Microphone choice

[Ed Lowenstein]

I do home recording of acoustic guitar and voice. I already own an AKG
C1000S and have gotten some good results using an X-Y configuration
with a friend's SM 57. If I'm going to get a second mike to do my own
X-Y and have a better vocal mike than the AKG C1000S, how about the
Rode NT1A??? Any other thoughts for this use. Thanks much.
---> Ed

[Stu Venable]

"Ed Lowenstein" > wrote in message
om...
> I do home recording of acoustic guitar and voice. I already own an AKG
> C1000S and have gotten some good results using an X-Y configuration
> with a friend's SM 57. If I'm going to get a second mike to do my own
> X-Y and have a better vocal mike than the AKG C1000S, how about the
> Rode NT1A??? Any other thoughts for this use. Thanks much.
> ---> Ed

I own an NT1A, and I'm disappointed with it. I've yet to find anything to
use it on. Whatever I'm recording invariably sounds better on one of my
other mics.

I record mostly folk music (acoustic guitar, bouzouki, mandolin, and lots of
vox).


Stu Venable

[George Perfect]

In this place, Ed Lowenstein was recorded saying ...
> I do home recording of acoustic guitar and voice. I already own an AKG
> C1000S and have gotten some good results using an X-Y configuration
> with a friend's SM 57. If I'm going to get a second mike to do my own
> X-Y and have a better vocal mike than the AKG C1000S, how about the
> Rode NT1A??? Any other thoughts for this use. Thanks much.
> ---> Ed
>

Ed, for X-Y you should really have two mics that are (as far as
possible) identical.

Buying a third type will make sense if (as you say) you are looking for
a better mic for your voice than the AKG (in which case, do, please, go
and audition a few on your voice before buying).

If you want to obtain proper X-Y recordings (and can't afford - say -
two NT1As,) look at some of the small diaphragm condensors now starting
to appear in numbers at very low prices from China.

I just know that folks round here are going to jump on me for suggesting
that (arguing - with some reasonable basis - that two of these cheap
mics hardly qualify as identical) but whatever - they will be a darn
sight closer in performance than a C1000S and SM57.

--

George
Newcastle, England

Problems worthy of attack
Prove their worth, by hitting back [Piet Hein]

[Richard Freeman]

"Ed Lowenstein" > wrote in message
om...
> I do home recording of acoustic guitar and voice. I already own an AKG
> C1000S and have gotten some good results using an X-Y configuration
> with a friend's SM 57. If I'm going to get a second mike to do my own
> X-Y

For X-Y try a pair of Rode NT5s

> and have a better vocal mike than the AKG C1000S, how about the
> Rode NT1A???

Studio Vocal mic - Dunno

[Mike Rivers]

In article > writes:

> I do home recording of acoustic guitar and voice. I already own an AKG
> C1000S and have gotten some good results using an X-Y configuration
> with a friend's SM 57.

Generally people use matched mics, at least least two mics of the same
make and model and roughly the same age and condition. I can't imagine
two more mismatched mics than the two you're using but if you're
getting good results, who's to argue?


--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

[geek]

What does this have to do with 9/11? Or terrorism?

Get back off topic kids.

Mike.

--


mikerekka at hotmail dot com hates spam


"Mike Rivers" > wrote in message
news:znr1090364245k@trad...
>
> In article >
writes:
>
> > I do home recording of acoustic guitar and voice. I already own an AKG
> > C1000S and have gotten some good results using an X-Y configuration
> > with a friend's SM 57.
>
> Generally people use matched mics, at least least two mics of the same
> make and model and roughly the same age and condition. I can't imagine
> two more mismatched mics than the two you're using but if you're
> getting good results, who's to argue?
>
>
> --
> I'm really Mike Rivers )
> However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
> lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
> you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
> and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

[Ben Bradley]

On Wed, 21 Jul 2004 02:25:00 GMT, "geek" >
wrote:

>What does this have to do with 9/11? Or terrorism?
>
>Get back off topic kids.

"I'd like to dedicate this performance of Desperado to ..."

>Mike.

[LJM]

Ed Lowenstein wrote:

> I do home recording of acoustic guitar and voice. I already own an AKG
> C1000S and have gotten some good results using an X-Y configuration
> with a friend's SM 57. If I'm going to get a second mike to do my own
> X-Y and have a better vocal mike than the AKG C1000S, how about the
> Rode NT1A??? Any other thoughts for this use. Thanks much.
> ---> Ed

Get a couple of these. MARSHALL MXL603S MXL 603 MXL603 MIC NEW CABLE
They should work out just fine.

Jim

--
it is better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to open your
mouth and remove all doubt....

[LJM]

Ed Lowenstein wrote:

> I do home recording of acoustic guitar and voice. I already own an AKG
> C1000S and have gotten some good results using an X-Y configuration
> with a friend's SM 57. If I'm going to get a second mike to do my own
> X-Y and have a better vocal mike than the AKG C1000S, how about the
> Rode NT1A??? Any other thoughts for this use. Thanks much.
> ---> Ed

Get a couple of these which should work out fine.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=41466&item=3734950923&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

Jim

--
it is better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to open your
mouth and remove all doubt....

[**bg**]

Hey Ed,

Everybody should have a couple of SM58s, rent a couple for a month...

-bg--
www.thelittlecanadaheadphoneband.ca


"Ed Lowenstein" > wrote in message
om...
> I do home recording of acoustic guitar and voice. I already own an AKG
> C1000S and have gotten some good results using an X-Y configuration
> with a friend's SM 57. If I'm going to get a second mike to do my own
> X-Y and have a better vocal mike than the AKG C1000S, how about the
> Rode NT1A??? Any other thoughts for this use. Thanks much.
> ---> Ed

[hank alrich]

Ben Bradley wrote:

> "I'd like to dedicate this performance of Desperado to ..."

"some chicken**** casino manager with overly bunched panties".

--
ha

[Raymond]

>
>"Ed Lowenstein" > wrote in message
om...
>> I do home recording of acoustic guitar and voice. I already own an AKG
>> C1000S and have gotten some good results using an X-Y configuration
>> with a friend's SM 57. If I'm going to get a second mike to do my own
>> X-Y and have a better vocal mike than the AKG C1000S, how about the
>> Rode NT1A??? Any other thoughts for this use. Thanks much.
>> ---> Ed
>
>

I've heard lots of good things about Studio Projects C1's, A bit more than the
Marshall's. I have two, but still working on my rooms so I can't say yes or no
for sure but they have been getting good review's.

[hank alrich]

**bg** wrote:

> Everybody should have a couple of SM58s, rent a couple for a month...

Not necessarily, and especially not necessarily for recording acoustic
guitar and voice for anything but rock.

> "Ed Lowenstein" wrote...

> > I do home recording of acoustic guitar and voice. I already own an AKG
> > C1000S and have gotten some good results using an X-Y configuration
> > with a friend's SM 57. If I'm going to get a second mike to do my own
> > X-Y and have a better vocal mike than the AKG C1000S, how about the
> > Rode NT1A??? Any other thoughts for this use. Thanks much.
> > ---> Ed

--
ha

[Richard Freeman]

"**bg**" > wrote in message
news:ALnLc.76038$ek5.33377@pd7tw2no...
> Hey Ed,
>
> Everybody should have a couple of SM58s, rent a couple for a month...

why ????

[David Morgan \(MAMS\)]

"hank alrich" > wrote in message...

> Ben Bradley wrote:
>
> > "I'd like to dedicate this performance of Desperado to ..."
>
> "some chicken**** casino manager with overly bunched panties".

"That cute little waitress with the really big..... eyes".

[Arny Krueger]

"LJM" > wrote in message
nk.net
> Ed Lowenstein wrote:

>> I do home recording of acoustic guitar and voice. I already own an
>> AKG C1000S and have gotten some good results using an X-Y
>> configuration with a friend's SM 57. If I'm going to get a second
>> mike to do my own X-Y and have a better vocal mike than the AKG
>> C1000S, how about the Rode NT1A??? Any other thoughts for this use.
>> Thanks much.
>> ---> Ed

> Get a couple of these. MARSHALL MXL603S MXL 603 MXL603 MIC NEW CABLE
> They should work out just fine.

Agreed.

MXL 603s are even available in *matched pairs* for a reasonable price.

Let's go down the list - SM57s sound thin and harsh, AKG C1000s are among
the most disrespected mics in the history of RAP, and its hard to find
anybody who says that MXL 603s are anything but a good musical instrument
mic and a great buy for the money. Oh, and you can buy the MXL603 matched
pair in a cute case for less bucks than one C1000.

[Arny Krueger]

"LJM" > wrote in message
nk.net
> Ed Lowenstein wrote:
>
>> I do home recording of acoustic guitar and voice. I already own an
>> AKG C1000S and have gotten some good results using an X-Y
>> configuration with a friend's SM 57. If I'm going to get a second
>> mike to do my own X-Y and have a better vocal mike than the AKG
>> C1000S, how about the Rode NT1A??? Any other thoughts for this use.
>> Thanks much.
>> ---> Ed

> Get a couple of these which should work out fine.

>
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=41466&item=3734950923&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

I've done a number of deals with this seller - no sweat.

[Arny Krueger]

"Richard Freeman" > wrote in message

> "**bg**" > wrote in message
> news:ALnLc.76038$ek5.33377@pd7tw2no...
>> Hey Ed,
>>
>> Everybody should have a couple of SM58s, rent a couple for a month...
>
> why ????

Perhaps, the same logic that says your first sex experience should be with a
whore.

[George Perfect]

In this place, Arny Krueger was recorded saying ...
>
> Agreed.
>
> MXL 603s are even available in *matched pairs* for a reasonable price.
>
> Let's go down the list - SM57s sound thin and harsh, AKG C1000s are among
> the most disrespected mics in the history of RAP, and its hard to find
> anybody who says that MXL 603s are anything but a good musical instrument
> mic and a great buy for the money. Oh, and you can buy the MXL603 matched
> pair in a cute case for less bucks than one C1000.

Just a note of caution, MXL603s are wide cardioids and wouldn't be my
first choice for an X-Y pair - excellent though they are in other areas.

--

George
Newcastle, England

Problems worthy of attack
Prove their worth, by hitting back [Piet Hein]

[Arny Krueger]

"George Perfect" > wrote in message
o.uk
> In this place, Arny Krueger was recorded saying ...
>>
>> Agreed.
>>
>> MXL 603s are even available in *matched pairs* for a reasonable
>> price.
>>
>> Let's go down the list - SM57s sound thin and harsh, AKG C1000s are
>> among the most disrespected mics in the history of RAP, and its hard
>> to find anybody who says that MXL 603s are anything but a good
>> musical instrument mic and a great buy for the money. Oh, and you
>> can buy the MXL603 matched pair in a cute case for less bucks than
>> one C1000.
>
> Just a note of caution, MXL603s are wide cardioids and wouldn't be my
> first choice for an X-Y pair - excellent though they are in other
> areas.

Point taken. 603s are wide cardiods, but the meaning of that fact varies
with the details of the situation. I seem to tend toward wide cardiods and
omnis. On balance, there is still a big difference between wide cardiods and
the omnis I use. I'm planning to do some X-Ying with 603s.

[Scott Dorsey]

Richard Freeman > wrote:
>
>"**bg**" > wrote in message
>news:ALnLc.76038$ek5.33377@pd7tw2no...
>> Hey Ed,
>>
>> Everybody should have a couple of SM58s, rent a couple for a month...
>
>why ????

Because sooner or later, there will be some singer who will demand an SM58
and won't work with anything else. Don't ask me why.

I have a tricked up SM58 with an omni condenser capsule inside for some
of those folks.

And it is good to know the SM58.... if you know how it sounds and what the
feedback characteristics are, you'll have a good common reference that everyone
else knows, so you can talk about other (better) mikes.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[U-CDK_CHARLES\\Charles]

On Wed, 21 Jul 2004 17:15:39 +1000, Richard Freeman
> wrote:
>
> "**bg**" > wrote in message
> news:ALnLc.76038$ek5.33377@pd7tw2no...
>> Hey Ed,
>>
>> Everybody should have a couple of SM58s, rent a couple for a month...
>
> why ????
>

Point of reference? Abuse?

If you're doing live sound, it's a decent "baseline handheld" mic, one
that a lot of tech riders specify because widely available and well
known to be "pro grade." and eliminates "Sound by Realistic."

Kinda like brown M&Ms. It's not really about the M&Ms. The line about
M&Ms was in the middle of a lengthy list specifying things like live
floor loading and power supply configuration.

In a studio setting, you only need it if the singer INSISTS on using a
handheld mic.

Live, there are better and worse mics, but none so widely
available--important if all your mics get stolen. Every other handheld
vocal mic is discussed as, "Kinda like a '58 but . . . "

I've been using the ATM41a in my live rig for the past twenty years. It
sounds kinda like a '58, but sound a smidgeon hotter (3dB-ish), have a
bit more presense peak, and seem to be a bit less feedback prone.

I know a guitar/vocal duo who uses a small diaphragm phantom powered
condensor on their vocals. It sounds kinda like a '58, but it's a TON
hotter and somehow . . "purer" and more detailed, even though it's in
the same "sonic family"

See what I mean?

[John Washburn]

"Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
...
> "George Perfect" > wrote in message
> o.uk
> > In this place, Arny Krueger was recorded saying ...
> >>
> >> Agreed.
> >>
> >> MXL 603s are even available in *matched pairs* for a reasonable
> >> price.
> >>
> >> Let's go down the list - SM57s sound thin and harsh, AKG C1000s are
> >> among the most disrespected mics in the history of RAP, and its hard
> >> to find anybody who says that MXL 603s are anything but a good
> >> musical instrument mic and a great buy for the money. Oh, and you
> >> can buy the MXL603 matched pair in a cute case for less bucks than
> >> one C1000.
> >
> > Just a note of caution, MXL603s are wide cardioids and wouldn't be my
> > first choice for an X-Y pair - excellent though they are in other
> > areas.
>
> Point taken. 603s are wide cardiods, but the meaning of that fact varies
> with the details of the situation. I seem to tend toward wide cardiods and
> omnis. On balance, there is still a big difference between wide cardiods
and
> the omnis I use. I'm planning to do some X-Ying with 603s.

I couldn't get much of a stereo image at all with two 603s' in XY, but ORTF
worked pretty well.

-jw

[Wayne]

>
>"LJM" > wrote in message
nk.net
>> Ed Lowenstein wrote:
>
>>> I do home recording of acoustic guitar and voice. I already own an
>>> AKG C1000S and have gotten some good results using an X-Y
>>> configuration with a friend's SM 57. If I'm going to get a second
>>> mike to do my own X-Y and have a better vocal mike than the AKG
>>> C1000S, how about the Rode NT1A??? Any other thoughts for this use.
>>> Thanks much.
>>> ---> Ed

Sell the C1000 and go get two AKG C535EB's, they're great small condenser's.
Can be used on just about anything including vocals, live or studio.

They're a good investment 'cause you can always use them somewhere.


--Wayne

-"sounded good to me"-

[Chris Hornbeck]

On Wed, 21 Jul 2004 17:15:39 +1000, "Richard Freeman"
> wrote:

>why ????

My not-vast experience is that many musicians will
insist on them. Even folks who *should* know better.

Something about the ball on the end makes them feel
comfortable about playing into it off-axis. I've
given up talking to trombonists anyway.

Chris Hornbeck

[Richard Freeman]

"Chris Hornbeck" > wrote in message
...
> On Wed, 21 Jul 2004 17:15:39 +1000, "Richard Freeman"
> > wrote:
>
> >why ????
>
> My not-vast experience is that many musicians will
> insist on them. Even folks who *should* know better.

While I would say that this used to be True - I have a bunch of PL80's and
have long Preferred them to SM58's I have found that of Recent years
Vocalists have become more accepting of Decent quality alternatives -
Obviously if you turn up with a bunch of Radio shack Mics they will turn up
their Nose but I always found that with the PL80s all it usually took was a
bit of Snob factor/Contempt and I could talk the Singer round .... ;-).

>
> Something about the ball on the end makes them feel
> comfortable about playing into it off-axis. I've
> given up talking to trombonists anyway.

Your bugbear is Trombonists mine has been Charity Gigs ....

It has been Ironic that it was always the talent in the Charity/freebie Gigs
who complained bitterly, The Pros were Generally much more accepting of
having a decent Mic in front of them.

Just as it has always been the charity/Freebie Gigs where the Organiser has
been complaining about this, that and the Other thing Whereas the
Professionals have always appreciated a good Job and been the easiest to
keep Happy.
Needless to say I no longer do freebies ....

Regards
Richard Freeman

[Chris Hornbeck]

On Thu, 22 Jul 2004 11:41:24 +1000, "Richard Freeman"
> wrote:

>Your bugbear is Trombonists mine has been Charity Gigs ....
>
>It has been Ironic that it was always the talent in the Charity/freebie Gigs
>who complained bitterly, The Pros were Generally much more accepting of
>having a decent Mic in front of them.

I think you've hit the nail on the head. A real pro makes everything
look easy and everybody look good.

Actually I blame myself for problems interacting with pickup
Big Bands. If a sax player *demonstrates* for me the contortions
he'll have to make to take his solo into an SM57, but feels
OK with an SM58, it's my fault for not giving the right vibe.

I'm older than most of these guys, it's "my" theater, etc. so
there really aren't any excuses. But I'm learning (OJT!).

Chris Hornbeck

[Roger W. Norman]

I don't know, bud. When I do jobs, it's my stage, and the band is there to
play. If it were their stage, well, then they'd sound like it was their
stage, big band or whatever. I will say that the only way I'll relinquish
the stage to a big band is if there's absolutely NO miking of instruments
and then they actually have to play like a band.

But I've almost never run into professionals that question what I put in
front of them, although I did have one guy ask "so what do you have, a
Mackie" and I dropped out of professional mode and said "**** no, I've got a
Crest". Suddenly I felt stupider.

Mics don't seem to be a point of contention in most circumstances, but I've
had a couple of musicians demand that I put up a "lesser" mic than I had for
them because they "knew" the mic. Of course, it means they don't know much
about the signal chain because I could put their most precious mic through
an ART mic pre and they'd still think it sounded better than a Neumann 105
through the Crest, but hey, it's psychological, not technical. Much easier
to acquiesce and do the job than complain about them missing out on using
the right mic for the job. The art of the job is doing the job while making
the musicians think that they are the ones in control. And being able to
respond to problems at light speed.

--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio

"Chris Hornbeck" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 22 Jul 2004 11:41:24 +1000, "Richard Freeman"
> > wrote:
>
> >Your bugbear is Trombonists mine has been Charity Gigs ....
> >
> >It has been Ironic that it was always the talent in the Charity/freebie
Gigs
> >who complained bitterly, The Pros were Generally much more accepting of
> >having a decent Mic in front of them.
>
> I think you've hit the nail on the head. A real pro makes everything
> look easy and everybody look good.
>
> Actually I blame myself for problems interacting with pickup
> Big Bands. If a sax player *demonstrates* for me the contortions
> he'll have to make to take his solo into an SM57, but feels
> OK with an SM58, it's my fault for not giving the right vibe.
>
> I'm older than most of these guys, it's "my" theater, etc. so
> there really aren't any excuses. But I'm learning (OJT!).
>
> Chris Hornbeck

[ThePaulThomas]

david > wrote in message >...
> Somebody ****ing on the invaluable sm57 isn't someone I'd be listening
> to for microphone advice.

Are you serious? The original post mentioned the C1000S and the SM-57
for a particular application and then asked for suggestions for other
mic's. The MXL-603 was later mentioned and that's the post he
responded to. Given the application and the three microphones
mentioned at that point I hardly think that he was "****ing on" the
SM57 just for the sake of ****ing on something.