1/4" versus 1/8" jacks

[TheKeith]

I'm doing some voice recording for my flash animations and I'm using a shure
sm57 with a midiman mic preamp. I used to feed the 1/4" line out from my mic
preamp to the 1/4" input on my soundblaster's LiveDrive unit (which is
basically an extension of the sound card with 1/4" inputs) -- the problem is
that I just started using it again after about a year and a half and for
some reason can't get it to work. The computer won't recognize it--no matter
how many times I uninstall the drivers and in the device manager and then
reinstall it. Enough rambling on, I went to radio shack today and picked up
a 1/4" stereo to 1/8" stereo adapter and just plugged that right into the
card instead-works fine, but since I have nothing to compare it to, I'm not
sure if it sounds worse than if I had been using the 1/4" ins.

In short, is there that much of a difference between 1/4" and 1/8",
particularly when the cable itself is a 1/4" one; only the plug (1/4" - 1/8"
adapter) is 1/8"? Thanks.

[Mark A]

"TheKeith" > wrote in message
...
> I'm doing some voice recording for my flash animations and I'm using a
shure
> sm57 with a midiman mic preamp. I used to feed the 1/4" line out from my
mic
> preamp to the 1/4" input on my soundblaster's LiveDrive unit (which is
> basically an extension of the sound card with 1/4" inputs) -- the problem
is
> that I just started using it again after about a year and a half and for
> some reason can't get it to work. The computer won't recognize it--no
matter
> how many times I uninstall the drivers and in the device manager and then
> reinstall it. Enough rambling on, I went to radio shack today and picked
up
> a 1/4" stereo to 1/8" stereo adapter and just plugged that right into the
> card instead-works fine, but since I have nothing to compare it to, I'm
not
> sure if it sounds worse than if I had been using the 1/4" ins.
>
> In short, is there that much of a difference between 1/4" and 1/8",
> particularly when the cable itself is a 1/4" one; only the plug (1/4" -
1/8"
> adapter) is 1/8"? Thanks.
>
There is no difference in quality.

[Jerry G.]

The jack and plug type should not change the quality at all.

--

Greetings,

Jerry Greenberg GLG Technologies GLG
=========================================
WebPage http://www.zoom-one.com
Electronics http://www.zoom-one.com/electron.htm
=========================================


"TheKeith" > wrote in message
...
I'm doing some voice recording for my flash animations and I'm using a shure
sm57 with a midiman mic preamp. I used to feed the 1/4" line out from my mic
preamp to the 1/4" input on my soundblaster's LiveDrive unit (which is
basically an extension of the sound card with 1/4" inputs) -- the problem is
that I just started using it again after about a year and a half and for
some reason can't get it to work. The computer won't recognize it--no matter
how many times I uninstall the drivers and in the device manager and then
reinstall it. Enough rambling on, I went to radio shack today and picked up
a 1/4" stereo to 1/8" stereo adapter and just plugged that right into the
card instead-works fine, but since I have nothing to compare it to, I'm not
sure if it sounds worse than if I had been using the 1/4" ins.

In short, is there that much of a difference between 1/4" and 1/8",
particularly when the cable itself is a 1/4" one; only the plug (1/4" - 1/8"
adapter) is 1/8"? Thanks.

[TheKeith]

"Jerry G." > wrote in message
...
> The jack and plug type should not change the quality at all.

great thanks. Just curious--what if I had been using a thinner (made for
1/8" plugs) cable, as opposed to just the jack? Would that have affected the
sound?

[PaulB]

if the cable quality is good and run is short it should not matter. one
thing you may want to use a 1/4" to 1/8" cord instead of just a metal
adaptor. it puts a lot of stress on the 1/8" plug and jack.


"TheKeith" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Jerry G." > wrote in message
> ...
> > The jack and plug type should not change the quality at all.
>
> great thanks. Just curious--what if I had been using a thinner (made for
> 1/8" plugs) cable, as opposed to just the jack? Would that have affected
the
> sound?
>
>

[Mark A]

> > The jack and plug type should not change the quality at all.
>
> great thanks. Just curious--what if I had been using a thinner (made for
> 1/8" plugs) cable, as opposed to just the jack? Would that have affected
the
> sound?
>
The shielding makes more of a difference. Often the thickness of the cable
is mostly due to quality of the shielding.

[Geoff Wood]

"TheKeith" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Jerry G." > wrote in message
> ...
> > The jack and plug type should not change the quality at all.
>
> great thanks. Just curious--what if I had been using a thinner (made for
> 1/8" plugs) cable, as opposed to just the jack? Would that have affected
the
> sound?

Going into a Soundblaster, cable quality is not a factor at all.

geoff

[Mike Rivers]

In article > writes:

> I went to radio shack today and picked up
> a 1/4" stereo to 1/8" stereo adapter and just plugged that right into the
> card instead-works fine, but since I have nothing to compare it to, I'm not
> sure if it sounds worse than if I had been using the 1/4" ins.

It won't sound any different until it falls out, or makes bad contact,
which it eventually will - just like the other one.

Every designer who ever put a 1/8" jack on a piece of equipment should
have a mini plug shoved up his ass with 120 VAC across two of the
terminals. Maybe if he's lucky it won't make good contact.

Equipment should be big enough to have robust connectors to the
outside world. If it has to be small, there are better (though
admittedly more expensive) connectors that could be used.



--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

[Laurence Payne]

On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 12:21:46 +1300, "Geoff Wood"
-nospam> wrote:

>Going into a Soundblaster, cable quality is not a factor at all.

I wouldn't put it QUITE as strongly as that! But you'll have a
pleasant surprise when you lay out surprisingly little cash on a
mixing board and interface to the SB Line in rather than it's crappy
mic in.

CubaseFAQ page www.laurencepayne.co.uk/CubaseFAQ.htm

[Scott Dorsey]

The difference is that 1/8" jacks fail, and 1/4" jacks (long frame
ones anyway) don't. 1/8" jacks fail constantly and should not be
trusted.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Arny Krueger]

"TheKeith" > wrote in message


> I'm doing some voice recording for my flash animations and I'm using
> a shure sm57 with a midiman mic preamp. I used to feed the 1/4" line
> out from my mic preamp to the 1/4" input on my soundblaster's
> LiveDrive unit (which is basically an extension of the sound card
> with 1/4" inputs) -- the problem is that I just started using it
> again after about a year and a half and for some reason can't get it
> to work. The computer won't recognize it--no matter how many times I
> uninstall the drivers and in the device manager and then reinstall
> it. Enough rambling on, I went to radio shack today and picked up a
> 1/4" stereo to 1/8" stereo adapter and just plugged that right into
> the card instead-works fine, but since I have nothing to compare it
> to, I'm not sure if it sounds worse than if I had been using the 1/4"
> ins.

> In short, is there that much of a difference between 1/4" and 1/8",
> particularly when the cable itself is a 1/4" one; only the plug (1/4"
> - 1/8" adapter) is 1/8"? Thanks.

The big problems with 1/8" jacks is that they are delicate and fussy. If you
have a good 1/8 jack and get the plug seated well, the technical performance
for line-level signals is the same as the equivalent 1/4" jack.

IME sticking a 1/4" to 1/8" adaptor plug into an 1/8" jack just exasperates
the already undesirable durability situation. An adaptor cable should be
used instead, because it avoids putting an undue mechanical load on the
jack. 1/8" jacks work best with relatively thin cables. For line-level
signals over a distance of 3 feet or less, thin cables aren't a problem.

[Marc Wielage]

On Fri, 21 Nov 2003 15:59:35 -0800, Mike Rivers wrote
(in message <znr1069452744k@trad>):

> Every designer who ever put a 1/8" jack on a piece of equipment should
> have a mini plug shoved up his ass with 120 VAC across two of the
> terminals.
>--------------------------------snip----------------------------------<

Mike, thanks for the best laugh I had all day! I almost sprayed my computer
screen with Mountain Dew, I laughed so hard...

--MFW

[TheKeith]

Thanks everyone for your advice. I see what some of you mean about the
weight from that extra adapter putting too much stress on the connection.
What I need though is a cable with 2x 1/4" monos on one end and 1x 1/8"
stereo on the other. This particular kind of cable is not easy to find. It
is easy to find y-cables with like-size jacks on both ends but not unlike,
it would seem. I guess a good way to go would be to either to use my 1/8"
male to male stereo cable and connect it to a y-adapter with a stereo 1/8"
jack and 2x 1/4" mono plugs, although I haven't begun to look for this combo
yet either. Since I have soldering skills, another thing I could do is to
just buy the connectors and make my own custom cables.

[George W.]

On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 19:06:59 -0500, TheKeith wrote:

>Thanks everyone for your advice. I see what some of you mean about the
>weight from that extra adapter putting too much stress on the connection.
>What I need though is a cable with 2x 1/4" monos on one end and 1x 1/8"
>stereo on the other. This particular kind of cable is not easy to find.

Hosa makes these in 3 and 10 foot length, CMP-153 and CMP-159.

http://www.hosatech.com/audio_cables_index_3.html

[Mark A]

"TheKeith" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks everyone for your advice. I see what some of you mean about the
> weight from that extra adapter putting too much stress on the connection.
> What I need though is a cable with 2x 1/4" monos on one end and 1x 1/8"
> stereo on the other. This particular kind of cable is not easy to find. It
> is easy to find y-cables with like-size jacks on both ends but not unlike,
> it would seem. I guess a good way to go would be to either to use my 1/8"
> male to male stereo cable and connect it to a y-adapter with a stereo 1/8"
> jack and 2x 1/4" mono plugs, although I haven't begun to look for this
combo
> yet either. Since I have soldering skills, another thing I could do is to
> just buy the connectors and make my own custom cables.
>
You are spending too much time worrying about things you don't need to worry
about.

[TheKeith]

"Mark A" > wrote in message
...
> "TheKeith" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Thanks everyone for your advice. I see what some of you mean about the
> > weight from that extra adapter putting too much stress on the
connection.
> > What I need though is a cable with 2x 1/4" monos on one end and 1x 1/8"
> > stereo on the other. This particular kind of cable is not easy to find.
It
> > is easy to find y-cables with like-size jacks on both ends but not
unlike,
> > it would seem. I guess a good way to go would be to either to use my
1/8"
> > male to male stereo cable and connect it to a y-adapter with a stereo
1/8"
> > jack and 2x 1/4" mono plugs, although I haven't begun to look for this
> combo
> > yet either. Since I have soldering skills, another thing I could do is
to
> > just buy the connectors and make my own custom cables.
> >
> You are spending too much time worrying about things you don't need to
worry
> about.

you're probably right :-)

[Arny Krueger]

"TheKeith" > wrote in message

> Thanks everyone for your advice. I see what some of you mean about the
> weight from that extra adapter putting too much stress on the
> connection. What I need though is a cable with 2x 1/4" monos on one
> end and 1x 1/8" stereo on the other. This particular kind of cable is
> not easy to find.

What is easy to find is a cable with 1 x 1/8" stereo on one end and 2 x RCA
on the other. Add RCA-to-1/4 mono adaptors, and you're stylin. Since the
adaptors are on the robust 1/4" end, durability is rarely an issue.

[TheKeith]

"Arny Krueger" > wrote in message
...
> "TheKeith" > wrote in message
>
> > Thanks everyone for your advice. I see what some of you mean about the
> > weight from that extra adapter putting too much stress on the
> > connection. What I need though is a cable with 2x 1/4" monos on one
> > end and 1x 1/8" stereo on the other. This particular kind of cable is
> > not easy to find.
>
> What is easy to find is a cable with 1 x 1/8" stereo on one end and 2 x
RCA
> on the other. Add RCA-to-1/4 mono adaptors, and you're stylin. Since the
> adaptors are on the robust 1/4" end, durability is rarely an issue.

That's a good idea--in fact, I even have that cable already! All I would
need are the 2x 1/4" mono adapters. Yeah, I might do it this way.

[Jack]

In article >, in
rec.audio.pro, says...
> On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 19:06:59 -0500, TheKeith wrote:
>
> >Thanks everyone for your advice. I see what some of you mean about the
> >weight from that extra adapter putting too much stress on the connection.
> >What I need though is a cable with 2x 1/4" monos on one end and 1x 1/8"
> >stereo on the other. This particular kind of cable is not easy to find.
>
> Hosa makes these in 3 and 10 foot length, CMP-153 and CMP-159.
>
> http://www.hosatech.com/audio_cables_index_3.html
>
>

And available from Musician's Friend and AMS on a regular basis.
--
de Jack N2MPU FN20
Modeling the NYC and NYNH&H in HO and CP Rail and D&H in N
Proud NRA member
addy:

[Rob Adelman]

Jack wrote:

>>Hosa makes these in 3 and 10 foot length, CMP-153 and CMP-159.

Hosa's are very unreliable in my experience. In general anything with
molded ends are suspect.

[Les Cargill]

TheKeith wrote:
>
> Thanks everyone for your advice. I see what some of you mean about the
> weight from that extra adapter putting too much stress on the connection.
> What I need though is a cable with 2x 1/4" monos on one end and 1x 1/8"
> stereo on the other. This particular kind of cable is not easy to find. It
> is easy to find y-cables with like-size jacks on both ends but not unlike,
> it would seem. I guess a good way to go would be to either to use my 1/8"
> male to male stereo cable and connect it to a y-adapter with a stereo 1/8"
> jack and 2x 1/4" mono plugs, although I haven't begun to look for this combo
> yet either. Since I have soldering skills, another thing I could do is to
> just buy the connectors and make my own custom cables.

What is easier to find is a stereo 1/8"-male-to-stereo-1/4" female adapter,
and an "insert cable" ( 1/4" stereo male to 2 mono 1/4" male ).

If you'll route this to a patchbay, you'll be able to get to them more easily
and not plug/unplug the 1/8" end quite so often.

--
Les Cargill

[Les Cargill]

Rob Adelman wrote:
>
> Jack wrote:
>
> >>Hosa makes these in 3 and 10 foot length, CMP-153 and CMP-159.
>
> Hosa's are very unreliable in my experience. In general anything with
> molded ends are suspect.

Depends on the application. If one end goes to the computer and the
other to a patchbay, it'll rarely move.

This being said, I built cables ( and the 1/8" end was painful to
solder ).


--
Les Cargill

[Mike Rivers]

In article > writes:

> What I need though is a cable with 2x 1/4" monos on one end and 1x 1/8"
> stereo on the other. This particular kind of cable is not easy to find.

> Since I have soldering skills, another thing I could do is to
> just buy the connectors and make my own custom cables.

That's what you have to do sometimes. However, cables with a stereo
mini plug on one end and two RCA plugs on the other are very common.
If you want an off-the-shelf solution, you can buy one of those and
two RCA-1/4" adapters. Those adapters aren't any heavier than a
standard 1/4" phone plug, so there's no worry about excess strain on
the jacks like there is when adapting a mini jack to a larger plug.



--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me here: double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

[Laurence Payne]

On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 19:06:59 -0500, "TheKeith" > wrote:

>Since I have soldering skills, another thing I could do is to
>just buy the connectors and make my own custom cables.

Well, what are you faffing about for? If you can make the bloody
things, just do it!

CubaseFAQ page www.laurencepayne.co.uk/CubaseFAQ.htm

[Rob Adelman]

Les Cargill wrote:

>>Hosa's are very unreliable in my experience. In general anything with
>>molded ends are suspect.
>
>
> Depends on the application. If one end goes to the computer and the
> other to a patchbay, it'll rarely move.
>
> This being said, I built cables ( and the 1/8" end was painful to
> solder ).

But you can buy such premade cables using quality cable and connectors.
More money than Hosa but think of it as insurance. Bad cables always
seem to go out at the most inopportune moment. Murphy's law.

[news.verizon.net]

"Mike Rivers" > wrote in message
news:znr1069452744k@trad...
>
> In article > writes:
>
> Every designer who ever put a 1/8" jack on a piece of equipment should
have a mini plug shoved up his ass with 120 VAC across two of the
terminals. Maybe if he's lucky it won't make good contact.
> >>

ha ha ha , agreed! Those mini vans can be a damn nuisance for real...

[El Queso]

TheKeith wrote:
> I'm doing some voice recording for my flash animations and I'm using a shure
> sm57 with a midiman mic preamp. I used to feed the 1/4" line out from my mic
> preamp to the 1/4" input on my soundblaster's LiveDrive unit (which is
> basically an extension of the sound card with 1/4" inputs) -- the problem is
> that I just started using it again after about a year and a half and for
> some reason can't get it to work. The computer won't recognize it--no matter
> how many times I uninstall the drivers and in the device manager and then
> reinstall it. Enough rambling on, I went to radio shack today and picked up
> a 1/4" stereo to 1/8" stereo adapter and just plugged that right into the
> card instead-works fine, but since I have nothing to compare it to, I'm not
> sure if it sounds worse than if I had been using the 1/4" ins.
>
> In short, is there that much of a difference between 1/4" and 1/8",
> particularly when the cable itself is a 1/4" one; only the plug (1/4" - 1/8"
> adapter) is 1/8"? Thanks.

I use to use a Shure sm57 for voice recordings, I switched to an Octava
MK319 (only 99 bux at git center on sale) and it is a WORLD of
difference for voice-over and foley stuff. Very sensitive and very
cheap. Test it in the store though, I have heard that there are a few
bad ones floating around. I love mine. I have it going into a cheap
Bellari pre-amp and then into a cheap Behringer compressor.
Cheers,
Queso

>
>

[dickydoo]

No difference.

[CJT]

dickydoo wrote:

> No difference.
>
>

I think 1/4" jacks are a _lot_ more reliable.

--
After being targeted with gigabytes of trash by the "SWEN" worm, I have
concluded we must conceal our e-mail address. Our true address is the
mirror image of what you see before the "@" symbol. It's a shame such
steps are necessary. ...Charlie

[dickydoo]

I think 1/4" jacks are a _lot_ more reliable.
Yes they are but he cant change the socket , so in this case it should be
okay, unless he wants to make a new lead with the cannon on one end and an
1/8 on the other.