I need a stereo mic bar

[Nate Najar]

well, possibly 2. I'm tapped and can't buy any more mics. and only
want to buy good ones anyway, and we know how expensive they are. so,
what I have for stereo recording possibility is a pair of schoeps
mk41, a pair of DPA 4061 (the mini omnis) and a THE hypercardioid that
i can do MS with a 414 in fig8.

Trio is in that same small hall next week (for those of you keeping
track at home, that's a classical guitar, upright bass and drumset) so
i'm going to attempt another recording. I was thinking the schoeps in
ortf (can you do hypercardioids in ortf?) on the drums as a spot, dpa
4061s for spots on the upright bass and guitar. I spent most of today
screwing around with microphones and found a way to mount that little
4061 mic on the guitar where I get a lot of direct sound, but it isn't
in the way of playing. and it isn't inside the guitar, so it actually
sounds like a guitar. It's just outside the soundhole, on the treble
side of the fingerboard, almost touching the fingerboard. kind of
where the fingerboard meets the rosette. sounds great in my little
project studio. surprisingly great. and super balanced. thank god
for sticky tack.

so that leaves the THE hypercardioid and 414 as a main pickup in MS.

OR should I use the schoeps for the main pair and the MS setup for the
drums?

that's first. next question, I need a way to mount this stuff.
what's a reasonably priced stereo bar that's easy to setup ortf with?

and is there a way to do the MS thing with a pencil mic and 414 from
one stand?

I've got a pretty good idea where to put an array for the drums, but
i'm not sure about the main pair. how close to the bandstand and how
high? the bandstand is only 6" off the floor in this room.

Thanks for all your consistent help....

N

[hank alrich]

Nate Najar > wrote:

> well, possibly 2. I'm tapped and can't buy any more mics. and only
> want to buy good ones anyway, and we know how expensive they are. so,
> what I have for stereo recording possibility is a pair of schoeps
> mk41, a pair of DPA 4061 (the mini omnis) and a THE hypercardioid that
> i can do MS with a 414 in fig8.
>
> Trio is in that same small hall next week (for those of you keeping
> track at home, that's a classical guitar, upright bass and drumset) so
> i'm going to attempt another recording. I was thinking the schoeps in
> ortf (can you do hypercardioids in ortf?) on the drums as a spot, dpa
> 4061s for spots on the upright bass and guitar. I spent most of today
> screwing around with microphones and found a way to mount that little
> 4061 mic on the guitar where I get a lot of direct sound, but it isn't
> in the way of playing. and it isn't inside the guitar, so it actually
> sounds like a guitar. It's just outside the soundhole, on the treble
> side of the fingerboard, almost touching the fingerboard. kind of
> where the fingerboard meets the rosette. sounds great in my little
> project studio. surprisingly great. and super balanced. thank god
> for sticky tack.
>
> so that leaves the THE hypercardioid and 414 as a main pickup in MS.
>
> OR should I use the schoeps for the main pair and the MS setup for the
> drums?

I'd try that first, because it would allow me to adust the aparent width
of the drums.

> that's first. next question, I need a way to mount this stuff.
> what's a reasonably priced stereo bar that's easy to setup ortf with?

http://tinyurl.com/45489wc

> and is there a way to do the MS thing with a pencil mic and 414 from
> one stand?

I think you could do that with the Shure A27M. The thing will enable a
whole lot of different mic pair positions. It can be confusing to deal
with at first but once you grok it it's pretty amazing. It's also quite
rugged. Don't drop it on your foot.

http://tinyurl.com/3gfuhg9

> I've got a pretty good idea where to put an array for the drums, but
> i'm not sure about the main pair. how close to the bandstand and how
> high? the bandstand is only 6" off the floor in this room.

This will come down to which appraoch you choose and how much room you
want versus direct sound. I generally find that the critical distance,
where direct and abient are equal, is a good starting place. Obivously,
that point relates to mics and patterns, etc.

Do you have any tall stands? I often like to put the pair up eight or
ten feet, but again, it all depends on mics and the room and what you
hear.

> Thanks for all your consistent help....
>
> N


--
shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpqXcV9DYAc
http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidriAlrichwithDougHarman

[Scott Dorsey]

Nate Najar > wrote:
>
>that's first. next question, I need a way to mount this stuff.
>what's a reasonably priced stereo bar that's easy to setup ortf with?

The AKG one is fine. Markertek stocks it.

>and is there a way to do the MS thing with a pencil mic and 414 from
>one stand?

Yes, you can do it with the same stereo bar.

>I've got a pretty good idea where to put an array for the drums, but
>i'm not sure about the main pair. how close to the bandstand and how
>high? the bandstand is only 6" off the floor in this room.

Stick a finger in your ear and listen.... the balances will change as you
move your head. When you find where the balances are right, put the mikes
there. Listen to the snare/tom/cymbal balance to start out with.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[[email protected]]

On 2011-04-27 (ScottDorsey) said:
>>I've got a pretty good idea where to put an array for the drums,
>>but i'm not sure about the main pair. how close to the bandstand
>>and how high? the bandstand is only 6" off the floor in this room.
>Stick a finger in your ear and listen.... the balances will change
>as you move your head. When you find where the balances are right,
>put the mikes there. Listen to the snare/tom/cymbal balance to
>start out with. --scott
That one might be on the order of pretty tough, as he's one
of the performers as well. Bring somebody along who knows
how to listen to do the move about with finger in ear thing
Nate.





Richard webb,

replace anything before at with elspider
ON site audio in the southland: see www.gatasound.com

[Arny Krueger]

"Nate Najar" > wrote in message


> well, possibly 2. I'm tapped and can't buy any more
> mics. and only want to buy good ones anyway, and we
> know how expensive they are. so, what I have for stereo
> recording possibility is a pair of schoeps mk41, a pair
> of DPA 4061 (the mini omnis) and a THE hypercardioid that
> i can do MS with a 414 in fig8.


I have several of these. Pretty adaptable:

http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/category.cgi?item=SP-DTS-10&source=froogle

[FL]

I've always found that a pair of these:

http://tinyurl.com/mic-clip

or these:

http://tinyurl.com/mic-clip-2

provide the greatest flexibility for mounting two microphones in a
stereo configuration. Most local music stores carry something like
this, and they're pretty inexpensive. On one of them, take out the
actual 5/8" knob and put it in the other way around, then you mount
one clip on the stand with the main mic stand mount part going up the
stand pipe, then mount the other clip with the mount part going down,
which allows the actual extender arms to be at the same level (or not
if you need to overlap the mics).

Good for X/Y, ORTF, NOS... One size fits all.

[geoff]

FL wrote:
> I've always found that a pair of these:
>
> http://tinyurl.com/mic-clip
>
> or these:
>
> http://tinyurl.com/mic-clip-2
>
> provide the greatest flexibility for mounting two microphones in a
> stereo configuration. Most local music stores carry something like
> this, and they're pretty inexpensive. On one of them, take out the
> actual 5/8" knob and put it in the other way around, then you mount
> one clip on the stand with the main mic stand mount part going up the
> stand pipe, then mount the other clip with the mount part going down,
> which allows the actual extender arms to be at the same level (or not
> if you need to overlap the mics).
>
> Good for X/Y, ORTF, NOS... One size fits all.

I have one each K&M 23510 and 23550. The former can be a little fiddly,
but very versatile. The second almost as versatile but less fiddly.

geoff

[Nate Najar]

On Apr 27, 12:03*am, Nate Najar > wrote:
> well, possibly 2. *I'm tapped and can't buy any more mics. *and *only
> want to buy good ones anyway, and we know how expensive they are. *so,
> what I have for stereo recording possibility is a pair of schoeps
> mk41, a pair of DPA 4061 (the mini omnis) and a THE hypercardioid that
> i can do MS with a 414 in fig8.
>
> Trio is in that same small hall next week (for those of you keeping
> track at home, that's a classical guitar, upright bass and drumset) so
> i'm going to attempt another recording. *I was thinking the schoeps in
> ortf (can you do hypercardioids in ortf?) on the drums as a spot, dpa
> 4061s for spots on the upright bass and guitar. *I spent most of today
> screwing around with microphones and found a way to mount that little
> 4061 mic on the guitar where I get a lot of direct sound, but it isn't
> in the way of playing. *and it isn't inside the guitar, so it actually
> sounds like a guitar. *It's just outside the soundhole, on the treble
> side of the fingerboard, almost touching the fingerboard. *kind of
> where the fingerboard meets the rosette. *sounds great in my little
> project studio. *surprisingly great. *and super balanced. *thank god
> for sticky tack.
>
> so that leaves the THE hypercardioid and 414 as a main pickup in MS.
>
> OR should I use the schoeps for the main pair and the MS setup for the
> drums?
>
> that's first. *next question, I need a way to mount this stuff.
> what's a reasonably priced stereo bar that's easy to setup ortf with?
>
> and is there a way to do the MS thing with a pencil mic and 414 from
> one stand?
>
> I've got a pretty good idea where to put an array for the drums, but
> i'm not sure about the main pair. *how close to the bandstand and how
> high? *the bandstand is only 6" off the floor in this room.
>
> Thanks for all your consistent help....
>
> N

ok I ordered 2 of the shure bars are 2 of the akg bars. we'll see how
I do.....

thanks for the suggestions!

N

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

Nate Najar wrote:

> ok I ordered 2 of the shure bars are 2 of the akg bars. we'll see how
> I do.....

Before you play a concert with your guitar you practice. You should also so
do with a mic bar and a pair of mics so as to learn how varyting the angle
between the microphones as well as their distance influence the stereo
image. Search term: "the stereophonic zoom".

Some folks say that you should vary the distance between mic pair and sound
source in accordance with the capsule-directivity, the narrower a room angle
pickup up the further away you should be. I disagree, there is one good
focal point for an ensemble and that is where the pair should be. Note:
capsule directivity and pair directivity are not quite identical issues,
which is why you need to read that AES paper and practice deploying a pair.

Generally I have stopped advocating using pairs for spot miking, simply
because an extra mic just tends to be extra imaging problems, but but I
recently remixed - just to see if I had gotten better at getting arrival
time right - an oratorio recording where I used a pair for the soloists to
save stage real-estate and it worked very will in terms of providing
reasonably stable soloists images with not too many added bass range
fuzkerk-issues; those will be worse with more separation between the soloist
spot-mikes. So yes, it can be a very useful way to deploy also spot-mikes
that actually are on different sound sources.

> N

Kind regards

Peter Larsen