Hey Roy rising (ecm50 question)

[Nate Najar]

How do you think the ECM 50 would do to capture for recording, in a live performance environment, upright bass in a jazz group (mounted hanging under the bridge)? I usually use dpa4060 for this and it works very well. But I've been doing a bunch of things lately where a piano is used and I only have 2 of those dpas and they work really well inside a piano. I could save a few hundred by not purchasing another dpa if I went with the sony, provided it gives similar performance.

Thanks for your thoughts!

N

[Scott Dorsey]

Nate Najar > wrote:
>How do you think the ECM 50 would do to capture for recording, in a live pe=
>rformance environment, upright bass in a jazz group (mounted hanging under =
>the bridge)? I usually use dpa4060 for this and it works very well. But I'=
>ve been doing a bunch of things lately where a piano is used and I only hav=
>e 2 of those dpas and they work really well inside a piano. I could save a=
> few hundred by not purchasing another dpa if I went with the sony, provide=
>d it gives similar performance. =20
>
>Thanks for your thoughts!

Take a 441 on a desk stand extended to perhaps a foot high, put it in front
of the bass pointing up at the bridge. Adjust the angle while listening
until it sounds right. There will be leakage which may turn out to be
problematic, but I think in a lot of situations you'll like it.

I am not a fan of the ECM50, but I think that your application is not going
to show huge differences between lav mikes and therefore an inexpensive one
might do fine. But try the 441 first.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Roy W. Rising[_2_]]

(Scott Dorsey) wrote:
> Nate Najar > wrote:
> >How do you think the ECM 50 would do to capture for recording, in a live
> >pe= rformance environment, upright bass in a jazz group (mounted hanging
> >under = the bridge)? I usually use dpa4060 for this and it works very
> >well. But I'= ve been doing a bunch of things lately where a piano is
> >used and I only hav= e 2 of those dpas and they work really well inside
> >a piano. I could save a=
> > few hundred by not purchasing another dpa if I went with the sony,
> >provide= d it gives similar performance. =20
> >
> >Thanks for your thoughts!
>
> Take a 441 on a desk stand extended to perhaps a foot high, put it in
> front of the bass pointing up at the bridge. Adjust the angle while
> listening until it sounds right. There will be leakage which may turn
> out to be problematic, but I think in a lot of situations you'll like it.
>
> I am not a fan of the ECM50, but I think that your application is not
> going to show huge differences between lav mikes and therefore an
> inexpensive one might do fine. But try the 441 first.
> --scott

Nate ~ I'll echo what Scott said. I miked Ray Brown and others using an EV
RE15 on an Atlas TS-8 Banquet Stand, placed as Scott describes. However,
the ECM-50 certainly is worth a shot. I think some of my de-commissioned
Sonys can be phantom powered. Let me know via email if you want any. I'll
investigate the power question if I hear from you.

--
~ Roy
"If you notice the sound, it's wrong!"

[Nate Najar]

Roy and Scott,

I agree 100% ... If I were to go that route I'd use one of my re15's, which have become nearly my favorite mics. But I've used them on proper record dates a few times on upright in a jazz group in the last year or so since I acquired them and they're absolutely perfect.

But one bass player I record a good bit live on location absolutely has to have a mic mounted to the instrument. A stand mounted mic will not do as he likes to move around s good deal- he often even picks up the fiddle and walks to the front of the bandstand!

Roy, how would I phantom power one of those ecm's?

Thanks!

N

[Mike Rivers]

On Monday, October 28, 2013 11:34:07 PM UTC-4, Nate Najar wrote:
> How do you think the ECM 50 would do to capture for recording, in a live performance environment, upright bass in a jazz group (mounted hanging under the bridge)?

An ECM-50 clipped to the strings between the bridge and tailpiece of a string bass was one of the folk festival standard miking techniques in the 1980s and '90s. It was a significant improvement over an SM-58 wrapped in foam or a towel and stuck under the tailpiece (which was the bluegrass standard until quite recently).

[Roy W. Rising[_2_]]

Nate Najar > wrote:
> Roy and Scott,
>
> I agree 100% ... If I were to go that route I'd use one of my re15's,
> which=
> have become nearly my favorite mics. But I've used them on proper
> record = dates a few times on upright in a jazz group in the last year or
> so since I=
> acquired them and they're absolutely perfect.=20
>
> But one bass player I record a good bit live on location absolutely has
> to = have a mic mounted to the instrument. A stand mounted mic will not
> do as h= e likes to move around s good deal- he often even picks up the
> fiddle and w= alks to the front of the bandstand! =20
>
> Roy, how would I phantom power one of those ecm's?
>
> Thanks!
>
> N

I'll check the batch I have and let you know. If memory serves, there was
a "Suffix-P" - or such - that was made for standard phantom power.

--
~ Roy
"If you notice the sound, it's wrong!"

[Scott Dorsey]

Roy W. Rising > wrote:
>Nate Najar > wrote:
>> Roy and Scott,
>>
>> Roy, how would I phantom power one of those ecm's?
>
>I'll check the batch I have and let you know. If memory serves, there was
>a "Suffix-P" - or such - that was made for standard phantom power.

If you have the non-phantom ones, it's possible to stack up standard button
batteries to replace the unavailable mercury bettery in there.

Also... a long, long time ago I used to have a phantom power modification
for those things. I will see if I can dig it up and if I can I'd be happy
to do it to your extra ones. I also had kits for T-power and to connect them
directly to a Uher 4000 Report-L. I was very proud of the Uher mod; I stole
power from the pause button input in order to power the mike.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Roy W. Rising[_2_]]

(Scott Dorsey) wrote:
> Roy W. Rising > wrote:
> >Nate Najar > wrote:
> >> Roy and Scott,
> >>
> >> Roy, how would I phantom power one of those ecm's?
> >
> >I'll check the batch I have and let you know. If memory serves, there
> >was a "Suffix-P" - or such - that was made for standard phantom power.
>
> If you have the non-phantom ones, it's possible to stack up standard
> button batteries to replace the unavailable mercury bettery in there.
>
> Also... a long, long time ago I used to have a phantom power modification
> for those things. I will see if I can dig it up and if I can I'd be
> happy to do it to your extra ones. I also had kits for T-power and to
> connect them directly to a Uher 4000 Report-L. I was very proud of the
> Uher mod; I stole power from the pause button input in order to power the
> mike. --scott

Thanks, Scott! I'll keep that in mind as I sort my hoard.

In 1970 I asked the ABC-TV Hollywood Lab folks to find a way to power the
ECM-50s directly from the Vega wireless transmitters. They did it and it
led the way for direct-powering the new world of electret mics.

--
~ Roy
"If you notice the sound, it's wrong!"

[hank alrich]

Nate Najar > wrote:

> How do you think the ECM 50 would do to capture for recording, in a live
>performance environment, upright bass in a jazz group (mounted hanging
>under the bridge)?

I have mounted a Countryman (the original very small omni offering) near
the end of the underside of the fingerboard extension and gotten
excellent results. It's so close to the instrument that bleed hasn't
been a problem, and the sound is quite natural.

--
shut up and play your guitar * HankAlrich.Com
HankandShaidriMusic.Com
YouTube.Com/WalkinayMusic

[Les Cargill[_4_]]

Jeff Henig wrote:
> hank alrich > wrote:
>> Nate Najar > wrote:
>>
>>> How do you think the ECM 50 would do to capture for recording, in a live
>>> performance environment, upright bass in a jazz group (mounted hanging
>>> under the bridge)?
>>
>> I have mounted a Countryman (the original very small omni offering) near
>> the end of the underside of the fingerboard extension and gotten
>> excellent results. It's so close to the instrument that bleed hasn't
>> been a problem, and the sound is quite natural.
>
>
> You mounted a Countryman? What did it do to your reputation?
>

Took a while - most taxidermists won't touch that sort of thing.

--
Les Cargill