Compare Blue to Neumann

[Rex]

I have two Neumann mics:

1. TLM103
2. U87

.... and three Avalon pre's (I mention this because many posts I see
asking for mic help say get good pre's. Done)

I do the bad home studio thing but it's picking up steam so I'm
expanding. I record heavy rock exclusively with the occasional
acoustic guitar.

I'm reading rave reviews of Blue mics, but they're generally by people
with a vested interest.

Do I need them? How do they compare to the Neumann's I have. Does
somebody out there own Neumann's and Blue's and have an opinion?

Thanks

[R Krizman]

What other mics do you have? I wouldn't think at all in terms of brand names,
as each manufacturer may have something that will uniquely work for you.

Some common choices you might want to investigate would be small diaphragm
condensers (Neumann 184's or Josephson C42's?), some decent dynamics like the
usual SM 57's and perhaps a more general purpose RE-20, a vibey, vintagey large
diaphragm condenser vocal mic (too subjective to recommend--I like my
Lawson--Soundelux is highly regarded), and perhaps a ribbon (Royer? AEA?),
which a lot of people like on guitar cabinets. Other people will recommend
different specific mics, so take this list as a general point. There are a lot
of tried and trues that cover the basics.

The Blue mics apparently all sound different from each other, so you'd have to
check out their individual sounds to see what suits you.. The opinion I see
coming up a lot is that they all have particular, unique sounds and may not be
as versatile as other mics. I spent some time with the Bottle, but didn't like
it enough to keep it. (I didn't dislike it, but in that price range there were
other mics that I instantly loved).

You might give Fletcher a shout at Mercenary. I believe he has some
distinctive opinions about both Blues and Neumanns.

Good luck,

-R

[John]

>Do I need them? How do they compare to the Neumann's I have. Does
>somebody out there own Neumann's and Blue's and have an opinion?
>
>Thanks

>From: (Rex)

For percussion (shakers, maracas, etc) I'll take the Blueberry over either of
the two mics you mentioned. For vox, there are many different choices in the
Blue line. Most notable -- and expensive-- is the Bottle. In fact, it may be
the only mic they make that could give you an improvement (over what you have)
for certain vocal types. I own the Blueberry and Baby Bottle. As far as
Neumann I just have a KM184. If you say you record heavy rock, why not look
into a Royer or an RE20? Both are great cab mics. If these two Neumanns are
the only two "good" mics you own though, I think you'd be hard pressed to find
a BLUE that wouldn't be of use to you. Even though my main vocal mic is a
Soundelux U99, I still get use out of my Baby Bottle for some folks.

-John Vice
www.summertimestudios.com

[Jim Kollens]

Rex: << Do I need them? >>

Maybe. I have a pair of Blue Cactus. If you want a smooth, retro fat buttery
mic, this is it. Like any mic, it won't work for every singer but it can
really sound great. But don't try to open the thing up. They use proprietory
screws and everything fits so tight you will screw the thing up. I never ran
into this before with a truly professional mic. Also, I have yet to
definitively find out just what tube this mic uses. Their tech support is
ellusive on the subject, another first for me with a costly mic. I guess it
really doesn't matter since you will have to send it to them anyway if the tube
goes. Despite these objections, it is one of my fav's. The Cactus is a
beautifully colored mic. I don't own any other Blues and I can't comment on
Neumann comparisons.

[Ty Ford]

In Article >,
(Rex) wrote:
>I have two Neumann mics:
>
>1. TLM103
>2. U87
>
>... and three Avalon pre's (I mention this because many posts I see
>asking for mic help say get good pre's. Done)
>
>I do the bad home studio thing but it's picking up steam so I'm
>expanding. I record heavy rock exclusively with the occasional
>acoustic guitar.
>
>I'm reading rave reviews of Blue mics, but they're generally by people
>with a vested interest.
>
>Do I need them? How do they compare to the Neumann's I have. Does
>somebody out there own Neumann's and Blue's and have an opinion?
>
>Thanks

I think you have some nice mics there. Not even an SM57, re20 or M260. Both
TLM 103 and U 87 are large diameter mics. If you're looking to spend money
at the same quality level, consider a Schoeps. The CMC641 does a great job,
especially in challenging acoustic environments. The Gefell M 296 omni is
also quite nice.

Regards,

Ty Ford

**Until the worm goes away, I have put "not" in front of my email address.
Please remove it if you want to email me directly.
For Ty Ford V/O demos, audio services and equipment reviews,
click on http://www.jagunet.com/~tford

[Scott Dorsey]

Rex > wrote:
>I have two Neumann mics:
>
>1. TLM103
>2. U87
>
>... and three Avalon pre's (I mention this because many posts I see
>asking for mic help say get good pre's. Done)
>
>I do the bad home studio thing but it's picking up steam so I'm
>expanding. I record heavy rock exclusively with the occasional
>acoustic guitar.
>
>I'm reading rave reviews of Blue mics, but they're generally by people
>with a vested interest.
>
>Do I need them? How do they compare to the Neumann's I have. Does
>somebody out there own Neumann's and Blue's and have an opinion?

BLUE makes microphones that are very strongly colored. All of them have
totally different coloration to them, to get very specific sounds. If they
are the sounds you want, the BLUE mikes are very quick and convenient ways
of getting them. If they aren't, they aren't useful mikes.

It's worth giving a listen to a few of them, but don't listen to one and
think they are all like that because they are all very dramatically different
and they are all intended to give very different sounds with the intention of
putting them all together into one mix.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[hollywood_steve]

I spent some time with the Bottle, but didn't like
it enough to keep it. (I didn't dislike it, but in that price range
there were
other mics that I instantly loved).
**************************************************

That comment and the comments by almost everyone else that "BLUE mics
are heavily colored" makes me think that I might need my hearing
tested. I've owned a BLUE Bottle with the B6 & B7 capsules for about
two years and I think its an incredible microphone. Unlike many new
LD tube mics, I find the Bottle to be very useful on my jazz and
classical sessions; I just wish that I could afford two more so I
could try out the "Supa-Size" Decca tree:

http://www.bluemic.com/news_air/air3.htm
http://www.bluemic.com/news_air.htm

My only regret is that I now work exclusively on location and I wish
that I had one of the B4 omni capsules, but the B4 is working its way
to the top of my shopping list.

I haven't spent much time listening to the other mics in the Blue
lineup, but I'll take everyone's word that they are heavily colored.
But I have found the original Bottle to be a very versatile mic that
can be utilized in a very wide range of situations. So, I guess I am
hearing the Bottle to be less colored than many other large diameter
tube mics.

steve

www.lexington125.com

[Roger W. Norman]

I'll say it again. Simply put up a list of requirements, add items and list
pros and cons for each item. If there aren't enough pros for the piece of
equipment then it doesn't match the requirements. And for god's sake, if
you don't have a NEED then don't spend money just to be spending it. This
stuff is a money pit enough when you're just buying things you have an
absolute need for. And need isn't money burning a hole in your pocket. If
there's something that you can't make happen without a purchase, that's
need.

I know, not much help, but if you make decisions by way of concensus you'll
do things like end up with three of the same pres rather than getting three
different pres that might end up giving you a greater palette from which to
paint. Ooops.

Seriously, you know what I mean. If you're improving on your recordings and
you're getting more work, I think the work itself will start demanding the
purchases. There's absolutely no reason to look at a BLUE over a Neumann,
nor vice versa. As a business you try to supply equipment that will draw
clients in so that you can continue to make purchases to get more clients.
Like I said, if you can't see a need, then when you talk with your clients,
ask them what they'd like to see. I'm sure they'll be more than glad to
tell you.

--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio
Purchase your copy of the Fifth of RAP CD set at www.recaudiopro.net.
See how far $20 really goes.




"Rex" > wrote in message
om...
> I have two Neumann mics:
>
> 1. TLM103
> 2. U87
>
> ... and three Avalon pre's (I mention this because many posts I see
> asking for mic help say get good pre's. Done)
>
> I do the bad home studio thing but it's picking up steam so I'm
> expanding. I record heavy rock exclusively with the occasional
> acoustic guitar.
>
> I'm reading rave reviews of Blue mics, but they're generally by people
> with a vested interest.
>
> Do I need them? How do they compare to the Neumann's I have. Does
> somebody out there own Neumann's and Blue's and have an opinion?
>
> Thanks

[R Krizman]

<< So, I guess I am
hearing the Bottle to be less colored than many other large diameter
tube mics. >>

I didn't think the bottle was particularly colored. In fact, the sound seemed
a little generic and I'd have a hard time identifying any particular character
to it. Like I said, I'm not so much criticizing the mic as I am making a
subjective statement that it just didn't blow up my kilt enough to keep it.

You're certainly not alone in thinking highly of it.

-R

[Rex]

Greatly appreciate you taking the time to respond. I see your point
and it is a good one. Noted.

I still, however, have not learned much about Blue microphones. Even
if I do not intend to purchase another microphone for the next year,
two, five, I'd like to know something about them beyond what I might
read in promotional material. Specifically I'd like to know what real
users feel good applications for these mics are.

I probably just asked the wrong question. I should have posed it as I
did above. Are there Blue users out there with real success stories
and could I get some of the details of their particular applications.
I guess I'm particularly interested in anyone who's used them for drum
or electric guitar applications.

Thanks


"Roger W. Norman" > wrote in message >...
> I'll say it again. Simply put up a list of requirements, add items and list
> pros and cons for each item. If there aren't enough pros for the piece of
> equipment then it doesn't match the requirements. And for god's sake, if
> you don't have a NEED then don't spend money just to be spending it. This
> stuff is a money pit enough when you're just buying things you have an
> absolute need for. And need isn't money burning a hole in your pocket. If
> there's something that you can't make happen without a purchase, that's
> need.
>
> I know, not much help, but if you make decisions by way of concensus you'll
> do things like end up with three of the same pres rather than getting three
> different pres that might end up giving you a greater palette from which to
> paint. Ooops.
>
> Seriously, you know what I mean. If you're improving on your recordings and
> you're getting more work, I think the work itself will start demanding the
> purchases. There's absolutely no reason to look at a BLUE over a Neumann,
> nor vice versa. As a business you try to supply equipment that will draw
> clients in so that you can continue to make purchases to get more clients.
> Like I said, if you can't see a need, then when you talk with your clients,
> ask them what they'd like to see. I'm sure they'll be more than glad to
> tell you.
>
> --
>
>
> Roger W. Norman
> SirMusic Studio
> Purchase your copy of the Fifth of RAP CD set at www.recaudiopro.net.
> See how far $20 really goes.
>
>
>
>
> "Rex" > wrote in message
> om...
> > I have two Neumann mics:
> >
> > 1. TLM103
> > 2. U87
> >
> > ... and three Avalon pre's (I mention this because many posts I see
> > asking for mic help say get good pre's. Done)
> >
> > I do the bad home studio thing but it's picking up steam so I'm
> > expanding. I record heavy rock exclusively with the occasional
> > acoustic guitar.
> >
> > I'm reading rave reviews of Blue mics, but they're generally by people
> > with a vested interest.
> >
> > Do I need them? How do they compare to the Neumann's I have. Does
> > somebody out there own Neumann's and Blue's and have an opinion?
> >
> > Thanks

[John Washburn]

"Rex" wrote
> Greatly appreciate you taking the time to respond. I see your point
> and it is a good one. Noted.
>
> I still, however, have not learned much about Blue microphones. Even
> if I do not intend to purchase another microphone for the next year,
> two, five, I'd like to know something about them beyond what I might
> read in promotional material.

Besides what you could learn by listening to them?


> Specifically I'd like to know what real
> users feel good applications for these mics are.
>

<snip happens>

Well..

The Dragonfly is nice on some vocals, sometimes overheads, sometimes guitar,
etc
The Bottle (B6 cap) is often nice on vocals but sometimes not. When it's
nice, it's really nice, but that depends. I suppose it could probably make
friends with guitars and drums, too.
The Mouse is nice on some things.
The Blueberry is okay on a lot of things, esp for the price. But sometimes
not.

It really depends on what you're pointing them at, the manner in which
you're pointing them and what else is living in the mix in which the
instruments you're pointing them at have to find a home.

You really kind of have to hear them. Find a dealer with a sensible return
policy, if you can't listen to them in a store.

Good luck

-jw

[hollywood_steve]

> I didn't think the bottle was particularly colored. In fact, the sound seemed
> a little generic and I'd have a hard time identifying any particular character
> to it. Like I said, I'm not so much criticizing the mic as I am making a
> subjective statement that it just didn't blow up my kilt enough to keep it.
>
> You're certainly not alone in thinking highly of it.
>
> -R

Do you recall which capsule you heard? The standard B6 capsule can
sound like a lot of other new "upscale" tube mics. But the 1st time
that I heard the B7 capsule, I was hooked - the difference is
startlingly dramatic. I really didn't think that two large D cardiod
capsules would sound so different on the same body/preamp - but its
really like listening to two completely different mics. (The B7 sound
is the sound I always wanted from a large D tube mic) And the B4
sphere-omni is my "gotta have" capsule - its supposed to be very
reminiscent of the old Neumann M50. I can't wait to see for myself.
(I just read what I wrote and realized that its starting to sound more
like an ad for Blue than a forum post, so I'll stop here).

steve

[Jeff Jasper]

Rex wrote:

>I still, however, have not learned much about Blue microphones.

Do a Google search. A while back Skipper Wise had a post listing the original
capsules upon which his various versions were modeled and their corresponding
model in his line.

Jeff Jasper
Jeff Jasper Productions, West Funroe, La.

[LeBaron & Alrich]

Rex wrote:

> Are there Blue users out there with real success stories
> and could I get some of the details of their particular applications.
> I guess I'm particularly interested in anyone who's used them for drum
> or electric guitar applications.

Google Advanced Groups Search:

<http://www.google.com/advanced_group_search>

--
ha

[R Krizman]

<< A while back Skipper Wise had a post listing the original
capsules upon which his various versions were modeled and their corresponding
model in his line.
>>


That just tells you what they're supposed to sound like. Most opinions I've
seen (along with my own limited listening) have indicated that the Blue mics
are better evaluated in their own terms, and if you're looking for a vintage
replication there might be better places to go.

-R