Definitive's Music Matters

[Ed Presson[_2_]]

Anyone planning to attend Definitive's "Music Matters" demonstration fest
in Seattle this Thursday evening?

Ed Presson

[[email protected]]

On Monday, March 5, 2018 at 10:49:47 AM UTC-8, Ed Presson wrote:
> Anyone planning to attend Definitive's "Music Matters" demonstration fest
> in Seattle this Thursday evening?
>
> Ed Presson

sure wished I lived up there.

[Ed Presson[_2_]]

wrote in message ...

On Monday, March 5, 2018 at 10:49:47 AM UTC-8, Ed Presson wrote:
> Anyone planning to attend Definitive's "Music Matters" demonstration fest
> in Seattle this Thursday evening?
>
> Ed Presson

>sure wished I lived up there.

The weather here was so dismal (heavy rain, wind) that I reluctantly decided
not to go.

Ed

[Peter Wieck[_2_]]

I am not being the slightest bit snarky when I ask this:

Unless your interest is purely social, and purely for being around like-minded people, which is worthy in its own right, why would someone go to such an event?

Other than transducers (speakers, microphones, phono-cartridges, headphones, guitar pick-ups and so forth), there is nothing new or improvable in the audio hobby. Bigger, perhaps. More powerful, perhaps. But better? Not hardly. So, I have to ask.

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA

[Ed Presson[_2_]]

"Peter Wieck" wrote in message ...

I am not being the slightest bit snarky when I ask this:

Unless your interest is purely social, and purely for being around
like-minded people, which is worthy in its own right, why would someone go
to such an event?

Other than transducers (speakers, microphones, phono-cartridges, headphones,
guitar pick-ups and so forth), there is nothing new or improvable in the
audio hobby. Bigger, perhaps. More powerful, perhaps. But better? Not
hardly. So, I have to ask.

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA
__________________________________________________ _______

Good question, I guess. I concur, it is transducers that vary the most, so
it is interesting to hear what high end companies think is good sound. Last
year, the answers seemed to vary
widely from demo room to demo room. Of course, the systems include only
those represented by Definitive Audio, and last year there were no large
planar speakers like Magnepan or
electrostatic speakers. Still, I found it interesting. I listen mostly to
classical recordings, mostly symphonic; that music was used less than 30% of
the time. Most of the classical recordings, however,
were quite fine, often done by the equipment manufacturers like Linn, rather
than commercial CDs or SACDs.

It was also interesting (in a ghastly way) to hear the prices of the most
expensive gear.

I hope this answers your question.

Ed Presson

[Peter Wieck[_2_]]

On Thursday, March 15, 2018 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, Ed Presson wrote:

>
> I hope this answers your question.

Thank you - it does!

It is a shame that no planar speakers were on-offer. I keep large Ribbon-Tweeter Maggies, and they are quite wonderful if driven from a brute-force amp. The other speakers are similar-vintage ARs and one set of Dynaco A35s.

As to costs: I ran a quick calculation using this source: http://www.usinflationcalculator.com/

And came to find out that the system in my library would cost, in 2018 dollars: $33,474. For the record, I did not pay 10% of that for the entirety, including repairs and refurbishments to bring everything back to *perfect*.

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA

[Ed Presson[_2_]]

"Peter Wieck" wrote in message ...

On Thursday, March 15, 2018 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, Ed Presson wrote:

>
> I hope this answers your question.

Thank you - it does!

>It is a shame that no planar speakers were on-offer. I keep large
>Ribbon-Tweeter Maggies, and they are quite wonderful if driven from a
>brute-force amp. The other speakers are similar-vintage ARs and one set >of
>Dynaco A35s.

>As to costs: I ran a quick calculation using this source:
>http://www.usinflationcalculator.com/

?And came to find out that the system in my library would cost, in 2018
dollars: $33,474. For the record, I did not pay 10% of that for the
entirety, including repairs and refurbishments to bring everything back to
>*perfect*.

>Peter Wieck
>Melrose Park, PA

It certainly sound like you have the knack of picking some classic
good-sounding speakers and the skills to refurbish your equipment. You've
got a fine system at a budget price.

Which reminds me, I'm overdue in cleaning all the connections in my system.
The last time I did that, the improvement was surprising to me.

Ed Presson

[[email protected]]

On 16 Mar 2018 22:01:47 GMT, "Ed Presson" > wrote:

>"Peter Wieck" wrote in message ...
>
>On Thursday, March 15, 2018 at 11:55:53 AM UTC-4, Ed Presson wrote:
>
>>
>> I hope this answers your question.
>
>Thank you - it does!
>
>>It is a shame that no planar speakers were on-offer. I keep large
>>Ribbon-Tweeter Maggies, and they are quite wonderful if driven from a
>>brute-force amp. The other speakers are similar-vintage ARs and one set >of
>>Dynaco A35s.
>
>>As to costs: I ran a quick calculation using this source:
>>http://www.usinflationcalculator.com/
>
>?And came to find out that the system in my library would cost, in 2018
>dollars: $33,474. For the record, I did not pay 10% of that for the
>entirety, including repairs and refurbishments to bring everything back to
> >*perfect*.
>
>>Peter Wieck
>>Melrose Park, PA
>
>It certainly sound like you have the knack of picking some classic
>good-sounding speakers and the skills to refurbish your equipment. You've
>got a fine system at a budget price.
>
>Which reminds me, I'm overdue in cleaning all the connections in my system.
>The last time I did that, the improvement was surprising to me.
>
>Ed Presson
>

That's why people think fancy interconnects made a difference. Funny
how switching back never returned the system back to the original
sound prior to the cable change.:-) I will add the RCA connect sucks.

On a side note I have a Counterpoint 3.1 pre amp and the input
selector switch oxidize's over time causing distorted sound. It has
silver contacts. I have tried TV tuner cleaner and DeoxIT with mixed
results. I have actually taken the switch apart and hand cleaned the
brushes but the problem comes back. Any ideas, any one, for a long
terms fix?

[Peter Wieck[_2_]]

On Saturday, March 17, 2018 at 8:02:39 AM UTC-4, wrote:

> On a side note I have a Counterpoint 3.1 pre amp and the input
> selector switch oxidize's over time causing distorted sound. It has
> silver contacts. I have tried TV tuner cleaner and DeoxIT with mixed
> results. I have actually taken the switch apart and hand cleaned the
> brushes but the problem comes back. Any ideas, any one, for a long
> terms fix?

Silver is problematic and problems with it are generally of local origin. To keep in mind:

a) Of all the room-temperature conductors, Silver is best by a long margin, copper is next, gold a poor third in that group.
b) Gold does not oxidize under normal conditions - but if the connections are poorly plated, or an alloy plating is used, they will be worse than plain copper or spring-bronze, or even tin-plated spring bronze. The cynical part of me will suggest that anything coming out of China into the audio market will *not* be good. On the surface, it is impossible to discern the difference.

Silver is attacked most commonly by sulphur. Source being fossil-fuels, especially coal or heavy oil, or *Heating Oil*. Secondary sources being low-grade kerosene, rubber and food processing plants, paper making and similar. Back in the day, the "Staff" were forever polishing the silver as mostly bituminous coal (burnt for power here in the US) was used for heating, generation of "town gas" for lighting, and the clinkers were used as ballast and instead of gravel for paving.

Ozone will degrade rubber products, wherein fairly large quantities of sulphur are used for vulcanizing. Some hair products - conditioners, setting gels and similar also contain significant amounts of sulphur. Then, eggs.

Put simply, if you are in an environment rich in sulphur compounds, anything silver will go 'black' quickly. Now, in the Better-Living-Through-Chemistry department, this issue with silver has been understood for about 100 years. And various solutions for various applications have been developed. In your case: https://silverguard.com/collections/3m-anti-tarnish-strips Would be a suggestion. If you put it inside the unit as proximate to the switch as possible, ideally with some contact to anything touching the silver, if not the silver itself, it will prevent oxidation/sulphation for some period until the volatiles disperse - a year or so in any case.

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA

[Peter Wieck[_2_]]

On Friday, March 16, 2018 at 6:01:50 PM UTC-4, Ed Presson wrote:

>
> Which reminds me, I'm overdue in cleaning all the connections in my system.
> The last time I did that, the improvement was surprising to me.

Oh MY! Yes. One of the best "upgrades" available to anyone at any price.

One learns, early on, that clamped connections are the best, and friction connections, even gold-plated, are eventually troublesome.

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA

[[email protected]]

On 17 Mar 2018 13:45:22 GMT, Peter Wieck >
wrote:

>On Saturday, March 17, 2018 at 8:02:39 AM UTC-4, wrote:
>
>> On a side note I have a Counterpoint 3.1 pre amp and the input
>> selector switch oxidize's over time causing distorted sound. It has
>> silver contacts. I have tried TV tuner cleaner and DeoxIT with mixed
>> results. I have actually taken the switch apart and hand cleaned the
>> brushes but the problem comes back. Any ideas, any one, for a long
>> terms fix?
>
>Silver is problematic and problems with it are generally of local origin. To keep in mind:
>
>a) Of all the room-temperature conductors, Silver is best by a long margin, copper is next, gold a poor third in that group.
>b) Gold does not oxidize under normal conditions - but if the connections are poorly plated, or an alloy plating is used, they will be worse than plain copper or spring-bronze, or even tin-plated spring bronze. The cynical part of me will suggest that anything coming out of China into the audio market will *not* be good. On the surface, it is impossible to discern the difference.
>
>Silver is attacked most commonly by sulphur. Source being fossil-fuels, especially coal or heavy oil, or *Heating Oil*. Secondary sources being low-grade kerosene, rubber and food processing plants, paper making and similar. Back in the day, the "Staff" were forever polishing the silver as mostly bituminous coal (burnt for power here in the US) was used for heating, generation of "town gas" for lighting, and the clinkers were used as ballast and instead of gravel for paving.
>
>Ozone will degrade rubber products, wherein fairly large quantities of sulphur are used for vulcanizing. Some hair products - conditioners, setting gels and similar also contain significant amounts of sulphur. Then, eggs.
>
>Put simply, if you are in an environment rich in sulphur compounds, anything silver will go 'black' quickly. Now, in the Better-Living-Through-Chemistry department, this issue with silver has been understood for about 100 years. And various solutions for various applications have been developed. In your case: https://silverguard.com/collections/3m-anti-tarnish-strips Would be a suggestion. If you put it inside the unit as proximate to the switch as possible, ideally with some contact to anything touching the silver, if not the silver itself, it will prevent oxidation/sulphation for some period until the volatiles disperse - a year or so in any case.
>
>Peter Wieck
>Melrose Park, PA

Don't think I am in a rich sulfur environment, at least not from an
industry stand point. Thanks, will give those strips a shot.

Bill T

[gregz]

" > wrote:
> On 17 Mar 2018 13:45:22 GMT, Peter Wieck >
> wrote:
>
>> On Saturday, March 17, 2018 at 8:02:39 AM UTC-4, wrote:
>>
>>> On a side note I have a Counterpoint 3.1 pre amp and the input
>>> selector switch oxidize's over time causing distorted sound. It has
>>> silver contacts. I have tried TV tuner cleaner and DeoxIT with mixed
>>> results. I have actually taken the switch apart and hand cleaned the
>>> brushes but the problem comes back. Any ideas, any one, for a long
>>> terms fix?
>>
>> Silver is problematic and problems with it are generally of local origin. To keep in mind:
>>
>> a) Of all the room-temperature conductors, Silver is best by a long
>> margin, copper is next, gold a poor third in that group.
>> b) Gold does not oxidize under normal conditions - but if the
>> connections are poorly plated, or an alloy plating is used, they will be
>> worse than plain copper or spring-bronze, or even tin-plated spring
>> bronze. The cynical part of me will suggest that anything coming out of
>> China into the audio market will *not* be good. On the surface, it is
>> impossible to discern the difference.
>>
>> Silver is attacked most commonly by sulphur. Source being fossil-fuels,
>> especially coal or heavy oil, or *Heating Oil*. Secondary sources being
>> low-grade kerosene, rubber and food processing plants, paper making and
>> similar. Back in the day, the "Staff" were forever polishing the silver
>> as mostly bituminous coal (burnt for power here in the US) was used for
>> heating, generation of "town gas" for lighting, and the clinkers were
>> used as ballast and instead of gravel for paving.
>>
>> Ozone will degrade rubber products, wherein fairly large quantities of
>> sulphur are used for vulcanizing. Some hair products - conditioners,
>> setting gels and similar also contain significant amounts of sulphur. Then, eggs.
>>
>> Put simply, if you are in an environment rich in sulphur compounds,
>> anything silver will go 'black' quickly. Now, in the
>> Better-Living-Through-Chemistry department, this issue with silver has
>> been understood for about 100 years. And various solutions for various
>> applications have been developed. In your case:
>> https://silverguard.com/collections/3m-anti-tarnish-strips Would be a
>> suggestion. If you put it inside the unit as proximate to the switch as
>> possible, ideally with some contact to anything touching the silver, if
>> not the silver itself, it will prevent oxidation/sulphation for some
>> period until the volatiles disperse - a year or so in any case.
>>
>> Peter Wieck
>> Melrose Park, PA
>
> Don't think I am in a rich sulfur environment, at least not from an
> industry stand point. Thanks, will give those strips a shot.
>
> Bill T

Vapor emitter by couple places. One I can't think of. Cortec Bullfrog,
Daubert. http://daubertcromwell.com/.

Greg