track clicks on authored CD

[Robert Morein]

I've authored some CD's from original material.
When the tracks are played in the editor, or WMP, there's no problem.
However, the authored CD's have a loud click at the beginning of each track,
even though the tracks start with near silence.
I would have thought that there would be a function to enforce a
zero-crossing transition at the start of the track, but this does not appear
to be the case with the program I use, Sound Forge 4.5.

Do other audio programs offer forced zero crossing at the start of a file,
as an effect, or is this problem best solved with a fade?

[TonyP]

"Robert Morein" > wrote in message
...
> I've authored some CD's from original material.
> When the tracks are played in the editor, or WMP, there's no problem.
> However, the authored CD's have a loud click at the beginning of each
track,
> even though the tracks start with near silence.
> I would have thought that there would be a function to enforce a
> zero-crossing transition at the start of the track, but this does not
appear
> to be the case with the program I use, Sound Forge 4.5.

If your using SF 4.5 to burn the CD, then that's your problem. It can only
do Track At Once, which can cause clicks. Try burning an audio CD with NERO
or similar burning program that can do Disk At Once. Sony/SF have a program
called CD Architect that will do CD mastering and DAO burning.

TonyP.

[James Perrett]

TonyP wrote:
>
> "Robert Morein" > wrote in message
> ...
> > I've authored some CD's from original material.
> > When the tracks are played in the editor, or WMP, there's no problem.
> > However, the authored CD's have a loud click at the beginning of each
> track,
> > even though the tracks start with near silence.
> > I would have thought that there would be a function to enforce a
> > zero-crossing transition at the start of the track, but this does not
> appear
> > to be the case with the program I use, Sound Forge 4.5.
>
> If your using SF 4.5 to burn the CD, then that's your problem. It can only
> do Track At Once, which can cause clicks. Try burning an audio CD with NERO
> or similar burning program that can do Disk At Once. Sony/SF have a program
> called CD Architect that will do CD mastering and DAO burning.
>
> TonyP.

Feurio would also be a good choice for burning audio CD's on a budget.
You should also avoid storing any extra information in the .wav file
header (like track title and artist information or cue lists) as some
software doesn't handle all the optional header fields properly.

Cheers.

James.

[Powell]

"Robert Morein" wrote

> I've authored some CD's from original material.
> When the tracks are played in the editor, or WMP, there's no problem.
> However, the authored CD's have a loud click at the beginning of each
track,
> even though the tracks start with near silence.
> I would have thought that there would be a function to enforce a
> zero-crossing transition at the start of the track, but this does not
appear
> to be the case with the program I use, Sound Forge 4.5.
>
In SF 6 & 7: Options/preferences/editing tab. Make
zero-crossing settings. SF 4.5 is a W95 platform, so
you many not have these same options.


> Do other audio programs offer forced zero crossing at the start of a file,
> as an effect, or is this problem best solved with a fade?
>
CD Architect.

[Peter Larsen]

James Perrett wrote:

> Feurio would also be a good choice for burning audio CD's

Yes.

> on a budget.

It is plain good and it is very cheap considering what it offers. It
does have a learning curve ... because it offers so much.

> James.


Kind regards

Peter Larsen

--
*******************************************
* My site is at: http://www.muyiovatki.dk *
*******************************************

[Robert Morein]

"The Milkman" > wrote in message
...
> "TonyP" > wrote:
>
> >> I've authored some CD's from original material.
> >> When the tracks are played in the editor, or WMP, there's no problem.
> >> However, the authored CD's have a loud click at the beginning of each
> >track,
> >> even though the tracks start with near silence.
> >> I would have thought that there would be a function to enforce a
> >> zero-crossing transition at the start of the track, but this does not
> >appear
> >> to be the case with the program I use, Sound Forge 4.5.
> >
> >If your using SF 4.5 to burn the CD, then that's your problem. It can
only
> >do Track At Once, which can cause clicks. Try burning an audio CD with
NERO
> >or similar burning program that can do Disk At Once. Sony/SF have a
program
> >called CD Architect that will do CD mastering and DAO burning.
>
> Yep.. sounds like a TAO problem.
>
> EAC has a built in CD writing, and it's free. CD Architect is very
> nice if you want to master the CD (levelling, crossfades, trimming
> etc) rather than just burning tracks straight. The user interface is
> great.
>
It definitely is the burner app. I burned a disk with WMP 10 and there were
no clicks.

I was using NTI CD Maker. It seems both versions 5 & 6 do not strip the wav
headers. I wonder how they get away with that?

I burned the tracks using WMP 10 and there were no clicks.
EAC isn't a good fit for what I need to do, which is pack multiple CDs with
a lot of little clips. I have to shuffle as I work, and EAC does not have
the WYSIWYG facility to shuffle the tracks on a CD.

CD Architect is, unfortunately, very expensive for the small amount of work
I have to do.

[TonyP]

"The Milkman" > wrote in message
...
> Don't know what you mean?
> What have wav headers got to do with burning CDs?

If the headers are burned as music data, there could be problems.

> Keep an eye out for an older version. Here's one that went for few $.

Be careful of old versions of CD Architect. It didn't support most IDE
drives until recently. The drives it did support are mostly obsolete.

TonyP.

[Lionel]

Robert Morein wrote:
> "The Milkman" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>"TonyP" > wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>I've authored some CD's from original material.
>>>>When the tracks are played in the editor, or WMP, there's no problem.
>>>>However, the authored CD's have a loud click at the beginning of each
>>>
>>>track,
>>>
>>>>even though the tracks start with near silence.
>>>>I would have thought that there would be a function to enforce a
>>>>zero-crossing transition at the start of the track, but this does not
>>>
>>>appear
>>>
>>>>to be the case with the program I use, Sound Forge 4.5.
>>>
>>>If your using SF 4.5 to burn the CD, then that's your problem. It can
>
> only
>
>>>do Track At Once, which can cause clicks. Try burning an audio CD with
>
> NERO
>
>>>or similar burning program that can do Disk At Once. Sony/SF have a
>
> program
>
>>>called CD Architect that will do CD mastering and DAO burning.
>>
>>Yep.. sounds like a TAO problem.
>>
>>EAC has a built in CD writing, and it's free. CD Architect is very
>>nice if you want to master the CD (levelling, crossfades, trimming
>>etc) rather than just burning tracks straight. The user interface is
>>great.
>>
>
> It definitely is the burner app. I burned a disk with WMP 10 and there were
> no clicks.
>
> I was using NTI CD Maker. It seems both versions 5 & 6 do not strip the wav
> headers. I wonder how they get away with that?

Don't search futher. I am testing NTI Cd 6.5 and I have exactly the same
problem, a "clac !" at the transition between 2 tracks, it's horrible.
The problem occurs on compilations only.



> I burned the tracks using WMP 10 and there were no clicks.
> EAC isn't a good fit for what I need to do, which is pack multiple CDs with
> a lot of little clips. I have to shuffle as I work, and EAC does not have
> the WYSIWYG facility to shuffle the tracks on a CD.
>
> CD Architect is, unfortunately, very expensive for the small amount of work
> I have to do.

[Robert Morein]

"Lionel" > wrote in message
...
> Robert Morein wrote:
> > "The Milkman" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >
> >>"TonyP" > wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>>I've authored some CD's from original material.
> >>>>When the tracks are played in the editor, or WMP, there's no problem.
> >>>>However, the authored CD's have a loud click at the beginning of each
> >>>
> >>>track,
> >>>
> >>>>even though the tracks start with near silence.
> >>>>I would have thought that there would be a function to enforce a
> >>>>zero-crossing transition at the start of the track, but this does not
> >>>
> >>>appear
> >>>
> >>>>to be the case with the program I use, Sound Forge 4.5.
> >>>
> >>>If your using SF 4.5 to burn the CD, then that's your problem. It can
> >
> > only
> >
> >>>do Track At Once, which can cause clicks. Try burning an audio CD with
> >
> > NERO
> >
> >>>or similar burning program that can do Disk At Once. Sony/SF have a
> >
> > program
> >
> >>>called CD Architect that will do CD mastering and DAO burning.
> >>
> >>Yep.. sounds like a TAO problem.
> >>
> >>EAC has a built in CD writing, and it's free. CD Architect is very
> >>nice if you want to master the CD (levelling, crossfades, trimming
> >>etc) rather than just burning tracks straight. The user interface is
> >>great.
> >>
> >
> > It definitely is the burner app. I burned a disk with WMP 10 and there
were
> > no clicks.
> >
> > I was using NTI CD Maker. It seems both versions 5 & 6 do not strip the
wav
> > headers. I wonder how they get away with that?
>
> Don't search futher. I am testing NTI Cd 6.5 and I have exactly the same
> problem, a "clac !" at the transition between 2 tracks, it's horrible.
> The problem occurs on compilations only.
>
>
Lionel,
It could be that NTI does not put your recorder into "disk at once
mode", silently substituting "track at once". I'm going to try it with a
newer drive by Plextor.

The other possible explanation is that it doesn't strip the wav headers.
There is a free utility to do that.

[Robert Morein]

"The Milkman" > wrote in message
...
> "Robert Morein" > wrote:
>
> >> Don't search futher. I am testing NTI Cd 6.5 and I have exactly the
same
> >> problem, a "clac !" at the transition between 2 tracks, it's horrible.
> >> The problem occurs on compilations only.
> >>
> >>
> >Lionel,
> > It could be that NTI does not put your recorder into "disk at once
> >mode", silently substituting "track at once". I'm going to try it with a
> >newer drive by Plextor.
> >
> > The other possible explanation is that it doesn't strip the wav
headers.
> >There is a free utility to do that.
>
> It would be moronic if a commercial CD burning application burned the
> headers. When looking at the PCM data in a .wav file the start
> position, and length, are indicated exactly. OK sometimes you may come
> across unexpected bespoke headers (eg. copyright information, fancy
> graphics etc), and these can occur before or after the sound data, but
> you just parse each header and skip the ones you're not interested in.
>
> The .wav file could be corrupted, but TAO mode is the most likely
> culprit...
>
The wav files are not corrupted, because WMP10 burns them perfectly.
What's left is TAO.