Multitrack soundcards and their respective software

[Cassandra Hemer]

Hi all! This is my first post to rec.audio.pro, although I've been
reading for about a month.

I'm currently studying music at university and I wish to pursue
engineering as my career.

I want to buy my own multitrack interface for use at home, and I'm
looking at Digi002 Rack or MOTU 896HD. We use DigiDesign stuff at
school, and I'm used to working with ProTools on Mac. My system at
home is PC. Some professors warned me that other software which might
be bundled with MOTU or other cards (software like Cubase or Sonar),
are not quite as intuitive or powerful as ProTools and that I should
consider this. One student suggested to me stick with ProTools as it
is industry standard, incase I want to take anything I record to
another studio. Taking projects between home and school is not a
great concern, as we do most of that work in groups during school
time. I was leaning towards the 896HD because of 4 extra mic pre's.

So my question, and sorry it took so long to get to it, is...

Are these other packages for PC really so horrible? I've heard
extreme opinions both fore and against. Must I use ProTools if I want
to take my project to some professional studio? Surely there is a
convertor software of some sort? And do you think it is silly to
purchase a multitrack soundcard based on how many mic pre's it has? I
need 8 to record drums, but I was suggested by a shop attendant to buy
Delta 1010 and a Mackie 14-channel analog mixer for this?

I know these types of questions are boring and common... I tried to
get my answers by searching the forums, and also investigating by
myself at stores... but this is all my spare money, I hope you
understand I am scared to make a mistake!

Any help is greatly appreciated, but I understand if you ignore me :)

Thank you!

Cass

[Mike Rivers]

In article > writes:

> My system at
> home is PC. Some professors warned me that other software which might
> be bundled with MOTU or other cards (software like Cubase or Sonar),
> are not quite as intuitive or powerful as ProTools and that I should
> consider this. One student suggested to me stick with ProTools as it
> is industry standard, incase I want to take anything I record to
> another studio.

He's right in that ProTools is an industry standard, but it's not that
hard to move basic tracks from one system to another. What's difficult
or impossible is to move edited or processed tracks without rendering
because there are no industry-wide standards for how edit transistions
are done, or for control of processing software. However, plenty of
good work gets done on systems other than ProTools, and if you're an
impoverished college student, being able to save $500 and have the
capability to record at home is a good thing.

> Are these other packages for PC really so horrible? I've heard
> extreme opinions both fore and against.

Of course not. They all have a significant learning curve, and they're
all different. There's little that you learn about ProTools other than
the basic concept of how it works that you'll be able to apply to
Cubase or Sonar or whatever, and vice versa. But once you understand
how DAWs work, you'll be able to translate between their vocabularies
pretty easily. (For instance I don't think any of them use the term
"rendered" but they all do it) There are plenty of tools available for
non-ProTools systems - not all exactly the same, but there are
compressors, reverbs, equalizers, and amplifier simulators, and weird
and crazy delay effects. What more could you want other than the name?

> Must I use ProTools if I want
> to take my project to some professional studio? Surely there is a
> convertor software of some sort?

Depends on what you want to do there. Sometimees it's easiest just to
carry your computer over there and show the engineer where the
"Record button" is.

> And do you think it is silly to
> purchase a multitrack soundcard based on how many mic pre's it has? I
> need 8 to record drums, but I was suggested by a shop attendant to buy
> Delta 1010 and a Mackie 14-channel analog mixer for this?

I would recommend that approach since it's a lot more flexible to use
a mixer or outboard preamps than to depend on built-in preamps. And
depending on what you get, it could sound better. Also, having a mixer
allows you a lot more flexibility for monitoring when you're
overdubbing, plus it eliminates "latency" because you can send the
signal you're recording direct to the headphones without making a
round trip through the computer. However, be aware that the Mackie
1402 VLZ Pro "14-channel" mixer only has six mic inputs. That might
not be enough for you. You can add a couple more outboard preamps if
you need them.

There are endless options and you're smart to do some shopping in
stores to get a sense of what's out there.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

[Geoff Wood]

Cassandra Hemer wrote:

> home is PC. Some professors warned me that other software which might
> be bundled with MOTU or other cards (software like Cubase or Sonar),
> are not quite as intuitive or powerful as ProTools and that I should
> consider this. One student suggested to me stick with ProTools as it
> is industry standard, incase I want to take anything I record to
> another studio.

"bundled' apps are often cut-down versions of stand-alone applications.
Most are the equal of, and some far superior to ProTools.

> Are these other packages for PC really so horrible?

No. But don't even bother to try convincing those who subscribe to the mac
or Digidesign religons.

>I've heard
> extreme opinions both fore and against. Must I use ProTools if I want
> to take my project to some professional studio?

No, but (unfortuantely) it actually *is* an industry standard.

> convertor software of some sort? And do you think it is silly to
> purchase a multitrack soundcard based on how many mic pre's it has? I
> need 8 to record drums, but I was suggested by a shop attendant to buy
> Delta 1010 and a Mackie 14-channel analog mixer for this?

That's along the lines of my preference for the way of doing things. If you
want your rig to be portable, make sure you soundcard system has drivers for
both worlds. MOTU certainly do.

> Any help is greatly appreciated, but I understand if you ignore me :)

Blank ......


geoff

[Paul Stamler]

There's plenty of stuff out there that will do the same things PT will do,
at a lower price, and without tying you to their hardware, which is mostly,
from what I gather, mediocre until you get to the really expensive stuff. A
really inexpensive way to get your feet wet is n-track studio, which I think
goes for $69 these days and will work with any PC hardware. It has lots of
flexibility although its interface is a little clunky, it'll take both
Direct-X and VST plug-ins, and makes very nice recordings. For a little more
cash (list I think is $299, street price less) Adobe Audition is less clunky
and sounds even better to my ears (better summing or dither algorithms?),
although it won't take VSTs. I concur with Mike: go for an interface that's
line-level multitrack, and external pres. You'll probably get
better-sounding results, and you'll certainly have a lot more flexibility. A
Mackie is a good starting point, but get one with enough inputs, and work
from the channel inserts direct to your line-level interface.

My $.02. Oh, and n-track studio uses the term "rendering" too.

Peace,
Paul

[anthony.gosnell]

"Cassandra Hemer" > wrote

> Are these other packages for PC really so horrible? I've heard
> extreme opinions both fore and against. Must I use ProTools if I want
> to take my project to some professional studio?

Don't believe that professional studios only use ProTools. Studios use a
lot of different software and you are more likely to need to transfer your
files to someone with Sonar or Cubase. Even if you get the right brand you
will probably find that they don't have the same plugins as you or they have
a different version.

Buy the card and software that look the best to you.

--
Anthony Gosnell

to reply remove nospam.

[Geoff Wood]

anthony.gosnell wrote:
> "Cassandra Hemer" > wrote
>
>> Are these other packages for PC really so horrible? I've heard
>> extreme opinions both fore and against. Must I use ProTools if I
>> want to take my project to some professional studio?
>
> Don't believe that professional studios only use ProTools.

The other lie is that "creative people only use Apple computers". This was
a theory purposefully nutured along the same lines as Yamaha NS10s - though
there is nothing actually *wrong* with Apple computers per se.

geoff

[EggHd]

<< The other lie is that "creative people only use Apple computers". >>

I have never heard that.




---------------------------------------
"I know enough to know I don't know enough"

[Geoff Wood]

EggHd wrote:
> << The other lie is that "creative people only use Apple computers".
> >>
>
> I have never heard that.


I've been told that (in not so many words) in the context of music,
graphics, publishing, and creative writing.


geoff

[hank alrich]

EggHd wrote:

> << The other lie is that "creative people only use Apple computers". >>

> I have never heard that.

<j>

I thini it's misstated.

"Only creative people use Apple computers".

</j>

--
ha

[EggHd]

<< I've been told that (in not so many words) in the context of music,
graphics, publishing, and creative writing. >>

I hear that some apps a Mac "works better" but not the type of people.



---------------------------------------
"I know enough to know I don't know enough"

[Roger W. Norman]

Yep, it was the Jeff Goldblum ads, IIRC.

But I guess there's nothing really wrong with a Mac, and as long is one is
already used to buying proprietary products, they might as well go along
with Pro Tools. At least it's a minimal number of companies one has to
point a finger at when something doesn't go right.

--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio

"hank alrich" > wrote in message
. ..
> EggHd wrote:
>
> > << The other lie is that "creative people only use Apple computers". >>
>
> > I have never heard that.
>
> <j>
>
> I thini it's misstated.
>
> "Only creative people use Apple computers".
>
> </j>
>
> --
> ha

[Cassandra Hemer]

Thank you all for your input!

I've decided to go with a MOTU 828mkII, Behringer UB2442FX and Alesis
M1 Actives.

That way I can at least get started, and if the Behringer mixer is as
horrid as some people report, I can upgrade when I can afford it!

Thanks again for your replies.

Cass

[Geoff Wood]

Cassandra Hemer wrote:
> Thank you all for your input!
>
> I've decided to go with a MOTU 828mkII, Behringer UB2442FX and Alesis
> M1 Actives.
>
> That way I can at least get started, and if the Behringer mixer is as
> horrid as some people report, I can upgrade when I can afford it!
>
> Thanks again for your replies.


Go for it mama !

You may be intersted in email list.
Controlled membership(no spammers/miners).

cheers

geoff