Toft / Trident A Range..anyone got 'em??

[Gene Porfido]

I'm interested in buying a dual channel Trident A Range that Malcom
Toft put out ( the purplish ones w/ the fraders for EQ gain..)....seems
I can get my hands on a channel or 2 but they are not returnable....I'm
not gonna buy them if I can't get an idea if they are any good or not!

Anybody using these...better yet, anyone in San Francisco area got a
unit I could listen to??

Thanks all :-)
geno

[Lou Gimenez]

from what some one who had them both apart told me, the Toft is not that
close to the original. The Daking is alot closer to the A range with better
build quality than the Toft. By the way the Daking 52270b's have a few more
mid bands than the original 52270's
--Lou Gimenez
The Music Lab
2" 24track w all the Goodies
www.musiclabnyc.com



> From: Gene Porfido >
> Organization: EarthLink Inc. -- http://www.EarthLink.net
> Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
> Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2003 20:36:36 GMT
> Subject: Toft / Trident A Range..anyone got 'em??
>
> I'm interested in buying a dual channel Trident A Range that Malcom
> Toft put out ( the purplish ones w/ the fraders for EQ gain..)....seems
> I can get my hands on a channel or 2 but they are not returnable....I'm
> not gonna buy them if I can't get an idea if they are any good or not!
>
> Anybody using these...better yet, anyone in San Francisco area got a
> unit I could listen to??
>
> Thanks all :-)
> geno

[Gene Porfido]

Thanks Lou.

Geez..you read 10 reviews and they all scream about how GREAT it
is..then you get one real world response and it doesn't add up. Oh well
:-) But I do hear Daking stuff is awesome...

I can get the Trident for about 1/2 of what it was selling for
though...w/ warranty, thats why I might just do it anyway.
Thanks
Geno

In article >, Lou Gimenez
> wrote:

> from what some one who had them both apart told me, the Toft is not that
> close to the original. The Daking is alot closer to the A range with better
> build quality than the Toft. By the way the Daking 52270b's have a few more
> mid bands than the original 52270's
> --Lou Gimenez
> The Music Lab
> 2" 24track w all the Goodies
> www.musiclabnyc.com
>
>
>
> > From: Gene Porfido >
> > Organization: EarthLink Inc. -- http://www.EarthLink.net
> > Newsgroups: rec.audio.pro
> > Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2003 20:36:36 GMT
> > Subject: Toft / Trident A Range..anyone got 'em??
> >
> > I'm interested in buying a dual channel Trident A Range that Malcom
> > Toft put out ( the purplish ones w/ the fraders for EQ gain..)....seems
> > I can get my hands on a channel or 2 but they are not returnable....I'm
> > not gonna buy them if I can't get an idea if they are any good or not!
> >
> > Anybody using these...better yet, anyone in San Francisco area got a
> > unit I could listen to??
> >
> > Thanks all :-)
> > geno
>

[D. Butler]

The Dakings are way closer to the original. We might be able to arrange a trial...

db

In article >,
Gene Porfido > wrote:

> I'm interested in buying a dual channel Trident A Range that Malcom
> Toft put out ( the purplish ones w/ the fraders for EQ gain..)....seems
> I can get my hands on a channel or 2 but they are not returnable....I'm
> not gonna buy them if I can't get an idea if they are any good or not!
>
> Anybody using these...better yet, anyone in San Francisco area got a
> unit I could listen to??
>
> Thanks all :-)
> geno

--
David 'db' Butler, Consultant
Acoustics by db
"...all the rest are just brokers"
now on the web at http://www.db-engineering.com
Boston, Mass
Phone 617 969-0585 Fax 617 964-1590

[Dave Martin]

"Gene Porfido" > wrote in message
...
> I'm interested in buying a dual channel Trident A Range that Malcom
> Toft put out ( the purplish ones w/ the fraders for EQ gain..)....seems
> I can get my hands on a channel or 2 but they are not returnable....I'm
> not gonna buy them if I can't get an idea if they are any good or not!
>
> Anybody using these...better yet, anyone in San Francisco area got a
> unit I could listen to??
>
Yeah, I've got the Toft. The preamp is nothing to write home about (useable
but not special), though I really like the sound of the EQ. I had to have
some fairly major work done to make it quiet enough for my needs (the work
included building an outboard PS as well as attending to some grounding
issues), though oddly enough, the noise problems developed, rather than
showing up as soon as I bought it.

--
Dave Martin
Java Jive Studio
Nashville, TN
www.javajivestudio.com

[rich wells]

> Geez..you read 10 reviews and they all scream about how GREAT it
> is..then you get one real world response and it doesn't add up. Oh well
> :-) But I do hear Daking stuff is awesome...

Just three weeks ago my Furman AR-1220 blew up, with most of my stuff
plugged into it and half of that turned on. The MTA A-Range was one of
the ones turned on (it doesn't have a power switch), and guess
what...it didn't work after that. Everything else did.

Plus, it doesn't have a fuse (I'm putting one in now as it's being
repaired).

All that makes me think I wouldn't do it again, I'd save up for the
Daking. (I got my MTA used from a friend, but was it worth it?)

-Rick

PS - I'm getting the Furman repaired, but I also wonder whether I want
to use it in the future, given that it CAUSED the exact problem it was
supposed to prevent. Wow that's aggravating. Anyone else out there
ever had this happen?

[Fletcher]

Gene Porfido wrote:

> I'm interested in buying a dual channel Trident A Range that Malcom
> Toft put out ( the purplish ones w/ the fraders for EQ gain..)....seems
> I can get my hands on a channel or 2 but they are not returnable....I'm
> not gonna buy them if I can't get an idea if they are any good or not!

FWIW, the new Toft ATC-2 seems to be a good measure better than the
"Meek/Toft" box... I tried an early revision [if there were subsequent
revisions I don't know... I stopped playing after the first one] and it
wasn't really anything to write home about.
--
Fletcher
Mercenary Audio
TEL: 508-543-0069
FAX: 508-543-9670
http://www.mercenary.com
"this is not a problem"

[Bill Buswinka]

If you can't go with the original: GO WITH THE DAKING!!!!!!!!

IN my opinion:

The supposed re-issue from Joe meek - pmi- er I mean Trident -er MTA
was a piece of.....well, I'll keep it clean here....my observations:
..

-A ranges ran off of a 48v supply vs. reissues dual 15v( to cater to
Ic chips ?)...barely on some units( Dave Martin ??)

-A ranges were completly discrete ( no ic's in em ....open up reissues
and see the nice TLO chips
mmmm those were in the original??????

-inductors that were hand wound for the original.....not there

-oh and the mic pre input transformer that was in the original( also
in B ranges and Fleximix)?
........was the original really the same tranfomer used in some of the
current joe meek's? It doesn't look the same?

....for $3500 one could reasonably have expected :

.....well, fuses and a power switch as Rick pointed out but also

1)a decent power supply( acopian, power one, lambda or international(
a la daking : ) in a separate external box

2) real recreations of the original tranfromers( "what!!!! a neve
reissue using Joe meek(for example; )" I could hear the screams! ...no
way !!!

.....why would they do it to the venerable A range: ((( Lundahl or
some other custom guys could have done it ...who is doing it for neve?
Sure the original might not have been as good spec wise as some
current transfomers but it was part of the sound! ( BTW, I have
actually contemplated taking a spare A range mic input transformer
from my fleximix and grafting it on to see how how it would sound on
the daking).

2a) same for the inductors

3) completely discrete.....sure tlo71's 5534 etc are fine but THEY
WERE NOT IN THE ORIGINAL!!
( are TL07x's in the 1073 recreations from Neve..or any of the 10
people at AES reissueing them..or being "inspired" by them.

4)half way decent build quality..this to me seems to be the only thing
they got "right on" co0mpared to the original(...well a 30 year old
original in need of service)-it is unreliable... Dave Martin' having
to build a power supply to make it work accepatble is par for the
course - and this after he could have just spent $3500 on the darn
thing.

4)... some magic in the box. try a good a range( or b range) and you
will hear how big, open and sweet it is

5) some respect for the original. If you are gonna suckle off the
luster of the original do it with some respect, emulate the parts that
were in the original( as all the neve recreations do)- don't
substitute with "newer, better, upgraded....cheaper!!" Stuff. People
hear the difference. Cherokee bothered to clone A range way back and
as I understand it they got the sound right( no chips etc)......and
thier clones still go for original A range prices- not the precipitous
drop that the MTA Millivanilli Trident Attempt version did.

6) If you are going to "upgrade" original please be clear it is A
range inspired ( as daking did) -BUT NOT THE ORIGINAL
...and please, do it better than the orignal.

Dakings build quality is AWESOME and he did a great job upgrading the
original- maybe he did not use the orignal mic input trans..but come
on he used a great jensen, ditto on the inductor and misc
components.... for example replacing the faders with nice switched
pots ....etc, etc. I seems he had more respect for the original
than the reissue of the original did. His look( outside and in), feel
and perform on par with Neve 10xx series and other pro
units...actually better , cleaner layout than the original.

No wonder the MTA reissue went from $3500 plus to current "deal"
prices for a a supposed reissue of the original... from the
blueprints... etc etc.

Peaple catch on.

Buy a daking-worst case, if you pay $1400 for a module you will get
your money out if you ever have to sell one(.......if you need to buy
a house or something stupid like that ..grrr!) -The reissues( ('a la
the great digidesign upgrade route ) will show up on the manufatureres
rep site selling for less than half what is was selling for a couple
months before.

sorry to those of you who bought one- like me - but the re-issue is
not a Daking...or the original A range either.


Sadly, I think the pale attempt at a reissue has polluted peoples
impression of Trident
A ranges. The real thing is held in very high regard( for good
reason) but most people think of Neve or others on a higher shelf
cause it is so rare to hear an A range. I wonder if most people's
impression of a Trident A range module is now actually of the MTA
reissue A range- that would be sad.

: )

[Gene Porfido]

Friggen OUCH!! I knock on wood as I state my Furmans have held up quite
well..I've got one that's gotta be 15 years old!

But no fuse in the A Range? Hmmmmm....and it went down with the ship.
Another ouch :)

thanks for the input..sorry about the weenie roast :-)

Geno

In article >, rich
wells > wrote:

>
> Just three weeks ago my Furman AR-1220 blew up, with most of my stuff
> plugged into it and half of that turned on. The MTA A-Range was one of
> the ones turned on (it doesn't have a power switch), and guess
> what...it didn't work after that. Everything else did.
>
> Plus, it doesn't have a fuse (I'm putting one in now as it's being
> repaired).
>
> All that makes me think I wouldn't do it again, I'd save up for the
> Daking. (I got my MTA used from a friend, but was it worth it?)
>
> -Rick
>
> PS - I'm getting the Furman repaired, but I also wonder whether I want
> to use it in the future, given that it CAUSED the exact problem it was
> supposed to prevent. Wow that's aggravating. Anyone else out there
> ever had this happen?

[Gene Porfido]

Thanks Dave...thats the kinda useful info I need. I was looking for a
killer pre amp as well as great EQ..but if the Pre is a bit soft on
greatness, then I'll pass.
thanks
Geno

In article >, Dave Martin
> wrote:

> "Gene Porfido" > wrote in message
> ...
> > I'm interested in buying a dual channel Trident A Range that Malcom
> > Toft put out ( the purplish ones w/ the fraders for EQ gain..)....seems
> > I can get my hands on a channel or 2 but they are not returnable....I'm
> > not gonna buy them if I can't get an idea if they are any good or not!
> >
> > Anybody using these...better yet, anyone in San Francisco area got a
> > unit I could listen to??
> >
> Yeah, I've got the Toft. The preamp is nothing to write home about (useable
> but not special), though I really like the sound of the EQ. I had to have
> some fairly major work done to make it quiet enough for my needs (the work
> included building an outboard PS as well as attending to some grounding
> issues), though oddly enough, the noise problems developed, rather than
> showing up as soon as I bought it.

[Dave Martin]

No problem; there are definitely more useable preamps. But for what I paid
for it, (certainly far less than $3500 - I don't know where that figure came
from...) the EQ adds a nice flavor.

--
Dave Martin
Java Jive Studio
Nashville, TN
www.javajivestudio.com

"Gene Porfido" > wrote in message
...
>
> Thanks Dave...thats the kinda useful info I need. I was looking for a
> killer pre amp as well as great EQ..but if the Pre is a bit soft on
> greatness, then I'll pass.
> thanks
> Geno
>

[Gene Porfido]

Thanks Fletcher...I did stop by the Mercenary site first to check out
all the goodies (I love that new Avalon Mercenary Edition..the
blackface is cool although I'd SWEAR the old purple caps had a sound of
their own??!); I read the 'review' on the ATC, and thought the reviewer
wasn't too swift on the mic pre's, although the EQ is supposed to be
nice. I guess when they ship I can try to find one to listen to.

I'm leaning towards the Daking at this point, although I'm very
interested in the S 80 box....and the pair of 1081's, the new ones Neve
is remaking. And the Helios...but they emailed me to tell me they won't
be out til 2004 sometime.
Trouble is no one has this stuff in San Francisco to listen to!! There
isn't one great audio store here that carries the good stuff, in stock
or on display.

Appreciate the input. There is so much gear to look at that it's hard
to decide. I better buy something before I waste the money on
crap...like Rent -- food -- drugs..:-)

Geno

In article >, Fletcher
> wrote:

> Gene Porfido wrote:
>[i]
> > I'm interested in buying a dual channel Trident A Range that Malcom
> > Toft put out ( the purplish ones w/ the fraders for EQ gain..)....seems
> > I can get my hands on a channel or 2 but they are not returnable....I'm
> > not gonna buy them if I can't get an idea if they are any good or not!
>
> FWIW, the new Toft ATC-2 seems to be a good measure better than the
> "Meek/Toft" box... I tried an early revision and it
> wasn't really anything to write home about.
> --
> Fletcher
> Mercenary Audio
> TEL: 508-543-0069
> FAX: 508-543-9670
> http://www.mercenary.com
> "this is not a problem"
>
>

[rich wells]

Gene Porfido > wrote in message > Appreciate the input. There is so much gear to look at that it's hard
> to decide. I better buy something before I waste the money on
> crap...like Rent -- food -- drugs..:-)
>
> Geno

Just wanted to post a small correction.

A couple friends opened their units and found that there is in fact a
fuse, it's just kind of hidden. It's located in a compartment in the
same housing where the IEC power cable connects to the mains in.

-Rick

[Mike Rivers]

In article > writes:

> A couple friends opened their units and found that there is in fact a
> fuse, it's just kind of hidden. It's located in a compartment in the
> same housing where the IEC power cable connects to the mains in.

An IEC power connector with a fuse is fairly common. You just have to
know that it's there. A good manual should tell you.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers - )

[Alan Hyatt]

It is a nice flavor, I agree with Dave on that, but the design was done by
Ted Fletcher, now of TF Pro after he had to bail out due to owed taxes.
Malcolm Toft never had anything to with the Trident-MTA A Range box. That
was all Ted's design disaster.

Dave knows the box in detail. Despite all of its design problems, it does
sound good. Not an original, that's for sure, but then again Ted lied about
a lot of things that was supposed to be in the box that was not. Dave and I
both had a good laugh when I found out the XLR's were not even grounded.

So, did Ted **** up the A range real bad...yes. Did he use a bunch of his
Joemeek designs in it...yes, but in the end, I will say it still sounded
pretty good, but designed badly enough to make me stay away from his
designs.

Now that we bought Joemeek and have redesigned the entire line, things will
be different, but only time will tell. Malcolm will do another real updated
A Range next year, but you can bet it will be right.

--
Alan Hyatt
PMI Audio Group
Joemeek Studio Projects Toft Audio Stephen Paul Microphones
23775 Madison Street
Torrance, CA 90505
toll free: 877-563-6335
e-mail:

Joemeek, Studio Projects and Toft Audio are Registered Trademarks Of PMI
Audio Group


"Dave Martin" > wrote in message
...
> No problem; there are definitely more useable preamps. But for what I paid
> for it, (certainly far less than $3500 - I don't know where that figure
came
> from...) the EQ adds a nice flavor.
>
> --
> Dave Martin
> Java Jive Studio
> Nashville, TN
> www.javajivestudio.com
>
> "Gene Porfido" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > Thanks Dave...thats the kinda useful info I need. I was looking for a
> > killer pre amp as well as great EQ..but if the Pre is a bit soft on
> > greatness, then I'll pass.
> > thanks
> > Geno
> >
>
>