quality portable MP3 recording

[Josh Brown]

Is there a portable MP3 Player/Recorder, either hard drive or flash
based, that can record semi-decent quality stereo field recordings of
loud rock music for example my band's practice sessions???

I was considering getting one of the iRiver models with a "Line-In"
and one of the "Sound Professionals" stereo microhones with battery
powered preamps.

Other options I have seen are the Archos models and there is a $49
stereo microphone that takes a battery that Archos also sells.

Another mic I have seen is the Sony ECMMS907 stereo battery powered
mic. But would this work with a line level input?

Any other suggestions out there? Should I do mini disc instead?

Thanks,

Josh

[William Sommerwerck]

> I think the Ipod can record higher-res wav files.

As I pointed out, the iRiver hard-drive jukeboxes can record .WAV files from
analog inputs. They have enough gain to handle an electret mic. Only problem is
that they lack record-level meters. Perhaps the next version, or a firmware
upgrade...

[William Sommerwerck]

> Hmm that's worth considering... thanks for the info. It's still a
> pain to carry around a mic but I could get something small.

Be sure to test this thoroughly before buying anything. I'm not sure there's
enough gain for, say, a string quartet.

[William Sommerwerck]

> Hmm that's worth considering... thanks for the info. It's still a
> pain to carry around a mic but I could get something small.

Be sure to test this thoroughly before buying anything. I'm not sure there's
enough gain for, say, a string quartet.

[Sugarite]

> >> The iRiver hard-drive jukeboxes can record .WAV files from
> >> analog inputs. They have enough gain to handle an electret mic.
>
> > So they can handle an electret mic w/out a preamp?
>
> Yes. You just have to crank up the gain.

Careful, that's digital gain, after the analog stage. Turning that up turns
up the noise too, so it doesn't help. If it's a loud setting you can get
away with an electret condenser pair. Otherwise you'll need a preamp, a
cheap compact mixer does the trick.

You should also consider the Nomad Jukebox 3, which has more refined
firmware (including rec level), records WAV or MP3, and has excellent 3rd
party software for doing transfers and keeping things organized. I've got
over 600 hours on mine, never even made a glitch.

[William Sommerwerck]

>>>> The iRiver hard-drive jukeboxes can record .WAV files from
>>>> analog inputs. They have enough gain to handle an electret mic.

>>> So they can handle an electret mic w/out a preamp?

>> Yes. You just have to crank up the gain.

> Careful, that's digital gain, after the analog stage. Turning that up turns
> up the noise too, so it doesn't help. If it's a loud setting you can get
> away with an electret condenser pair. Otherwise you'll need a preamp,
> a cheap compact mixer does the trick.

I don't know that that's true. Do you know as a fact that the gain increase is
in the digital domain?

I did some testing yesterday with the iHP-120 and a "good" Sony stereo electret
mic.

Playing orchestral music at a high level through my main system, I found that
(even with the iRiver's gain all the way up) I couldn't "clip" the recording.
This is NOT good, as it indicates that the iRiver doesn't have enough gain,
except for relatively loud sounds close to the mic. In other words, you might
not have trouble with a rock group or even full orchestra (with the mic behind
the conductor's head), but you're almost certainly not going to have enough gain
for a string quartet.

I'm sure a cheap compact mixer would do the trick, but then why use the iRiver?
It kind of kills the whole idea of portability.

I have a Sony TCD-D3 "pocket" DAT, and it works fine. Overall, it's about 3x the
volume of the iRiver.

[Marc Heusser]

In article >,
(Josh Brown) wrote:

> Is there a portable MP3 Player/Recorder, either hard drive or flash
> based, that can record semi-decent quality stereo field recordings of
> loud rock music for example my band's practice sessions???

Have a look at the Marantz PMD-670. XLR inputs, nice meters, limiter
(switcheable), built in mic (just in case ...), records mp2, mp3, PCM to
CF cards.

HTH

Marc

--
Marc Heusser
(remove the obvious: CHEERS and MERICAL...until end to reply via email)

[normanstrong]

"Sugarite" > wrote in message
...
> > >> The iRiver hard-drive jukeboxes can record .WAV files from
> > >> analog inputs. They have enough gain to handle an electret mic.
> >
> > > So they can handle an electret mic w/out a preamp?
> >
> > Yes. You just have to crank up the gain.
>
> Careful, that's digital gain, after the analog stage. Turning that
up turns
> up the noise too, so it doesn't help. If it's a loud setting you
can get
> away with an electret condenser pair. Otherwise you'll need a
preamp, a
> cheap compact mixer does the trick.
>
> You should also consider the Nomad Jukebox 3, which has more refined
> firmware (including rec level), records WAV or MP3, and has
excellent 3rd
> party software for doing transfers and keeping things organized.
I've got
> over 600 hours on mine, never even made a glitch.

You say the NJB3 has a record level control. How do you tell what the
actual recording level is? Is there a bar graph display or something
to that effect?

Thanks,

Norm Strong

[Arny Krueger]

"normanstrong" > wrote in message
news:U45Uc.134734$8_6.130012@attbi_s04
> "Sugarite" > wrote in message
> ...
>>>>> The iRiver hard-drive jukeboxes can record .WAV files from
>>>>> analog inputs. They have enough gain to handle an electret mic.
>>>
>>>> So they can handle an electret mic w/out a preamp?
>>>
>>> Yes. You just have to crank up the gain.
>>
>> Careful, that's digital gain, after the analog stage. Turning that
>> up turns up the noise too, so it doesn't help. If it's a loud
>> setting you
> can get
>> away with an electret condenser pair. Otherwise you'll need a
>> preamp, a cheap compact mixer does the trick.
>>
>> You should also consider the Nomad Jukebox 3, which has more refined
>> firmware (including rec level), records WAV or MP3, and has
> excellent 3rd
>> party software for doing transfers and keeping things organized.
> I've got
>> over 600 hours on mine, never even made a glitch.
>
> You say the NJB3 has a record level control. How do you tell what the
> actual recording level is? Is there a bar graph display or something
> to that effect?

Yes.

[Mike Rivers]

In article <U45Uc.134734$8_6.130012@attbi_s04> writes:

> You say the NJB3 has a record level control. How do you tell what the
> actual recording level is? Is there a bar graph display or something
> to that effect?

With a good imagination you can get an idea of the record level (at
least being sure you have some and that you're not overdriving) with
teh tiny bargraph meters in the LCD.

--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

[Marc Wielage]

On Aug 12, 2004, Josh Brown > commented:

> Is there a portable MP3 Player/Recorder, either hard drive or flash
> based, that can record semi-decent quality stereo field recordings of
> loud rock music for example my band's practice sessions?
>--------------------------------snip----------------------------------<

You might want to take a look at the new Sony Hi-MD portables. Their sound
quality is extremely good (far better than MP3 at the highest settings), and
I find they're more convenient and better for battery time than the MP3 units
I've found.

--MFW
[remove the extra M above for email]

[Mike Rivers]

In article > writes:

> You might want to take a look at the new Sony Hi-MD portables. Their sound
> quality is extremely good (far better than MP3 at the highest settings)

Do you have one? How about a full report?

I thought it was still a rumor, but I don't follow that technology
very closely.

--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

[Todd H.]

(Josh Brown) writes:
> Is there a portable MP3 Player/Recorder, either hard drive or flash
> based, that can record semi-decent quality stereo field recordings of
> loud rock music for example my band's practice sessions???

Yes.

> I was considering getting one of the iRiver models with a "Line-In"
> and one of the "Sound Professionals" stereo microhones with battery
> powered preamps.

Good idea. And actually, if you're an electric band, you don't even
really need the preamp--a battery box will do if you get th ehigh
sensitivity omni mics from SP.

I have a page where I talk about this setup in quite a bit of detail:

http://toddh.net/music/njb/

> Another mic I have seen is the Sony ECMMS907 stereo battery powered
> mic. But would this work with a line level input?

That Sony mic isn't nearly hot enough to provide line level.

> Any other suggestions out there? Should I do mini disc instead?

Minidisc isn't bad if you don't mind dealing with changing media and
not being able to get the recordings to your computer in the digital
domain.

Best Regards,
--
/"\ ASCII Ribbon Campaign | Todd H
\ / | http://www.toddh.net/
X Promoting good netiquette | http://triplethreatband.com/
/ \ http://www.toddh.net/netiquette/ | "4 lines suffice."

[Sugarite]

> You say the NJB3 has a record level control. How do you tell what the
> actual recording level is? Is there a bar graph display or something
> to that effect?

It does have stereo input meters, but the record gain is in the digital
domain for the NJB3 as well. You're going to find there's a key component
missing to every similar recorder, the NJB3 is just the most practical and
certainly a good value.

I use mine with a Rode NT4 and DBX 386 (which has built-in a/d converter) so
the NJB3 only puts the digital signal on the hard drive. I've got under $1k
invested, and it's by far the best sounding reasonably compact recording rig
under ~$2500. For full portability the NT4 can be plugged directly into the
NJB3 at loud shows, otherwise I use a Behringer MXB1002, again a great value
at $99.

[Len Moskowitz]

Josh Brown > wrote:

>Is there a portable MP3 Player/Recorder, either hard drive or flash
>based, that can record semi-decent quality stereo field recordings of
>loud rock music for example my band's practice sessions???

iRiver iHP-120, Creative Nomad Jukebox 3, Archos Gmini 120.

The iRiver will power a set of plug-in power mics, like our Low Cost
Binaurals.

And you can add a Mic Pre/A-to-D later and feed its optical digital
audio input.




--
Len Moskowitz PDAudio, Binaural Mics, Cables, DPA, M-Audio
Core Sound http://www.stealthmicrophones.com
Teaneck, New Jersey USA http://www.core-sound.com
Tel: 201-801-0812, FAX: 201-801-0912

[Richard Kuschel]

>
>Josh Brown > wrote:
>
>>Is there a portable MP3 Player/Recorder, either hard drive or flash
>>based, that can record semi-decent quality stereo field recordings of
>>loud rock music for example my band's practice sessions???

Marantz 670.

Also records in PCM and MP2
Richard H. Kuschel
"I canna change the law of physics."-----Scotty