Recommended Home Speakers Around $500/pr

[david correia]

I am out of touch about what's really good on the market today. What's
today's version of a Polk 10b? Recommendations for rock/acoustic music
listening around this price point.




David Correia
www.Celebrationsound.com

[William Sommerwerck]

"Rock" and "acoustic" are not the same thing. (They are, in theory,
antithetical.) For the past 20 years or so, designers have been moving in
the direction of genuinely accurate speakers, without euphonic colorations.
*

You're going to have to listen to decide exactly what you want -- no one can
do this for you. Find a good dealer and bring some familiar recordings.

As a starting point, try B&W. Their products provide -- to my ears -- an
unusual combination of accuracy and a /lack/ of insipidity. Whether there is
a $500 pair of B&Ws that will satisfy you, I don't know. That's why you have
to listen.

* It's a shame KLH Audio isn't still in business. They made good, cheap
speakers. The chief designer told me that their speakers were as accurate as
could be made at a given price point, with the only conecession to "taste" a
slightly higher bass Q than what was "correct" for added "punch".

[david correia]

In article >,
"William Sommerwerck" > wrote:

> "Rock" and "acoustic" are not the same thing. (They are, in theory,
> antithetical.) For the past 20 years or so, designers have been moving in
> the direction of genuinely accurate speakers, without euphonic colorations.
> *
>
> You're going to have to listen to decide exactly what you want -- no one can
> do this for you. Find a good dealer and bring some familiar recordings.
>
> As a starting point, try B&W. Their products provide -- to my ears -- an
> unusual combination of accuracy and a /lack/ of insipidity. Whether there is
> a $500 pair of B&Ws that will satisfy you, I don't know. That's why you have
> to listen.
>
> * It's a shame KLH Audio isn't still in business. They made good, cheap
> speakers. The chief designer told me that their speakers were as accurate as
> could be made at a given price point, with the only conecession to "taste" a
> slightly higher bass Q than what was "correct" for added "punch".



Thanks for letting me know that rock and acoustic are not the same
thing. I'm probably gonna have a hard time getting to sleep tonight tho'.

And thanks for telling me that I should be listening to speakers. I've
been buying them to put family photos on.

Which T shirt should I wear today?




David Correia
www.Celebrationsound.com

[William Sommerwerck]

>> "Rock" and "acoustic" are not the same thing. (They are, in
>> theory, antithetical.) For the past 20 years or so, designers
>> have been moving in the direction of genuinely accurate
>> speakers, without euphonic colorations. *

>> You're going to have to listen to decide exactly what you want
>> -- no one can do this for you. Find a good dealer and bring some
>> familiar recordings.

>> As a starting point, try B&W. Their products provide -- to my
>> ears -- an unusual combination of accuracy and a /lack/ of
>> insipidity. Whether there is a $500 pair of B&Ws that will
>> satisfy you, I don't know. That's why you have to listen.

>> * It's a shame KLH Audio isn't still in business. They made
>> good, cheap speakers. The chief designer told me that their
>> speakers were as accurate as could be made at a given price
>> point, with the only conecession to "taste" a slightly higher
>> bass Q than what was "correct" for added "punch".


> Thanks for letting me know that rock and acoustic are not the same
> thing. I'm probably gonna have a hard time getting to sleep tonight tho'.

> And thanks for telling me that I should be listening to speakers. I've
> been buying them to put family photos on.

I hope the preceding is simply ill-considered humor. If not, I shouldn't
have wasted my time with any advice at all. I find that people generally ask
the wrong questions, so I like pointing them in the right direction.

Don't ask for advice, then throw it back in the giver's face, when it's not
what you wanted to hear. You are not "damn nice folks".

By the way, I posted my advice before looking at your site or knowing who
you were. I am especially surprised that you asked for advice, as you
shouldn't need it. You either know what's good, or you know what you want.
Why bother to ask?


> Which T shirt should I wear today?

Any one with Jack and Ennis on it, though my preference is for Ennis
standing behind Jack, his arm around him.

[Scott Dorsey]

david correia > wrote:
>I am out of touch about what's really good on the market today. What's
>today's version of a Polk 10b? Recommendations for rock/acoustic music
>listening around this price point.

Do you want to buy speakers or do you want to recommend speakers to someone
else?

If you want to recommend something to someone else, let me say that because
the Canadian National Research Council provides free acoustical engineering
assistance and facilities to speaker manufacturers (as part of a government
plan to boost the Canadian lumber industry), there are some excellent cheap
Canadian speakers. Look for companies like Energy and PSB.

I'll also say that NHT makes some really nice speakers in that price range.

If you want to buy something yourself, I suggest you buy something used
and get more for your money. If you troll Ebay, you will find plenty of
Tannoy dual-concentric speakers well under that price range; they are great
systems for casual listening if you like a very forward sound, and I think
you'd find something you really enjoy. Sometimes I have seen the Tannoy
all-weather dual-concentrics on Ebay for under $100 each.

Oh, also $400 will buy the bottom of the line Magnepans... and because the
audiophile crowd is always into the latest thing and is dumping last year's
thing at a fraction of the price, you can buy last year's Magnepans on the
used market at a great discount.

Part of the problem is that the market has fragmented... there is cheap crap
and expensive stuff and it can be hard to find stuff in-between.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Laurence Payne[_2_]]

On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 06:57:29 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
> wrote:

>By the way, I posted my advice before looking at your site or knowing who
>you were. I am especially surprised that you asked for advice, as you
>shouldn't need it. You either know what's good, or you know what you want.
>Why bother to ask?

Because he's lost touch with what's good in that price range? It's
like when people ask for advice in using "lite" versions of software.
They often draw a blank (or get inappropriate advice) because those
who know the answers wouldn't have been hands-on with the lite
version.

[William Sommerwerck]

>> By the way, I posted my advice before looking at your site or
>> knowing who you were. I am especially surprised that you asked
>> for advice, as you shouldn't need it. You either know what's good,
>> or you know what you want. Why bother to ask?

> Because he's lost touch with what's good in that price range? It's
> like when people ask for advice in using "lite" versions of software.
> They often draw a blank (or get inappropriate advice) because those
> who know the answers wouldn't have been hands-on with the lite
> version.

But I don't see what that has to do with anything. The OP gave no
criteria -- objective or subjective -- for what comprises "good" (assuming
"good" was what he was looking for). His /only/ criteria were price, and
that the speaker be suitable for antithetical types of music.

The posting was typical of 99% of posts asking for advice -- the poster told
us (almost) nothing whatever about what he was looking for or why. That's
why most requests result in poor advice and acrimonious arguments. I have
zero sympathy for people who are too lazy to spell out "what" and "why". I
can't read their minds.

[hank alrich]

William Sommerwerck > wrote:

> "Rock" and "acoustic" are not the same thing.

They certainly can be. Put the right acoustic guitar in the right hands
and record it to get a powerful rhythm sound, along with a plywood
upright bass, a bass player who can deliver the goods, and the
appropriate drum kit and player, and you have all acoustic sources, and
rock.

--
shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/
http://armadillomusicproductions.com/who'slistening.html
http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidriAlrichwithDougHarman

[hank alrich]

William Sommerwerck > wrote:

<snip>

> By the way, I posted my advice before looking at your site or knowing who
> you were. I am especially surprised that you asked for advice, as you
> shouldn't need it. You either know what's good, or you know what you want.
> Why bother to ask?

David is fully employed. He spends a lot of time working at his studio.
He doesn't go hang around consumer audio stores, or mess with audiopile
magazines.

He has been posting here for a very long time. That you were unaware of
who he is and what he does is remarkable.

--
shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/
http://armadillomusicproductions.com/who'slistening.html
http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidriAlrichwithDougHarman

[William Sommerwerck]

>> By the way, I posted my advice before looking at your site
>> or knowing who you were. I am especially surprised that you
>> asked for advice, as you shouldn't need it. You either know
>> what's good, or you know what you want. Why bother to ask?

> David is fully employed. He spends a lot of time working at his
> studio. He doesn't go hang around consumer audio stores, or
> mess with audiopile magazines.

> He has been posting here for a very long time. That you were
> unaware of who he is and what he does is remarkable.

MY ignorance of HIS business does not justify HIS poorly defined request for
assistance.

Let him clearly state what he needs, and why, and I'm sure someone will be
able to supply useful information.

[Laurence Payne[_2_]]

On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 09:34:39 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
> wrote:

>> Because he's lost touch with what's good in that price range? It's
>> like when people ask for advice in using "lite" versions of software.
>> They often draw a blank (or get inappropriate advice) because those
>> who know the answers wouldn't have been hands-on with the lite
>> version.
>
>But I don't see what that has to do with anything. The OP gave no
>criteria -- objective or subjective -- for what comprises "good" (assuming
>"good" was what he was looking for). His /only/ criteria were price, and
>that the speaker be suitable for antithetical types of music.
>
>The posting was typical of 99% of posts asking for advice -- the poster told
>us (almost) nothing whatever about what he was looking for or why. That's
>why most requests result in poor advice and acrimonious arguments. I have
>zero sympathy for people who are too lazy to spell out "what" and "why". I
>can't read their minds.

You have zero sympathy for EVERYTHING, William :-) Want to f*** off
from this group too?

[Don Pearce[_3_]]

On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 10:06:37 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
> wrote:

>>> By the way, I posted my advice before looking at your site
>>> or knowing who you were. I am especially surprised that you
>>> asked for advice, as you shouldn't need it. You either know
>>> what's good, or you know what you want. Why bother to ask?
>
>> David is fully employed. He spends a lot of time working at his
>> studio. He doesn't go hang around consumer audio stores, or
>> mess with audiopile magazines.
>
>> He has been posting here for a very long time. That you were
>> unaware of who he is and what he does is remarkable.
>
>MY ignorance of HIS business does not justify HIS poorly defined request for
>assistance.
>
>Let him clearly state what he needs, and why, and I'm sure someone will be
>able to supply useful information.
>

I think you are being quite unfair. Had he been in a position to
enunciate his requirements as exactly as you demand, he probably would
not have needed to post his request in the first place. The way these
things work is that the first vague post is made, then as the
suggestion roll in, a consensus starts to emerge as each new post
helps him refine his need - hopefully to the point where he really
understands what he wants, and why he wants it.

Maybe you live your life in certainty. I feel sorry for you if you do,
because you are missing out on 90% of the fun of being human.

d

[Arny Krueger]

"david correia" > wrote in message

> I am out of touch about what's really good on the market
> today. What's today's version of a Polk 10b?
> Recommendations for rock/acoustic music listening around
> this price point.

They are sold as powered studio monitors, but I have a number of friends who
use them as home speakers, in groups of up to 7:

Behringer B2031A. For the left over $250, you might be able to build a
decent subwoofer...

[Laurence Payne[_2_]]

On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 10:06:37 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
> wrote:

>MY ignorance of HIS business does not justify HIS poorly defined request for
>assistance.
>
>Let him clearly state what he needs, and why, and I'm sure someone will be
>able to supply useful information.

He did.

"I am out of touch about what's really good on the market today.
What's today's version of a Polk 10b? Recommendations for
rock/acoustic music listening around this price point."

Perfectly clear. Reason given. Not good enough for William, but then
what ever is?

[hank alrich]

William Sommerwerck > wrote:

> >> By the way, I posted my advice before looking at your site or
> >> knowing who you were. I am especially surprised that you asked
> >> for advice, as you shouldn't need it. You either know what's good,
> >> or you know what you want. Why bother to ask?
>
> > Because he's lost touch with what's good in that price range? It's
> > like when people ask for advice in using "lite" versions of software.
> > They often draw a blank (or get inappropriate advice) because those
> > who know the answers wouldn't have been hands-on with the lite
> > version.
>
> But I don't see what that has to do with anything. The OP gave no
> criteria -- objective or subjective -- for what comprises "good" (assuming
> "good" was what he was looking for). His /only/ criteria were price, and
> that the speaker be suitable for antithetical types of music.

A good speaker is a good speaker. I have mixed hard rock and solo
acoustic on the same set of speakers. I am not able to consider music so
simply described as "rock" or "acoustic" as "antithetical". I also use
the same pair of ears to listen all the music I hear.

> The posting was typical of 99% of posts asking for advice -- the poster told
> us (almost) nothing whatever about what he was looking for or why. That's
> why most requests result in poor advice and acrimonious arguments. I have
> zero sympathy for people who are too lazy to spell out "what" and "why". I
> can't read their minds.

Like I said, David has been posting here for a long time. I don't need
for him to describe speaker characteristics, which is a bit, in my own
mind, like dancing about architecture. I might appreciate that dance,
but I will probably remain clueless about the building itself.

The likely culprits to deliver an informed response here are people who
listen to and appreciate a wide range of music, including the rather
vast range of material labelled "rock", and have some knowledge of
what's available in his targeted price range.

Once upon a time I might have suggested something from Paradigm, but I
haven't heard their current offerings and I have read some comments that
suggest they might not be as good, period, or as good a value/price line
as they were a few years ago. They, too, came up through the Canadian
efforts Scott mentioned in this thread.

--
shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/
http://armadillomusicproductions.com/who'slistening.html
http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidriAlrichwithDougHarman

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

david correia wrote:

> I am out of touch about what's really good on the market today. What's
> today's version of a Polk 10b? Recommendations for rock/acoustic music
> listening around this price point.

I'm very fond of my KEF Q15's, they are not the most recent model, probably
a couple of versions back. I paid the equivalent of USD 200 for the first
pair and when I found one on offer at the equivalent of USD 120 I rushed and
got it for rear channel use.

> David Correia
> www.Celebrationsound.com


Kind regards

Peter Larsen

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

William Sommerwerck wrote:

> MY ignorance of HIS business does not justify HIS poorly defined
> request for assistance.

> Let him clearly state what he needs, and why, and I'm sure someone
> will be able to supply useful information.

He asked for budget home speakers and defined a budget range, the only
parameter that was left undefined was size of room.


Kind regards

Peter Larsen

[William Sommerwerck]

> You have zero sympathy for EVERYTHING, William :-)
> Want to f*** off from this group too?

No, I have great sympathy for people who have real problems, and make the
effort to express them clearly. People who ask poor questions shouldn't
throw the answers back in the face of the person who tried to help them.

[William Sommerwerck]

> I think you are being quite unfair. Had he been in a position to
> enunciate his requirements as exactly as you demand, he
> probably would not have needed to post his request in the
> first place.

So I'm wrong in telling him he should go out and listen? Perhaps /he's/
missing the fun of shopping for speakers.

[PStamler]

Over the years, I've found Phase Technology makes decent speakers in
most price ranges. Not flashy, not heavy-duty marketing, but they were
among the few lower-priced speakers I heard that didn't have harsh
highs.

I haven't heard them for a few years, ever since the dealer I used to
be the service manager for closed his store, but what I heard between
1982 and 2002, I liked better than the price-equivalent competition.

Peace,
Paul

[William Sommerwerck]

> He asked for budget home speakers and defined a budget range,
> the only parameter that was left undefined was size of room.

Actually, he said NOTHING about where the speakers would be used. He might
have been asking for speakers to use in the studio -- for monitoring mixes
on less-than-SOTA speakers, or letting customers hear what their recordings
sounded like on an "average" system.

[Laurence Payne[_2_]]

On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 11:33:05 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
> wrote:

>> He asked for budget home speakers and defined a budget range,
>> the only parameter that was left undefined was size of room.
>
>Actually, he said NOTHING about where the speakers would be used. He might
>have been asking for speakers to use in the studio -- for monitoring mixes
>on less-than-SOTA speakers, or letting customers hear what their recordings
>sounded like on an "average" system.

And if he had, you'd have criticised him for something else. We're
wise to you, billy-boy :-)

[William Sommerwerck]

Here is my original response, which is not rude (though possibly a bit
"emphatic", and even a little patronizing). Note that I recommended a
specific brand, because I thought it would likely meet the OP's seemingly
contradictory needs. (I would not, for example, recommend any number of
artsy-fartsy audiophile brands.)


"Rock" and "acoustic" are not the same thing. (They are, in theory,
antithetical.) For the past 20 years or so, designers have been moving in
the direction of genuinely accurate speakers, without euphonic colorations.

You're going to have to listen to decide exactly what you want -- no one
can do this for you. Find a good dealer and bring some familiar recordings.

As a starting point, try B&W. Their products provide -- to my ears -- an
unusual combination of accuracy and a /lack/ of insipidity. Whether there is
a $500 pair of B&Ws that will satisfy you, I don't know. That's why you have
to listen.


And here is the rude response from a man who bills his company as "damn nice
folks"...

> Thanks for letting me know that rock and acoustic are not the same
> thing. I'm probably gonna have a hard time getting to sleep tonight tho'.

> And thanks for telling me that I should be listening to speakers. I've
> been buying them to put family photos on.

> Which T shirt should I wear today?


When someone gives you good advice, based on many years of reviewing and
recording, don't kick them in the teeth. If anyone owes anyone an apology,
I'm not the ower.

[William Sommerwerck]

> >> He asked for budget home speakers and defined a budget range,
> >> the only parameter that was left undefined was size of room.

> >Actually, he said NOTHING about where the speakers would be used. He
might
> >have been asking for speakers to use in the studio -- for monitoring
mixes
> >on less-than-SOTA speakers, or letting customers hear what their
recordings
> >sounded like on an "average" system.

> And if he had, you'd have criticised him for something else. We're
> wise to you, billy-boy :-)

You're not wise about anything, Mr Payne. You won't admit that I gave a
reasonable and useful response, but the OP flipped me off. See my other
posting.

By the way... I sometimes see postings in groups -- such as
rec.antiques.radio+phono or sci.electronics.repair -- where the poster gives
a perfect description of their problem, and what they had already done to
resolve it. It is an absolute pleasure to read (and respond to) such
postings. They can and do exist.

[Laurence Payne[_2_]]

On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 11:41:12 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
> wrote:

>
>When someone gives you good advice, based on many years of reviewing and
>recording, don't kick them in the teeth. If anyone owes anyone an apology,
>I'm not the ower.
>

Yup. You're faultless as always. Guess it must just be your
personality that riles people.

[William Sommerwerck]

> Once upon a time I might have suggested something from Paradigm, but I
> haven't heard their current offerings and I have read some comments that
> suggest they might not be as good, period, or as good a value/price line
> as they were a few years ago. They, too, came up through the Canadian
> efforts Scott mentioned in this thread.

And I suggested B&W, did I not, pointing out that they were basically
accurate ("acoustic") and not-insipid ("rock")? And the OP throws it back in
my face.

"You people" have a perverse idea of who, exactly, is being rude. I answered
him usefully and courteously within the limited amount of information he
gave me, and he kicked me in the teeth. Then everyone gathered 'round and
started kicking the stray dog.

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

William Sommerwerck wrote:

>> He asked for budget home speakers and defined a budget range,
>> the only parameter that was left undefined was size of room.

> Actually, he said NOTHING about where the speakers would be used.

Correct. But it doesn't matter and some implications about room size can be
drawn from budget range. Something good and affordable is asked for, and it
doesn't matter whether they are for the studio lounge or for some living
room in some context.

> He
> might have been asking for speakers to use in the studio -- for
> monitoring mixes on less-than-SOTA speakers, or letting customers
> hear what their recordings sounded like on an "average" system.

Correct, but it would still be Home Speakers as pr. the subject header.

No point in speculating about what truly doesn't matter.

And as for the speakers for genre concept ... nah, Ritchie Blackmore or
Pergolesi go well on the same speakers in this here household, the concept
of speakers for genre only ever was an excuse for selling poor quality
anyway.


Kind regards

Peter Larsen

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

William Sommerwerck wrote:

> As a starting point, try B&W. Their products provide -- to my ears --
> an unusual combination of accuracy and a /lack/ of insipidity.
> Whether there is a $500 pair of B&Ws that will satisfy you, I don't
> know. That's why you have to listen.


Yes, they are also an interesting brand to listen to. I read the question as
one of something that would be good enough to order by phone or craigslist
or ebay sans using any more time for the selection process.


Kind regards

Peter Larsen

[Scott Dorsey]

> Once upon a time I might have suggested something from Paradigm, but I
> haven't heard their current offerings and I have read some comments that
> suggest they might not be as good, period, or as good a value/price line
> as they were a few years ago. They, too, came up through the Canadian
> efforts Scott mentioned in this thread.

Some of the Paradigm speakers are great, some of them (like the Atom and
Titan) have really annoying dome tweeter spittiness. I don't think anything
they are currently making sounds as clean as the Mini Mk. II did, but
I'd give them a listen also.
--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Arny Krueger]

"Peter Larsen" > wrote in message
k
> david correia wrote:
>
>> I am out of touch about what's really good on the market
>> today. What's today's version of a Polk 10b?
>> Recommendations for rock/acoustic music listening around
>> this price point.
>
> I'm very fond of my KEF Q15's, they are not the most
> recent model, probably a couple of versions back. I paid
> the equivalent of USD 200 for the first pair and when I
> found one on offer at the equivalent of USD 120 I rushed
> and got it for rear channel use.

IMO a good choice. I've gotten a lot of enjoyment out of my pair of Q15s. I
paid about 3-and-a quarter for my pair back in the day.

[hank alrich]

PStamler > wrote:

> Over the years, I've found Phase Technology makes decent speakers in
> most price ranges. Not flashy, not heavy-duty marketing, but they were
> among the few lower-priced speakers I heard that didn't have harsh
> highs.
>
> I haven't heard them for a few years, ever since the dealer I used to
> be the service manager for closed his store, but what I heard between
> 1982 and 2002, I liked better than the price-equivalent competition.
>
> Peace,
> Paul

Thanks, Paul. I'd never heard fo those.

--
shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/
http://armadillomusicproductions.com/who'slistening.html
http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidriAlrichwithDougHarman

[Dale A. Francis]

On Jul 24, 9:31*pm, david correia > wrote:
> I am out of touch about what's really good on the market today. What's
> today's version of a Polk 10b? Recommendations for rock/acoustic music
> listening around this price point.
>
> David Correiawww.Celebrationsound.com

well, you have a lot of leads and some contrite bs ... you can find
some nice used here
<http://www.audiogon.com/>

[GregS[_3_]]

In article >, (Scott Dorsey) wrote:
>david correia > wrote:
>>I am out of touch about what's really good on the market today. What's
>>today's version of a Polk 10b? Recommendations for rock/acoustic music
>>listening around this price point.
>
>Do you want to buy speakers or do you want to recommend speakers to someone
>else?
>
>If you want to recommend something to someone else, let me say that because
>the Canadian National Research Council provides free acoustical engineering
>assistance and facilities to speaker manufacturers (as part of a government
>plan to boost the Canadian lumber industry), there are some excellent cheap
>Canadian speakers. Look for companies like Energy and PSB.
>
>I'll also say that NHT makes some really nice speakers in that price range.
>
>If you want to buy something yourself, I suggest you buy something used
>and get more for your money. If you troll Ebay, you will find plenty of
>Tannoy dual-concentric speakers well under that price range; they are great
>systems for casual listening if you like a very forward sound, and I think
>you'd find something you really enjoy. Sometimes I have seen the Tannoy
>all-weather dual-concentrics on Ebay for under $100 each.
>
>Oh, also $400 will buy the bottom of the line Magnepans... and because the
>audiophile crowd is always into the latest thing and is dumping last year's
>thing at a fraction of the price, you can buy last year's Magnepans on the
>used market at a great discount.
>
>Part of the problem is that the market has fragmented... there is cheap crap
>and expensive stuff and it can be hard to find stuff in-between.

Scott's right.

Looking at their replacement at $1700
http://www.polkaudio.com/homeaudio/lsi/index.php?s=lsi15

[Mark]

what IS it about Usenet that gets otherwise civil and intelligent
people to fighting with each other?

Mark

[William Sommerwerck]

> What IS it about Usenet that gets otherwise civil
> and intelligent people to fighting with each other?

Who says /any/ of us are intelligent or civil?

It's not UseNet, per se. It has something to do with the physical anonymity
of public posting. Because no one can punch you in the nose, you're not
afraid to say what you think, even if it isn't carefully considered.

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

Mark wrote:

> what IS it about Usenet that gets otherwise civil and intelligent
> people to fighting with each other?

Summer.

> Mark

Kind regards

Peter Larsen

[nebulax]

On Jul 25, 4:21*pm, (hank alrich) wrote:
> PStamler > wrote:
> > Over the years, I've found Phase Technology makes decent speakers in
> > most price ranges. Not flashy, not heavy-duty marketing, but they were
> > among the few lower-priced speakers I heard that didn't have harsh
> > highs.
>
> > I haven't heard them for a few years, ever since the dealer I used to
> > be the service manager for closed his store, but what I heard between
> > 1982 and 2002, I liked better than the price-equivalent competition.
>
> > Peace,
> > Paul
>
> Thanks, Paul. I'd never heard fo those.
>
> --

I've liked the Phase Technology speakers I've heard over the years
too, but it's danged hard to find a dealer that you could actually
listen to a pair at these days. Actually, it's danged hard to find a
dealer to listen to ANY speaker at these days, because most of them
have either shut their doors, or have transitioned over to doing
'installations by appointment', which means they most likely won't
even have a demo room at all.

-Neb

[Jay Ts[_2_]]

William Sommerwerck wrote:
>> What IS it about Usenet that gets otherwise civil and intelligent
>> people to fighting with each other?
>
> Who says /any/ of us are intelligent or civil?
>
> It's not UseNet, per se. It has something to do with the physical
> anonymity of public posting. Because no one can punch you in the nose,
> you're not afraid to say what you think, even if it isn't carefully
> considered.

All true. And it's the basic design of Usenet itself that is
conducive to this. It connects people from all over the world,
from different cultures and beliefs. If they were in the same
room, maybe they would naturally avoid each other.

And the connection is just plain text, with little other than
emoticons to express emotion and feeling. It's an informal system,
allowing people to post sometimes a little too easily, without
thinking, or considering how what they write might be taken.

Basically, it's a recipe for disaster. :-)

On the other hand, Usenet and the Internet get people connected
who would otherwise never meet, allowing them to share thoughts
and ideas in ways never before possible. Even with the very low
signal-to-noise levels of today's Usenet, IMO it is still worthwhile.

Jay Ts

[Jay Ts[_2_]]

david correia wrote:
> I am out of touch about what's really good on the market today.

Same here, due to the lack of "brick and mortar" Hi-Fi stores.
So like most anyone else, I'm left with shopping on the Internet,
and that doesn't work for speakers. Buying speakers is like buying
clothes. Your personal tastes are just as important as specifications.
Buying clothes on the Internet works a lot better because they are
lighter in weight and easier to return!

The last time I went to a store to compare speakers, I ended up
in (OMG) Guitar Center comparing Mackie HR824s to Event 20/20bas's.
It seems like eons ago. I got the Events (actually the passive
20/20 model) because the Mackies didn't sound much better to
me and were more than twice as expensive.

But now they are available used on eBay, and I saw some of the
original model of HR824s for about $500-550 per pair. And the
Event 20/20bas's are much cheaper. I was surprised to see the
20/20bas powered model going for about the same price as the
passive 20/20's, at about $150 or so per pair. However, it is
difficult to get them in good condition, due to very thin
and delicate outer covering material.

I have no idea if any of those would do it for you -- and I
expect maybe not, in the case of the Events -- but they are
in the price range, and I thought I might add in.

Jay Ts

[Cyberserf[_2_]]

On Jul 24, 9:31*pm, david correia > wrote:
> I am out of touch about what's really good on the market today. What's
> today's version of a Polk 10b? Recommendations for rock/acoustic music
> listening around this price point.
>
> David Correiawww.Celebrationsound.com

Just an aside, you can probably still get a pair of 10b on the net for
under $500...they come up on eBay now and again and other places such
as:

http://www.canuckaudiomart.com/details/144039-polk_audio_monitor_10b_speakers/

Luck, CS

[Paul Kotheimer]

On Jul 25, 2:45*pm, Laurence Payne > wrote:
> On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 11:41:12 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
>
> > wrote:
>
> >When someone gives you good advice, based on many years of reviewing and
> >recording, don't kick them in the teeth. If anyone owes anyone an apology,
> >I'm not the ower.
>
> Yup. *You're faultless as always. Guess it must just be your
> personality that riles people.

Jesus you people need to meditate or something. I saw the subject
line and expected to see 40 replies about speaker recommendations,
instead there's this completely inane ego-war from hell.

[William Sommerwerck]

>>> When someone gives you good advice, based on many years
>>> of reviewing and recording, don't kick them in the teeth. If anyone
>>> owes anyone an apology, I'm not the ower.

>> Yup. You're faultless as always. Guess it must just be your
>> personality that riles people.

> Jesus, you people need to meditate or something. I saw the subject
> line and expected to see 40 replies about speaker recommendations,
> instead there's this completely inane ego-war from hell.

In addition to my maliciously rejected suggestions, there were other
worthwhile comments. It was the OP who started it all.

[Don Pearce[_3_]]

On Tue, 27 Jul 2010 10:48:10 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
> wrote:

>It was the OP who started it all.

That one goes on the wall of fame.

d

[GregS[_3_]]

In article >, "William Sommerwerck" > wrote:
>>>> When someone gives you good advice, based on many years
>>>> of reviewing and recording, don't kick them in the teeth. If anyone
>>>> owes anyone an apology, I'm not the ower.
>
>>> Yup. You're faultless as always. Guess it must just be your
>>> personality that riles people.
>
>> Jesus, you people need to meditate or something. I saw the subject
>> line and expected to see 40 replies about speaker recommendations,
>> instead there's this completely inane ego-war from hell.
>
>In addition to my maliciously rejected suggestions, there were other
>worthwhile comments. It was the OP who started it all.


Its been a long time since people bought full range speakers for
their home. Its true there is more low and high priced ranged speakers.
Full range meaning at least an 8 inch or larger woofer. Getting
one for reasonable volume at 40 Hz is the trick.

At least I showed on example.

I think it was the JBL LX-44 I last bought used real cheap for home.
I modified the HF crossover network and tightned screws and
terminals, and treated the cones. I like it real well. I think I paid $50.
A nice lady greated me at the lovely house when I picked them up, from a Pennysaver add.
I'm sure she was glad to see them go. Hubby not home.

You never see floor speakers in those TV home shows.

greg

[hank alrich]

Don Pearce > wrote:

> On Tue, 27 Jul 2010 10:48:10 -0700, "William Sommerwerck"
> > wrote:
>
> >It was the OP who started it all.
>
> That one goes on the wall of fame.
>
> d

<!>

"I started out as a child"...

--
shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/
http://armadillomusicproductions.com/who'slistening.html
http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidriAlrichwithDougHarman

[Anahata]

On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 18:12:13 +0100, Laurence Payne wrote:

> You have zero sympathy for EVERYTHING, William :-) Want to f*** off
> from this group too?

Your killfile is your friend.
Well, mine is, anyway.

--
Anahata
--/-- http://www.treewind.co.uk
+44 (0)1638 720444

[William Sommerwerck]

> "I started out as a child"...

And when I became a man, I put away childish things.

[Cyberserf[_2_]]

On Jul 28, 8:12*am, "William Sommerwerck" >
wrote:
> > "I started out as a child"...
>
> And when I became a man, I put away childish things.

Really? I kept my red Converse and BB gun...hehehe ;-)

-CS

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

Cyberserf wrote:

> On Jul 28, 8:12 am, "William Sommerwerck" >
> wrote:

>>> "I started out as a child"...

>> And when I became a man, I put away childish things.

> Really? I kept my red Converse and BB gun...hehehe ;-)

It is much better to remember that you are the same you, and to be True to
yourself, than to think you have "grown up".

> -CS

Kind regards

Peter Larsen

[Ron Capik[_3_]]

Peter Larsen wrote:
> Cyberserf wrote:
>
>> On Jul 28, 8:12 am, "William Sommerwerck" >
>> wrote:
>
>>>> "I started out as a child"...
>
>>> And when I became a man, I put away childish things.
>
>> Really? I kept my red Converse and BB gun...hehehe ;-)
>
> It is much better to remember that you are the same you, and to be True to
> yourself, than to think you have "grown up".
>
>> -CS
>
> Kind regards
>
> Peter Larsen
>
Reminds me of C. S. Lewis' use
of the quote:

[ ... ] to carry on into middle life or even into early
manhood this concern about being adult is a mark of really
arrested development. [ ... ] When I became a man I put away
childish things, including the fear of childishness and the
desire to be very grown up.
==

....ah, but what the heck do I know.


Later...
Ron Capik
--

[david correia]

In article >,
"Peter Larsen" > wrote:

> david correia wrote:
>
> > I am out of touch about what's really good on the market today. What's
> > today's version of a Polk 10b? Recommendations for rock/acoustic music
> > listening around this price point.
>
> I'm very fond of my KEF Q15's, they are not the most recent model, probably
> a couple of versions back. I paid the equivalent of USD 200 for the first
> pair and when I found one on offer at the equivalent of USD 120 I rushed and
> got it for rear channel use.
>
> > David Correia
> > www.Celebrationsound.com
>
>
> Kind regards
>
> Peter Larsen




Anyone familiar with KEF C80's? A pair is available locally cheap, but
they are from the 80's, which is the reason I was shying away from a
pair of 10b's ...

I certainly fell in love with KEF 105's back in the day, but never owned
a pair.



David Correia
www.Celebrationsound.com

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

david correia wrote:

> Anyone familiar with KEF C80's? A pair is available locally cheap, but
> they are from the 80's, which is the reason I was shying away from a
> pair of 10b's ...

http://www.kef.com/history/en/1980/c80.asp

My KEF Coda's from 1978 or so are still ok suspensionwise, the black rubber
seems to have excellent longevity. I need to recone one of the tweeters,
fortunately I got two repair-kits when the first one died due to an
oscillating x-over .... O;-)

> I certainly fell in love with KEF 105's back in the day, but never
> owned a pair.

You need to take the drive and listen, unless you have a decent luck with
buying loudspeakers unseen and unheard. I'd just call and go get them and
just check that all units are ok, don't just listen, also feel that the low
midrange and bass unit(s) move freely. Rotate them just in case they are
marginally sagging .... KEF rear spiders are fairly soft.

The usual reason for selling KEF's is that they sound boring to the
unskilled owner because the programme sounds boring or the other hardware in
the household. They don't, they just tell it like it is. But like all
speakers, they will be boring initially if they have been left unused for
some time.

Your risk, your decision. I don't think the age is a reason for worrying,
but just as with classic cars it gets to be about the actual ones. Seem that
it might be an estate ... or someone having to sell beccause there ain'y
room for them in the "Home" .... they will in all likelyhood play an
excellent "Rainbow", but those that like that kind of music don't know ....

If you wanna use them in earnest, and not just for wallpaper then get a
decent size amplifier and use it modestly. Most complains about "wet" bass
that I have read when people have written about things KEF seem to me to
correlate with their amplifiers being too small and losing control.

No affilation of any kind, tho' I did get to listen to a lot of KEF models
in the danish importers showroom in the late 1970'ties.

Your mileage may vary ...

> David Correia
> www.Celebrationsound.com


Kind regards

Peter Larsen

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

Peter Larsen wrote:


> Rotate them
> just in case they are marginally sagging .... KEF rear spiders are
> fairly soft.

NB!: preventive maintenance if you decide to buy them ... generally
loudspeakers are better at self-recentering when used than when left unused
....


Kind regards

Peter Larsen