Do frozen trumpets sound better?

[clamnebula]

Kind of ice blue?
-Neb

---Original Message---
In Tuesday's (11/18) New York Times, Terry Schwadron reports that two Tufts
University engineering researchers have conducted a study "rebutting a popular
myth among some trumpet players that deep-freezing the instruments will change
the sound for the better. Rather, they told the Acoustical Society of America
meeting in Austin, Tex., that scientific testing of cryogenically freezing ten
trumpets showed minimal differences when the instruments were thawed and played
by six musicians."

The research involved trumpeters "ranging in skill from a former high school
musician to a New England Conservatory player to a member of the Boston Symphony
Orchestra." Still, Schwadron quotes a retailer, Wayne Tanabe, who continues to
offer cryogenic freezing in a tank "where he can fit a tuba and several
trumpets. His freeze technique costs about $200 and takes 35 to 50 hours. As Mr.
Tanabe explains it, cryogenics accelerates what seems to happen to brass
instruments as they age," resulting in "a difference in ease of playing and in
the range of 'color' in the tone."

------------------------------

[John L Rice]

"clamnebula" > wrote in message
.. .
> Kind of ice blue?
> -Neb
>
> ---Original Message---
> In Tuesday's (11/18) New York Times, Terry Schwadron reports that two
Tufts
> University engineering researchers have conducted a study "rebutting a
popular
> myth among some trumpet players that deep-freezing the instruments will
change
> the sound for the better. Rather, they told the Acoustical Society of
America
> meeting in Austin, Tex., that scientific testing of cryogenically freezing
ten
> trumpets showed minimal differences when the instruments were thawed and
played
> by six musicians."
>
> The research involved trumpeters "ranging in skill from a former high
school
> musician to a New England Conservatory player to a member of the Boston
Symphony
> Orchestra." Still, Schwadron quotes a retailer, Wayne Tanabe, who
continues to
> offer cryogenic freezing in a tank "where he can fit a tuba and several
> trumpets. His freeze technique costs about $200 and takes 35 to 50 hours.
As Mr.
> Tanabe explains it, cryogenics accelerates what seems to happen to brass
> instruments as they age," resulting in "a difference in ease of playing
and in
> the range of 'color' in the tone."
>
> ------------------------------
>


I bet that guy offers CD degaussing too . . .

John L Rice

[Steven Sena]

I thought it was the musicians who got frozen...?
DOH...!

--
Steven Sena
XS Sound
www.xssound.com


"clamnebula" > wrote in message
.. .
> Kind of ice blue?
> -Neb
>
> ---Original Message---
> In Tuesday's (11/18) New York Times, Terry Schwadron reports that two
Tufts
> University engineering researchers have conducted a study "rebutting a
popular
> myth among some trumpet players that deep-freezing the instruments will
change
> the sound for the better. Rather, they told the Acoustical Society of
America
> meeting in Austin, Tex., that scientific testing of cryogenically freezing
ten
> trumpets showed minimal differences when the instruments were thawed and
played
> by six musicians."
>
> The research involved trumpeters "ranging in skill from a former high
school
> musician to a New England Conservatory player to a member of the Boston
Symphony
> Orchestra." Still, Schwadron quotes a retailer, Wayne Tanabe, who
continues to
> offer cryogenic freezing in a tank "where he can fit a tuba and several
> trumpets. His freeze technique costs about $200 and takes 35 to 50 hours.
As Mr.
> Tanabe explains it, cryogenics accelerates what seems to happen to brass
> instruments as they age," resulting in "a difference in ease of playing
and in
> the range of 'color' in the tone."
>
> ------------------------------
>
>

[Dave]

Still, Schwadron quotes a retailer, Wayne Tanabe, who
> continues to
> > offer cryogenic freezing in a tank "where he can fit a tuba and several
> > trumpets. His freeze technique costs about $200 and takes 35 to 50
hours.
> As Mr.
> > Tanabe explains it, cryogenics accelerates what seems to happen to brass
> > instruments as they age," resulting in "a difference in ease of playing
> and in
> > the range of 'color' in the tone."
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
>
>
> I bet that guy offers CD degaussing too . . .


Jeez, I hope they let those horns thaw out before they put their lips on
'em! =80

dave

[Chuck]

Naw, old brass musicians just age..........

Chuck
(horn player)

"Steven Sena" > wrote in message
...
> I thought it was the musicians who got frozen...?
> DOH...!
>
> --
> Steven Sena
> XS Sound
> www.xssound.com
>
>
> "clamnebula" > wrote in message
> .. .
> > Kind of ice blue?
> > -Neb
> >
> > ---Original Message---
> > In Tuesday's (11/18) New York Times, Terry Schwadron reports that two
> Tufts
> > University engineering researchers have conducted a study "rebutting a
> popular
> > myth among some trumpet players that deep-freezing the instruments will
> change
> > the sound for the better. Rather, they told the Acoustical Society of
> America
> > meeting in Austin, Tex., that scientific testing of cryogenically
freezing
> ten
> > trumpets showed minimal differences when the instruments were thawed and
> played
> > by six musicians."
> >
> > The research involved trumpeters "ranging in skill from a former high
> school
> > musician to a New England Conservatory player to a member of the Boston
> Symphony
> > Orchestra." Still, Schwadron quotes a retailer, Wayne Tanabe, who
> continues to
> > offer cryogenic freezing in a tank "where he can fit a tuba and several
> > trumpets. His freeze technique costs about $200 and takes 35 to 50
hours.
> As Mr.
> > Tanabe explains it, cryogenics accelerates what seems to happen to brass
> > instruments as they age," resulting in "a difference in ease of playing
> and in
> > the range of 'color' in the tone."
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> >
>
>

[Charles Franklin]

"clamnebula" > wrote in message
.. .
> Kind of ice blue?
> -Neb
>
> ---Original Message---
> In Tuesday's (11/18) New York Times, Terry Schwadron reports that two
Tufts
> University engineering researchers have conducted a study "rebutting a
popular
> myth among some trumpet players that deep-freezing the instruments will
change
> the sound for the better. Rather, they told the Acoustical Society of
America
> meeting in Austin, Tex., that scientific testing of cryogenically freezing
ten
> trumpets showed minimal differences when the instruments were thawed and
played
> by six musicians."
>
> The research involved trumpeters "ranging in skill from a former high
school
> musician to a New England Conservatory player to a member of the Boston
Symphony
> Orchestra." Still, Schwadron quotes a retailer, Wayne Tanabe, who
continues to
> offer cryogenic freezing in a tank "where he can fit a tuba and several
> trumpets. His freeze technique costs about $200 and takes 35 to 50 hours.
As Mr.
> Tanabe explains it, cryogenics accelerates what seems to happen to brass
> instruments as they age," resulting in "a difference in ease of playing
and in
> the range of 'color' in the tone."
>
> ------------------------------
>
>
>
That's a 'new' trend with audiophiles, 'freezing' tubes, cables, etc.

Here's a couple of threads from Head-Fi, a headphone forum on the subject.

This guy has had good results with tubes:
http://www4.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=49910

And a general discussion here:
http://www4.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=14750&highlight=frozen+tubes

[dt king]

"clamnebula" > wrote in message
.. .
> Kind of ice blue?
> -Neb
>
> ---Original Message---
> the sound for the better. Rather, they told the Acoustical Society of
America
> meeting in Austin, Tex., that scientific testing of cryogenically
freezing ten
> trumpets showed minimal differences when the instruments were thawed and
played
> by six musicians."

"Minimal differences" is significant. How many audiophiles pay tens of
thousands of dollars for minimal differences? I think what they were
looking for was "no difference".

dtk

[Carey Carlan]

"Steven Sena" > wrote in
:

> I thought it was the musicians who got frozen...?
> DOH...!

Only during football games.

[Mike Rivers]

In article > writes:

> In Tuesday's (11/18) New York Times, Terry Schwadron reports that two Tufts
> University engineering researchers have conducted a study "rebutting a popular
> myth among some trumpet players that deep-freezing the instruments will change
> the sound for the better.

What took them so long, or is this old news just recently reported? I
remember a NAMM show several years, where someone was peddling
cryogenic treating of brass instruments. I seem to recall that he was
doing just the mouthpiece rather than the whole instrument, but his
claims were for significant improvements.



--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

[William Sommerwerck]

If the freezing process significantly alters the metal's "structure," then it
might very well produce audible changes in the instrument's timbre.

[Willie K.Yee, M.D.]

>---Original Message---
>In Tuesday's (11/18) New York Times, Terry Schwadron reports that two Tufts
>University engineering researchers have conducted a study "rebutting a popular
>myth among some trumpet players that deep-freezing the instruments will change
>the sound for the better.

There have been a few reports from archtop guitar players that after
their instument got dropped (usually while inside a hard shell case)
or knocked over, the sound significantly improved. I guess the theory
is that it relieves stress built up between different wooden parts as
they aged.

Maybe I could set up a business, charge $200, and drop people's
guitars on the floor.

Then somebody could spend $75,000 of university or taxpayers money
showing it to be not helpful.

Seems to be everybody wins.
Willie K. Yee, M.D. http://users.bestweb.net/~wkyee
Developer of Problem Knowledge Couplers for Psychiatry http://www.pkc.com
Webmaster and Guitarist for the Big Blue Big Band http://www.bigbluebigband.org

[Geoff Wood]

"clamnebula" > wrote in message
.. .
> Kind of ice blue?
> -Neb
>
> ---Original Message---
> In Tuesday's (11/18) New York Times, Terry Schwadron reports that two
Tufts
> University engineering researchers have conducted a study "rebutting a
popular
> myth among some trumpet players that deep-freezing the instruments will
change
> the sound for the better.

Imagine the blood when they player tries to rip his frozen-on lips off the
mouthpiece ...


geoff

[Geoff Wood]

"Chuck" > wrote in message
news:2XWvb.212073$9E1.1139607@attbi_s52...
> Naw, old brass musicians just age..........

Some tarnish ....


geoff

[anthony.gosnell]

"Willie K.Yee, M.D." > wrote
> There have been a few reports from archtop guitar players that after
> their instument got dropped (usually while inside a hard shell case)
> or knocked over, the sound significantly improved. I guess the theory
> is that it relieves stress built up between different wooden parts as
> they aged.
>
> Maybe I could set up a business, charge $200, and drop people's
> guitars on the floor.

Just make sure that your business is well insured.

--
Anthony Gosnell

to reply remove nospam.

[Tony Elka]

In article >, Geoff Wood
-nospam> wrote:

> Imagine the blood when they player tries to rip his frozen-on lips off the
> mouthpiece ...



I wasn't expecting the Spanish Inquisition.

Tony

[William Sommerwerck]

>> Imagine the blood when they player tries to rip his
>> frozen-on lips off the mouthpiece ...

> I wasn't expecting the Spanish Inquisition.

NO ONE expects the Spanish Inquisition...!

[Tony Elka]

In article >, William Sommerwerck
> wrote:

> >> Imagine the blood when they player tries to rip his
> >> frozen-on lips off the mouthpiece ...
>
> > I wasn't expecting the Spanish Inquisition.
>
> NO ONE expects the Spanish Inquisition...!


Their chief weapon is surprise.

[William Sommerwerck]

>>>> Imagine the blood when they player tries
>>>> to rip his frozen-on lips off the mouthpiece...

>>> I wasn't expecting the Spanish Inquisition.

>> NO ONE expects the Spanish Inquisition...!

> Their chief weapon is surprise.

Surprise and a fundamental understanding of the laws of metallurgy...

Their TWO chief weapons are surprise, surprise and a fundamental understanding
of the laws of metallurgy, and a belief in the usefulness of subjective
evaluation...

[Artie Turner]

Tony Elka wrote:
> In article >, William Sommerwerck
> > wrote:
>
>
>>>>Imagine the blood when they player tries to rip his
>>>>frozen-on lips off the mouthpiece ...
>>
>>>I wasn't expecting the Spanish Inquisition.
>>
>>NO ONE expects the Spanish Inquisition...!
>
>
>
> Their chief weapon is surprise.

Surprise and fear!

AT

[Kendall]

"William Sommerwerck" > wrote in message
...
> >>>> Imagine the blood when they player tries
> >>>> to rip his frozen-on lips off the mouthpiece...
>
> >>> I wasn't expecting the Spanish Inquisition.
>
> >> NO ONE expects the Spanish Inquisition...!
>
> > Their chief weapon is surprise.
>
> Surprise and a fundamental understanding of the laws of metallurgy...
>
> Their TWO chief weapons are surprise, surprise and a fundamental
understanding
> of the laws of metallurgy, and a belief in the usefulness of subjective
> evaluation...
>

Y'know, I sometimes wonder what somebody would make of a post like this,
were they not familiar with the source material....

--
Kendall

[Geoff Wood]

"William Sommerwerck" > wrote in message
...
> >>>> Imagine the blood when they player tries
> >>>> to rip his frozen-on lips off the mouthpiece...
>
> >>> I wasn't expecting the Spanish Inquisition.
>
> >> NO ONE expects the Spanish Inquisition...!
>
> > Their chief weapon is surprise.
>
> Surprise and a fundamental understanding of the laws of metallurgy...
>
> Their TWO chief weapons are surprise, surprise and a fundamental
understanding
> of the laws of metallurgy, and a belief in the usefulness of subjective
> evaluation...

Is it oxygen-free brass ?

geoff

[Eric Toline]

OTOH Cryogenic treatment of rifle barrels has shown to produce created
greater accuracy.

Apparently the freezing process does something to the molecular
structure of the barrel that enhances it's performance.

Eric

[Arny Krueger]

"William Sommerwerck" > wrote in message

>>>>> Imagine the blood when they player tries
>>>>> to rip his frozen-on lips off the mouthpiece...
>
>>>> I wasn't expecting the Spanish Inquisition.
>
>>> NO ONE expects the Spanish Inquisition...!
>
>> Their chief weapon is surprise.

> Surprise and a fundamental understanding of the laws of metallurgy...

Which laws of metallurgy do you think apply here?

> Their TWO chief weapons are surprise, surprise and a fundamental
> understanding of the laws of metallurgy, and a belief in the
> usefulness of subjective evaluation...

Would this be true subjective evaluation, or sighted evaluation?

[Scott Porter]

"Geoff Wood" -nospam> wrote in message
...
> Imagine the blood when they player tries to rip his frozen-on lips off the
> mouthpiece ...
>
>
> geoff


D'oh. I played euphonium in high school marching band in Wisconsin. Been
there, don't have to imagine it!

-Scott

[Ryan Mitchley]

I'd love to know how they would prove that any changes aren't due solely to
the reaction that I imagine most players would have when sticking their lips
against a frozen instrument.

Ryan

[dwgriffi]

I've still can't get a horn player to let me test the green magic marker
enhancement.

--
Raindances always worked because they didn't stop dancing until it rained.



To reply, please remove the 555 from the return address

[littledog]

Anybody seen Ted Williams in there?

[Ryan Mitchley]

Oh, whoops - I should have read that properly . . .

[[email protected]]

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On 2003-11-24 said:
>> Imagine the blood when they player tries to rip his frozen-on
>>lips off the mouthpiece ...
>D'oh. I played euphonium in high school marching band in Wisconsin.
>Been there, don't have to imagine it!
I played trumpet in Iowa in high school marching band. Used to keep
my mouthpiece in my pocket and only atach it to the horn when drummers
did the roll off to start playing. Only way to go when you're
marching in the Christmas parade <g>.




Richard Webb
Electric Spider Productions
REplace anything before the @ symbol with elspider for real email

--