

> What are the best headphones at various price points? Something that
> won't kill the singer's head (save THAT for ME *evil cackle*), or
> fatigue my ears . . .
>
> My present situation is such that I often need to monitor using cans. I
> realize that's not idea, but I've a wife and a Mother in Law. I don't
> wanna trade in the wife, and the MiL is part of the set for now .. . .
>
> So my application is BOTH "Talent Monitors" AND "My Own Ears"
>
> How'bout these price points:
>
> Sub $100?
>
> $100~250?
>
> $250~500?
>
> What if I win the lottery?
>
>
> Thanks
>
>

Koss makes some little "portable" model phones that
sound very good to me ( and a couple other people I
know who use 'em). They're like $20, ordered online.

Model is the KTX-PRO.

--
Les Cargill

[David Satz]

Charles Krug wrote:

> What are the best headphones at various price points?

If you search the archives of this newsgroup for any of the (rather
numerous) past discussions of this same topic, I think you will find
that there is only a limited convergence of viewpoints, even among
those of us who generally understand where each other are coming from.
What that means exactly is subject to interpretation--perhaps we all
agree to agree too readily on other topics; we like the groupthink!

But when headphones are the issue, I have seen no obvious way to bridge
the differences of opinion that are voiced. Many people here whose
listening expertise I value highly like headphones that I can't f**king
stand, and vice versa.

It's not _only_ the fact that we use different criteria when choosing
headphones (e.g. truth vs. beauty, maximum blockage of outside sound vs.
the sense of immersion in the recorded space, etc.). Look at the way any
two people describe the frequency response of the Sony MDR-V6 or the AKG
K 240--just to name two models that a lot of us have tried--and you'll
see very little agreement even on whether one has a boosted bass or
treble or not. That's unusual here, and I don't quite understand it.

But the result seems clear enough: The value of people's suggestions
and opinions on this topic dips even lower than it already is on most
other topics regarding equipment choices, and the importance of taking
the time to try out at least a few candidates under realistic working
conditions becomes even greater than usual. Actually I shouldn't say
"the importance"--it's downright indispensible.

[david]

In article >, David Satz
> wrote:

> Look at the way any
> two people describe the frequency response of the Sony MDR-V6 or the AKG
> K 240--just to name two models that a lot of us have tried--and you'll
> see very little agreement even on whether one has a boosted bass or
> treble or not.




Mebbe that's cuz the great majority of the people posting here are not
actually professional recording engineers - lotsa folks with
basement/bedroom studios, people that used to engineer at some point in
their life, folks with sound cards in their computers, people that
wannabe engineers, etc. etc. Where are all the full time, experienced
pros? Long time passin'.

The quality of the info on the actual posts about pro audio continues
to degrade here imo. Damn shame. RAP used to be great place to learn
things.I sure as hell don't know everything but I ain't learning much
here anymore. Fletcher may have had it right to flee to
http://recforums.prosoundweb.com. for more than a paycheck.





David Correia
Celebration Sound
Warren, Rhode Island


www.CelebrationSound.com

[Ty Ford]

On Sun, 15 Aug 2004 21:38:18 -0400, david wrote
(in article >):

> In article >, David Satz
> > wrote:
>
>> Look at the way any
>> two people describe the frequency response of the Sony MDR-V6 or the AKG
>> K 240--just to name two models that a lot of us have tried--and you'll
>> see very little agreement even on whether one has a boosted bass or
>> treble or not.
>
>
>
>
> Mebbe that's cuz the great majority of the people posting here are not
> actually professional recording engineers - lotsa folks with
> basement/bedroom studios, people that used to engineer at some point in
> their life, folks with sound cards in their computers, people that
> wannabe engineers, etc. etc. Where are all the full time, experienced
> pros? Long time passin'.
>
> The quality of the info on the actual posts about pro audio continues
> to degrade here imo. Damn shame. RAP used to be great place to learn
> things.I sure as hell don't know everything but I ain't learning much
> here anymore. Fletcher may have had it right to flee to
> http://recforums.prosoundweb.com. for more than a paycheck.
>
>
>
>
>
> David Correia
> Celebration Sound
> Warren, Rhode Island

And yet George M is having his problems over there because posters don't want
to reveal their real names in his forum.

What are people thinking? Oh, maybe they aren't!

Regards,

Ty Ford





-- Ty Ford's equipment reviews, audio samples, rates and other audiocentric
stuff are at http://home.comcast.net/~tyreeford

[Kurt Albershardt]

David Satz wrote:
>
> If you search the archives of this newsgroup for any of the (rather
> numerous) past discussions of this same topic, I think you will find
> that there is only a limited convergence of viewpoints, even among
> those of us who generally understand where each other are coming from.
> What that means exactly is subject to interpretation--perhaps we all
> agree to agree too readily on other topics; we like the groupthink!
>
> But when headphones are the issue, I have seen no obvious way to bridge
> the differences of opinion that are voiced. Many people here whose
> listening expertise I value highly like headphones that I can't f**king
> stand, and vice versa.
>
> It's not _only_ the fact that we use different criteria when choosing
> headphones (e.g. truth vs. beauty, maximum blockage of outside sound vs.
> the sense of immersion in the recorded space, etc.). Look at the way any
> two people describe the frequency response of the Sony MDR-V6 or the AKG
> K 240--just to name two models that a lot of us have tried--and you'll
> see very little agreement even on whether one has a boosted bass or
> treble or not. That's unusual here, and I don't quite understand it.

Nearfield response of individual ears vary quite radically due to pinnae shape. There's also the comfort factor to consider--what feels good on my head may cause pain for someone else. I tell people to try on a LOT of headphones if they want to end up with something they can wear for any length of time...